Retune *all* The Frames! (11/19: Wildfire)

[Phyrak]

Lots of the changes there didn't really affect statements in the OP. 

 

 

My usual policy applies with Atlas: I put nothing in the OP until at least a week has passed.

 

From what I've been hearing, the big issue with Atlas is (as with Oberon) a lack of baseline scalability. Flat damage attacks, flat damage shield, poor AI minions, Petrify and his passive being the only real outliers (and given that almost all frames have some kind of CC, he's not earning any points for the former). Most of your changes do little to affect this, changing damage types but not how the damage scales, or adding rather unnecessary additions.

 

And your Rumblers augment is a wind attack.

Gonna fix the last bit :P

Am gonna throw some maths at my thread to show you how the new landslide works aka: if modded with 200%+

Power strength upto 20x damage multiplier - doesn't sound too bad to me :P

[Archwizard]

Initial, independent thoughts on Atlas:

 

- Landslide seems easy enough to fix: Just remove the upper limit on the combo multiplier, while maintaining the rules of Power Efficiency. If you can ramp it up high enough to matter, good on you.

- Tectonics is tricky. The issue is that it has flat health, and does flat damage. If just one of those had a scaling feature, it would be fine. Personally, I think it might be an idea to remove the Bulwark's health and instead add a toggle - or perhaps like Pacify/Provoke, have it drain energy only when hit. I can also see this getting an augment to become a full-on Katamari ball.

- Rumblers might be stronger if keeping them active (or getting them killed) also put a buff on Atlas - he summons rock armor when he activates it, why drop that? Additionally, more interaction with his kit would be ideal; perhaps some way to direct them.

- Stats are good, passive's good, Petrify's good.

Edited October 5, 2015 by Archwizard

[Phyrak]

Initial, independent thoughts on Atlas:

 

- Landslide seems easy enough to fix: Just remove the upper limit on the combo multiplier, while maintaining the rules of Power Efficiency. If you can ramp it up high enough to matter, good on you.

- Tectonics is tricky. The issue is that it has flat health, and does flat damage. If just one of those had a scaling feature, it would be fine. Personally, I think it might be an idea to remove the Bulwark's health and instead add a toggle - or perhaps like Pacify/Provoke, have it drain energy only when hit. I can also see this getting an augment to become a full-on Katamari ball.

- Rumblers might be stronger if keeping them active (or getting them killed) also put a buff on Atlas - he summons rock armor when he activates it, why drop that? Additionally, more interaction with his kit would be ideal; perhaps some way to direct them.

- Stats are good, passive's good, Petrify's good.

interesting idea on tectonics

 

fixed up the ult as recommended :P

 

I also added a heap of maths to show much the new landslide under my feedback thread on how much damage it does...alot if my maths is correct 

[Archwizard]

Some notes from my first day leveling Tremor:
 

- Landslide is loads of fun, like the combat system from the Arkham games. Downside is that the range sucks to start off, and the combo fades rapidly (probably intended); once everyone around you gets ragdolled, it's hard to keep the combo up. Will probably be better by the time I'm capped, can't officially judge until the second forma or whatever the rule is.

- Bulwark's size isn't affected by Power Range? That's unusual.

- Apparently Tectonics can push downed allies. Interesting.

- Might be an idea to have the Rumblers scale off his melee, now that I think about it...

[Elydir]

Atlas Changes & Fixes

 

• Atlas’ Landslide now has improved damage scaling based on the Mods of your Melee weapons.
• Atlas’ Rumblers health is now affected by Health and Shield Mods.
• Atlas’ Rumblers armor is now affected by Armor and Strength Mods.
• Atlas’ Rumblers base armor has been increased to 500.
• Atlas’ Landslide proc chance and crit multiplier have been increased.
• Atlas’ Tectonics health is now affected by Atlas’ armor rating. Tectonics starts invulnerable and absorbs any damage for a certain period, just like Frost's Snowglobe.
• Fixed Atlas’ Tectonics boulder not doing damage to enemies when cast by Clients.
• Fixed Atlas’ Tectonics boulder not dragging ragdolled enemies with it while rolling.
• Fixed Atlas’ Tectonics boulder not hitting ragdolled enemies once launched.

 

Well this happened.

[taiiat]

Well this happened.

i don't know about anyone else but i'd rather have discussion in this thread, rather than copy pasting Changelogs that we all should be reading anyways.

 

which is not to say Quoting isn't useful, but posts that are copy pasting Changelog but aren't discussion seem superfluous to me.

[Archwizard]

i don't know about anyone else but i'd rather have discussion in this thread, rather than copy pasting Changelogs that we all should be reading anyways.

 

which is not to say Quoting isn't useful, but posts that are copy pasting Changelog but aren't discussion seem superfluous to me.

 

I'll allow it. For posterity's sake (and my personal reference), it helps if the reader doesn't have to constantly cross-check dates of updates against discussions right after a frame's release. 

That and I'd rather someone else did it than me double-posting again.

 

Back to today's news, Landslide is fantastic now; a three-hit combo is easily able to take out heavy units on the higher level planets, and it's a cheap way to clear out thick crowds near a downed teammate. It might actually be one of the most effective and fun Basic abilities available, but that's just my personal (and very early) opinion.

Have more tests to do with his other abilities though, still unsatisfied with Tectonics' size (can't block doorways with it in the Void, even when you have a perfect angle) and the recent change to make players phase through it (I feel it defeats the purpose of making a solid stone wall on some level, if you can't parkour off it or stand upon it). Additionally, part of the problem with any pet-based ability is that if you're not constantly observing them, it's hard to see a difference in effectiveness... especially when they're prone to charging off on their own.

Edited October 9, 2015 by Archwizard

[FelisImpurrator]

Landslide is apparently overkill at the moment, actually. To the point where I've been told it can oneshot a level 50 Heavy Gunner when built properly... along with the hilariously large AoE. So it's kind of Exalted Blade with the cost of Pull...

 

Also, Tectonics phasing was the only way they could think of to counter trolling, especially with three Atlases in a squad.

 

Tectonics size, hm. Maybe it should scale more with range in terms of width? I haven't gotten to try it though.

[LordSebastian]

I want my new Saryn T_T

[TheBrsrkr]

Archwizard, what's your opinion on the Valkyr changes?

[xLordKogax]

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/541756-ash-koga-style-redesign/

 

Just released this new thread show, check it out and leave your thoughts about it.

 

Be Nice :)

[Archwizard]

Landslide is apparently overkill at the moment, actually. To the point where I've been told it can oneshot a level 50 Heavy Gunner when built properly... along with the hilariously large AoE. So it's kind of Exalted Blade with the cost of Pull...

 

Also, Tectonics phasing was the only way they could think of to counter trolling, especially with three Atlases in a squad.

 

Tectonics size, hm. Maybe it should scale more with range in terms of width? I haven't gotten to try it though.

 

Exalted Blade itself costs 25 energy - and only 3 energy per second to keep up. I wouldn't say Landslide is any more efficient, even with the combo buff.

 

Part of the problem with Tectonics is that it's a blatantly worse Snow Globe (smaller and double-sided); being able to climb on and parkour off it was the main unique feature it brought about. That should come back to some degree.

 

I want my new Saryn T_T

 

Reb already responded to this for me:

Saryn's rework is almost far enough along for testing internally - I believe we can get more info out of the team on October 16th's Devstream + ideally a written explanation of the plans at that time as well.

 

Archwizard, what's your opinion on the Valkyr changes?

 

Rip Line changes were good, Hysteria damage buff was necessary, Hysteria toggle change was... questionable.

 

Be Nice :)

 

What's with all the strike outs?

Edited October 10, 2015 by Archwizard

[Volinus7]

Rip line is great for valkyr mobility now. But when I grab an enemy it got thrown out of the universe by sheer force of her muscles lol.

[FelisImpurrator]

Exalted Blade itself costs 25 energy - and only 3 energy per second to keep up. I wouldn't say Landslide is any more efficient, even with the combo buff.

Hm, except it's an ult versus a 1 ability... that has 100 more base damage than said ult and attacks in a potentially 3+ meter radius ahead of it. Atlas is One-Punch Man (and I've colored him appropriately, to enjoy my one week of overpowered punching murder).

 

That said, I love Landslide - just that I think it should trade 100 of its base damage (that puts it on par with EB and Hysteria damage-wise) for a way to increase Atlas' armor temporarily during the combo, because at the moment, even with the huge armor buff he dies too easily.

[Archwizard]

So, I added Atlas to the lower list. Sort of.

 

Following his buff, the only things I can really say I take issue with are Bulwark [size=2](how annoying is it that the ability and wall have different names?)[/size] and Rumblers - and in the latter case, I'm not sure exactly what needs changing that doesn't just blatantly clone Hysteria or Iron Skin. Honestly if he were going to get a "I'm a Rumbler too now" ability, that'd probably be from an augment.

Edited October 13, 2015 by Archwizard

[Archwizard]

Aaaaand according to the NYCC Warframe panel, the upcoming Archer Warframe will - in the essence of Robin Hood - have a version of Desecrate she can use while enemies are still alive.

 

Because apparently, stating that META POWERS ARE BAD, STOP PUTTING THEM OUT, THEY'RE HURTING THE GAME is seen as a dare for the devs.

[taiiat]

i mean, if it's a Support thing, and provides Health/Energy/Ammo and then perhaps only Credits, it could be alright.

if it goes into multiplying Mods and Crafting Resources and Et Cetera though - yeah, ofcourse that's not really helping the situation.

 

 

 

tbh i'm more alarmed that you'll be able to... guide projectiles to their target.

surely this would only apply to Non Ray-Trace Spike Damage Weapons, right?

i don't know how you'd guide a Ray Trace Projectile or why you'd bother guiding a single projectile from like, a Cestra to a target. the former sounding impossible and the latter being a waste of your time.

 

and i wonder how practical it really is to do so. that being said, seems like i'd be able to do silly things like shoot randomly into the sky, and then fly-by-wire the projectile to where ever i feel like hitting.

[Archwizard]

tbh i'm more alarmed that you'll be able to... guide projectiles to their target.

 

I just assumed that that would be limited to her bow. Like how Peacemaker has limited autohitting, but only with Mesa's own pistols.

 

What's harder than imagining them setting up guidance systems for hitscan weapons is trying to set up guidance systems for beam weapons, weapons with multiple pellets (especially Drakgoon), or weapons with alternate fire functions.

Edited October 15, 2015 by Archwizard

[4G3NT_0R4NG3]

I just assumed that that would be limited to her bow. Like how Peacemaker has limited autohitting, but only with Mesa's own pistols.

 

What's harder than imagining them setting up guidance systems for hitscan weapons is trying to set up guidance systems for beam weapons, weapons with multiple pellets (especially Drakgoon), or weapons with alternate fire functions.

 

I think it would work (only for her bow obviously) if it functioned like a super fast moving Antimatter Drop, where the arrow is guided towards whatever your crosshair is set on. This would mean the ability would actually require the player to be sentient as opposed to the arrows aiming themselves for you.

 

Maybe there could even be a damage bonus or some additional effect based on how much the arrow has turned, rewarding crazy trickshots. I want to see an enemy, shoot an arrow behind me, spin around 180 degrees, put my crosshair on the enemy's head, and watch them messily redecorate their living room. I see no reason not to reward players for this.

Edited October 15, 2015 by 4G3NT_0R4NG3

[Archwizard]

-snip-

 

They said that it would be a guided attack in the sense that you transfer your motion controls and camera to it, "the first ability that moves your control away from the Warframe". Think drone.

Edited October 15, 2015 by Archwizard

[taiiat]

if we're going to reward Players for Trickshots, where's my Flubber inspired Grenade Launcher!

 

i want to bounce my Grenades around the map like a pinball and get rewarded for my unnecessarily complex shots! :p

the bouncing that Penta/Tonkor can get with Terminal Velocity for extra bouncing just isn't enough :(

[PsychoticMarik]

Aaaaand according to the NYCC Warframe panel, the upcoming Archer Warframe will - in the essence of Robin Hood - have a version of Desecrate she can use while enemies are still alive.

 

Because apparently, stating that META POWERS ARE BAD, STOP PUTTING THEM OUT, THEY'RE HURTING THE GAME is seen as a dare for the devs.

All of my hope for a proper replacement for desecrate(as well as any hope I had that DE was actually learning what is and what is not good game design)has finally been snuffed out.

[4G3NT_0R4NG3]

They said that it would be a guided attack in the sense that you transfer your motion controls and camera to it, "the first ability that moves your control away from the Warframe". Think drone.

 

Interesting. I still think it would be possible for the guided projectile to gain an additional trickshot bonus effect that's based on how much it's turned.

 

if we're going to reward Players for Trickshots, where's my Flubber inspired Grenade Launcher!

 

i want to bounce my Grenades around the map like a pinball and get rewarded for my unnecessarily complex shots! :p

the bouncing that Penta/Tonkor can get with Terminal Velocity for extra bouncing just isn't enough :(

 

Tonkor augment: Truth Seeker. Grenades now aim themselves towards enemies on ricochet.

[taiiat]

Tonkor augment: Truth Seeker. Grenades now aim themselves towards enemies on ricochet.

boo :(

 

i don't want aimbotting easymode. being rewarded for making complex bouncing of my shots though, by all means.

if the game plays for me/does everything for me, then what's the point. not a game anymore.

[Archwizard]

Idea for Well of Life:

 

Enemies deal negative damage. Any damage they would deal is reduced by over 100%, the excess of which becomes healing.