A Complete Rework Of The Foundation Of Warframe.

[(PSN)Nilphelan]

A rework on the core function of mods would be more ideal then converting back to a skill tree. I do not play Warframe to sit there and figure out what to do with my skill tree.

 I kill Grineer, Corpus and Infested for the fusion cores and mods, plain and simple. I want that to never change, because that is why I play

Warframe. As far as content goes with the utility and power of a Warframe, I agree with this thread on that point but it could be some what solved by adding a passive or combo effect to equipped groups of mods together in one load out, or just giving a general rework to the 'standard base' mods w all use like Redirection, Serration, Split chamber, etc.

 Also in a previous Dev stream we were all told about a completely new system, adding in an ability not tied into mods, or just one specific warframe, but to our character as a whole. That system is probably what the original poster of this thread is seeking to change his Warframe experience to something more modern and new.

 

 While the original poster had some great ideas on how to change the current system, I do not believe in it, or else I'd be playing a game with a skills tree. And to be honest, it seems like he is trying to make Warframe Destiny, and please do not make Warframe Destiny. If I want to play Destiny, I'l go play Destiny.. but do not make Warfame.. Destiny, please.

[optyk]

I doubt there was min/maxing in BF 1942-BFBC, COD-COD3,CS,Halo, etc etc. plenty of games  since there wasn't anything to min/max in the first place. Even in call of duty ghosts and BF4 matches, I rarely see reoccurring load outs, or any sort of "min-maxing". loadouts are based on what your personal preferences are, whether you camp, run and gun, spray n pray, or take careful aim with each shot. All these other games have different attachments/equipment/ styles to best fit how you want to play.  Warframe mod loadouts don't let you choose your own style (at least in current "endgame"), since all you can do is stack damage and abuse a frame with infinite scaling abilities. 

 

 

Wrong. When DiCE implemented weapon loadouts into Battlelog with Battlefield and we had the ability to go to someones profile and copy their weapon attachments and gear selections for each class; people complained about that. They even disliked how it showed what you used in-game when you killed someone.

 

So people wanted 'realism'. So DiCE added 'Hardcore' mode. So people wanted more challenge in Warframe, DE gave us 'Nightmare' mode.

 

Not to mention, there was/is only 1 good mix of weapon attachments per weapon and everyone uses them. Saying you never seen reoccuring loadouts in at least Battlefield is a BLATANT LIE Sir.

 

ie: 

- M16's were 95% of the time seen with a Heavy Barrel, Foregrip and Red Dot Reflex Sight.

- Most class played was/is Medic because of the quickness of gaining points and self-preservation.

 

Lets call the M16 the Soma/Boltor Prime and lets call the Medic Nova and or some other FoTM popular Frame.

 

Anyways I don't need to give any more examples with other games, that was enough proof of a 1:1.

 

This 'Endgame' anyone ever speaks of in Warframe is just goofy, there is none. People here whip up their own versions of it by playing insane survival and or defense for just WAY TOO LONG periods of time and they are calling that endgame. I dont know why. Kudos to players who do that, but to hold a term like "Endless" defense and "Survival" against DE and say thats endgame is unfair. Its endless FFS.

 

I'm not tooting my own horn, but I have these mentioned base mods that are needed -maxed, I have 95% of Prime Frames and Weapons. I'm only missing 1 set of event mods and all the other rares/nightmares/corrupted mods I have as well, and I haven't ever needed to run missions where the mobs were of so insane level that you needed specifically A, B, and C mods to do it. When you go that far in a endless system, its only logical that you will need a specific set anyways -that means its all broke?

 

Telling DE the system sucks because you need to keep a Serration and similar core mods on is not feedback. Saying 'OMG I 5 forma'd my rocket launcher and cant kill a level 200 Ancient' is just ridic as well. WTF are you doing fighting level 200s and you actually think theres going to be a Mod or a set of mods that is going to cover a "Endless" scaling system? News to me.

 

Normally games suffer changes from PvP'ers whining and moaning. In Warframes case, I tend to believe its from the Lone Wolfs/Universal Soldiers who want to do it all solo. I'm just not seeing what the OP is moaning about at all. Warframe is by far not perfect, but a complete overhaul and or a LINEAR skill tree? Hells to the NO.

[optyk]

..... If I want to play Destiny, I'l go play Destiny.. but do not make Warfame.. Destiny, please.

 

THIS.

 

This is what's ruining games. Players want to copy and paste systems/mechanics from every other game to the next and Dev's for some reason are following it and doing it. "Hey this feature was cool in this game, you guys should add it here!". You know what we end up with? All the same damn games but with different skins. Then players have the nerve to yell at developers later saying that their game is nothing new and or just a clone of another and it sux. uh... ok?

 

If more people actually did say 'hey, I like PVP, I'll go play a PVP game then duh!' or something similar, the industry would be filled with better games.

[(PSN)DIGITAL-DAMAGE]

OK, yees that´s a lot of text!

 

But at this part i´ve stoped reading:

 

(This really is nothing more than a joke. Giving players the ability to gimp their effectiveness via poor design choices is just stupid. What this showcases is too much choice..........)

 

To call that stupid is a little bit extreme, the game is still in beta so call it a try and not a joke!

 

Good, so from my side,

I like the mod system and it´s one of the reasons why I´m still playing this game, to collect all the mod´s out there!.... ;-)

 

Every other game has that Skilltree thing so it´s nothing new and it´s boring.....

 

Make the Mod system better with some unlockable Modslots by polarizing and so the polarizing funktion will become more usefull.

 

That´s what I´m thinking.

[BloodArmoredApostle]

Making a game similar to others makes a game rather dull. No one plays a game for it to be the same thing you played in another title. Great ideas but really you can't think that this is fun by making it into something that you have already played before? This doesn't give Warframe that "Warfamy" feel. Farm for resources and cores/mods I mean that by itself and killing enemies is fun all by itself. Incorporating something that would make this game unique design into something (popular by masses) just because everyone may have used the system, would damage this game beyond repair.

[Ja_man]

Not to mention, there was/is only 1 good mix of weapon attachments per weapon and everyone uses them. Saying you never seen reoccuring loadouts in at least Battlefield is a BLATANT LIE Sir.

 

ie: 

- M16's were 95% of the time seen with a Heavy Barrel, Foregrip and Red Dot Reflex Sight.

- Most class played was/is Medic because of the quickness of gaining points and self-preservation.

 

That was BF3, not one of the games I mentioned, so I'd say it wasn't a "blatent lie". And I was a beast at that game (http://bf3stats.com/stats_ps3/chulupe#ps3) and rarely used the m16. The m16 was a damn good gun, not the be all end all of the game. you didn't need the m16 to be good. you do need serration/split chamber to be "good" in warframe.

 

 

 

Anyways, I said BF4. have you played it? Cause I generally see all the classes used about the same amount. I don't see one gun with select attachments used by every player, especially now that there are 4 gun types per class, so you can use shotguns,DMRs,Carbines, or your class specific gun. and they are all pretty balanced too (well, maybe not the shotguns). You can go ahead and use you're boring assault kit loadout you found online, I'll use what works for me and still get top of the leader board every other round.

 

How is high end t4 not endgame? the only thing for high level players to do is get the new prime stuff, which is in t4. Why wouldn't you use nyx,loki etc since they will get more chances at prime stuff using their magical scaling abilities? So what are players supposed to do if there is no endgame as you say? play star chart missions? Why? they're far to easy, and have no real reason to play them. with the current mod system, missions fall into 2 difficulties, weak enemies I can kill in half a second, or stupidly overpowered enemies I can kill in 1 second and can do the same. I would say that is a glaring sign that Something needs a big overhaul. Not necessarily to the extent the OP wants, but it does need some significant changes.

 

When Destiny does come out and Warframe hasn't changed a bit, I'm gonna want to play something new over a game I'm struggling to maintain interest in. And I doubt I'm the only one.

Edited July 7, 2014 by Ja_man

[-SLX-J3tAc3]

Making a game similar to others makes a game rather dull. No one plays a game for it to be the same thing you played in another title. Great ideas but really you can't think that this is fun by making it into something that you have already played before? This doesn't give Warframe that "Warfamy" feel. Farm for resources and cores/mods I mean that by itself and killing enemies is fun all by itself. Incorporating something that would make this game unique design into something (popular by masses) just because everyone may have used the system, would damage this game beyond repair.

And this is why I utterly despise hearing these children talk about "balance" - they always use that term to try to make this game play like others. If they want to play COD with Parkour, that's what Titanfall is for.

[KvotheTheArcane1]

And this is why I utterly despise hearing these children talk about "balance" - they always use that term to try to make this game play like others. If they want to play COD with Parkour, that's what Titanfall is for.

"balance" and "play like other games" are two completely different things. The game can be balanced without playing like CoD (i.e.), and the game can be unbalanced, but play like CoD (i.e.)

[43Emprah]

That was BF3, not one of the games I mentioned, so I'd say it wasn't a "blatent lie". And I was a beast at that game (http://bf3stats.com/stats_ps3/chulupe#ps3) and rarely used the m16. The m16 was a damn good gun, not the be all end all of the game. you didn't need the m16 to be good. you do need serration/split chamber to be "good" in warframe.

 

 

 

Anyways, I said BF4. have you played it? Cause I generally see all the classes used about the same amount. I don't see one gun with select attachments used by every player, especially now that there are 4 gun types per class, so you can use shotguns,DMRs,Carbines, or your class specific gun. and they are all pretty balanced too (well, maybe not the shotguns). You can go ahead and use you're boring assault kit loadout you found online, I'll use what works for me and still get top of the leader board every other round.

 

How is high end t4 not endgame? the only thing for high level players to do is get the new prime stuff, which is in t4. Why wouldn't you use nyx,loki etc since they will get more chances at prime stuff using their magical scaling abilities? So what are players supposed to do if there is no endgame as you say? play star chart missions? Why? they're far to easy, and have no real reason to play them. with the current mod system, missions fall into 2 difficulties, weak enemies I can kill in half a second, or stupidly overpowered enemies I can kill in 1 second and can do the same. I would say that is a glaring sign that Something needs a big overhaul. Not necessarily to the extent the OP wants, but it does need some significant changes.

 

When Destiny does come out and Warframe hasn't changed a bit, I'm gonna want to play something new over a game I'm struggling to maintain interest in. And I doubt I'm the only one.

Why people have convinced themselves that Destiny is bringing anything "new" to the table, is beyond me. It'll be a decent game, no doubt, but it's hardly innovative. All they have done is exactly what posts have complained about. They grabbed a bunch of features that people like in other games, and did their best to cram them into a single title. We'll see if it lives up to hype, and by all means enjoy the game. If it hits PC, I'll definitely give it a go. Just don't try parading Destiny around as "something new".

Edit: Also looked at your BF3 stats page, and your most used weapon was the AEK. Which completely debunks your entire argument, as that gun was leagues better than nearly every weapon in the game for it's role. Just saying.

Edited July 8, 2014 by 43Emprah

[optyk]

... How is high end t4 not endgame? the only thing for high level players to do is get the new prime stuff, which is in t4. Why wouldn't you use nyx,loki etc since they will get more chances at prime stuff using their magical scaling abilities? So what are players supposed to do if there is no endgame as you say? play star chart missions? Why? they're far to easy, and have no real reason to play them. with the current mod system, missions fall into 2 difficulties, weak enemies I can kill in half a second, or stupidly overpowered enemies I can kill in 1 second and can do the same. I would say that is a glaring sign that Something needs a big overhaul. Not necessarily to the extent the OP wants, but it does need some significant changes.   ...

 

 

 

 

Overhaul our skill/mod system? No. Re-purpose some developers, as best they can, to give us more replayable, meaningful 'end game' content? Yes. What does that include? I dunno, I'm a player not a Dev. I pay them to figure that out and I trust'em.

 

But that falls into the whole Warframe is still beta and growing statement. And thats still 100% true. I drank the kool-aid when Steve said the only thing holding back Warframe was the time needed to get it all out. Maybe gamers have been institutionalized by the big AAA publishers/Dev's who churn out 'new games' within a year of each title and have grown impatient? I have 1 friend that always gives me a hard time about playing this game. He'll say "Oh back to Warframe eh? Thought you quit for the upteenth time last week?" and I say "No moron, I just love playing so much that I catch up fast to what they release and sometimes I take breaks and have to wait for more to do sadly...".

 

Some players here want more edible content than shiny toys. 110% understand that, but at the same time they jump from game to game so much they are being hypocrites when they say DE just releases new toys more than content. Well, those same players jump to the new released games so fast its the same damn thing.

 

DE just cant keep up with their players and how much we play the S#&$ outta this game and thats a good thing; growing pains. DE would sure benefit from some additional creative staff tho -thats the needed overhaul.

 

What do vets and completionists do in the meantime?

Well theres options. Take a break (if you're tired of gameplay) and lurk the forums and post opinions on things like play styles and warframe abilities. Share tips and how to do things faster and more efficient. Follow DEs news on the game, just cause your on pause does not mean the game is. Help edit the Wiki. I played Dark Sector stuff in an alliance for a little, wasn't my cup of tea so I moved on. I play Endless D and Survivals but not to the crazy insane waves/time ranges because there is no need to go farther than 2 Rotation C cycles as void keys drop like water. I still do runs for resources, Void Keys etc. I always jump into OD's because theres always players who need the XP and cool stuff I already have. I'll help others on alerts and unlocking systems as well. I Sell BPs/Mods cheap on Trade. Basically HELP OTHERS because that means you get to play the game and do something nice in return; I know thats asking a lot in todays time and gamer attitude of "What about ME", "PFFT I already have/done that", "tl;dr".

 

tl;dr -

DE would sure benefit from some additional creative staff -thats the needed overhaul.

 

PS - I would not recommend RSI's Star Citizen to you. It would upset you greatly on its progress thus far. Stick to quick, easy, copy/paste games that are dead within a year, like Destiny.

[TheDoctah]

This is truly a great read, no wonder Steve got upset, Zam (imo) rightfully stepped on his toes a little. (maybe a little too far) but I'm glad someone did it, can't keep pretending your game is some holy grail when it has HUGE flaws.

 

They keep sitting on these huge glaring problems and keep adding crap like the rest of the game doesn't need fixing. lol

Edited July 8, 2014 by TheDoctah

[DirkDeadeye]

This is truly a great read, no wonder Steve got upset, Zam (imo) rightfully stepped on his toes a little. (maybe a little too far) but I'm glad someone did it, can't keep pretending your game is some holy grail when it has HUGE flaws.

 

They keep sitting on these huge glaring problems and keep adding crap like the rest of the game doesn't need fixing. lol

I went down that road. Its kinda dark and scary dont do ot.

But I agree

[cyril1204]

You're just "making ideas" from other games and slapping them into a new system that you can't live with. How is that skill tree any different from the one we see a million times over 3 decades. The skill tree you "designed" looks identical to Far Cry 3 one.

 

This is a game in development that tries to stay away from the main stream of MMORPG. Of course there are flaws, that why we see new tweaks every now and then.

 

You guys started playing Warframe because of what: The system, the design. They have potential. Don't turn this system into a clone of others. Don't be narrow minded and help them build on the foundation they created, not turning it into rubble again.

 

Imo weapon balancing is the most important thing right now. But that won't happen until post U14

[TheDoctah]

You're just "making ideas" from other games and slapping them into a new system that you can't live with. How is that skill tree any different from the one we see a million times over 3 decades. The skill tree you "designed" looks identical to Far Cry 3 one.

 

This is a game in development that tries to stay away from the main stream of MMORPG. Of course there are flaws, that why we see new tweaks every now and then.

 

You guys started playing Warframe because of what: The system, the design. They have potential. Don't turn this system into a clone of others. Don't be narrow minded and help them build on the foundation they created, not turning it into rubble again.

 

Imo weapon balancing is the most important thing right now. But that won't happen until post U14

To be fair, I didn't start playing warframe for the system and still don't. I thought back then and still do to this day that this game is bare bones, I gave it a break though cause it has the beta tag slapped on it.  I started playing cause of how this game looked, not how it played. and kept playing till around update 12 (again, because of how it looks), then I just got burnt out and haven't had the desire to touch this game since. So if there's anyone in DE I'm gonna thank for the work they put in on this game, it's the art team. Still trying to give the devs that work on the gameplay mechanics a chance, but they need to come up with something that doesn't make me feel like a treasure hunter with fancy guns. I totally agree with your opinion though, they shouldn't copy other game styles, but this game burns you out like nobodies business. Hoping they bring something new AND exciting.Time will tell however.

[Zarfilg]

 

 

When Destiny does come out and Warframe hasn't changed a bit, I'm gonna want to play something new over a game I'm struggling to maintain interest in. And I doubt I'm the only one.

 

You are not the only one. I am sure people are leaving in droves. Most that leave couldn't be bothered to post here hence why you see a biased demographic in forums.

 

I wan't to know why someone would not leave?  You don't even have to be an end game player with everything in the game to hit that "warframe wall"

 

Even if you didn't get every weapon or every warframe in the game. Even if DE is pumping out weekly warframes/primes/scarfs/dogs/weapons etc the fundamental problem for a reasonable and objective game player is WHAT DO I DO WITH ALL THIS STUFF? 

 

The answer is NOTHING. There are 3 extremely shallow mission types/maps to do in this game that are devoid of any fun and reasonable challenge which get stale extremely fast and that's it ( I am including void) 

 

How long will DE blindly and desperately shovel this nonsense down our throats with each platinum centric weekly update? Do they not understand this type of "new content' only works if there is compelling content to use it on?

 

In fact the only thing that is keeping me remotely interested in the thing that Warframe these days is the forums. 

[tmtke]

Maybe Steve was a bit harsh, but I think the OP's wording is really rude on almost every points he made. I can't decide if it's from disappointment or just incapable of proposing his ideas in a decent way (as a lot of really intelligent people are), or just my English is not good enough...

 

We criticized his ideas many times waaay before this stream thing happened, so this is not some fanboyism. Although almost everybody here agrees on the most visible flaws like necessary mods taking space, or the need of deeper gameplay, the solution is wrong. At first, it's almost unreadably long. I reread it a few times when I was asked to. While it states mostly that if this would be in the game, EVERY problem would be easily solved, the design is very rough, shallow and undetailed. Yes, undetailed, regardless of the wall of text, because it just skips over things which are important, and were noted in the comments by a lot of the readers (and was asked stubbornly to reread the OP).

 

As I told somewhere in this topic, this game can be played in a lot of ways. Mine is not minmaxing. Of course I slap on those necessary mods (though I hate it), but I don't really need max damage output or overpowered frames to survive (don't even have 80% of the corrupted mods). Of course, I don't play endless defense with those ridiculously high level enemies, because it's not interesting to me. I progress slowly. I'm over 450 hours and still MR 9. I bought 2k plats almost a year ago, and still have over 400, and I never traded anything for plat. I don't have all the frames and weapons, because most of them are not interesting to me. I don't forma my equipment mindlessly, I just level them up to see if I want to keep it, and then maybe. I don't care about those, because I can help my clan/teammates with my skill and teamplay, not by pure damage output.

 

And finally, I know a lot about development in general, and in games also. There is always things you can improve within your software. And it takes time. A lot (currently I'm rewriting something in our software which at first might sound like a small thing, but it goes on and on since March). Most of us just simply can't have a clue, how many things are on the list and how hard is to make. Steve said that they know about the flaws we're talking about, and they have a backlog to do things for more than a year. So why complaining? Suggestions, yes, maybe somebody will come up with something interesting, which is FITTING in their game. Whining is unnecessary.

[Nagisawa]

And this is why I utterly despise hearing these children talk about "balance" - they always use that term to try to make this game play like others. If they want to play COD with Parkour, that's what Titanfall is for.

Ah, the Balance Fallacy.  Nice to see it crop up once again.

 

Come back when you understand what balance actually means in the context of a game, and then we can talk to you like adults.  Until then, we won't be discussing such topics until you grow out of this phase.

[HavocWolf]

removed

Edited July 9, 2014 by Brawleee

[Ja_man]

PS - I would not recommend RSI's Star Citizen to you. It would upset you greatly on its progress thus far. Stick to quick, easy, copy/paste games that are dead within a year, like Destiny.

OK, ill save hundreds of dollars not wasting money on virtual spaceships for a game that has yet to prove itself. Oh, I get it, too hipster and intelligent for AAA games. Thats cool. 

 

OT: I've done plenty of helping out newbies, trading, starchart clearing, and weapon making. If you started playing warframe before update 10, you probably have all the guns/primes you need. there is literally no motivation to continue playing this game aside from just enjoying the gameplay after so long . Too bad Its so incredibly shallow after you discover the "element multishot element damage element" combo and a few corrupt mods. There is/has been nothing to progress past once you buy orthos/boltor/rhino prime for 75 plat in the market. all you need is MR 2 and 10 bucks. Its a shame its so easy and devoid of real challenge.

 

I think It's funny how you condemn a game that's not even in beta yet simply because "it's AAA". You say Warframe can't keep up with how fast we play the game? When will it? every update just adds more fluff we don't need. Wow kubrows and a personal Dojo? what a game changer. I don't even remember what the last 3 updates added besides new frames and more RNG. Melee 2.0 was a swing and a miss for more engaging combat, same as damage 2.0 IMO. Neither added any real depth or meat to the gameplay. Not to insult warframe, but Destiny doesen't have to prove much to be more worthy of my next 60 bucks. Most of the "new stuff" they add is so much fluff, It's like a teddy bear.

 

TL:DR Form follows Function not vice versa.

 

Edit: @ 43 emprah. How so? I didn't mention bf3 in my games that weren't min max based, but optyk claimed I did. secondly, Everyone claimed the M16 was the best, but I didnt use it. I was just pointing out you didn't need it to be good at bf. Thirdly, assault was my second least used class in play time, so "most used class b/c self preservation"-optyk was not true for me either, and all that time spent with other classes + kills with non-assault kit weapons is evidence enough that it wasn't a "must use weapon" to be good.

Edited July 9, 2014 by Ja_man

[43Emprah]

OK, ill save hundreds of dollars not wasting money on virtual spaceships for a game that has yet to prove itself. Oh, I get it, too hipster and intelligent for AAA games. Thats cool. 

 

OT: I've done plenty of helping out newbies, trading, starchart clearing, and weapon making. If you started playing warframe before update 10, you probably have all the guns/primes you need. there is literally no motivation to continue playing this game aside from just enjoying the gameplay after so long . Too bad Its so incredibly shallow after you discover the "element multishot element damage element" combo and a few corrupt mods. There is/has been nothing to progress past once you buy orthos/boltor/rhino prime for 75 plat in the market. all you need is MR 2 and 10 bucks. Its a shame its so easy and devoid of real challenge.

 

I think It's funny how you condemn a game that's not even in beta yet to warframe. You say Warframe can't keep up with how fast we play the game? When will it? every update just adds more fluff we don't need. Wow kubrows and a personal Dojo? what a game changer. I don't even remember what the last 3 updates added besides new frames and more RNG. Melee 2.0 was a swing and a miss for more engaging combat, same as damage 2.0 IMO. Neither added any real depth or meat to the gameplay. Not to insult warframe, but Destiny doesen't have to prove much to be more worthy of my next 60 bucks. Most of the "new stuff" they add is so much fluff, It's like a teddy bear.

 

TL:DR Form follows Function not vice versa.

 

Edit: @ 43 emprah. How so? I didn't mention bf3 in my games that weren't min max based, but optyk claimed I did. secondly, Everyone claimed the M16 was the best, but I didnt use it. I was just pointing out you didn't need it to be good at bf. Thirdly, assault was my second least used class in play time, so "most used class b/c self preservation"-optyk was not true for me either, and all that time spent with other classes + kills with non-assault kit weapons is evidence enough that it wasn't a "must use weapon" to be good.

It was more of a friendly jab, than a blatant criticism. I understand that tone is nonexistent in a forum post, though. 

I was just making a point about the fact that the AEK was highly regarded as the best assault rifle in the game by most of the community, because of the fact that it blatantly performed the job better than all other weapons of it's class. M16 stats are horribly inflated by the fact that it's kill stats actually record the progress of two guns, and it is the default US assault rifle. When you consider the number of players using a starter set-up in comparison to a later game unlock, and the fact that battlelog/stat parses collected data for the M16A3 and the M16A4 as a single weapon, instead of two, like it should have, you get people linking and claiming it to be the "op" gun of the game.

I just thought it was kind of humorous that you linked your BF3 stats to disprove using the powerhouse weapon that someone else falsely claimed to be so, when you were in reality using the ACTUAL powerhouse weapon.

Not knocking it, use what you enjoy, it a video game. Hell my stats got completely ruined when the M26 Dart became OP and a few friends and I had fun with it for 2-3 days, and racked up 20-30 service stars with it, dwarfing any kind of legitimate play.

I myself sympathize with your stance at its heart. I was a diehard engineer player, I only played assault when we were up against all assault squads, and we had to fight fire with fire. I loved sniping and managed to be credit to team while doing so. It was just kind of ironic is all, I should have clarified that originally.

Edited July 9, 2014 by 43Emprah

[Janzer]

Maybe Steve was a bit harsh, but I think the OP's wording is really rude on almost every points he made. I can't decide if it's from disappointment or just incapable of proposing his ideas in a decent way (as a lot of really intelligent people are), or just my English is not good enough...

 

We criticized his ideas many times waaay before this stream thing happened, so this is not some fanboyism. Although almost everybody here agrees on the most visible flaws like necessary mods taking space, or the need of deeper gameplay, the solution is wrong. At first, it's almost unreadably long. I reread it a few times when I was asked to. While it states mostly that if this would be in the game, EVERY problem would be easily solved, the design is very rough, shallow and undetailed. Yes, undetailed, regardless of the wall of text, because it just skips over things which are important, and were noted in the comments by a lot of the readers (and was asked stubbornly to reread the OP).

 

As I told somewhere in this topic, this game can be played in a lot of ways. Mine is not minmaxing. Of course I slap on those necessary mods (though I hate it), but I don't really need max damage output or overpowered frames to survive (don't even have 80% of the corrupted mods). Of course, I don't play endless defense with those ridiculously high level enemies, because it's not interesting to me. I progress slowly. I'm over 450 hours and still MR 9. I bought 2k plats almost a year ago, and still have over 400, and I never traded anything for plat. I don't have all the frames and weapons, because most of them are not interesting to me. I don't forma my equipment mindlessly, I just level them up to see if I want to keep it, and then maybe. I don't care about those, because I can help my clan/teammates with my skill and teamplay, not by pure damage output.

 

And finally, I know a lot about development in general, and in games also. There is always things you can improve within your software. And it takes time. A lot (currently I'm rewriting something in our software which at first might sound like a small thing, but it goes on and on since March). Most of us just simply can't have a clue, how many things are on the list and how hard is to make. Steve said that they know about the flaws we're talking about, and they have a backlog to do things for more than a year. So why complaining? Suggestions, yes, maybe somebody will come up with something interesting, which is FITTING in their game. Whining is unnecessary.

 

Well said. I'd elaborate on what I find to be good points, but I'm at work :D  I just had to log in because your viewpoint and sentiments about the game are very much appreciated.

[HansJurgen]

I have started playing about the same time as you and share similar accomplishments at this point in the game. I am glad you took the time to articulate my sentiments about this came so well. I agree with you 100% - good job.

 

I knew it was time to walk away from the game when I started buying colors on a weekly basis.

 

I walked away (about the time I made that post) and haven't looked back.

[HansJurgen]

Maybe Steve was a bit harsh, but I think the OP's wording is really rude on almost every points he made. I can't decide if it's from disappointment or just incapable of proposing his ideas in a decent way (as a lot of really intelligent people are), or just my English is not good enough...

 

We criticized his ideas many times waaay before this stream thing happened, so this is not some fanboyism. Although almost everybody here agrees on the most visible flaws like necessary mods taking space, or the need of deeper gameplay, the solution is wrong. At first, it's almost unreadably long. I reread it a few times when I was asked to. While it states mostly that if this would be in the game, EVERY problem would be easily solved, the design is very rough, shallow and undetailed. Yes, undetailed, regardless of the wall of text, because it just skips over things which are important, and were noted in the comments by a lot of the readers (and was asked stubbornly to reread the OP).

 

As I told somewhere in this topic, this game can be played in a lot of ways. Mine is not minmaxing. Of course I slap on those necessary mods (though I hate it), but I don't really need max damage output or overpowered frames to survive (don't even have 80% of the corrupted mods). Of course, I don't play endless defense with those ridiculously high level enemies, because it's not interesting to me. I progress slowly. I'm over 450 hours and still MR 9. I bought 2k plats almost a year ago, and still have over 400, and I never traded anything for plat. I don't have all the frames and weapons, because most of them are not interesting to me. I don't forma my equipment mindlessly, I just level them up to see if I want to keep it, and then maybe. I don't care about those, because I can help my clan/teammates with my skill and teamplay, not by pure damage output.

 

And finally, I know a lot about development in general, and in games also. There is always things you can improve within your software. And it takes time. A lot (currently I'm rewriting something in our software which at first might sound like a small thing, but it goes on and on since March). Most of us just simply can't have a clue, how many things are on the list and how hard is to make. Steve said that they know about the flaws we're talking about, and they have a backlog to do things for more than a year. So why complaining? Suggestions, yes, maybe somebody will come up with something interesting, which is FITTING in their game. Whining is unnecessary.

 

 

Sorry, this "but it is not that bad" excuse does not convince me in the slightest to give this game a second chance. Why would I bother with a "not that bad" game when I can try out good ones?

 

Glad to hear it works for you, though.

[SquirmyBurrito]

Sorry, this "but it is not that bad" excuse does not convince me in the slightest to give this game a second chance. Why would I bother with a "not that bad" game when I can try out good ones?

 

Glad to hear it works for you, though.

 

 

Seriously though, the game is still in beta. What exactly were you expecting when you picked it up? Most early access/beta games are lacking some degree of gameplay and/or polish, they amount that they're lacking varies from game to game. It also happens to be free 2 play, which should give it some degree of wiggle room as far as expectations go. 

 

I'm not trying to convince you to play the game again (as I really couldn't care less), I'm just saying you should have known what you were getting into.

[LtZefar]

I'm sure I commented on this topic in some manner but I'm gonna do it again.

https://i.imgur.com/o5O24BL.jpg

 

Going by that picture I will tell you the most ideal build.

 

Cores: Critical Damage

Magazines: Critical Rounds

Barrel: Split Chamber

Underbarrel: Ammo Storage

Accessory: Something that actually helps.

 

But now I've select all the best options for a weapon. When would one ever use a Silencer over Split Chamber? Or even Primed and Charge chamber? When you can get double the power all the time?

 

Why bother with Elemental rounds when enemy variation is quite big and where Critical is just better overall in every way.  Ammo storage is better for weapons with bad ammo consumption too.

 

So all in all you've just made it less unique and turned it into Battlefield 3 and 4 type unlocks instead. When we now can mod our weapon with a lot of damage stuff and have fun with them. Also I can't do Rainbow builds on those guns. I want to do Rainbow builds. This is the only game that lets me do this. Every other game limits me in so many ways it's not fun to play. 

 

Now for this image.

https://i.imgur.com/0KncGH4.jpg

That looks like a linear path on each part. How is that gonna solve the problem with all Warframes using the same mods? When here everyone will use the same path.

 

 

Now I'm not a snotty little kid that just like to powerful. I've played plenty of MMORPG in my life and only two really got a grip on me. 

 

Ragnarok Online and Dragonica. Ragnarok Online being the best one of the two because it added such freedom. The cards which where are basically the same as Mods in Warframe allowed the player to gain quite the power or rather become far more durable and do far more damage.

 

For example if I wanted to take as little damage as possible from Fire monsters I would use a Fire Armor, Fire Muffler, A card in the shield that reduce damage from the Form type that monster was and that's about it. Now I'd take like 90% reduced damage from Fire enemies or maybe even up to 95%. It was AWESOME. I worked hard to get those cards and that was my reward, now I could have fun in that area which I did.

 

In Dragonica, stats didn't matter so much but the damage you dealt out was pretty big which is why I liked it. Also it was a bit skill based too.

 

 

But I know the Developers won't redo the whole game. They just won't. It's hard enough for them to fix useless mods and up the power on worthless damage mods to rifles and other weapons. That only increase the damage by 30% on max level. Pffft who's gonna use them?