Is repairing hull ruptures and fires a "waste of materials"?

[Soleyman1]

basically one guy told me to stop repairing hull ruptures and fires, and only repair breaches, because I was "wasting materials"
Is that actually true or should I ignore people like them and repair everything?

[Cloudyvisage]

I'd prefer the intrinsics at this point in time, that being said, useful information, though I can't help but be quite sure that having near indefinite invincibility will be getting nerfed. Playing Engineer feels kinda stupid sometimes, I personally like it but it does make me wonder, if I am even a little competent and my team occasionally grabs resources I can keep this ship alive through anything, is that good? At least I would appreciate it if it was a tiny bit more... interesting. The ramsleds are kinda fun I suppose.

Maybe make the repair minigame a tiny bit more intensive instead of the quarter second slide of your reticle over the breach.

Basically, there needs to be a reason for engineering to yell at the pilot and gunners to hurry it up/be safer because as it is no matter how hectic it gets I can repair everything, repel boarders and maintain forged Revolite indefinitely without even using fast travel yet. Once I actually start using fast travel it's going to be ridiculously easy.

Edited December 16, 2019 by Cloudyvisage

[Renegade343]

41 minutes ago, SocialFox said:

" Fixing hull breaches, then letting the Railjack health drop back down to critical (since fixing hull breaches heals the Railjack a bit), would reset the catastrophic failure timer. Don't know whether that's a bug, but anyway, it works. "

Which means, yes, it's even more of a waste of resources, so that guy was right on the money.

Not actually the case when you run with a squad. What you do is have the host equip Last Stand, and while you're getting hammered, fix the hull breaches (which cost 10 Revolite) at around 40 seconds remaining into the catastrophic failure timer, and let the enemy hammer you back down to critical again. That way, you refresh your invulnerability timer, and you get the benefits from Last Stand.

Found the timer reset myself, somebody else in the Railjack crew I ran with talked about Last Stand, I put the two and two together.

EDIT: I should add, when you fix the hull breach, your current catastrophic failure timer continues to run down. Once the bit of restored health is gone again, that catastrophic failure timer resets back to 1 minute.

Edited December 16, 2019 by Renegade343

[BethTheBean]

19 hours ago, SHArK-FiN said:

OP was asked not to care about anything BESIDES the 60 seconds countdown.

Because of how the mission fail works now is only caused by the hull breach.

Despite other hazard posts a threat to cause a hull breach, there would only be one breach at a time.

Meaning if you don't seal the breach for 50seconds. you won't necessarily need to repair anything within that 50 seconds.

RJ also favors from invincibility and healing shortly after the breach was sealed.

 

34 minutes ago, SocialFox said:

He wasn't and I'll explain below.

Yes, you are wasting resources, but not entirely, I don't know if this is intended or not, but, repairing only the "FIX THIS NOW OR WE BLOW UP" around the 10s mark, is all you really need to worry about, anything else is just wasting resources as you're going to have electrical fires, and the regular fires, and hull breaches near constantly, getting rid of those costs 10 revolite, getting rid of one "FIX THIS NOW OR WE BLOW UP" costs 30 revolite, fix 3 fires, and you just wasted resources that didn't actually save the ship.
Fixing the "RED" one, at around the 10s mark, ensures you're invulnerable for at least 55 seconds (50 seconds of waiting, and 5 seconds after fixing). At 300 Revolite, you're looking at 550 seconds of invulnerability or just 9 minutes and 10 seconds.

Every time you fix a non "CATASTROFIC FAILURE IMINENT" thing, you remove Invulnerable time from your total.
So no, his info is not backwards, he just did his best to understand the mechanic, and take advantage of it, considering how fragile the railjack is.

EDIT: I noticed he said Breaches, and not Ruptures, there's this little tidbit I found on another forum post, which explains why that's the case

" Fixing hull breaches, then letting the Railjack health drop back down to critical (since fixing hull breaches heals the Railjack a bit), would reset the catastrophic failure timer. Don't know whether that's a bug, but anyway, it works. "

Which means, yes, it's even more of a waste of resources, so that guy was right on the money.

I REALLY need to stop watching the vids and streams, from warframe partners. The official forums is where it's at!

When I join another's mission, their railjack is about to blow. Each time it's the same story -- one player flying the bucket, while the others are in space. I guess, I'm just a bleeding heart.

 

[Renegade343]

3 minutes ago, GrazeZeroLow said:

 

I REALLY need to stop watching the vids and streams, from warframe partners. The official forums is where it's at!

When I join another's mission, their railjack is about to blow. Each time it's the same story -- one player flying the bucket, while the others are in space. I guess, I'm just a bleeding heart.

 

Yeah, I probably worded it badly with that statement he quoted from me. What happens is this:

1. You have a catastrophic timer running right now, and it drops to 40 seconds.
2. You fix a hull breach (the orange markers), giving the ship a little bit of health back.
3. The enemy drops your Railjack health back to critical again (let's say it takes them 10 seconds)
4. Your catastrophic timer now resets, from 30 seconds to 60 seconds, and counts down from 60 again.

[--K--Sharkfin]

3 hours ago, Renegade343 said:

You fix a hull breach (the orange markers), giving the ship a little bit of health back.

Correct me if I am wrong, but aren't rupture the orange marker and breach the red marker?

Anyway it's just a communication issue that doesn't impact the context if remarked and understood.

[Renegade343]

4 minutes ago, SHArK-FiN said:

Correct me if I am wrong, but aren't rupture the orange marker and breach the red marker?

Anyway it's just a communication issue that doesn't impact the context if remarked and understood.

The orange small markers are the hull breaches, the red large marker is the hull rupture.

[BlackVortex]

On 2019-12-15 at 11:30 PM, GrazeZeroLow said:

You have one minute to repair a rupture, or the ship blows apart ( mission fails ).

This "guy" either has their info backwards, or was trolling you.

if you are non-stop repairing then it becomes a waste of materials and then you run out and die

there is however a situation where breaches, ruptures and fires are welcome to have

Edited December 17, 2019 by BlackVortex

[Moscatinka]

Isn't everyone conveniently ignoring the fact that repairs is how the engineer player gets their affinity? Or whatever it's called for intrinsics. It's all nice and well to say "do this do that" but all that advice requires you to have rank 5 in gunning or piloting, so that's pretty pointless for the average crew on public, because that's just not happening, ever.

If everyone followed the advice laid out here, nobody would ever get to the rank where they can actually follow the advice. It's a catch-22. You have to START with getting some ranks, to worry about high end mechanics before that point is... well... pointless. So I would say if you're still ranking up your intrinsics on a earth public mission, repair that stuff, at the low level missions with a full crew you're not going to run out of omni-tool fuel before the mission is done, assuming you topped it up to 300 before leaving dry dock. Heck I did it in a 2 man team of total RJ noobs, repairing whatever I could,  and came back to dry-dock with still 100 of 300 left in the omni-tool.

 

[Audbot]

I think it's also probably worth noting that (AFAIK) repairing Hull Ruptures removes the maximum health penalty and heals your ship for 20% of its max health, and only costs 10 Revolite compared to a Hull Breach's 30 Revolite.

So I think that the takeaway is something like...

1. If you're in a hard mission where you're getting put back into Hull Breach almost immediately upon fixing it, then your invulnerability time is the only thing keeping your Railjack alive... which means that yeah, you probably want to only fix the Hull Breaches, and to wait as long as possible before doing that to maximize how long you spend invincible.
    
2. If you've picked up Hull Ruptures but you're still comfortably at full health, then it might be good to hold off until you need the healing... though if you're in this situation, the mission might be easy enough that it doesn't matter and you might as well fix 'em for the experience points.
    
3. But if you're taking a lot of damage but haven't hit a Hull Breach yet, then I think you should fix a Hull Rupture. Combined with your ship's natural regeneration (and your pilot hopefully doing some dodging), if you fix three Hull Ruptures over the course of a minute and thereby avoid a Hull Breach, then you're breaking even in terms of Revolite cost.
   
   And if you'd used that 30 Revolite to only fix the Hull Breach, then when your invincibility wears off you'd still have the substantial Max HP penalty from the ruptures and be that much closer to yet another expensive Hull Breach.
    
4. If you're not in Situation #1 where your ship's health is useless anyways, I do also think you should always put out fires: their damage-over-time isn't that much, but it can cripple your ship's natural health regeneration. (Electrical faults could go either way, I think; on one hand, Railjacks have enough armor that the vast majority if your Effective Hit Points are Health... but on the other hand, if enough of your shields have regenerated to take a few hits, those are hits that aren't inflicting more Hull Ruptures.)

So yeah. I feel like the "don't fix Hull Ruptures" strategy is definitely a thing, but it's a mostly a thing for relatively flimsy ships that have rushed into hard missions? But the takeaway is that you probably want to be fixing Hull Ruptures if it'll help you avoid a Hull Breach... but switch to only fixing Hull Breaches if frequent Breaches are inevitable. The situations where you run out of Revolite are usually the ones where you're spending twice as much resources to fix both.