If Survival Is Going To Replace Raids, Then You Have To Keep It Fresh ( Gets Boring After 20 Min ).

[__Kanade__]

I do love the fact that Survival keeps you moving throughout the map since the usual places to 'camp' enemies in a regular defense get overrun and cut off by enemies is pretty much gone out the window which means you really need to think how your going to handle the increasing difficulty as endless numbers of enemies come at you.

But in this event for example, the mission does get boring after awhile, there really is no point going on any further after the 20 minute mark when we've pretty much earned both the rewards, after that it's just keep going til someone says enough is enough and just lets themselves get killed to get the round to end quicker by weakening the parties manpower.

An idea is if this mode does in fact replace Raids, that after a certain amount of time, maybe in intervals of 20 minutes. We get a random rare mod with a high % that it's a Rare 1, 3, or 5 fusion core. After 1 hour, we get a random blueprint for a Reactor, Catalyst, or Forma with a high % that it will be a Forma. ( this is all I could think of ).

Honestly, many people will be doing Survival just to rank up weapons and gain loads of resources and random mods without any sort of high risk, high reward incentive for surviving as long as they can other than getting their name splattered on the leaderboards.

Edited September 1, 2013 by __Kanade__

[Archistopheles]

I say no on the reactor/catalyst blueprint.

 

In regards to the survival maps of the future; I can't imagine anything other than a modified endless defense exit system.

 

Instead of a pop-up with a reward, it would need to be a terminal we activate at any time after 5 minutes. No bonus reward for leaving - That would overlap with endless defense too much.

[Sophronius]

A reward for going a certain period of time will be great!...for people who enjoy grinding/farming for items in the game. However the key is to make the mission itself more enjoyable, not through ploys or (mind the term please) "skinner-box" methods.

 

What the survival mission could use is variance in the mission itself so that it doesn't get stagnant. I almost fell asleep during a run on this mission yesterday. It was 30 minutes in and I literally almost passed out from boredom.

 

How to fix it? In short, open up new rooms. Modify the existing oxygen system. Add unique enemies that spawn at specific times. Make the scenery change, and thus give different tactical vantage points..etc

 

I had created a thread about this idea if you want to know more about it. --> https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/100710-survival-event-and-future-missions/

Edited September 1, 2013 by Sophronius

[__Kanade__]

I say no on the reactor/catalyst blueprint.

 

Like I said, it was all I could come up with, besides not everyone has the strongest mods, frames and the time to go past 1 hour in the same game, my weapons become useless after 25 minutes or so on top of the boredom I get hit by, and this is that I use a Rank 11 Serration and max AP and whatever elemental mods that enemies have low resistance towards. 

 

My longest time is 25:10, I just got so bored that I just spammed M.Prime all over the place til I ran out of energy then let myself die, the other 3 players did the same thing, we were all bored, already had the mod and Strun Wraith locked down, so why bother going further? They're aren't anymore rewards past the 20 minute mark.

Edited September 1, 2013 by __Kanade__

[Aure7]

Can we simply have these missions happen in non defense tiles? Like large outdoor areas from phobos or corpus outpost. Also additional secondary objectives?

[ValhaHazred]

In short, open up new rooms. Modify the existing oxygen system. Add unique enemies that spawn at specific times. Make the scenery change, and thus give different tactical vantage points..etc

While I don't really have any issues with Survival as is, this sounds lovely.

[Stormandreas]

I do love the fact that Survival keeps you moving throughout the map since the usual places to 'camp' enemies in a regular defense get overrun and cut off by enemies is pretty much gone out the window which means you really need to think how your going to handle the increasing difficulty as endless numbers of enemies come at you.

But in this event for example, the mission does get boring after awhile, there really is no point going on any further after the 20 minute mark when we've pretty much earned both the rewards, after that it's just keep going til someone says enough is enough and just lets themselves get killed to get the round to end quicker by weakening the parties manpower.

An idea is if this mode does in fact replace Raids, that after a certain amount of time, maybe in intervals of 20 minutes. We get a random rare mod with a high % that it's a Rare 1, 3, or 5 fusion core. After 1 hour, we get a random blueprint for a Reactor, Catalyst, or Forma with a high % that it will be a Forma. ( this is all I could think of ).

Honestly, many people will be doing Survival just to rank up weapons and gain loads of resources and random mods without any sort of high risk, high reward incentive for surviving as long as they can other than getting their name splattered on the leaderboards.

Your making judgement too soon. The mission type hasn't passed the event yet, and so we do not know what they intend to do for finishing rewards.

Ontop of this, they are an amazing source of fusion cores! People would gladly play longer than 20 minutes JUST to get say 70 or 80 fusion cores (which can very easily be done)

[Eirshy]

These things are an amazing source of fusion mats as Storm pointed out. I took my Serration from 50% till 9 to 50% till 10 with a few runs on Friday night.

 

 

As for it getting "boring", I actually found Infested fun the entire time. Corpus got really cheese, and I haven't done Grineer yet.

 

However, I honestly don't think they should completely replace Raid with this. It should be kept as an alternate mode, but Raid isn't a bad mode.

Edited September 1, 2013 by TheBlueJelly

[Keltik0ne]

Can we simply have these missions happen in non defense tiles? Like large outdoor areas from phobos or corpus outpost. Also additional secondary objectives?

This is an idea I could get behind.

 

I don't need rewards, I don't need bonus anything. I only want to enjoy the game, this mode lets me do that, I'd play it even without the mods or resources (the resources are nice though). A mode where you get attacked constantly, while searching for a secondary objective, sounds good, maybe they could call it ............................

 

A Raid mission.

 

The circle is complete.

[Zerethon]

i would say this:

Rather than replace raid, survival should be a new mode entirely with new map nodes in each area (Easy, medium, hard, DIE{Pluto})

 

I mean, if this is set SO MANY YEARS in the future, i'm sure planets have new moons, or even pull a phobos and add a new world entirely dedicated to it

 

However, it doesn't need to be an actual world, it could be a collection of grineer/corpus bases & ships around a ruined orokin tower (And some infested ships, obv.)

 

As far as rewards go, Do this:

 

Every 10/15 minutes, a hackable pod is dropped in (the "Supply cache" lotus refers to) when opened, it drops ammo & healing spheres, as well as a new gold-colored mod pod, with a random uncommon or better mod in it, with the value of said mod increasing with the difficulty of the enemies (After say, 40/50 minutes it could have a chance of containing a new "Survival" Void key, hint hint.)

 

The pod works like the cryopod, after a short delay, it can be damaged by enemies, so no waiting, and then hacking them later, and only one can be in the map at a time.

 

That keeps the spirit of survival, gives more reason to run around, and avoids the "Extraction" mechanic of defense. It would be a bit of work, but something like that would make this into a lasting & frantic game mode. (Especially if pluto had a node for it....)

[Hayden11121]

I say give us a time set to live if you want rewards. This one called be called "Survival" and we could have a modified version with no air tanks but we have an objective, or a time limit (See Mobile Defense vs Defense) called Distraction where we use oxygen and such and we FAIL once oxygen runs out, but we have to leave by hitting terminals.

[Zerethon]

I say give us a time set to live if you want rewards. This one called be called "Survival" and we could have a modified version with no air tanks but we have an objective, or a time limit (See Mobile Defense vs Defense) called Distraction where we use oxygen and such and we FAIL once oxygen runs out, but we have to leave by hitting terminals.

we have this, it's called nightmare mode missions with a time limit.

[Hayden11121]

we have this, it's called nightmare mode missions with a time limit.

Oh sorry, where did I see the nightmare mode for survival that had secondary objectives without oxygen?

 

You most likely only read the first sentence.

[MuhhhhKuh]

i would like to see that some environmental  hazards would be added, like you loose contant shield until a console is hacked, should happen every 5 min.

Another possibility could be that the enemy place a device that make them stronger, and the players have to disable it like hacking a console.

 

or mayby a bit more challanging, the enemie activates whatever (maybe a debuf for the tenno, maybe a buff for the enemy themselves, to disable it, there should appear 4 different spots, each has to be hacked till it is disabled.

 

Or maybe a similar one, could be that the tenno have to hack / activate different consoles and then they get a buff or the enemy a debuff for a short periode of time.

 

Maybe the reward could scale with the duration, the longer you live the higher is the chance to get a rare mod, also maybe the amount of credits could scale with it.

But to prevent farming for exp and similar i would lower the mod / resource drop chance of the enemies by 1/2 also the bonus exp should be reduced (maybe also for defense).

 

What i would like to see would be more skins for frames and weapons, and the future rewards could then maybe contain a skin blueprint for very high survivals :)

[Zerethon]

Oh sorry, where did I see the nightmare mode for survival that had secondary objectives without oxygen?

 

You most likely only read the first sentence.

 

You get time by killing enemies without having to pick up a drop, it can be basically any objective from assassinate to hack.

 

it can also be hack, followed by exterminate or something.

 

we don't need to make survival into just a single variation on a pre-existing combination likely to appear in ~5% of all nightmare missions, it should be it's own thing (Go for as long as possible whilst dealing with harder and harder enemies & Picking up air to keep from running out of time)

 

what it -does- need, is a randomnly appearing side objective (Like my hack the pod) idea that gives a reward for doing so, because right now, there's really no reason beyond drops to go past the 20 minute mark, so adding something that keeps giving guarenteed better and better drops gives you a reason to shoot for those really long times without killing the spirit of the mode.

[WarG0d]

I say a random faction specific boss(with loot) should show up to attempt to end the tenno killing spree

Edited September 1, 2013 by WarG0d

[[DE]Skree]

Can we simply have these missions happen in non defense tiles? Like large outdoor areas from phobos

Survive as long as you can in the wasteland before being overrun by Gerudo?      *not-bad.gif*