How Do You Feel About De Making Sweeping Changes To The Game?

[DoomsDayDan]

I'm not sure about that. Could you please explain what you mean by bandaid? 

I meant it metaphorically, as in they should get it over with and tear off the bandaid, it'll be painful but in the long run it just has to happen

[notlamprey]

If we're being honest?

 

Burn down all my "hard work," if that's what it takes. Burn my Mastery Rank, my multi-forma'd weapons, my huge piles of crafting materials. If a better game can be built on the ashes, go for it.

 

DE knows the benefits of trying to "do right" by players who have been stuck by so-called progress destruction. They haven't done it consistently, mind you, but they know how to try. (vis: Legendary Cores)

 

If they are indeed planning to make any Sweeping, Mopping, Shop-Vacing, Power Washing or Dust Busting changes to Warframe's core systems, I have confidence that someone will spend the time quantifying how progress in the old system can be compensated in the new.

 

I'd really hate to hold them back from trying new stuff in an effort to get better at what they do.

[Hexagoros]

no

 because ive been around to long for a complete overhaul

[Vastaren]

I think it's inaccurate to say that DE is being limited by fear of angering their playerbase. While this is definitely a legitimate concern, I don't see them pandering to the outspoken players demanding an immediate release of exclusive items like event color palettes or relics from closed beta. "limited by fear" as I saw it used a couple posts back seems to imply that they are afraid of making sweeping changes to the system as it is. Yes, I can see how some would get this impression, but I also notice they didn't back down from releasing Melee 2.0 and other such updates, including revising the much-debated Trinity Blessing skill. In this regard, I honestly think that they aren't as much limited by the playerbase as they are sensitive to it, while also maintaining a vision for what they see as conducive towards the overall improvement of gameplay mechanics.

 

However, I also wouldn't say that DE is developing the game at the rate which they could be - yes, this is beta, but it feels to be settling in to a very established routine of updates which do relatively little to address problems players have pointed out. Very few visible changes to mechanics are occurring where (I feel) there ought to be changes in favor of smaller bugfixes and new content. While yes, events and attractions are coming out at an admirable rate, I get the feeling (and I understand this is a completely subjective statement to make) that the focus has leaned more heavily towards player retention and attraction rather than gameplay development in a ratio I would expect more from a finished product than from an open beta product.

 

Having said that, I applaud DE for having the audacity to consider large changes to gameplay mechanics, while also remaining sensitive to the wishes of the playerbase. If I were to encourage them to focus more on development than player interactions, then that would be a small criticism to make, everything considered.

To address the topic itself, I would personally be welcoming of any and all changes that they make to better the state of the game, however wide-ranging, provided they explain their reasoning, take into account player-debated and player-reviewed suggestions when doing so (such as notionphil's topic on varying enemy design here), and never forget that Warframe is a game about space ninjas for space ninjas at heart.

[CY13ERPUNK]

+9999 OP

 

honestly i was super impressed with DE when they re-did the upgrade tree/node system and gave us the mod cards

 

but ever since then, i have completely underwhelmed by their lack of serious changes, sure dmg 2.0 was nice, but enemy scaling is still bonkers, and melee 2.0 is just a pretty but incredibly shallow swap that honestly added VERY LITTLE to melee at all and even took away charge attacks for no reason (why we STILL have no mid-air/uppercut/aim-able melee is beyond me)

 

get rid of ALL of the core base dmg mods (serration/hornet/etc) and give all weapons +5% dmg per rank, thus +150% base dmg at rank 30, viola, now all weapons actually gain something beyond mod pts and can be functional as they rank up instead of having tenno with guns at rank 30 but garbage dmg becuz they either couldnt find the right mods or dont have the creds/cores to fuse them up

 

reimburse everyone who loses a serration/hornet over rank 5 with a legendary core, or whatevs, and give them 1 million credits or something, boom, done

 

then we can build/mod our gear based on how we want it to perform, and not on the necessity of having to put on the required dmg just to get it to function at all in higher lvl content

[Unibot]

Something I've been thinking about.

 

When DE proposed their intention with removing stats from helmets, they wrestled for some time with the proper course of action to dispose of them. The resulting solution, as many have expressed, did little to solve the problem (if you view it as one) that they presented in the first place and just placed a handicap on newer players. Many players were disappointed with how it was resolved.

 

Myself, and many other players that I have seen post, felt that it would have been far more fair and clean to simply remove stats from ALL helmets, regardless of when you obtained them. Perhaps this change would slightly impede the way that you play, but I feel as if that is part of what you agree to when you play a game in beta. Despite the slight setback you might experience from the change, the point to focus on is that it would be in the best interest of the long term health of the game.

 

A future example might be Serration. I think very few people are satisfied with how this mod exists in the game now, for reasons that have been expressed countless times. However, if it were removed, and replaced with some other way of upgrading your weapon damage, DE would be faced with innumerable players upset over the loss of a mod they spent time and money ranking.

 

I am of the opinion that this dissatisfaction is a small price to pay for a change that can be agreed upon is in the best interest in the long term health of the game. If DE comes up with an adequate replacement for Serration, I feel that they should not let player's mewling limit their decisions and - by extension - the overall quality of the game.

 

Important notes to be considered are that I would only endorse such a radical change if it was properly communicated to the community previously and generally accepted as a proper alternative. Although I feel it's unnecessary, some kind of compensation could also be given to players for their lost mod.

 

This thread is not specifically about Serration, however. It is about sweeping changes *such as this* that might upset many players for the sake of a greater game overall. I feel as if currently DE is very scared of angering its players, and that this fear limits their creative decisions.

 

Please give me your thoughts on this.

TL;DR

OP thinks removing features is "in the best interest of the long term health of the game"

 

I however do not agree. Features should be not removed. Bad implemented features should be again reworked.

Helmet situation could be easilly solved with addition of a separate stat bonus in the exchange of other stat cripple. Same as helmets before, but chosen by player and not bind to a specific cosmetics.

Serration could be rework to still give weapon additional bonus and if not damage one, but a different one that still boost its perfomance, you can even rework it to give weapon bonus mod points like stance mods or auras. Same for pistols. Taking in account that weapon still gets damage bonus as it gains ranks.

There are good ways to implement changes and to achieve goal that suit both new and old players, its just DE doesn't want to do it.

Edited July 13, 2014 by Unibot

[(PSN)Zelgorath]

I assume DE did away with stats on alternate helms because they felt like it made the game more pay to win instead of free to play (as cosmetic helmets were purchaseable through platinum and gave stat bonuses). To balance that, they made those alternate helmets available as special alert rewards so patient players did not have to spend plat to get stat boosting gear.

Blanketly removing stats from all new helmet purchases and alert reward blueprints while leaving previously crafted/purchased helmets with stats is a nod to the veterans but a slap to newer players. The new players must drop large amounts of plat in trades with vets to get these now exclusive helemts, or pay plat for a cosmetic helm or wait for a random helm alert with no additional benefit.

It made more sense to leave stats on all helms and give the option of paying plat or doing an alert, or to remove all stats from helmets.

As for the MOD system, there is no doubt huge room for improvements. For one, in the face of Cicero/Tethra/Breeding Grounds event MOD's, serious rebalancing needs to be done across the board. I don't know if I would say Serration needs to be nerfed or removed, but the way weapons are treated needs to be edited.

Weapons like Launchers and Bows deal some of the most ridiculous dmg in the game. Bows have a limited ammo pool and their ammo drop is among the rarest. The Ogris needs a smaller ammo pool and specialized ammo drop (should be on par with bows).

They should eliminate ability mods and have all abilities activate then level up as you level. This gives the player 8 slots to really play around with. Anyway, just some ideas. DE should be a little more radical if it gives the players a fresh better and more balanced experience.

Edited July 13, 2014 by (PS4)Zelgorath