Nuke Builds Are Ruining Gameplay Enjoyment

[Merkranire]

Just now, Aesyaan said:

I play multiplayer all the time, and I don't see how me responding late changes anything. All the replies here weren't going anywhere, so I read them all. To tell you the truth you just seem self-centered wanting people who don't want to waste their time to conform to your standards.

You can play multiplayer and not want to be there. Ask anyone else in this thread, that’s kind of part of the reason they build the way they do, so as to not have to rely on others.

I think you’ll be hard-pressed to find someone who’ll say “My build is designed to not do everything on its own”

[Merkranire]

Just now, darklord122 said:

You can keep smoking that copium. Wont change a thing.

🤔 Maybe I should posit it to DE. They have had problems trying to keep the game fun for everyone, far as I know, and instead of taking away your toys (by extension my toys), a filter based on the player knowing what they want might be a better solution.

Of course that requires players knowing what they want. Which means knowing why you’re joining multiplayer

[(PSN)AyinDygra]

When you play multiplayer, you don't gain control of the rest of the group. The game mode's objectives gain control of the group.

Warframe is co-op, in multiplayer, as opposed to PVP multiplayer. You're all working toward the same objective, not against each other.

Under these circumstances, whether or not you get to kill something doesn't really matter if the objective was to kill that something. The only problem here, is you demanding to be the one that killed that something, instead of other players in the multiplayer mission.

If you want to play a certain way, play solo, or build a team that shares your particular goals. Those are your only options here. Those are my only options here. As I said previously, I don't insist on Voca hunting in an exterminate bounty in the labs... that's not the objective of the mission, that's not the objective of the other players who grouped up randomly... that would be selfish and inconsiderate to the other players.

[darklord122]

2 minutes ago, Merkranire said:

You can play multiplayer and not want to be there. Ask anyone else in this thread, that’s kind of part of the reason they build the way they do, so as to not have to rely on others.

I think you’ll be hard-pressed to find someone who’ll say “My build is designed to not do everything on its own”

Maybe ask yourself if the game itself is intended for your type of play.

Either way, Ill enjoy my game with everyone else while you can whine about everyone else.

[Merkranire]

2 minutes ago, darklord122 said:

Maybe ask yourself if the game itself is intended for your type of play.

Either way, Ill enjoy my game with everyone else while you can whine about everyone else.

Game works good, in ways I wish other games did.

The problems happen when you and I meet for mysteeerious reasons that involve an expectation that I’m going to fight you for something to do, since I also play with my partner and the game’s even better together, so all it needs is a way to prevent you and I from meeting

[Tsukinoki]

5 minutes ago, Aesyaan said:

I play multiplayer all the time, and I don't see how me responding late changes anything. All the replies here weren't going anywhere, so I read them all. To tell you the truth you just seem self-centered wanting people who don't want to waste their time to conform to your standards.

No real point in arguing with him.

He wants players to be psychic and predict "Merkranire wants to play 10 minutes in this survival, I better unequip most of my mods so that I can barely go 10 minutes instead of having gear on to go 20+ like I want to because his desires are so much more important and valid than my desires."
After all if you're built to go 20 minutes in a survival and he's built for 10 then you're going to outshine him and kill more than him and that's just not fair!

If you have anything that outshines his build/weapon in any way then you obviously aren't playing properly as only his desires and play style matters.

If that means he wants to spend 10 minutes in an exterminate fissure slowly going through then that is what the rest of the team is going to do, because if you don't then you aren't being considerate or properly playing the game!  After all the only thing that matters is how Merkranire wants to play.

It doesn't matter at all how fast the other 3 players wants to go.
It doesn't matter at all how far the other 3 players want to push endless missions.
All that matters is what Merkranire wants and how he wants to play.

 

Either you play ball exactly how he wants to play ball, or you should be tossed out because obviously you're the rude one for not conforming exactly to his unstated desires when you queue up for a PUG match to crack some relics.

[Merkranire]

1 minute ago, Tsukinoki said:

No real point in arguing with him.

He wants players to be psychic and predict "Merkranire wants to play 10 minutes in this survival, I better unequip most of my mods so that I can barely go 10 minutes instead of having gear on to go 20+ like I want to because his desires are so much more important and valid than my desires."
After all if you're built to go 20 minutes in a survival and he's built for 10 then you're going to outshine him and kill more than him and that's just not fair!

If you have anything that outshines his build/weapon in any way then you obviously aren't playing properly as only his desires and play style matters.

If that means he wants to spend 10 minutes in an exterminate fissure slowly going through then that is what the rest of the team is going to do, because if you don't then you aren't being considerate or properly playing the game!  After all the only thing that matters is how Merkranire wants to play.

It doesn't matter at all how fast the other 3 players wants to go.
It doesn't matter at all how far the other 3 players want to push endless missions.
All that matters is what Merkranire wants and how he wants to play.

 

Either you play ball exactly how he wants to play ball, or you should be tossed out because obviously you're the rude one for not conforming exactly to his unstated desires when you queue up for a PUG match to crack some relics.

Butt out, this isn’t a “Make your gun do a certain amount of damage” or whatever, this is a “There’s literally nothing left to do”

[Merkranire]

11 minutes ago, Tsukinoki said:

No real point in arguing with him.

He wants players to be psychic and predict "Merkranire wants to play 10 minutes in this survival, I better unequip most of my mods so that I can barely go 10 minutes instead of having gear on to go 20+ like I want to because his desires are so much more important and valid than my desires."
After all if you're built to go 20 minutes in a survival and he's built for 10 then you're going to outshine him and kill more than him and that's just not fair!

If you have anything that outshines his build/weapon in any way then you obviously aren't playing properly as only his desires and play style matters.

If that means he wants to spend 10 minutes in an exterminate fissure slowly going through then that is what the rest of the team is going to do, because if you don't then you aren't being considerate or properly playing the game!  After all the only thing that matters is how Merkranire wants to play.

It doesn't matter at all how fast the other 3 players wants to go.
It doesn't matter at all how far the other 3 players want to push endless missions.
All that matters is what Merkranire wants and how he wants to play.

 

Either you play ball exactly how he wants to play ball, or you should be tossed out because obviously you're the rude one for not conforming exactly to his unstated desires when you queue up for a PUG match to crack some relics.

Seriously, re-reading this, just how granular do you think I’m talking? The game’s surprisingly robust, when it gets a chance to exist

[(PSN)AyinDygra]

18 minutes ago, Merkranire said:

I think you’ll be hard-pressed to find someone who’ll say “My build is designed to not do everything on its own”

Actually, I have a Styanax build designed to provide support for my team, entirely, with whatever offensive bonuses that build provides being ancilliary to the main goal. He's an overshield and energy battery extraordinaire. I primarily bring that along to compliment my roommate's low HP / low shield / energy hungry offensive builds, and together, we form a very powerful single unit.

I'd never run that alone in a PUG group, because it relies on having that other core part of the team, that I can't expect the other players to fill in the same way as my roommate.

[Merkranire]

Just now, (PSN)AyinDygra said:

Actually, I have a Styanax build designed to provide support for my team, entirely, with whatever offensive bonuses that build provides being ancilliary to the main goal. He's an overshield and energy battery extraordinaire. I primarily bring that along to compliment my roommate's low HP / low shield / energy hungry offensive builds, and together, we form a very powerful single unit.

I'd never run that alone in a PUG group, because it relies on having that other core part of the team, that I can't expect the other players to fill in the same way as my roommate.

Given the opportunity to not have to, do you think your teammates would want to rely on your support?

[(PSN)AyinDygra]

That really depends... if they could build entirely offensively, using no mods for shields or survival, no need for Primed Flow, no need for Adrenaline, and instead go full on offensive, they might... that's what my build lets my roommate do with the other frames, allowing them to skyrocket their other stats. However, that takes preparation and knowledge of how to work together, to stay within affinity range, and headset communication so we share the same goals minute to minute.

[Aesyaan]

17 minutes ago, Tsukinoki said:

No real point in arguing with him.

He wants players to be psychic and predict "Merkranire wants to play 10 minutes in this survival, I better unequip most of my mods so that I can barely go 10 minutes instead of having gear on to go 20+ like I want to because his desires are so much more important and valid than my desires."
After all if you're built to go 20 minutes in a survival and he's built for 10 then you're going to outshine him and kill more than him and that's just not fair!

If you have anything that outshines his build/weapon in any way then you obviously aren't playing properly as only his desires and play style matters.

If that means he wants to spend 10 minutes in an exterminate fissure slowly going through then that is what the rest of the team is going to do, because if you don't then you aren't being considerate or properly playing the game!  After all the only thing that matters is how Merkranire wants to play.

It doesn't matter at all how fast the other 3 players wants to go.
It doesn't matter at all how far the other 3 players want to push endless missions.
All that matters is what Merkranire wants and how he wants to play.

 

Either you play ball exactly how he wants to play ball, or you should be tossed out because obviously you're the rude one for not conforming exactly to his unstated desires when you queue up for a PUG match to crack some relics.

this all made me giggle quite a bit. Thank you, I needed that

[(XBOX)MesaGaming87]

On 1/19/2024 at 5:38 PM, Zinxori- said:

Say you got yourself a shiny new Gotva Prime from the Twitch Prime rewards, and you were itching to try it out in a mission. You pull up a Exterminate Fissure mission on Public matchmaking, just to increase the chances of a good reward. However, inevitably, and as many of you witnessed I'm sure whether you've been playing for 5 days or 2 weeks, that IDIOTS with no consideration for the others in the squad, will bring some ridiculous "nuke build" to Exterminate mission and blast all the enemies to hell in like 2-3 casts, and the mission is over before you even aimed up your weapon.

To some this is probably fine, and I'll sound like a complainer, but at MR27 and playing since 2015, I've seen every decent "nuke build" from Mirage Simulor to stuff like Saryn 4th spam in the current age. In things like Defense missions where the time to finish can go up due to enemies being spread out everywhere, using a wide-range, powerful nuking setup is ABSOLUTELY VALID AND UNDERSTANDABLE. But in a simple Axi Exterminate mission??? C'mon let me just shoot my Gotva and leave happy. I know I cannot be the only player who feels this way, but I'm probably one of few who would actually make a whole forum post about it. I hope this reaches players and that it generates a healthy discussion on why Nuke Builds should be UNACCEPTABLE in a simple mission like an Exterminate. Have respect for your fellow Tenno and LET THEM PLAY THE GAME TOO, or you'll risk stepping on someone's toes, even if you don't know it, or didn't intend it that way.

This sounds like just another one of those “he stole all my kills it’s not fair” moans tbh. There are umpteen missions on this game and an entire mode for you to use any weapon in any way you like. If you’re going to load into a public random lobby it’s not up to you to determine and dictate how other people should play the game how you want them too. Fissure missions are mostly done in the quickest fashion possible because that’s what 99% of people are in there to do, especially exterminate missions. I’ve never understood this complaining about other people killing things quicker than you argument at all. It’s a PVE game, they’re in your team, it’s helping you. If you don’t want that there’s plenty of options for you to avoid it. Play with friends, play in solo mode, but don’t try and dictate what other people can and can’t do or “shouldn’t” do because you can’t use your Gotva Prime in the way you’d like to. This whole argument of “nerf everything because I don’t like other people killing quicker than me” has always been one of the more irritating aspects of a certain section of the player base. 

[Merkranire]

12 minutes ago, (PSN)AyinDygra said:

That really depends... if they could build entirely offensively, using no mods for shields or survival, no need for Primed Flow, no need for Adrenaline, and instead go full on offensive, they might... that's what my build lets my roommate do with the other frames, allowing them to skyrocket their other stats. However, that takes preparation and knowledge of how to work together, to stay within affinity range, and headset communication so we share the same goals minute to minute.

I missed that it was your roomate you’re talking about.

That’s why playing with my partner is so much better as well, because we leave each other game to play while we create alternative builds and sometimes have to work together unexpectedly because something in the fight shifted. I’m assuming you’re talking high-level, but this is true for us across most any level aside from the lowest which is going to be easy regardless of what we do.

Most of this topic has been about randoms, because the solution of most of these players of “Find other likeminded players” is already available and it’s working about as well as one would expect. When it comes to just looking for some randoms to play with, expecting to rely on others is probably a bit much (though we get things like heavy weapons to draw upon), but it’s still a thing that can happen, and on some level even if someone’s not built to rely on someone, there’s still a gradient where they aren’t taking everything away.

Right now, we aren’t even at the point where people are considering how to leave some gameplay for others, much less relying on others, and again that question of “Are they even wanting to play multiplayer” comes up

Edited February 6 by Merkranire

[darklord122]

1 minute ago, Merkranire said:

I missed that it was your roomate you’re talking about.

That’s why playing with my partner is so much better as well, because we leave each other game to play and sometimes have to work together unexpectedly because something in the fight shifted. I’m assuming you’re talking high-level, but this is true for us across most any level aside from the lowest which is going to be easy regardless of what we do.

Most of this topic has been about randoms, because the solution of most of these players of “Find other likeminded players” is already available and it’s working about as well as one would expect. When it comes to just looking for some randoms to play with, expecting to rely on others is probably a bit much (though we get things like heavy weapons to draw upon), but it’s still a thing that can happen, and on some level even if someone’s not built to rely on someone, there’s still a gradient where they aren’t taking everything away.

Right now, we aren’t even at the point where people are considering how to leave some gameplay for others, much less relying on others, and again that question of “Are they even wanting to play multiplayer” comes up

People are wanting to play multiplayer just not your version of it. No game will cater to you so don't expect it from players who just want to mind their own business.

No game can be fun for everyone, If such games existed people wouldn't quit playing games in this day and age. So either increase your own enjoyment by changing the way you think everyone should play or be angry at everyone else for having fun instead of you.

The game does not need to change just because you have a set playstyle you want to force on others.

Copium.

[(PSN)AyinDygra]

Personally, the only reasons I have to go PUG, are for relic cracking missions (because 4 relics open at one time, instead of 1, and there is no solo option to bring and crack 4 relics at the same time, so it's just less efficient to do that solo), and missions, where the objective is more annoying to do solo, than with a group, such as interception and disruption (at least for me.)

I never go into multiplayer to "work with the group" against a "hard challenge" that NEEDS everyone working together to accomplish the objective. I go to other games for that sort of thing (if ever.) I used to play Destiny raids, and while that required exactly this, they were also horribly boring, annoying, punishing, and vitriol-creating experiences where repeated failures would start to create bad blood between members, along with blame throwing, and overall, a bad experience.

Warframe is my comfort game... quickly and easily zipping through missions as a one man army, slashing through hordes of enemies that don't stand a chance... THAT IS FUN for me. (whether I'm actually killing the enemies or not, if the mission is accomplished, I had fun.)

[Merkranire]

3 minutes ago, darklord122 said:

People are wanting to play multiplayer just not your version of it. No game will cater to you so don't expect it from players who just want to mind their own business.

No game can be fun for everyone, If such games existed people wouldn't quit playing games in this day and age. So either increase your own enjoyment by changing the way you think everyone should play or be angry at everyone else for having fun instead of you.

The game does not need to change just because you have a set playstyle you want to force on others.

Copium.

No, you want to solo multiplayer. Go back to your side of the filter

2 minutes ago, (PSN)AyinDygra said:

Personally, the only reasons I have to go PUG, are for relic cracking missions (because 4 relics open at one time, instead of 1, and there is no solo option to bring and crack 4 relics at the same time, so it's just less efficient to do that solo), and missions, where the objective is more annoying to do solo, than with a group, such as interception and disruption (at least for me.)

I never go into multiplayer to "work with the group" against a "hard challenge" that NEEDS everyone working together to accomplish the objective. I go to other games for that sort of thing (if ever.) I used to play Destiny raids, and while that required exactly this, they were also horribly boring, annoying, punishing, and vitriol-creating experiences where repeated failures would start to create bad blood between members, along with blame throwing, and overall, a bad experience.

Warframe is my comfort game... quickly and easily zipping through missions as a one man army, slashing through hordes of enemies that don't stand a chance... THAT IS FUN for me. (whether I'm actually killing the enemies or not, if the mission is accomplished, I had fun.)

I don’t think that’s such a personal impression, and is quite shared. That does put you at odds with having a reason to have other players on the team

[darklord122]

Just now, Merkranire said:

No, you want to solo multiplayer. Go back to your side of the filter

No I want to play multiplayer just as much as everyone else and everyone else but you is fine in doing so.
If you lose out on kills due to your lack of build its not my fault its only your own.

So keep whining about it, The game still wont cater to you with or without a filter cause you will still complain till the ends of the earth for players outperforming you because you still wont be able to dictate a single thing any person with free will can do.

So keep up with the game or don't.

[Merkranire]

6 minutes ago, darklord122 said:

No I want to play multiplayer just as much as everyone else and everyone else but you is fine in doing so.
If you lose out on kills due to your lack of build its not my fault its only your own.

So keep whining about it, The game still wont cater to you with or without a filter cause you will still complain till the ends of the earth for players outperforming you because you still wont be able to dictate a single thing any person with free will can do.

So keep up with the game or don't.

Your impression of my inconsolability is noted; I’m guessing you’re drawing upon how you would act. Though I know what the other side with gameplay alongside someone else looks like and am quite accomodating, considering my partner is not me. I just ask that we can play together instead of against each other, she would too, and it’s very easy to be accomodating and the game rewards it, both intrinsically and extrinsically

Edited February 6 by Merkranire

[Aesyaan]

4 minutes ago, Merkranire said:

Your impression of my inconsolability is noted; I’m guessing you’re drawing upon how you would act. Though I know what the other side with gameplay alongside someone else looks like and am quite accomodating, considering my partner is not me. I just ask that we can play together instead of against each other, she would too, and it’s very easy to be accomodating and the game rewards it

My man, other players killing faster than you is the exact opposite of "against each other" because they're helping you complete the mission faster and more effectively. I'm starting to feel like you're so delusioned into thinking you're right when literally everyone here is going against you and for good reason. That other guy was right, there is no point in arguing with the brick wall of nonsense that is you.

Edited February 6 by Aesyaan

[Merkranire]

1 minute ago, Aesyaan said:

My man, other players killing faster than you is the exact opposite of "against each other" because they're helping you complete the mission faster and more effectively. I'm starting to feel like you're so delusioned into thinking you're right when literally everyone here is going against you and for good reason. That other guy was right, there is no point in arguing with a brick wall of nonsense.

And you think I’m fine with sitting around with my thumb up my ass or fighting for scraps of content to engage with.

I would run around farming resources in Open World or hunting for Vocas on my own if you’re going to do everything yourself and have made it clear you don’t need my help. Normally I’d be more considerate, but if you can’t spare the thought, I’m thinking I can’t either

[darklord122]

1 minute ago, Merkranire said:

Your impression of my inconsolability is noted; I’m guessing you’re drawing upon how you would act. Though I know what the other side with gameplay alongside someone else looks like and am quite accomodating, considering my partner is not me. I just ask that we can play together instead of against each other, she would too, and it’s very easy to be accomodating and the game rewards it

The problem is people are playing together with you. But you still must realize you are not the center of the game and people are allowed to play the way the wish. And if that disrupts your playstyle its not their responsibility to change.

Its not that they are inconsiderate its that they want to enjoy the game with other players in their own way.

The game does not increasingly reward players for playing at a certain build and sticking to that, The game actively rewards players for finishing things fast while sticking together for the maximum rewards on higher tiers.

So realize, You are not the center of this universe. People are accommodating in different ways and just because you dont get to play a very specific way in a game where high damage and clearing missions fast is highly rewarded its still not everyone else fault.

So stop expecting everyone to accommodate for you, When you wont accommodate for the way they play. All you want is your way, But you never stopped to think about their way and why they want to play that way.

So realize that people are playing together with you, Its just that they have different performances and preferences to play. And that's their right to do.

[Aesyaan]

Just now, Merkranire said:

And you think I’m fine with sitting around with my thumb up my ass or fighting for scraps of content to engage with.

I would run around farming resources in Open World or hunting for Vocas on my own if you’re going to do everything yourself and have made it clear you don’t need my help. Normally I’d be more considerate, but if you can’t spare the thought, I’m thinking I can’t either

yeah you should be fine with your thumb up your ass because it means less work for you, in fact they are doing most of the work so you should be thanking them instead. It's not another player's responsibility to be less efficient just because you "want to help" when you have no need or reason to.

[Merkranire]

1 minute ago, darklord122 said:

The problem is people are playing together with you. But you still must realize you are not the center of the game and people are allowed to play the way the wish. And if that disrupts your playstyle its not their responsibility to change.

Its not that they are inconsiderate its that they want to enjoy the game with other players in their own way.

The game does not increasingly reward players for playing at a certain build and sticking to that, The game actively rewards players for finishing things fast while sticking together for the maximum rewards on higher tiers.

So realize, You are not the center of this universe. People are accommodating in different ways and just because you dont get to play a very specific way in a game where high damage and clearing missions fast is highly rewarded its still not everyone else fault.

So stop expecting everyone to accommodate for you, When you wont accommodate for the way they play. All you want is your way, But you never stopped to think about their way and why they want to play that way.

So realize that people are playing together with you, Its just that they have different performances and preferences to play. And that's their right to do.

Oh I realise that we’re in the same mission, we’re fighting the same enemies, we exist within proximity to each other and can, I dunno, chat, because one of us is doing everything themselves. Is that doing a thing together then?

Gee, I should just sit down and shut up and be grateful that they aren’t making things harder, though by this point I’d welcome that

1 minute ago, Aesyaan said:

yeah you should be fine with your thumb up your ass because it means less work for you, in fact they are doing most of the work so you should be thanking them instead. It's not another player's responsibility to be less efficient just because you "want to help" when you have no need or reason to.

Ooooooooohhhhhhhh

[darklord122]

1 minute ago, Merkranire said:

Oh I realise that we’re in the same mission, we’re fighting the same enemies, we exist within proximity to each other and can, I dunno, chat, because one of us is doing everything themselves. Is that doing a thing together then?

Gee, I should just sit down and shut up and be grateful that they aren’t making things harder, though by this point I’d welcome that

Ooooooooohhhhhhhh

At this point maybe you should, Because you can't have enough self reflection to see that your way is not the only way.

So good luck with that mindset in this game and every other game, Cause you will be just as miserable.