Are We Ever Going To Get Unique Weaponry?

[KvotheTheArcane1]

Complaining about something when you already spent 250$, and recieved more then enough plat... Either way you cut it, it boils down to one thing.

 

Also, I'm talking in general, I never said it was the shotgun that time. Make sure you read better, I'm saying having any type of gun, that can take an enemy out of play for a duration of time. Without costing more then a single bullet is too powerful, like doing a max status weapon already in game, with blast. Sure the status wont get over 40% I beleieve, but in it's own way, having the ability to keep an enemy from ever moving, with more then a bullet is too game breaking. Example, Vauban's vortex only costing one enery per cast.

1. errr no. How much money he spent is irrelevant of what he thinks of plat prices. Where did you get the idea they were linked?

 

2. Again, who said it has to cost a single bullet? It could cost a special ammo type, or a percentage of a clip, or have a cooldown and one of the above. If it did cost a single bullet then yes, it'd probably be OP, which is why it wouldn't cost one bullet.

[Luminati07]

So yeah, good job, starting a debate. To only turn around and be like. "I'm ignoring you now, because you don't see it my way."

Argh, why do I always fall for traps.

 

You're right, this did start a debate.

 

Why am I not replying to you?

Because after dealing with certain individuals on these forums, getting into heated debates such as this one accomplishes nothing except giving mods a reason for a lock.

 

I can tell when a debate will turn into an argument.

Ending the debate is the best way to avoid that.

 

There was a time when mods were extremely lock-happy, and I'd rather not have this one succumb to that as well.

[ArchangelForcas]

1. errr no. How much money he spent is irrelevant of what he thinks of plat prices. Where did you get the idea they were linked?

 

2. Again, who said it has to cost a single bullet? It could cost a special ammo type, or a percentage of a clip, or have a cooldown and one of the above. If it did cost a single bullet then yes, it'd probably be OP, which is why it wouldn't cost one bullet.

"It could cost a special ammo type, or a percentage of a clip, or have a cooldown and one of the above."

You see that thing in the top right corner with numbers, 1,2,3, and 4. That is called your Warframes abilities. It costs something called energy.

Also you see that aresenal tab? Open that up, go to your gun, click upgrade. Add certain mods, and OMG look. The gun now has special properties that happen once in a ever great so often called effect procing. CONGRATS YOU LEARNED WARFRAME 101... Would you like more redundancy in your samwich?

[Aesthetic_Dialectic]

The reason Borderlands had issues, was due to the random weapon generator.

 

It is hard to make insane weapons work (Borderlands stick homing tesla cluster grenades that heal).

But, hand crafted ones with some kind of unique mechanic aren't as hard.

 

They work extremely well.

 

In regards to powers/weapons.

I'll detail that in my thread that's in progress. Will be finished when I'm home from work.

 

I just...

 

Alright, like I did with Arlayn, I'm not replying to you after this. I can tell it's not going to lead anywhere.

 

1. So, because I spent a lot of money on the game, I'm not allowed to think about what's fair for players who don't have my amount of expendable income?

I couldn't give 2 S#&$s whether DE releases a gun that's $25. It doesn't affect me.

 

But, what about the newer guys? Those who aren't informed about the foundry.

They see a shiny new weapon, they spend $20 on it.

 

Then, a week later they are educated on the foundry.

That's some shady stuff right there.

 

Second. The shotgun.

Again, nobody suggested it for Warframe.

That's one example.

 

Is anyone suggesting it for this game? not at all.

Do some people want some actual variety? Hell yes.

 

That's enough for now.

Good day.

Well Borderlands 2 actually works like this on it's drops: manufacturer/weapontype> Manufacturer> Grade> body> grip> barrel> sight> element> Accesory> material> Prefix> title> game stage

So basically for the norfleet it works like this

First it rolls to see what type, for our case it will be a maliw an rocket launcher

Then it rolls for the balance, again for us this is Maliwan Unique Alien Norfleet

Then manufacturer Maliwan

The grade which is the level, 72 over power 8 effectively level 80

Then body, maliwan rocket launcher rarity 5

Barrel Alien Norfleet

Sight Maliwan

Stock Maliwan

Element Shock

Accessory Reload speed

Material mat maliwan 3 norfleet

Prefix is always based on the accessory so for this it's Prudential

Title is norfleet because that's the rarity, which forced the balance to be norfleet and the barrel to be alien norfleet

Game stage is just level again which is 80 in our case.

THe only variables in a single weapon balance/rarity is the stock, sight, grip, accessory and Element which do not change the weapons function on statistics for reload speed, damage multiplier, accuracy, recoil, magazine size and firerate. So based on that I'm not sure what you're talking about but I hope balanced unique weapons can be made in this game regardless.

[ArchangelForcas]

Argh, why do I always fall for traps.

 

You're right, this did start a debate.

 

Why am I not replying to you?

Because after dealing with certain individuals on these forums, getting into heated debates such as this one accomplishes nothing except giving mods a reason for a lock.

 

I can tell when a debate will turn into an argument.

Ending the debate is the best way to avoid that.

 

There was a time when mods were extremely lock-happy, and I'd rather not have this one succumb to that as well.

Okay, I'll just give me opinion. I don't think the whole weapons getting such "Unique" effects should happen. Unless maybe something like the Ignis, Ogris, Torid. Only due to the fact, it takes away from having a frame to have those abilities already in some shape or form. Unless they bring out a frame that pratically has no abilities what so ever, like nothing at all. Then I could see a need, or want for that. But personally, anything over the fact of weapons being granted a unique ability, kinda takes away from the game, unless it's something like the current dmg 2.0.

[Brahmastra]

As for me, every weapon that comes out goes onto the "wait-for-the-next-proper-event-to-level up-pile"

I really cba anymore to grind all the weapons to 30 without a purpose. At least an event feels like you're doing something useful.

 

I rather just have DE fix things or make up something for in the long term. I'm pretty sure that 90% of the people that play this game get these reinforcement weapons to 30 then sell or never use them ever again.

 

Looking back on update 11 they added 3 weapons. Why not release about 6-9 of them instead of these weekly reinforcements.

 

 

Anyway just look at this guys post and the up votes he got.

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/143351-update-1120/?p=1699705

[qqchurch]

Would be nice if that Grineer Heat-Polearm/Hammer thing they showed in the recent Livestreams would have a large AoE fire-attack on its charge attack, or maybe even mixing in fire damage in some of the normal attacks. Not like the Deat Swords wherein the only instance of fire damage actually comes from its slam attack (I'm still really bummed out that HEAT swords don't even deal fire damage on normal attacks).

 

That Flak-cannon/charge shotgun also seemed interesting, but apart from the lessened spread mechanic, it doesn't really seem to stand out. Maybe make the bullets ricochet like some other flak-cannons I know (Jedi Knight II: Jedi Outcast had that, I think). 

 

In fact, Jedi Knight II: Jedi Outcast was actually a pretty fun game (for me at least). All of the weapons had an alternate fire mechanic, the E11 Blaster can shoot higher damage bullets at the cost of more ammo, the Wookie Bowcaster (energy crossbow) can charge up to fire 5 bolts in a horizontal spread or a ricocheting single strong bolt depending on which fire button you're charging with, or that repeater rifle that can be a suppressing mini-gun (like the Supra) or an AoE damage/cc weapon with its attached grenade launcher....

 

...it would be really nice to have more charge-type weapons with more interesting alternate fire mechanics, is what I'm trying to say. Or just more fun weapons than Corpus Assault Rifle (Dera), Grineer Assault Rifle (Grakata - more SMG I think, but meh), and Infeste- oh wait. 

 

Maybe... semi-auto radiation/heat projectile pistol that has a charge-attack that can fire a strong hitscan beam of pure pain something at the cost of 1/4 or 1/2 its clip? 

 

Or, a burst-fire dart gun that can... I dunno, fire tracking darts that can stick to a target for a small amount of damage and detonate for 2-3 times the on-hit damage 3-5 seconds later? Or maybe just induce 100% status proc when they explode? 

 

Yeah, I guess I'm rambling. :v

 

Might as well make a suggestion thread in weapon feedback while I'm at it.... not that I have the time between writing other things and just being lazy

 

-

 

Also, to anyone wondering about that grineer heat-polearm/hammer thing:

 

 

I remember Steve or one of the devs saying it has a 'cool' animation during its charge attack where the heat-source opens up and lets it do fire damage. Kind of hoping it becomes true, tbh.

 

-

 

Also, I don't get why the stand on letting weapons also do warframe ability-type effects? Is it because it diminishes the importance of our super space-ninja powers? That there would be a setup that actually makes several frames obsolete?

 

That sounds... I dunno, dumb? I mean, for me, frame abilities feel separate from weapon effects. Kogake/Obex/Kestrel can knockdown/back mobs, but there doesn't seem to be Banshee's QQ-ing about them doing Sonic Boom's job (though I can also point out that the weapons are only single target while Boom actually has almost unlimited targeting). Glaive can shred a line of mobs, but Excal can also do that and noone seems to be saying that its removing his niche. 

 

More examples of weapons with 'unique' effects making frame abilities obsolete? Let me think for a bit... nah I think I made my point. I mean, obviously there's gonna be a 'x weapon actually trivializes y frame ability' and I'll be pretty much 'oh, okay' since I'm not really invested much on this point of contention. 

 

-

 

I'm rambling again. I'm really not good for these types of things (forums) since I'll just ~drift away~ from my main point, so yeah. 

 

Have fun~

[KvotheTheArcane1]

"It could cost a special ammo type, or a percentage of a clip, or have a cooldown and one of the above."

You see that thing in the top right corner with numbers, 1,2,3, and 4. That is called your Warframes abilities. It costs something called energy.

Also you see that aresenal tab? Open that up, go to your gun, click upgrade. Add certain mods, and OMG look. The gun now has special properties that happen once in a ever great so often called effect procing. CONGRATS YOU LEARNED WARFRAME 101... Would you like more redundancy in your samwich?

Gee, thanks, I only have 1.4k hours, how have I not found this vital information /sarcasm.

Don't be a smartass, you can't pull it off, as you don;t understand what you're talking about.

 

And if every weapon does the same thing, it's not unique. Here, let me get the definition for you since you don't understand what it means:

"1. being the only one of its kind; unlike anything else."

 

If EVERY gun has a chance to proc for fire, it's not unique. Understand? No? Dang, well I tried.

 

Oh, and this would lessen the redundancy btw, as there would be weapons that play much differently from what we have now. Every gun is simply a copy/paste with a new look and stats.

[ArchangelForcas]

Gee, thanks, I only have 1.4k hours, how have I not found this vital information /sarcasm.

Don't be a smartass, you can't pull it off, as you don;t understand what you're talking about.

 

And if every weapon does the same thing, it's not unique. Here, let me get the definition for you since you don't understand what it means:

"1. being the only one of its kind; unlike anything else."

 

If EVERY gun has a chance to proc for fire, it's not unique. Understand? No? Dang, well I tried.

 

Oh, and this would lessen the redundancy btw, as there would be weapons that play much differently from what we have now. Every gun is simply a copy/paste with a new look and stats.

You're one of those players that want a Neural Toxin Gun huh?

[KvotheTheArcane1]

You're one of those players that want a Neural Toxin Gun huh?

Explain further please.

[ArchangelForcas]

Explain further please.

Ah, if you don't understand what I'm saying by that alone... You wont ever understand it, 1.4k player.

[Mainabi]

I don't know tigris feels very unique to me

[KvotheTheArcane1]

Ah, if you don't understand what I'm saying by that alone... You wont ever understand it, 1.4k player.

Ah, didn't realise 12 words can convey a meaning with no context.

 

Ok serious time, are you just trying to be an A******?

[Arlayn]

Okay, I'll just give me opinion. I don't think the whole weapons getting such "Unique" effects should happen. Unless maybe something like the Ignis, Ogris, Torid. Only due to the fact, it takes away from having a frame to have those abilities already in some shape or form. Unless they bring out a frame that pratically has no abilities what so ever, like nothing at all. Then I could see a need, or want for that. But personally, anything over the fact of weapons being granted a unique ability, kinda takes away from the game, unless it's something like the current dmg 2.0.

Someone who actually gets it! It does take away from the abilities. Things like grenades don't happen because Vauban would lose purpose in his Tesla, Scorpion whip doesn't happen because Valkyr has it as Grapple, Naplam gun doesn't happen because it would render Ember's fireball pointless.

[qqchurch]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nerve_agent#Biological_effects

 

 

 

Initial symptoms following exposure to nerve agents (like sarin) are a runny nose, tightness in the chest, and constriction of the pupils. Soon after, the victim will then have difficulty breathing and will experience nausea and drooling. As the victim continues to lose control of their bodily functions, they will involuntarily salivate, lacrimate, urinate, defecate, and experience gastrointestinal pain and vomiting. Blisters and burning of the eyes and/or lungs may also occur.This phase is followed by initially myoclonic jerks followed by status epilepticus. Death then comes via complete respiratory depression, most likely via the excessive peripheral activity at the neuromuscular junction of the diaphragm.

 

That sounds too long to happen in-game, tbh. Unless some space-ninja magic is used to boost up the effects.... not seeing much of a use for it. Maybe.... low on-hit damage projectile weapon that does a crazy DoT, like the old Acrid but non-stackable? Hmmm, bears some thinking I guess...

 

On the other hand, this doesn't seem like a constructive discussion, and I think if this keeps going on (the tone and how Forcas replies; and how others would react), this might lead onto a lock. 

 

Just to be that poor sap that tries to defuse an argument: Can we at least tone down the baiting and the biting? As entertaining as they are, they're not really helpful for the thread's health. 

 

--

Also:

 

 

Someone who actually gets it! It does take away from the abilities. Things like grenades don't happen because Vauban would lose purpose in his Tesla, Scorpion whip doesn't happen because Valkyr has it as Grapple, Naplam gun doesn't happen because it would render Ember's fireball pointless.

 

What about Glaive, though. Add Power Throw on it and it can clear a corridor of mobs. Excal's Slash Dash does the same thing, but it doesn't feel like it makes it pointless. Same with Miter.

 

Kestrel/Obex/Kogake can ragdoll again (and before), same as Banshee's Sonic Boom (but it's AoE ragdoll) and Nekros Soul Punch (though it's hitscan), but the effect is the same, only different in range/application. 

 

There doesn't really seem to be much weapons that emulate frame abilities, to be honest. Unless you want me to stretch it and compare Dread with Ash's Shuriken. Or base Synapse with Volt's Shock. Or, the obvious thing, Ignis and Ember. 

 

I guess it's just me not really seeing your points. I mean, the Napalm's gun isn't exactly like Ember's fireball (AoE vs single target), Scorpion's whip doesn't do as much damage as Ripline (unless high levels) and only does knockdown not mobility increase, Tesla is more like a easily placed turret than a grenade. 

 

What's really wrong with having weapons emulate frame abilities? I just really want a clear answer to that since some of you seems so gungho on this...

 

And the topic is derail further, but eh.

Edited December 5, 2013 by qqchurch

[Arlayn]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nerve_agent#Biological_effects

 

 

 

 

That sounds too long to happen in-game, tbh. Unless some space-ninja magic is used to boost up the effects.... not seeing much of a use for it. Maybe.... low on-hit damage projectile weapon that does a crazy DoT, like the old Acrid but non-stackable? Hmmm, bears some thinking I guess...

 

On the other hand, this doesn't seem like a constructive discussion, and I think if this keeps going on (the tone and how Forcas replies; and how others would react), this might lead onto a lock. 

 

Just to be that poor sap that tries to defuse an argument: Can we at least tone down the baiting and the biting? As entertaining as they are, they're not really helpful for the thread's health. 

Actually this bares no discussion purpose in the first place we already know the unique weapons people are asking for will not happen because they would render Valkyr's, Vauban's, Ash's, and Ember's abilities useless. Plus we already know advanced weapons take a LONG time to make, but people here are practically asking for it to be rushed, or faster. As if they think these ideas are made by all the teams, but in reality it depends on the people making the animations, and putting together all the stuff so it is not OP, or clash with future, or current warframe abilities.

 

It would be better off locked. Rather than continue on going.

Edited December 5, 2013 by Arlayn

[low1991]

-cut-

why not you give DE some of "YOUR" unique ideas?

[Arlayn]

why not you give DE some of "YOUR" unique ideas?

yes maybe you should. I hear Steve, Scott and the others have an open inbox invitation to anyone who has ideas.

[qqchurch]

Actually this bares no discussion purpose in the first place we already know the unique weapons people are asking for will not happen because they would render Valkyr's, Vauban's, Ash's, and Ember's abilities useless. Plus we already know advanced weapons take a LONG time to make, but people here are practically asking for it to be rushed, or faster. As if they think these ideas are made by all the teams, but in reality it depends on the people making the animations, and putting together all the stuff so it is not OP, or clash with future, or current warframe abilities.

 

It would be better off locked. Rather than continue on going.

 

I can't seem to get this point, but okay. Previous post edited to add my reply to yours.

 

Don't see people looking to rush these 'unique' weapons, though I guess it's a matter of perspective. I'm seeing people being discontented with the current mastery fodder and asking for more interesting weapons that have unique mechanics. 

 

*shrug* It takes time, I get that, I guess. Might as well pass the time to make suggestions. Hmm.... 

[KvotheTheArcane1]

why not you give DE some of "YOUR" unique ideas?

 

yes maybe you should. I hear Steve, Scott and the others have an open inbox invitation to anyone who has ideas.

Did you guys read any of his posts saying he will make another thread later will these?

[Luminati07]

Did you guys read any of his posts saying he will make another thread later will these?

Exactly.

 

Quick warning in advance, though. It's going to be an extremely long read :D

[Tulzscha]

Moved to the proper section.

[Shin]

I like how everyone went in all-out-war with nugget. Sometimes i think presenting your feedback is a crime on this forum. Every goddamn thead has to had some people who defend DE or act silly just because they didnt like OP and what he said and drive theads into trash dont do that guys.

 

DE doesnt need you to defend them. You provide feedback harsh or not, this helps them get better.

 

Just provide feedbacks, and maybe in a distant Dreamy magic land where we agree on a point without arguing over silly things like they are going to save human kind, maybe DE decide to take our ideas and our accepted point into an ingame content which would make all of us happy.

 

Aside from that yeah i mentioned UT weapons a couple of times (Flak Canon my baby.) but i guess DE never saw them. I wish DE would take a look at suggestions and feedback theads more. There are couple of good and almost perfect ideas. 

 

Edit: some mistakes

Edited December 5, 2013 by Shin

[LukeAura]

Actually this bares no discussion purpose in the first place we already know the unique weapons people are asking for will not happen because they would render Valkyr's, Vauban's, Ash's, and Ember's abilities useless. Plus we already know advanced weapons take a LONG time to make, but people here are practically asking for it to be rushed, or faster. As if they think these ideas are made by all the teams, but in reality it depends on the people making the animations, and putting together all the stuff so it is not OP, or clash with future, or current warframe abilities.

 

It would be better off locked. Rather than continue on going.

Ignis already invalidate most of Ember's abilities as it is. And Ash's Shuriken is so useful on its own we can't let a weapon take that over. And Valkyr's Hysteria claws are just Furaxs with a unique animation and her hook that can hit 50 metres away will not be outdone by a reach of about 5 metres in a whip that did the same thing without the mobility use.  

You're limiting possibility because a frame may get a power similar to that someday. Which is a ridiculously slippery slope because if they had given Mag the ability to launch a cloud of shrapnel straight forward in a small cone, we wouldn't have shotguns. 

It takes a lot more effort into creating a warframe than it would to creating a gun. DE could likely get at least 4 unique guns out in the time they usually would do 1 warframe. That's going from having Tenno Reinforcements every week, to every other week as far as their latest trends have shown.  

 

[Luminati07]

Ugh, anyone who's waiting for me to make the second thread, sit tight.

 

It's taking a tonne of time, and you'll see why once it's posted.

 

Probably going to be a few more hours of nonstop typing :/