Sprint Boost Troll Aura

[LukeAura]

If you're being thrown off by a Speed Boost aura, and can actually tell after the first couple of screw ups, why not just use the timings of another frame?
.9+10%=.99, close enough to 1 to use it.
1 would become 1.1, an exact copy of a common speed tier. 
1.1 would become 1.21, close enough for the 1.2 tier of Nova. 
1.15 would become 1.265, .15 more than Loki. About 1.2%. 
You have two or three frames out of the whole that would end up great than a .1 difference from any other frames speed. 
You've gone from a 10% difference to a 1.2% at the most. And if you can not handle a 1%, literally, 1% ruins all your combos and precision, Warframe probably isn't your game. I will not believe that with the current mechanics you can time everything down to be within 1% margin of error. 

This game is not meant to be a precisely timed everything down to the millisecond intense combo game. It is organic, freestyled, adaptable. If you're moving faster, pick wider jump targets, ground slam to hit the ground faster if something gets in your way. if you've got the intellectual capacity to analyze and understand all your possible options and tricks at any given moment, I think you can adapt to a minor change in speed. 




 

[Llyssa]

Okay, drawing a picture to help explain this.

Let's say this is a piece of terrain in WF. There's a lot similar to this, this is a commonly used piece.

How each speed handles it:

Speed 0.9: There is no way to comfortably do this. You're going to have to try and do a wall cancel trick and then do a jump. If you try it, chances are you will fail, any lag or timing errors on your part will make you miss it. There's almost certainly an elevator or staircase nearby, ambling over to it is going to be a lot faster than trying to make this jump if you fail, and a lot easier than trying to make it succeed. If you're feeling lucky, you can (A)jump onto the step, jump as high as you can from the step, wall run up, and backflip, and you *might* grab the edge if you did it *just right*.

Speed 1.0: This was made for you. (A)Take a running jump at the wall, wall run straight up, and backflip at the top. You're going to land perfectly.(B) Standing on the step is fail, because if you jump and then wallrun, you'll go too far up and hit the upper lip. ©Standing on the step and wallrunning up is fail, you're going to just backflip under the overhang. (D) Wall running up the side won't work without a wall cancel, and with this terrain, you're probably going to end up running sideways unless your camera is PERFECT.

 

Speed 1.1: You have to take this differently. (A) Running jump at the wall will fail, you're going to hit too high, run too far, and bump the upper lip. (B) Same deal if you jump from the step. © If you stand on the step, and start wall running straight up, you can backflip in okay--you may have to catch the ledge, but you'll hit it like mid-body, so you're good.(D) Wall running up the side is the same as for 1.0. Don't bother.

 

Speed 1.2: Fairly fast here. New strategy. (A) Running jump at the wall will fail, just like 1.1, you go too far. (B) Standing jump from the step, too far, but you can land on top of the top lip with ease, if that was your goal. It's pretty darn impossible to do the falling mid-air slide required to get in that hole, though. © Standing on the step and running straight up, if you time it *just right*, and make sure you do a slide immediately when you backflip, you can get under the upper lip and get inside. (D) Turns out you can actually just wall run up the side here, no problem.

 

Speed 1.3+: Unusually fast. So, some issues. It's noteworthy that you can reach the elevator/stairs nearby pretty fast now, so that might be your best option.  (A), (B), and © are all going to frustrate you, but you can actually climb straight over the wall, so you have totally different options if there's something on the other side. (D) Going up the side might be an option if there's no funky geometry at the top. Otherwise you risk banging your head and falling back down.

 

These are just 5 possible speeds, and this is just the tactics required for one out of hundreds of different setups across the maps. There's also 0.95, 1.15, 1.25, and that's just with default frame speeds. The addition of a random number between 0.025 and 0.1 to your speed opens up the potential number of speeds you need to learn by 11, and that's just for 1 person. If you can have up to 3, then you're looking at learning upwards of 30 different additional speeds, and that's not to mention all the effort needed to learn all of those speeds at all of the hundreds of different setups.

Unless you're playing solo, there's nothing stopping you from ending up with a new person at any random point in the game, and there's nothing stopping them from altering your speed. We don't get any warning about the exact change, and even if we DID, even if you DO know how to play at the different speed you've now been given, you have to sit there and try to remember it for the rest of the match, instead of paying attention to things that actually matter, like the game itself.

Now, granted, there's USUALLY the elevator/stairs option, but it's not always there, and when it is, it's normally something you have to go out of your way to reach. It defeats the entire purpose of them building all these carefully designed levels if we're forced to default to the stairs because we've been given an unknown amount of speed, and it's insanely frustrating if you don't even know that you've been given that tiny speed boost, as it makes you miss ALL of your jumps, and you have NO idea why.

There is no method to deal with suddenly missing your jumps, other than "guess". Did you time it wrong? Did you step incorrectly? Is there lag? Did you press the wrong key? So you can keep trying again, or you can try guessing that "gee, someone has an aura that's messing me up", and if you're right, you now have to go to a totally different thought process, and hope you're right, and hope you've learned how to do whatever speed they happen to be moving you at now.

If you guess "speed aura", and it is just lag, then you've wasted extra time even further because you're trying something that will NEVER work. If you guess "lag" or "I made a mistake", you're trying something that will NEVER work. If you guess "speed aura", and it is a speed aura, you then have to guess exactly how much it is.

That's a ton of extra hassle, and for what most people keep calling a "unnoticable difference". What's the point?

[LukeAura]

I really wish I could see images on this computer right now so I could understand what's going on. 

[Liminal]

But you can release the jump key to jump off the wall earlier. Wallrun distances are not static.

(And sliding or using melee in mid air both work to correct jump distances).

[LukeAura]

(And sliding or using melee in mid air both work to correct jump distances).

This quite true. Melee slams got myself adapted to over shooting jumps with Zephyr near immediately. 

[Archistopheles]

If you're playing the game the way it's designed to be played, Sprint Boost aura's negative effect is huge.

 

See ^ This is why you're causing conflict with other players. You assume that everyone thinks the same way you do. You assume everyone is not only playing the same way you do, but that they HAVE TO play the same way you do... That's insanely selfish, and the primary reason people are "insulting" you.

 

That's a ton of extra hassle, and for what most people keep calling a "unnoticable difference". What's the point?

 

The reason others don't see it as a hassle is that other players adapt to the situation. Just like the topics where Volt's boost is the example, players like us not only know the exact distance/speed calculations to make certain jumps, but we can compensate almost instantly if the variable changes.

 

We have two distinct thought processes and play styles at conflict in this thread:

 

A) Players who calculate perfect maneuvers once so they don't have to later

 

B) Players who adapt their calculations on-the-fly

 

Please attempt to put yourself in the other's shoes for discussion's sake

[SquirmyBurrito]

-snip-

 

That reasoning is flawed. Speed restrictions work down, not up. A frame with a sprint speed of .9 won't be able to do everything my Loki with a rush can, but the opposite isn't true. As others have pointed out there are numerous ways to reduce/cancel your momentum and/or tweak it so it is going in different directions.

 

Your pictures are even more flawed.

 

#snip

 

Many of the examples of fails in your pictures either do not account for the infinite wall run glitch (for slower frames) or the ability to jump off the wall early (speaking specifically about the example A of all pictures after (but including) the one for sprint speed 1.1. Not getting a warning about a change in speed shouldn't matter. All changes can be compensated for (try playing the game as a hobbled Thrak Rhino it is possible).

 

edit: oops, forgot to snip

Edited March 5, 2014 by SquirmyBurrito

[BladeMaverick]

[hashtag]SNIP

 

The only issue I see here is a timing issue. Instead of basing your jumps/backflips for timing, gauge them for distance up/across the wall. If you're really "timing" your wall jumps and have to be that precise about it, just stop. I mean really. If you gauge for distance traveled instead of timing, you know exactly where to jump. Pretty much what I do and I have no issues between the use of Loki with a Rush mod and a stock Frost. Crisis averted. Let's go home.

Edited March 6, 2014 by BladeMaverick

[Tsukinoki]

@Llyssa

So it seems your entire problem is that you time everything down to the last tenth of second and have figured out you need to jump at exactly 2.1 seconds of wall running to make it to the ledge.

Why not instead try to learn to base it off of distance? That way you know that around given speed you just have to make it near a certain point on the wall (which is *really* easy to gauge) and then jump off to make it. That way even if you speed increases by 10% you know that you just have to go a slightly shorter distance to make the jump. And honestly no jump needs to be down to the last pixel in order to make it.

Even the hardest jumps in the game have plenty of room for error. The only time that the system would be unforgiving is if you ignore distance completely and go "I need to wall run across this wall for exactly 1.5 seconds before jumping off...it doesn't matter that Volt just hit me with his speed ability I will still run for exactly 1.5 seconds before jumping". At which point the fault is entirely you're own and you just need to learn to play the game outside of a super rigid playstyle.

I parkour a ton, I find a lot of hidden areas and shortcuts. I explore the map with multiple wall jumps from one wall to another one and see how far it gets me and stuff. And yet I have *never* had to judge a jump down a meter, or time it to within a tenth of a second.

The problem isn't with the aura. The problem is with how you play the game. And you need to adjust your playing style and adapt.

[LukeAura]

I wonder if this could work like driving. 
"Look where you want to go." 
if you're trying to base it off of timing then you will mess up, try to drive like that and you'd crash in to something guaranteed. 
 

[taiiat]

Im guessing the OP leaves whenever a volt shows up in a pug?

 

I like playing Volt and keeping Speed ability up full time for invasions, never would have thought someone would have an issue with it

i don't like Volt's using Speed. i liked it better when it affected just him. 

i don't need to move any faster, moving faster will probably make me overshoot my targets. mostly because of the significant speed change. the worst offender would be if a Volt casts Speed while i'm in the middle of a wallrun. i'll probably end up falling into a pit. q.q

 

It sounds to me like your problem is really with DE's handling of physics and using sprint speed to impact wall-run and airborne launch speed.  So it's not really the mod's fault.  All its doing is more clearly revealing a pre-existing problem.  If launch speed was always the same, we wouldn't have this problem. 

eh, i like Sprint Speed affecting those aspects of Parkour. it makes things a little unreliable, but it works. might be just because i'm used to it after 14 months, lol.

 

With due respect, I find it quite difficult to believe that you can measure that precisely whilst playing the game in real-time.

actually, because of (Lyssa explained it quite well) the tiles all being already existing and maps being laid out in a random, but certain way, i can control my results over many distances to hit a specific point.

 

using a combination of Dagger SpinDashes(i can explain the difference between the Animation sets of Daggers and Duals and why that makes Zoren actually bad some other time), Wallrun/jumps, tricks/shortcuts, Sliding ofc, and Ground Smashes, i greatly enjoy being able to traverse tiles and chain many things together. especially if i see an Enemy in the distance, i can combine these to close the distance and get to the ideal distance very efficiently. 

with perhaps a surprising amount of precision(choosing a landing point and well, landing there). but that's what 2000 Hours logged in Warframe does.

 

i don't find as much issue as Lyssa does, but there is some. 

i can adapt to Speed changes, though that'll probably end up in some movements failing due to velocity changes. imperfectly shaped surfaces combined with Ping combined with Speed changes, can result in movement having all kinds of minor goofiness.