The Issue With 'necessary' Mods Like Serration And Multishot Isn't That They're Hard To Find. It's That They're Necessary

[Innocent_Flower]

To make a rifle that can stand up in mid-high level games

 

1- Add plain damage mod . No exceptions. 

 

(optional) If crit rate is high, add crit chance mod. If crit rate is above 200% add crit damage. If not, Ignore this step. 

 

2- Add multishot

 

3- Add as many elemental mods as you can.

 

 

 

 

 

 

That's boring. There's no variety. No depth. No complexity. You're just trying to be as OP as possible by slapping as much on as possible. yet the guy in the devstream's response was "oh, we should start giving out serration at different ranks" Rather than "we're going to balance mods such as these"  Excuse me? A balanced set of mods should have been out months ago. you're just fueling the problem. Assuming you followed the instructions above you've only got two mod slots left (none for those who put the crit mods on) Customisation? Freedom of choice? Nope. 

 

 

There shouldn't be vital mods like that. 

Edited June 21, 2014 by Innocent_Flower

[BrotherIcarus]

No one is forcing you to use said mods.

[Katakuna]

No one is forcing you to use said mods.

 

Point missed so hard, the wind that passed by was like a hurricane.

[StinkyPygmy]

Even when I first started playing I've never found any of these mods strictly necessary. It might be a bit different for new players now with dmg 2.0. 

But even for end game stuff I've managed to make it by without a maxed serration and find myself using it on very few weapons.

So I don't know where people are getting the idea that they are "necessary". Some less OP or functional weapons require them to scale into the higher lvl stuff. But thats about as close as I can see for them being needed. 

[-HAKUNA-YOUR-TATAS-]

Even when I first started playing I've never found any of these mods strictly necessary. It might be a bit different for new players now with dmg 2.0. 

But even for end game stuff I've managed to make it by without a maxed serration and find myself using it on very few weapons.

So I don't know where people are getting the idea that they are "necessary". Some less OP or functional weapons require them to scale into the higher lvl stuff. But thats about as close as I can see for them being needed. 

 

They're necessary to achieve highest e-peen (read DPS) of which a majority of the nerds playing this game feel they MUST have.  XD

 

EDIT:  Yeah so the moral of the story is to stop building to max DPS and actually build to what you like.  Maxing out DPS through forma'ing will allow a player to pretty much steamroll all reasonable content in this game.  It's really up to us players to decide to use reload, ammo mutations, silencing mods, etc. to give ourselves variety.  If we drone on and follow what everyone else is doing then yes...  That's boring.  We mod our gear based on our own choices.  No one is forcing anyone to equip anything on their weaons.  lol.

Edited June 21, 2014 by sushidubya

[Davoodoo]

Even when I first started playing I've never found any of these mods strictly necessary. It might be a bit different for new players now with dmg 2.0. 

But even for end game stuff I've managed to make it by without a maxed serration and find myself using it on very few weapons.

So I don't know where people are getting the idea that they are "necessary". Some less OP or functional weapons require them to scale into the higher lvl stuff. But thats about as close as I can see for them being needed. 

Ofc you can do it without maxed serration. From my estimations 4k dps(around 6k for vor) is enough to clear t4 wtih ease.

Balance is so out of whack that you can reach it with any weapon you want.

 

At the same time they provide highest dps increase and thus are only rational choice.

Also makes it alot easier for new players.

Edited June 21, 2014 by Davoodoo

[BrotherIcarus]

Point missed so hard, the wind that passed by was like a hurricane.

I got the point but someone needed to make that post. 

[Davoodoo]

I got the point but someone needed to make that post. 

No one is forcing you to get the job, you could probably survive without money but more rational choice is to get job and have some money for living.

 

You missed the point.

[Brahmastra]

>don't use Serration / HC comments.

 

Do you guys even PLAY the freaking game?

 

I suggest you make a new account and try the new player experience. Have fun shooting rubber bullets at mobs for half an hour.

On high level defense or survival you NEED Serration and HC. If you don't have these mods you still shoot rubber bullets.

Sure these 2 mods are OP when it comes down to completing the solar map.

[(PSN)GR13V4NC3]

I personally, don't care that there are "vital mods" and I see the reason for needing them more on certain weapons and less on others, though a little change here and there would be nice.

 

More importantly, the precepts on the frames themselves are a problem. I see a good amount of threads/comments about needing more mod slots on warframes when realistically, the precepts should just be removed from the equation altogether and either put into a new pane or just be the "powers of the warframe" and not need to be leveled through fusion, but rather some other means (like xp or something). With the precepts gone from the warframe mod pane, this would enable all players to have, essentially, 2 extra slots but without actually adding in any.

 

I run Ash as my main and I really only have room for Smoke Screen and Shuriken as the powers used by my frame and I only use Shuriken cause it fits in the slot. My other mods are: Streamline, Flow, Sprint, Narrow Minded, Constitution, Continuity, Vitality and Redirection. Basically a survivability/ SS build. With the "2 extra spaces," I'd have room for Quick Rest and Fast Deflection or maybe even Stretch. I don't think that would make me OP, just able to survive better.

 

Just a thought.

Edited June 21, 2014 by (PS4)GR13V4NC3

[LukeAura]

Even when I first started playing I've never found any of these mods strictly necessary. It might be a bit different for new players now with dmg 2.0. 

They are a necessity, not so much that they need to be maxed out, but that nothing else will compare to them in terms of damage, especially when stacking. They're needed because if you don't want to focus on damage, then they are the best option to keep your damage output up for higher levels while minimizing mod space consumption.  

[Dawg]

i feel that a maxed serration should be anymore than an extra 50% dmg the mods should make a big enough difference to be noticeable but not big enough to make the guns 10 times as powerful.

[BrotherIcarus]

Lets say we remove these vital mods, after a couple weeks the community will settle on a new set of "Best" mods and they will just take the place of these ones. 

 

This whole problem you see here is not an objective problem it is a matter of opinion thus you see a problem and others do not.

 

No one is forcing you to get the job, you could probably survive without money but more rational choice is to get job and have some money for living.

 

You missed the point.

No I definitely got the point. 

Edited June 21, 2014 by BrotherIcarus

[KvotheTheArcane1]

Lets say we remove these vital mods, after a couple weeks the community will settle on a new set of "Best" mods and they will just take the place of these ones. 

 

This whole problem you see here is not an objective problem it is a matter of opinion thus you see a problem and others do not.

Try playing without any multishot/base damage. Any of the vital mods

 

Go to a level 20 planet.

 

Lemme know how it works out for you.

 

Go now pluto.

 

Lemme know what happens.

Edited June 21, 2014 by KvotheTheArcane1

[BrotherIcarus]

Try playing without any multishot/base damage. Any of the vital mods

 

Go to a level 20 planet.

 

Lemme know how it works out for you.

 

Go now pluto.

 

Lemme know what happens.

Are the dual status and elemental mods allowed?

[KvotheTheArcane1]

Are the dual status and elemental mods allowed?

Are they vital? Yes. Therefore...

[LukeAura]

Are they vital? Yes. Therefore...

I'd recommend allowing dual status mods. Maybe say one or two can be used, and elements that are below a certain rank as they're only there for the combined proc effect and not to up damage output. 

[BrotherIcarus]

Are they vital? Yes. Therefore...

I would not consider them vital at all they have pretty low damage due to increased status chance, But I will run it again without them.

[CosyPigeon]

They're necessary to achieve highest e-peen (read DPS) of which a majority of the nerds playing this game feel they MUST have.  XD

 

EDIT:  Yeah so the moral of the story is to stop building to max DPS and actually build to what you like.  Maxing out DPS through forma'ing will allow a player to pretty much steamroll all reasonable content in this game.  It's really up to us players to decide to use reload, ammo mutations, silencing mods, etc. to give ourselves variety.  If we drone on and follow what everyone else is doing then yes...  That's boring.  We mod our gear based on our own choices.  No one is forcing anyone to equip anything on their weaons.  lol.

That would be fine, IF DE used some other form of difficulty besides infinitely scaling HP. Since they don't, latter content is restricted to boring builds in order to be viable, end of story. That fact that it's boring is why there are so many complaints. 

[CosyPigeon]

i feel that a maxed serration should be anymore than an extra 50% dmg the mods should make a big enough difference to be noticeable but not big enough to make the guns 10 times as powerful.

Serration should not exist, base damage percentage increase should depend on the weapons RANK, not a mandatory mod. 

[KvotheTheArcane1]

I'd recommend allowing dual status mods. Maybe say one or two can be used, and elements that are below a certain rank as they're only there for the combined proc effect and not to up damage output. 

Eh, that's true I guess.

 

I would not consider them vital at all they have pretty low damage due to increased status chance, But I will run it again without them.

Eh, alright, but lets add T3/T4 survival (T3 as in grineer/corpus, or you can do a T3 key)

Edited June 21, 2014 by KvotheTheArcane1

[vaugahn]

Serration should not exist, base damage percentage increase should depend on the weapons RANK, not a mandatory mod. 

 

I would compare mods to attachments in CoD but that seems like it'd have a good chance of causing rage. In my opinion the point of mods should be to modify the existing behavior of a weapon, not just make the weapon viable. Try playing on ceres or pluto without damage mods and tell me if that weapon is still even useful. Of course, if damage was tied to weapon rank the weapon rank system would probably need a change but that's a secondary issue here.

[CosyPigeon]

I would compare mods to attachments in CoD but that seems like it'd have a good chance of causing rage. In my opinion the point of mods should be to modify the existing behavior of a weapon, not just make the weapon viable. Try playing on ceres or pluto without damage mods and tell me if that weapon is still even useful. Of course, if damage was tied to weapon rank the weapon rank system would probably need a change but that's a secondary issue here.

Won't get any rage from me, I agree whole heartedly, mods should not dictate viability, they should add interest and personalisation to weapons and gear. 

[BrotherIcarus]

Eh, alright, but lets add T3/T4 survival (T3 as in grineer/corpus, or you can do a T3 key)

Ye no I will not do something like like this on a mission that scales with time. (Not going to waste a useful key on proving a point) Maybe on a T3 exterminate. 

 

But here is your Pluto run

 

[BrotherIcarus]

Won't get any rage from me, I agree whole heartedly, mods should not dictate viability, they should add interest and personalisation to weapons and gear. 

I disagree at the moment mods do not dictate viability they add it, with mods you can take the starter gear and can run ever single mission in the game (Getting to wave 20 and 20 minutes defence and survival)