Shotguns Nerfed Again?

[Noble_Cactus]

"Accelerated Blast's bonus to puncture damage now matches the description (at base level, was adding 22% Puncture so when mod itself said 15%), as well as all the other mods that increase physical damage."

 

I understand this was a bug, but this is the third time shotguns have been hit with a major nerf (first falloff, the proc chance, and now the AB fix). Is there any reason to why shotguns should hit like they're shooting wet noodles? Will we see any compensation for shotgun damage and versatility now that is even weaker than it was before? Does someone at DE hold a grudge against our poor shotguns?

Edited March 6, 2014 by Noble_Cactus

[Imaru]

ONE change to ONE mod for shotguns (one that while good isn't vital to every build ever) is not a nerf.

[(PSN)KalGerion_Beast]

Is the puncture damage now based off puncture, or still based off total physical damage?

 

If its still total, its not too bad of a nerf.  I would rather the mods actually be correct than incorrect.

[VKhaun]

How in the world do you arrive at the conclusion that shotguns hit like wet noodles?

[Cuddley]

Wow, its a single mod.

 

MAJOR NERF PLZ DE FIX

[AnActualPool]

Wow, its a single mod.

 

MAJOR NERF PLZ DE FIX

^

 

Wurse nerf evar.

im dun wif warfrem

Edited March 6, 2014 by godzonner

[Ritchel]

shotguns? falloff damage? no tks, dont care

[Noble_Cactus]

How in the world do you arrive at the conclusion that shotguns hit like wet noodles?

 

Correction: wet noodles past 15m. I just don't see a reason to keep muzzling an entire class of weapons when nobody asks for those nerfs.

 

And yes, I am aware of Hek sniping. I just don't think falloff (or at least, how it was implemented) was the best way to go about it.

Edited March 6, 2014 by Noble_Cactus

[GrosslyIncandescent1709]

it's annoying but at least i don't need to bother with shotguns in the future anymore (unless they're secondaries obviously :P)

[LGear]

A correction to a single rare Nightmare Mod does not make a shotgun nerf.  

[MCT360]

Accelerated Blast,  people still use this?

[Imaru]

I dunno about you guys, but my drakgoon is still hitting like a freight train after 25 meters...

[VKhaun]

Correction: wet noodles past 15m. I just don't see a reason to keep muzzling an entire class of weapons when nobody asks for those nerfs.

 

And yes, I am aware of Hek sniping. I just don't think falloff (or at least, how it was implemented) was the best way to go about it.

 

Sorry but exaggeration is not an argument.

 

There's nothing wrong with shotguns AFAIK, and shotguns are not just a second class of assault rifle. Damage at range is the obvious differentiation.

 

After I do the event, I'll farm the void with various shotguns. See if I change my mind.

[Noble_Cactus]

Fair enough. My concern is that the role of just about every shotgun (high single-target damage at close range) can be performed better by a good number of other weapons that fill other roles as well, and that shotguns keep getting pigeonholed into this role with each update and become worse at it at the same time. Yet nobody is asking for these changes when plenty of others go unchecked (i.e., secondaries outclassing a majority of primaries, and yes I know one of those happens to be a shotgun). Nobody asked for the proc chance nerf to pellet weapons, and several threads in the Weapons section express their discontent with it because the procs were part of what made shotguns fun to use. They also gave them much higher damage.

 

I dunno about you guys, but my drakgoon is still hitting like a freight train after 25 meters...

 

To my knowledge, the Drakgoon does not suffer from falloff.

Edited March 6, 2014 by Noble_Cactus

[RealPandemonium]

Accel blast justified shotguns' tradeoffs because it was such a powerful mod.  Now it hardly does anything except for the Hek.  The strength of Accel Blast was that it gave additional puncture damage according to the weapon's total base damage instead of only its puncture damage.  The additional fire rate is still useful but the mod is nerfed by about 70% for every shotgun but the Hek now and is thus outclassed by more useful mods.

[zerogear5]

While there are obviously more viable choices, having a choice is part of the fun of this game. I personally love my shotguns but in reality I never find myself using more then one weapon while in a mission anyway but I have the option to. Mod balancing and fixing will always be on going but it in no way cripples any weapon type.

[Tulzscha]

Moved to the proper section.

[Wallace24]

fixing accelerated blast so that it works as intended isn't really a nerf. it just means now I won't add it to every shotgun, making them essentially puncture-based instead of impact-based (no tigris here. bad shotgun). it definitely cuts down on the damage output, but it does mean I can add another elemental mod, as consolation

[jinsaotomex4]

A change even if it's a fix, to a mod that makes a whole class of weapons less desirable overall is a nerf. There is really no other way to call it.

However, this is just another bullet point on a list of shotgun "fixes" that just makes a whole class of weapons just less desirable than well, anything else really. The Phage is saved from all this nonsense because it doesn't behave like a shotgun, it just uses shotgun mods but then you have to deal with DE's equally as S#&$ty continuous weapon firing "fix". Shotguns have too many inconveniences in this game to be as crummy as they are. Yeah, they'll get you through the main solar system just "fine" if you just slap a catalyst on them but so will a Braton.

 

The issues with shotguns really start to show up when fighting heavy armored targets at 35+ (easiest to test in the void vs Heavy Gunners) where the lack of procs compared to other gun classes, the falloff damage, and overall reliance on the card damage (no reliable way to stack up procs like other gun classes) as well as other unlisted changes to elemental combos (viral, corrosive and magnetic no longer stacking. And while these affected all gun classes, the other high status chance guns can just stack the other elemental damage types). Low crit rate (in before this gets "fixed" as well), actually having to be close enough so all your pellets hit otherwise you aren't actually getting all your damage per shot, as well as having proc damage on shotguns based on how hard the pellet that causes the proc hit (I sure love that one proc ticking for 17 damage while anything with combined damage per shot will do hundreds to thousands of damage per tick) and I might be missing some.  The Drakgoon is a joke now compared to it's previous state before the multi-pellet weapon hotfix despite being the only primary shotgun with no damage falloff. 

 

So I guess the question is, where the hell do shotguns as primary weapons fit? The risk involved with being right on the enemy's face to do most of your damage is not being rewarded when a huge number of guns can do the same and even more damage from all the way across the screen while having better accuracy, less recoil, high status chance, higher crit rate, higher proc damage ticks, etc.  Let's not even talk about how the shotgun secondaries can dish out almost twice the damage in the same amount of time as most shotgun primaries save for 2 of them. Probably even more now that they fixed AB.

 

Well whatever, this will fall on deaf ears as usual. Time to sleep. 

Edited March 6, 2014 by jinsaotomex4

[Monolake]

ONE change to ONE mod for shotguns (one that while good isn't vital to every build ever) is not a nerf.

 

A correction to a single rare Nightmare Mod does not make a shotgun nerf.  

FYI it has resulted in 20% DPS decrease for Phage, dont remember other numbers exactly, more like 15-16% for Boar prime. Its another significant nerf for the class of weapons overall just right after status chance nerf, and another mod made almost useless.  https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/190137-gg-making-accelerated-blast-useless-instead-of-improving-useless-mods/

[Rafarix]

On-Topic: Accelerated Blast Fix was bound to happen so it was expected.

 

Slightly off-topic: They should remove damage falloff, because with all the new weapons and power creep recently coming out there really isn't any reason to have fall-off anymore.

[Nadhua]

I am disappoint. Was hoping they'd make other physical damage mods like it.

[Psychus]

Correction: wet noodles past 15m. I just don't see a reason to keep muzzling an entire class of weapons when nobody asks for those nerfs.

 

And yes, I am aware of Hek sniping. I just don't think falloff (or at least, how it was implemented) was the best way to go about it.

You mean they're designed to work like shotguns? Holy S#&$ worst gun ever, must buff. It's not like they INSTAGIB anything in front of you or anything under 15m or anything.

[LazyKnight]

 Does someone at DE hold a grudge against our poor shotguns?

I think Sniper Hek is the root cause of the grudge

 

Honestly with way status effects work with shotguns, I am tempted to vender all of mine. Not only is the chance bad, but if a slash or gas proc occurs it is based of a tiny amount of damage caused by a pellet. I would say at this point shotguns are the most useless weapons for anything other than raw damage.

[Noble_Cactus]

You mean they're designed to work like shotguns? Holy S#&$ worst gun ever, must buff. It's not like they INSTAGIB anything in front of you or anything under 15m or anything.

 

Did you not read the thread? They're not even the best at their intended role. The rapid fire weapons all perform the role of a shotgun much better than a shotgun, and at farther ranges too. If a whole class of weapons is intended to be pigeonholed into a restrictive role, at least make them awesome at doing just that.

Edited March 6, 2014 by Noble_Cactus