Isolation Vault Issues

[(XBOX)Grimsley Clause]

Below are my personal opinions, briefly listed but remain constant frustrations. If you have your own problems, or have a similar issue, do tell.

 

-Bait is fine as is, though i'm aware the timer has been nerf from 60 to 90 seconds. While 30/60/90 extra seconds depending on how many tiers of the vault you've done isn't much, time adds up quickly with the next two phases of the mission.

-Toxin phase nerf is an immediate issue. Considering how tedious the phase is, rapidly ramping toxin with a now very griefable penalty, or even accidentally punishable penalty if somebody spawns in and just happens to be out of range, paired with a needlessly long timer further complicates and muddles any enjoyment of the mission.

-My least favorite part, the Necramechs. While fighting the single one solo isn't bad, the issues that come from fighting in pairs or a trio of them still shine through. These have MULTIPLE issues. They arguably ruin the entire run for me, and paired with their borked drop rates for seemingly anything useful outside Matrices, they're just unnecessarily one sided bullet sponges.
    -Apparently nonexistent hitbox. Even with a Stropha, Arca Plasmor, etc, it's still hit or miss whether you actually deal any damage. If you do, great, but it's likely you won't. If you're not using a high spread weapon, good luck shooting their tip toes and fingernails, that seems like their only normal vulnerable spot.

    -Abilities: Infuriating to an umpteenth degree.

        -Their Slowing Canister slows you for an indeterminable amount of time due to their being no proc listed. You have to hope they aim at something else as even if you die and revive yourself you're still slowed. Even worse when you're doing the latter two tiers as this really can be a killer solo.

        -Their Electric Shield that grants invincibility is used WAY too often, they're invulnerable seemingly 95% of the time, and when paired or in a trio that are all invincible, with a seeming decent timer to wait out before they're vulnerable, they just eat time and revives. 

        -Grenades. Paired with their other two abilities, it's a death sentence, at least for non-tanky frames. Every single time those grenades go out, if you're within 50m it seems to get you anyway regardless of your position.

-Loid and Otak:

    -Repetitive speeches for each tier. More of a personal annoyance as I do enjoy them as characters, but was there really no other dialogue that was recorded, or even variations?

    -Insanely slow speed. Considering he's a 4 part mobile defense, and moves at a snails pace, it's baffling that it was decided to nerf the bait timer. While moving slowly to each crystal is... tolerable, despite the growing despise of Mobile Defense and Deimos as a whole, the fact that certain paths are incredibly long, and the arbitrary shuffle back to the vault door after all crystal have been activated is asinine. I'm aware you can somewhat help this with some frames like Loki and Nova, but there's no way I'm soloing these things with those frames, in addition to his AI apparently becoming offset and needing to reroute if helped along. he needs to have his speed drastically increased, or at least teleport back to the door when he's done if the player runs ahead to wait.

-Scintillant. They do not exist, even after the hotfixes. I refuse to believe they exist, and if they do, actively are avoiding being seen. There needs to be a guaranteed one in the T3 vault or something, as these aren't even comparable to PoE Wisps in their worst state. Those are needed for a lot of stuff, but can be reliably farmed.

 

Overall, the Vaults are just one big mobile defense, but the entirety of Deimos is mobile defense after mobile defense. It's getting old very fast, and progression gets grounded to grinding halts every single bounty step. Necramechs are the worst offenders in vaults, and I genuinely hate doing them now just attempting to get Scintillant.

It's ridiculous that a single resource has been put behind such a tedious grindwall, especially since they are not guaranteed at all.

Deimos has quickly gotten very infuriating from the seemingly lack in transparency about everything, and the Vaults are single handedly expediting my boredom, anger, and intolerance with the open world.

 

I have more issues with Deimos as a whole, but that's for another time. 

[NeoRetro10K]

You have put my exact feelings and observations on this into words. This has all been my experience as well, in addition to Scintillant not existing in Bounty reward tables.

[(XBOX)Grimsley Clause]

28 minutes ago, NeoRetro10K said:

You have put my exact feelings and observations on this into words. This has all been my experience as well, in addition to Scintillant not existing in Bounty reward tables.

There's just way too much wrong with Deimos right now, which is very infuriating considering it's almost as if nothing has been learned about what does and doesn't work from the last two open worlds, in addition to player history.

[(XBOX)SychoticMage]

My thoughts exactly, im already sick of fighting these mechs over and over when the t2 or t3 just 1 shot most frames and stay invincible for eternity.

[(XBOX)Grimsley Clause]

10 minutes ago, (XB1)SychoticMage said:

My thoughts exactly, im already sick of fighting these mechs over and over when the t2 or t3 just 1 shot most frames and stay invincible for eternity.

They're just expired icing on the moldy cake.

[Qargantia]

...

[(XBOX)Grimsley Clause]

1 minute ago, Qargantia said:

...

Agree, disagree, indifferent?

[(XBOX)SychoticMage]

The mechs SHOULD be difficult, but not on par with the damage of the Profit Taker and health of the average Inaros player.

[(XBOX)Grimsley Clause]

8 minutes ago, (XB1)SychoticMage said:

The mechs SHOULD be difficult, but not on par with the damage of the Profit Taker and health of the average Inaros player.

It wouldn't even be as much of an issue if they weren't always invincible.

If it bleeds you can kill it, but they have no time to bleed.

[(XBOX)SychoticMage]

Fortunately i have all the parts for the mech, but unfortunately now ive moved on to the tier 3 damaged weapon parts of which ive only ever seen 1 as a reward, so i know ill be at this for a very long time.

[Unimira]

Reached max rank with the mech faction but never seen a single scintillant in the vaults, they feel more rare than the Cetus Wisps and you could fly between lakes in seconds while it takes a minimum of 5 minutes to reach a vault (and can't even semi-afk the toxic phase anymore). Complete BS.

I'm just using Octavia for the mechs, can't get wrecked if you don't give them a target (other than the lollipop). Also found a few other ways to cheese them but all these tactics involve never getting close, you will probably die if you do. 😉

[(XBOX)Grimsley Clause]

32 minutes ago, Unimira said:

Reached max rank with the mech faction but never seen a single scintillant in the vaults, they feel more rare than the Cetus Wisps and you could fly between lakes in seconds while it takes a minimum of 5 minutes to reach a vault (and can't even semi-afk the toxic phase anymore). Complete BS.

I'm just using Octavia for the mechs, can't get wrecked if you don't give them a target (other than the lollipop). Also found a few other ways to cheese them but all these tactics involve never getting close, you will probably die if you do. 😉

Should be 3 with Necroloid tomorrow. Despite constant vault grind im still missing every piece of the weapon, and with the capsule and engine.

 

I actually found a Scintillant today. Just one, but one regardless. Looked like Jesus himself floating in the middle of the room. Now i actually know what to look for. 

However, the grind for them is still atrocious, the timers are tedious, and the Necramechs are just egregious (gotta have some fun, might as well rhyme).

[(PSN)NemitheNem]

16 hours ago, (XB1)Grimsley Clause said:

-Toxin phase nerf is an immediate issue. Considering how tedious the phase is, rapidly ramping toxin with a now very griefable penalty, or even accidentally punishable penalty if somebody spawns in and just happens to be out of range, paired with a needlessly long timer further complicates and muddles any enjoyment of the mission.

This also happens in the defence portion. Someone spawns in far away and if they can't speed on over the mission aborts

[GodModeFrame]

I agree 100%. Whole isolation vault thingy is a grieving grind with badly designed enemies (necramechs). What is the point of giving the enemy a skill that gives invulnerability and mirrors all damage back to player - with an apparently 1-2 second cooldown. They just spam it the whole fight. And if you actually manage to cancel it with void dash (it seems to work about 10% of the time - usually you just end up hopping up and down while you try to use it), necramech grows it arms back instantly and two seconds later is invulnerable again.

[lindenbrock]

Check what i posted here in another thread. Mechs are immune to everything except IPS damage, so if you dont want to ez mode it with octavia then youll need some crazy ips damage. As for everything else 10 agree 10000%. Deimos is just annoying now, neither of the other 2 open worlds sucked this much as release. I came back to wf after a few years off when poe was announced. I farmed those twitch drops so hard that i had like 4 months of every booster and started grinding my way up from almost the start of the game (i was like mr5 or something) for the duration of those boosters. I also hit fortuna hard when it came out and i enjoyed it until the stupid solaris u heist bs with that awful drop chance on most things. It took me until steel path was announced to finally be able to buy all the baruuk parts, but even that grind wasnt as annoying and offputting as this initial deimos grind and the circumstances surrounding it's release (stupid changes/ideas, annoying nerfs, failure to really do any kind of bug testing it seems, etc.)

[(XBOX)Grimsley Clause]

3 minutes ago, lindenbrock said:

Check what i posted here in another thread. Mechs are immune to everything except IPS damage, so if you dont want to ez mode it with octavia then youll need some crazy ips damage. As for everything else 10 agree 10000%. Deimos is just annoying now, neither of the other 2 open worlds sucked this much as release. I came back to wf after a few years off when poe was announced. I farmed those twitch drops so hard that i had like 4 months of every booster and started grinding my way up from almost the start of the game (i was like mr5 or something) for the duration of those boosters. I also hit fortuna hard when it came out and i enjoyed it until the stupid solaris u heist bs with that awful drop chance on most things. It took me until steel path was announced to finally be able to buy all the baruuk parts, but even that grind wasnt as annoying and offputting as this initial deimos grind and the circumstances surrounding it's release (stupid changes/ideas, annoying nerfs, failure to really do any kind of bug testing it seems, etc.)

Read through the link, I fully agree that there's way too much stuff in Deimos release that seemingly announces it was not tested well, if at all. It's essentially a Beefed up version of Wolf with the damage resistances.

2 hours ago, GodModeFrame said:

I agree 100%. Whole isolation vault thingy is a grieving grind with badly designed enemies (necramechs). What is the point of giving the enemy a skill that gives invulnerability and mirrors all damage back to player - with an apparently 1-2 second cooldown. They just spam it the whole fight. And if you actually manage to cancel it with void dash (it seems to work about 10% of the time - usually you just end up hopping up and down while you try to use it), necramech grows it arms back instantly and two seconds later is invulnerable again.

I've been under the impression that, completely against lore, Necramevhs prevent operator ability use for some ungodly reason. I've heard hitting their spine disables the shield but uh... those things don't turn around, they're like Z-Targeted on you.

3 hours ago, (PS4)NemitheNem said:

This also happens in the defence portion. Someone spawns in far away and if they can't speed on over the mission aborts

I've noticed that.

That's why I do these solo, it's not worth the risk. But that also means that T3 vault is essentially impossible thanks to the Regi Trio over there.

[lindenbrock]

23 minutes ago, (XB1)Grimsley Clause said:

Read through the link, I fully agree that there's way too much stuff in Deimos release that seemingly announces it was not tested well, if at all. It's essentially a Beefed up version of Wolf with the damage resistances.

Funny that you mention that. I did some basic math and the lv 100 steel path juguluses are roughly equivalent to a lv 154 wolf (change his level at the right under his pic if you didnt know) in terms of armor/ehp. I say basic math because i was only taking my mesa's fire rate multiplied by her approximate damage per shot (which varied a little). I had a fire rate of 23 per second before arcane buffs, and was doing a minimum of 400 dmg per shot. 23 X 400 = 9200. Because my damage varied a bit and also to make the math a little easier, lets say thats 10k damage per second. The fastest i managed a kill with her 4 was about 20 seconds. So 10k damage per second times 20 seconds comes out to roughly 200k health. Level 154 wolf has almost 200k health but a bit over than in EHP. Level 120 wolf has just under 200k ehp. Can you imagine fighting a lv 120 wolf on his release? The only legitimate strategy on him was magus lockdown or sarpa armor strip for the longest time, and here we are with something even worse than him (because im pretty sure he didnt spawn in at lv 120+ most of the time, if ever) but yet Jugs arent even a boss or a mini boss. You can lockdown and strip them though which is nice. Same idea goes for mechs, you can lockdown and strip them too, but theres literally no reason for them to be straight up immune to all damage from 10 of the potential 13 damage types (excluding true and void dmg because i havent tested them) and theres also no reason for them to not #*!%ing say anything about it and let us believe that they are actually weak to their listed weaknesses.

[(PSN)NemitheNem]

28 minutes ago, (XB1)Grimsley Clause said:

I've noticed that.

That's why I do these solo, it's not worth the risk. But that also means that T3 vault is essentially impossible thanks to the Regi Trio over there.

They're 'weak' to archguns, try that.

[GentlePuppet]

Sometimes when I goto mother in the field to go to the next vault, after completing the first one, it will send me back to the first vault. 
The bait door will already be open but I'll have to complete the toxin phase again, even though the door is already open, or I fail the bounty.
Then I'll have to fight a single nechamech again, in the same vault.
Finally, I won't be able to do the bonus cause the vault was already unlocked and it'll complete the bounty without the bonus.

And sometimes after doing the first or second vault there won't be any other vault bounties at any of the field mothers so I can't do anymore vaults forcing me to leave and restart the session.

With how completely #*!%y and broken these vaults are there is absolutely no way in hell they ever tested these more than once. Cause these bugs are so easy to reproduce that the only possible way they missed them was they did them once and the rng let the go through with no issue and they said "Yep it works" and shipped it. Or they never tested it and assumed their code would work as intended.

[lindenbrock]

5 minutes ago, GentlePuppet said:

And sometimes after doing the first or second vault there won't be any other vault bounties at any of the field mothers so I can't do anymore vaults forcing me to leave and restart the session.

Could be because the day/night worms switched. when they do that you have to go back and restart at mother in the town. I have experienced that "same vault" issue though, its pretty annoying. 

[GentlePuppet]

20 minutes ago, lindenbrock said:

Could be because the day/night worms switched. when they do that you have to go back and restart at mother in the town. I have experienced that "same vault" issue though, its pretty annoying. 

I wish it was because the worms switched, cause then it probably wouldn't have been a bug, but they didn't switch.
It was Fass the whole time I was in the session. It was Fass when I started the first vault and it was Fass when I left the 2nd vault to get the bounty for the 3rd.
I recorded the whole session to try to capture the same vault bug. Unless they switched twice within 30 minutes that's not what happened. Maybe I just got a really rare bug...