Excalibur 2.0 - We Are Almost There!

[r0ckwolf]

Excalibur doesn't need an 'overhaul'.  He needs a Quality of Life adjustment.

 

Most of his cast-time frames need to be removed so his movement skills can compliment what currently exists instead of hinder it.  I'm thinking about making another thread about this with some details.

 

Being a heavy xcal player myself, I know exactly where his faults are.

while i´m all for "quality of life improvements", i don´t really get your point?! His casting time is long yes, even after they reduced it, but what does that have to do with his abilitie effects and damage capacities?? How would reducing the casting time help in complimenting anything?? Super Jump and Radial Javelin are bad because they are mechanically and thematically bad, not because they are to slow to utilize! 

 

And just to be clear i didn´t really suggest an overhaul. I also consider most of my changes "quality of life improvements", but in the sense that they add missing traits to the Abilitys. Removing Super JUmp in favor of something better is also not really an overhaul but an rework!

[Malitias]

Uhm.. this'll probably generate some hatred, but to be honest, I actually think RB should be replaced as well.. =/
Feels like DE listened to https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OlBifX0H3yg while creating Excal.

[DrBorris]

Two small tweaks to an otherwise awesome suggestion.

 

Tenno Kenshi: Super Jump is Excalibur's best survivability skill, so this new ability would need to replace that aspect of Super Jump. The change is simple... give it unlimited Stamina. Excalibur could block as much as he wished, giving him some well needed survivability.

 

Radial Javelin: All of my yes to reverting back to original mechanics, it is till lackluster though. Give Radial Javelin a radial knock down as soon as his energy Skana hits the ground then give a non-LoS radial Blind when Excalibur takes his Skana out of the ground. This would give some well needed utility to Radial Javelin.

[Malitias]

Two small tweaks to an otherwise awesome suggestion.

 

Tenno Kenshi: Super Jump is Excalibur's best survivability skill, so this new ability would need to replace that aspect of Super Jump. The change is simple... give it unlimited Stamina. Excalibur could block as much as he wished, giving him some well needed survivability.

 

Radial Javelin: All of my yes to reverting back to original mechanics, it is till lackluster though. Give Radial Javelin a radial knock down as soon as his energy Skana hits the ground then give a non-LoS radial Blind when Excalibur takes his Skana out of the ground. This would give some well needed utility to Radial Javelin.

knockdown and good damage is enough. Otherwise it'd be too strong actually.

[WolvenEdge]

Super Jump is Excalibur's best survivability skill

 

Wut? All it does is make him harder to hit for three seconds at most. That isn't surviving, that's extending your turn by the amount of time it took to play that card, reaching an ultimate gain of maybe as many kills as you get in the resulting slam, nothing more. You still die just as easily right after, the extra time isn't enough to regain any lost shields, and maybe five hit points if your entire team has rejuvenation. If you're talking about mobility, and you have the energy, slash dash is supposed to fulfill that purpose by giving you invulnerability for a short distance sprint... and maybe allowing you to take out a few of them in the process.

 

Stealth doesn't actually LAST in this game. The instant your cloak disappears, they all know exactly where you are again whether they are looking your direction or not. You're left dealing with the business ends of the same weapons you tried to avoid before! Stealth belongs with frames designed around it, and Excalibur makes no real use of it considering the game's mechanics.

 

His only real survivability skill is radial blind, and it is no longer consistent enough to be any good at its own given purpose. Excalibur's been a one-trick pony for a long time, be it whether you build him for blind or javelin... I'm hoping he gets some abilities that aren't completely overshadowed by other mechanics that already exist.

 

Edit; further clarification.

Edited April 6, 2015 by WolvenEdge

[(XBOX)SkinnyANOINTED1]

Ideas for a couple adjustments:

Base stats: 115 health, 115 shield, 90 armor, 1.1 speed

Passives: armor increase when not carrying primary 10%, when not carrying secondary 5%, for a total possible boost of 15%.

Slash Dash: skill is mainly utility and mobility. Needs a bleed proc on all enemies touched.

Radial Blind>>Blinding Fury: Excalibur emits a blinding light that blinds enemies for 6/8/10/12 seconds (effected by duration mods) for a range of 7/8/9/10 meters( effected by range mods). Excalibur becomes the light so wherever he goes enemies in that radius are blinded. Will require los.

Super jump/supercharge: Tap and get super jump (10 energy). Hold and get supercharge (25 energy and togglable/3 energy per second afterword effected by efficiency mods). Charge can be initiated on the ground or in the air. So you would not need to jump before charge or you could. Excalibur is in a channelling state. When blocking you cover 360° and you reflect 20/40/60/80% damage back. There is no additional channel cost for using melee so this does encourage but doesn't confine you to melee. Stamina is unlimited for the length.

Radial Javelin: Old javelin back where javelins are shot from Excalibur. Reduce the range to 15 meters and keep the damage as is. Add Furious javelin to ability. Reduce the cast time in half.

This creates pretty good synergy.

The numbers could probably be adjusted but this would be a really fun kit to play with and mod for.

Edited April 6, 2015 by (XB1)SkinnyANOINTED1

[Malitias]

Wut? All it does is make him harder to hit for three seconds at most. That isn't surviving, that's extending your turn by the amount of time it took to play that card, reaching an ultimate gain of maybe as many kills as you get in the resulting slam, nothing more. You still die just as easily right after, the extra time isn't enough to regain any lost shields, and maybe five hit points if your entire team has rejuvenation. If you're talking about mobility, and you have the energy, slash dash is supposed to fulfill that purpose by giving you invulnerability for a short distance sprint... and maybe allowing you to take out a few of them in the process.

Again, this is not the case. You do NOT gain invulnerability during the dash. You just move fast, throwing off enemy aim for the duration. Try dashing against something you can't dash through (so pretty much anything) for some time and keep close attention to your bars. You will be damaged.

 

Edit: I don't know if it's different on XB1. On PC it's definetely not the case.

Edited April 6, 2015 by Malitias

[Malitias]

Ideas for a couple adjustments:

Base stats: 115 health, 115 shield, 90 armor, 1.1 speed

Passives: armor increase when not carrying primary 10%, when not carrying secondary 5%, for a total possible boost of 15%.

Slash Dash: skill is mainly utility and mobility. Needs a bleed proc on all enemies touched.

Radial Blind>>Blinding Fury: Excalibur emits a blinding light that blinds enemies for 6/8/10/12 seconds (effected by duration mods) for a range of 7/8/9/10 meters( effected by range mods). Excalibur becomes the light so wherever he goes enemies in that radius are blinded. Will require los.

Super jump/supercharge: Tap and get super jump (10 energy). Hold and get supercharge (25 energy and togglable/3 energy per second afterword effected by efficiency mods). Charge can be initiated on the ground or in the air. So you would not need to jump before charge or you could. Excalibur is in a channelling state. When blocking you cover 360° and you reflect 20/40/60/80% damage back. There is no additional channel cost for using melee so this does encourage but doesn't confine you to melee. Stamina is unlimited for the length.

Radial Javelin: Old javelin back where javelins are shot from Excalibur. Reduce the range to 15 meters and keep the damage as is. Add Furious javelin to ability. Reduce the cast time in half.

This creates pretty good synergy.

The numbers could probably be adjusted but this would be a really fun kit to play with and mod for.

Isn't this a repost? O.o I'm pretty sure it is.

[RahuHordika]

Again, this is not the case. You do NOT gain invulnerability during the dash. You just move fast, throwing off enemy aim for the duration. Try dashing against something you can't dash through (so pretty much anything) for some time and keep close attention to your bars. You will be damaged.

 

Edit: I don't know if it's different on XB1. On PC it's definetely not the case.

And that only makes things even worse. Slash Dash needs something to make it worthwhile definitely, but I feel that as long as it's only redeeming feature at higher levels is 'mobility' then it is still going to be on the short side and still going to be overshadowed.

I also think that it should keep a consistent use thoughout all of the levels, not start off as an offensive tool and suddendly become purely an escape route.

[Amuga]

I also find that honestly instead of increasing his base shields, increase his base HP instead, making a vitality + lifesteal build a little bit more viable on him, for instance ash can get near 1k HP with my vitality mod and it's 2 levels from max.

Excal gets around 640~ If I recall correctly,

I love the base armor increase, as a frame like Chroma has 340 armor or something crazy, whereas Excal and Ash have around 65, which is pretty weak to current standards.

 

I'm in favor of most, if not all, suggested changes in this.

[(XBOX)BAMMM Lightning]

Wut? All it does is make him harder to hit for three seconds at most. That isn't surviving, that's extending your turn by the amount of time it took to play that card, reaching an ultimate gain of maybe as many kills as you get in the resulting slam, nothing more. You still die just as easily right after, the extra time isn't enough to regain any lost shields, and maybe five hit points if your entire team has rejuvenation. If you're talking about mobility, and you have the energy, slash dash is supposed to fulfill that purpose by giving you invulnerability for a short distance sprint... and maybe allowing you to take out a few of them in the process.

 

Stealth doesn't actually LAST in this game. The instant your cloak disappears, they all know exactly where you are again whether they are looking your direction or not. You're left dealing with the business ends of the same weapons you tried to avoid before! Stealth belongs with frames designed around it, and Excalibur makes no real use of it considering the game's mechanics.

 

His only real survivability skill is radial blind, and it is no longer consistent enough to be any good at its own given purpose. Excalibur's been a one-trick pony for a long time, be it whether you build him for blind or javelin... I'm hoping he gets some abilities that aren't completely overshadowed by other mechanics that already exist.

 

Edit; further clarification.

 

I disagree. Super jump has saved me countless times in T4 survival while chaining RB. The cloak gives me enough time to recollect myself in an ambush and use RB to re-engage. Of course this only works well in rooms with high ceilings. I'm not against improvements to Xcal, but saying super jump is garbage is something I disagree with.  

[dominodom]

I think the energy sword idea is amazing! :D

+1

[Flyghter]

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  Now wouldn´t we all like to see this! ;) Thx to SteelSoldier for the Gif! 

Man i just love this ideea:D

[WolvenEdge]

I disagree. Super jump has saved me countless times in T4 survival while chaining RB. The cloak gives me enough time to recollect myself in an ambush and use RB to re-engage. Of course this only works well in rooms with high ceilings. I'm not against improvements to Xcal, but saying super jump is garbage is something I disagree with.  

 

Because you chained it with another ability. -w- That doesn't make superjump any better, it just makes it an accessory to excal's actual survival ability; radial blind, which became sketchy thanks to an in-need-of-improvement line-of-sight system. I never said superjump was garbage, I said that it is overshadowed and practically useless on its own in current gameplay.

Don't get me wrong; I main excalibur. I know how much fun the challenge is when working with a frame that has abilities that are pointless in late-game due to any one enemy being entirely capable of two-shotting you... and they're all using machine guns. Call me a masochist, but I get my kicks surviving in areas I likely shouldn't be able to. But in this case, in this game, every ability was meant to be useful on its own as well as in combination with other abilities, and currently only one is actually useful above level 20... which one that is depends on your mods, but radial blind beats radial javelin any day because of utility over damage. Superjump is a turn extender that gives you the same effect as directional melee straight up... and directional melee keeps enemies from hitting you with almost the same efficiency (thanks to movement vs enemy accuracy) and doesn't cost energy.

 

I'm not calling Excal garbage, I'm saying he needs another look or three.

[Void_Vis_Vires]

 

•  

   

  

  Now wouldn´t we all like to see this! ;) Thx to SteelSoldier for the Gif! 

Man i just love this ideea:D

 

 

We neeeeeddd this, ive wanted this in the game for so long either a power for him or a mod for melee, cmon DE this is a low lying branch, grab it! lol

[Malitias]

^

Yea, I think something like that would be extremely nice to have, if balanced properly. And by that I mean worth doing.

[r0ckwolf]

I disagree. Super jump has saved me countless times in T4 survival while chaining RB. The cloak gives me enough time to recollect myself in an ambush and use RB to re-engage. Of course this only works well in rooms with high ceilings. I'm not against improvements to Xcal, but saying super jump is garbage is something I disagree with.  

Nobody said that when you are in an room with high ceilings, that Super Jump couldn´t be suefull! 

 

What i´m saying is that an air directional Melee Strike would have saved you just as well, but faster and for free! ^^ 

Super JUmp itself is an decent idea, but it´s too situational and already acomplished by the games movement system, that´s why ißm suggesting a replacement! ^^

[Flyghter]

I think RJ should be completely changed in a buff to help him whit melee and the new Tenno Kenshi and survivability (Life steel ,attack speed , dmg mult, runing speed  i dont know somthing to make him more active the actual RJ make u stay in a safe place and spam 4 )

Edited April 8, 2015 by Flyghter

[(XBOX)BAMMM Lightning]

Nobody said that when you are in an room with high ceilings, that Super Jump couldn´t be suefull! 

 

What i´m saying is that an air directional Melee Strike would have saved you just as well, but faster and for free! ^^ 

Super JUmp itself is an decent idea, but it´s too situational and already acomplished by the games movement system, that´s why ißm suggesting a replacement! ^^

 

I'm open to other suggestions, but I would prefer them to offer the same amount of opportunity that super jump gives me in engagements. I don't know the exact specifics of how air directional works vs stealth in regards to AI auto-targeting. I would imagine the stealth works better (ie rockets from a bombard don't follow you after a super jump). I also noticed that directional melee differs between weapons. Some weapons seem to get you higher than others. That tells me that I would have to use a specific weapon to achieve what others claim as a "better super jump", I'm not a fan of that logic. Adding extended stealth to Super Jump, creating openings for melee finishers, etc are things I would support. But I'm not sure about replacing the skill entirely without trying these first. 

 

PS - I wonder how a glaive throw while cloaked in super jump works. I understand you get a stealth bonus while in the air.... 

[Malitias]

I also noticed that directional melee differs between weapons. Some weapons seem to get you higher than others. That tells me that I would have to use a specific weapon to achieve what others claim as a "better super jump", I'm not a fan of that logic.

yes, some weapons will, depending on your attack speed, result in insane jumps. For example heavy weapons (Gram, Scindo, etc.) have most of their movement done in a very short amount of time with alot of velocity. Increasing your attack speed to a high level will result in something even faster than zorencoptering due to the momentum you achieve and possibility to alter the angle (I mean it, try it).

 

Adding extended stealth to Super Jump, creating openings for melee finishers, etc are things I would support. But I'm not sure about replacing the skill entirely without trying these first.

Of course you could just add more stealth to the skill or change it so you just float around for a specific time, but the issue is in my opinion about his theme not being accomplished. His skills relating to swords are useless in later levels, which reduces him to some sort sort of shining space-ninja-frog.

Yearightthatsgreat.

 

PS - I wonder how a glaive throw while cloaked in super jump works. I understand you get a stealth bonus while in the air.... 

You can't throw a glaive while midair. You will merely initiate a directional attack.

[Flyghter]

I'm open to other suggestions, but I would prefer them to offer the same amount of opportunity that super jump gives me in engagements. I don't know the exact specifics of how air directional works vs stealth in regards to AI auto-targeting. I would imagine the stealth works better (ie rockets from a bombard don't follow you after a super jump). I also noticed that directional melee differs between weapons. Some weapons seem to get you higher than others. That tells me that I would have to use a specific weapon to achieve what others claim as a "better super jump", I'm not a fan of that logic. Adding extended stealth to Super Jump, creating openings for melee finishers, etc are things I would support. But I'm not sure about replacing the skill entirely without trying these first. 

 

PS - I wonder how a glaive throw while cloaked in super jump works. I understand you get a stealth bonus while in the air.... 

Man dont understand us wrong we like Super Jump but we would like in exchange of Super Jump a skill that can make Excalibur more viable/more fun and maybe whit the introduction of passives we wold see super jump as Excalibur's passive.

[Malitias]

Man dont understand us wrong we like Super Jump but we would like in exchange of Super Jump a skill that can make Excalibur more viable/more fun and maybe whit the introduction of passives we wold see super jump as Excalibur's passive.

I don't.

[(XBOX)BAMMM Lightning]

yes, some weapons will, depending on your attack speed, result in insane jumps. For example heavy weapons (Gram, Scindo, etc.) have most of their movement done in a very short amount of time with alot of velocity. Increasing your attack speed to a high level will result in something even faster than zorencoptering due to the momentum you achieve and possibility to alter the angle (I mean it, try it).

 

Of course you could just add more stealth to the skill or change it so you just float around for a specific time, but the issue is in my opinion about his theme not being accomplished. His skills relating to swords are useless in later levels, which reduces him to some sort sort of shining space-ninja-frog.

Yearightthatsgreat.

 

You can't throw a glaive while midair. You will merely initiate a directional attack.

 

If that's the case, then something should be added to Super Jump to offer more than height and cloak. It will give the opportunity to achieve a directional melee in the air without being forced to use a specific weapon loadout, with added benefits.

 

Not all of his skills need to include some sort of sword. It's better to add a little variety in a kit, ultimately if it assists with the main purpose of the frame. Excalibur being more focused on melee than anything else; allowing super jump to open enemies for finishers would compliment this. Obviously all of his skills need to be looked at for more utility. I personally think skills should offer more utility, since weapons already bring more than enough damage. Examples currently in use: RB + a melee for that stealth damage, paralysis/teleport + a finisher, Rhino Stop, etc. 

[SiiNN321]

Although i personally LOVE Super Jump on Excal since it gives you sooo much utility if you know how to use it correctly. It can really save your butt too and more so than slash dash can at times. But i would like DE to look at this. It is awesome although I think super jump is okay as is, but perhaps some invincibility or longer jumps or make it multi directional like Zephs

[CGs_Knackie]

 

•  

   

  

  Now wouldn´t we all like to see this! ;) Thx to SteelSoldier for the Gif! 

Man i just love this ideea:D

 

I want that for Slash Dash. :o

Hope DE will see this great idea.