Tenacious Bond

[4thBro]

Do they really mean FINAL crit chance?

 

Or is that before orange/red calcs?

[LittleLeoniePrime]

final as in after mods and any potential abilities and other buffs in active gameplay.

Edited July 28 by LittleLeoniePrime

[4thBro]

I'm not asking about mods or abilities or buffs.

I'm asking about orange and red+ crits.

 

If you're not sure how it works, I'll explain the math:

 

Let's say a weapon's crit damage stat is... I dunno, 3.4x.

That means when it's a white hit, you're dealing 1x damage. But when it's a yellow crit, you're dealing 3.4x damage.

But let's now say your crit chance is 150%. You have a 50% chance to yellow crit, and a 50% chance to orange crit. This orange crit will have (crit damage - 1) added to the crit multiplier. In this case, it'll be 3.4x + 2.4x which gives us an orange crit of 5.8x damage.

This linear math continues onward with red crits, adding 2.4x damage to the crit damage multiplier for each crit tier you advance in.

 

What I'm asking is... Does Tenacious Bond add the 1.2x crit to the ABSOLUTE FINAL crit damage stat, or just to the final yellow crit damage stat?

 

This is what the difference would look like with the above hypothetical weapon:

 

Actual final:

Yellow crit = 4.6x

Orange crit = 7x

1st Tier Red crit = 9.4x

 

Final, but before crit tiers:

Yellow crit = 4.6x

Orange crit = 9.4x

1st Tier Red crit = 13x

[German]

Since the game always calculates mods first, I'd say orange and red crits acting as an outside multiplier, will multiply the final crit damage with the  tenacious bond increase.

Don't have proof but since that's how the game usually works I think it's save to say it does here aswell. Afterall tenacious bond is even displayed in the arsenal crit damage.

[4thBro]

34 minutes ago, German said:

Since the game always calculates mods first, I'd say orange and red crits acting as an outside multiplier, will multiply the final crit damage with the  tenacious bond increase.

Don't have proof but since that's how the game usually works I think it's save to say it does here aswell. Afterall tenacious bond is even displayed in the arsenal crit damage.

Yeahhhhhh that's my assumption, but I feel like it could equally go either way, as it merely depends on where they placed it in the formula.

The Arsenal sheet already doesn't account for crits past yellow. So maybe what we're seeing right now is simply:

(modded crit damage * undisplayed crit tier) + Bond

... Instead of...

(modded crit damage + Bond) * undisplayed crit tier

 

And, personally, I hold literally 0 value on their use of the word "final". They are infamous for their incorrect wordings that were intended to make things easier to understand for newbies, but ended up being more misleading for those that understand the game mechanics.

 

🤔🤷‍♂️

Edited July 28 by 4thBro

[PublikDomain]

Since the mod affects the Final Critical Damage I'd have to think it means after tiers and headcrits and such have been calculated, since the Crit Tier is part of the Final Critical Damage.

Final Critical Damage = 1 + Critical Tier * (Modded Critical Damage - 1)

As written, this would then be multiplied by 1.2x.

With 3.4x Modded Critical Damage and 150% Critical Chance you'd deal:

• Yellow Crit: 1 + 1 * (3.4 - 1) = 3.4x * 1.2 = 4.08x
• Orange Crit: 1 + 2 * (3.4 - 1) = 5.8x * 1.2 = 6.96x

If it were the other way around, the mod could simply say "+120% Critical Damage". But it specifically calls out 1.2x Final Critical Damage, similar to Faction Damage which also applies at the end after everything else.

Edited July 28 by PublikDomain

[4thBro]

Thanks for the post! A little badly timed, though, haha :S

 

I just thoroughly tested it in Simulacrum. It's actually not final. It's before crit tiers. (Which is the good answer for we the people.)

 

I'll upload the test, in case anyone is ever curious about this as I was.

[(PSN)Sentiel]

The way I understand this mod is that it adds flat 1.2 CD to all your weapons. So a 2.0 CD weapon turn into a 3.2 CD weapon. Naturally, if you get above 100%.CC this 3.2 CD turns into a 6.4 CD.

All in all it's a pretty strong and useful mod.

[4thBro]

 

For anyone interested.

[PublikDomain]

Did some checking ingame myself, and yep it's a flat addition to your Modded Critical Damage. Something new added to my spreadsheet :)

[PublikDomain]

Also I found that the buff stacks, so Khora can get +2.4x if both companions have the mod.

[TsukuyomiNoGeki]

2 hours ago, PublikDomain said:

Also I found that the buff stacks, so Khora can get +2.4x if both companions have the mod.

2.4? Seems very excessive. Are sure it's not 1.44?

[PublikDomain]

1 hour ago, TsukuyomiNoGeki said:

2.4? Seems very excessive. Are sure it's not 1.44?

Yep, it's +2.4. You're welcome to confirm independently though.

• Unmodded Khora Prime
• Venari Prime with Tenacious Bond + Bite
• MOA companion with Tenacious Bond, Vulklok with Critical Delay
• Tenant with Sacrificial Steel

Heavy attack deals 6x damage, so my calculator says it should hit an Infested Charger for 11,285 damage on an Orange Crit when it has +2.4 Crit Damage (4.8x total).

The Arsenal in the sim also shows the expired buff in your stats when you enter it, here showing the 4.8x being downgraded to a 2.4x:

With Organ Shatter equipped and then entering the Arsenal menu, it shows the 7x Crit being downgraded to 4.6x:

Edited July 28 by PublikDomain

[TsukuyomiNoGeki]

6 hours ago, PublikDomain said:

Yep, it's +2.4. You're welcome to confirm independently though.

• Unmodded Khora Prime
• Venari Prime with Tenacious Bond + Bite
• MOA companion with Tenacious Bond, Vulklok with Critical Delay
• Tenant with Sacrificial Steel

Heavy attack deals 6x damage, so my calculator says it should hit an Infested Charger for 11,285 damage on an Orange Crit when it has +2.4 Crit Damage (4.8x total).

The Arsenal in the sim also shows the expired buff in your stats when you enter it, here showing the 4.8x being downgraded to a 2.4x:

With Organ Shatter equipped and then entering the Arsenal menu, it shows the 7x Crit being downgraded to 4.6x:

Ah yes. My bad, for whatever reason, all this time I thought tenacious bond would multiply the crit modifier by 1.2, and not actually add a flat 1.2 value

[BoochieKatt]

On 2024-07-28 at 5:35 PM, PublikDomain said:

Yep, it's +2.4. You're welcome to confirm independently though.

• Unmodded Khora Prime
• Venari Prime with Tenacious Bond + Bite
• MOA companion with Tenacious Bond, Vulklok with Critical Delay
• Tenant with Sacrificial Steel

Heavy attack deals 6x damage, so my calculator says it should hit an Infested Charger for 11,285 damage on an Orange Crit when it has +2.4 Crit Damage (4.8x total).

The Arsenal in the sim also shows the expired buff in your stats when you enter it, here showing the 4.8x being downgraded to a 2.4x:

With Organ Shatter equipped and then entering the Arsenal menu, it shows the 7x Crit being downgraded to 4.6x:

Does it work with whip claw?

[PublikDomain]

36 minutes ago, BoochieKatt said:

Does it work with whip claw?

Yep! 😈

[Venus-Venera]

good tests. too bad that the mod is hardly possible anywhere. because cats don't convince me at all. and khora has too few areas of application in my opinion.

I also tested it with kullervo and I hardly notice any damage boost. and according to the stats it's only 1x tau vielott shard more for me. so kind of pointless because verglas with cold+corr brings extreme advantages.