BlazeBigBang Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 Dude. You. Read. My. Mind. The other day I was thinking "we need a plant/earth frame", and Bramble and Verdance are pretty much of what I thought. Do you mind if I pm you a couple of ideas I got? :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPigman Posted January 12, 2015 Author Share Posted January 12, 2015 I really like this concept, and I love the artwork for how the frame looks, even the alt helmets. If it is alright with you I am gonna do some critiques in this post. :D Art and look: love it, absolutely would not change a thing. Stats: Judging by the abilities, these stats feel a bit off. even if these are for rank 30 they still feel big. according to abilities 1,2 and 4 she is heavy CC. her 3rd is the only thing alluding towards being a self heal tank(which I have a suggestion change to it.) Now, assuming these stats are rank 30, I propose this instead stat wise Support stats ( my personal choice for her) Health:275. Reason: highest health frame unmodded is Oberon at 375, and he is supposed to be a heal tank. this frame doesn't feel tank like, it feels natural CC support type. frames closer to that are mag(225), banshee(300), Nyx(300), and trinity(300). I say 275 because of her 3 also. 300 max. Shield: 300, again from my perspective she is more support and most support frames have 300 shields(except mag who has 450). So I would set her at 300. Power:225, 150 feels like that of someone who is not a caster, has no toggle abilities that would eat power, or for rank 0. 225 would be better for her Armour: drop it to maybe 20, mag is really the only support with high armor at 65, the others have 15. even ember( similar ult) only has 15 armor speed:1.0-1.1, 1.2 is to fast and only frame who has that is prime loki. Stamina: fine Tank: Health:300, again most of the tank frames with CC have 300 max. 450 is to much Shield:450, average tank frame has a 450 shield. Power:175, because of her toggle she needs a bit more power then average tank Armor: 110 Speed:.9-1.0, again 1.2 is really fast Stamina:fine Abilities 1. Lignify: is fine but due to stagger I would lower it a bit more. make it 10/25/40/50 instead and should be fine.make this affected by duration and range. maybe strength if you want to lower base and make strength raise it up. 2. Bramble:lower the proc chance of the slash Make it affected by Range and strength, the strength can bring the the slash proc to 100%. 3. Synthesis: I assume you mean it to have an initial 25 then cost maybe 2-5 power a second for it being on, otherwise it is way to powerful cost wise. 1.Tank: 5/4/3/2 seconds instead of 1 and make it 2/4/6/8%. Think if you have 700 health(after mods) at max you are healing 280 health a second with that on. that means in less then 3 seconds you are back to full health. you can out heal almost everything. at 8% every 2 seconds you get 56 which is more balanced, or do 6% at the least which gives 42 every 2 second. 2. Make it support! 5/4/3/2 a second for 2/4/6/8% missing health, and have it affect you and allies close by. making you a CC off healer. Range if support can affect it, and you could add strength to strengthen the heal. maybe choose 6 for base and 8 for max if using power strength mods. Personally I like the idea of having it more support oriented. Veradance: depending on how heavy "heavy puncture damage" is is if I have to criticize. right now though it is fine. Obvious effective mods for it - range for distant's of enemies that can be hit, strength for damage, duration for how long it lasts. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Overall I love the concept, just a few things feel they need tweaking. As for %, use a % calculator like this http://www.math.com/students/calculators/source/3percent.htm. (for the heal, you can use one of your frames with vitality or warframe builder to find out the health of a frame with at least max vitality on. then plug the numbers into the calculator till you find something that sounds more balanced for a toggle ability.) Great work all in all, I full endorse this frame coming to the game at some point!(sorry for long wall O' text xD) thanks for the feedback! i really appreciate it! lets clarify some things here though! STATS HP: both ash and zephyr have 450 hp making them have the highest in the game not oberon. my reasoning for her having such high health is due to her synthesis ability and she will have to be somewhat closer than other frames to make full use of most of her skills, so a high hp makes sense (or to me at least) Shield: Her shield was lower to make up for her high hp, essentially how i thought of it was sacrificing shield for more usefulness of an ability. perhaps she should have a bit more shield and less health though, will look into the math. power: i thought it might be too little, but after reviewing some other frames i feel 150 power is fair. only a few frames have 225 as a base and those that do are VERY reliant on their abilities due to their intense squishiness, however Flora is not really too squishy, aside from armor. take a look at zephyr who has 450 of both health and shield but only 15 armor, she has 150 energy. giving her that amount of energy is completely appropriate in my opinion. armor: she is not meant to be too squishy, is it too much to ask for good utility and decent tankiness? speed: 1.2 would not be the fastest, fastest being loki and loki p at 1.25, while she would be fast it's not fastest, though i do feel 1.15 would be more appropriate. SKILLS the only skill i see that you didnt suggest numeral changes (which i will look into) was Synthesis which i like your idea and i will think of something or just use that idea! thanks for the feedback again i appreciate it! as for the percent clac, you can also just convert it to a decimal! like 50% is .5 or 13% is .13! Dude. You. Read. My. Mind. The other day I was thinking "we need a plant/earth frame", and Bramble and Verdance are pretty much of what I thought. Do you mind if I pm you a couple of ideas I got? :D feel free! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kasumi- Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 I'd main this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LinkGetsuei Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 (edited) thanks for the feedback! i really appreciate it! lets clarify some things here though! STATS HP: both ash and zephyr have 450 hp making them have the highest in the game not oberon. my reasoning for her having such high health is due to her synthesis ability and she will have to be somewhat closer than other frames to make full use of most of her skills, so a high hp makes sense (or to me at least) Shield: Her shield was lower to make up for her high hp, essentially how i thought of it was sacrificing shield for more usefulness of an ability. perhaps she should have a bit more shield and less health though, will look into the math. power: i thought it might be too little, but after reviewing some other frames i feel 150 power is fair. only a few frames have 225 as a base and those that do are VERY reliant on their abilities due to their intense squishiness, however Flora is not really too squishy, aside from armor. take a look at zephyr who has 450 of both health and shield but only 15 armor, she has 150 energy. giving her that amount of energy is completely appropriate in my opinion. armor: she is not meant to be too squishy, is it too much to ask for good utility and decent tankiness? speed: 1.2 would not be the fastest, fastest being loki and loki p at 1.25, while she would be fast it's not fastest, though i do feel 1.15 would be more appropriate. SKILLS the only skill i see that you didnt suggest numeral changes (which i will look into) was Synthesis which i like your idea and i will think of something or just use that idea! thanks for the feedback again i appreciate it! as for the percent clac, you can also just convert it to a decimal! like 50% is .5 or 13% is .13! feel free! Stats: ahh miss that on ashe and zephyr. but I mainly looked towards other support/tanky frames. Since it is to make full use of her 3 then that balance of health and shields is fine, I still feel it should be a tad lower because of her 3 being a toggle. maybe 425. Edit:also maybe drop the shield to 225. thing mag's stats buts instead of super high shield and super low health. its super high health with super low shields. if you drop the shields to 225 then 450 would be fine HP wise xD As for power, most toggle abilities cost power a second. Otherwise they would be way to strong. so I would still raise it some. maybe 175 would be a better number without being to high? for armor no its not to much to ask xD I guess considering mag 65 is fine. Speed: I guess considering loki 1.2 is fine. I would personally make her 1.1 but that is just me xD maybe 1.15 tops. again my personal choice xD I felt you would like the synthesis suggestion ^^ she feels very a mix of support and damage so having the heal effect her and others near her makes sense to me :D the calculator was just an idea to double check numbers. I like to double check my math through a calculator just in case I made a mistake. Oh, I have a bit of a bio/back story idea, if you don't mind me pitching you the idea let me know and I will PM it :) Edited January 12, 2015 by LinkGetsuei Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPigman Posted January 12, 2015 Author Share Posted January 12, 2015 (edited) Stats: ahh miss that on ashe and zephyr. but I mainly looked towards other support/tanky frames. Since it is to make full use of her 3 then that balance of health and shields is fine, I still feel it should be a tad lower because of her 3 being a toggle. maybe 400 or 425. As for power, most toggle abilities cost power a second. Otherwise they would be way to strong. so I would still raise it some. maybe 175 would be a better number without being to high? for armor no its not to much to ask xD I guess considering mag 65 is fine. Speed: I guess considering loki 1.2 is fine. I would personally make her 1.1 but that is just me xD maybe 1.15 tops. again my personal choice xD I felt you would like the synthesis suggestion ^^ she feels very a mix of support and damage so having the heal effect her and others near her makes sense to me :D the calculator was just an idea to double check numbers. I like to double check my math through a calculator just in case I made a mistake. Oh, I have a bit of a bio/back story idea, if you don't mind me pitching you the idea let me know and I will PM it :) edit: perhaps maybe a small nerf on hp. yea i know toggle drain over time however would the lesser amount of power not balance out the healing rate of it? it might force players to use it a little more conservatively. as for synthesis, perhaps a syndicate mod to add the AOE to it? or maybe just make it base. ill put it in the OP to get opinions. but feel free to pm me the lore im all ears(or eyes since im reading) Edited January 12, 2015 by MrPigman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)LIGHTNINGCOMBAT Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 Unless those health and shield stats are at rank 30... and even then honestly now that I think of it... They are way too high! She should have something like base 150 Health, base 100 Shield, more even that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPigman Posted January 12, 2015 Author Share Posted January 12, 2015 Unless those health and shield stats are at rank 30... and even then honestly now that I think of it... They are way too high! She should have something like base 150 Health, base 100 Shield, more even that way. the stats are at level 30 yes, i will make it clear that they are in the OP! 150 health at level 30 would be absurdly low! considering loki a VERY squishy frame has 225 health and shield at 30 that would make her wayyy to squishy. as it is i want her to have higher hp value to make use of her synthesis ability. she also has much more hp than shield because she will make more use of having a lot of HP. also having low shield and high hp will give her an opportunity to make use of Rage as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPigman Posted January 12, 2015 Author Share Posted January 12, 2015 added syandana and sugatra to the other concepts section. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lightsmith Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 Looks great, perhaps make it a little more 'tech' like, but maintain shape. Like segment the armor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)SteampunkJester Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 Love the design! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPigman Posted January 12, 2015 Author Share Posted January 12, 2015 Looks great, perhaps make it a little more 'tech' like, but maintain shape. Like segment the armor. well the idea was to give a very organic feel because it's a plant frame! and bt segmenting the armor you mean make more cuts into the design and separate some of the pieces? Love the design! thank you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blatantfool Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 I like how you're constantly working on this. I come by to check periodically and in just a couple of days you've refined what you wanted to do with your suggested skills even further. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)TheLegend 64312 Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Again, 1 has a little much going on. It's a bit OP. But I really like the rest of her abilities. Maybe make 3 an aoe team heal and give it a base value instead of percent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlazeBigBang Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 For her 4th ability, what do you think of this: Flora casts an animation for a couple of seconds. While she's casting, a big tree grows in front of her (5 metes ~). In a medium range radius, the roots of the tree start coming out of the floor, dealing heavy damage, every 3 seconds. The other idea I had was having as an alternate name, or for an alternate helmet, naming her Daphne. You know, because of the Daphne and Apollo's myth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPigman Posted January 13, 2015 Author Share Posted January 13, 2015 Again, 1 has a little much going on. It's a bit OP. But I really like the rest of her abilities. Maybe make 3 an aoe team heal and give it a base value instead of percent will look into value nerfs again, thanks for the feedback For her 4th ability, what do you think of this: Flora casts an animation for a couple of seconds. While she's casting, a big tree grows in front of her (5 metes ~). In a medium range radius, the roots of the tree start coming out of the floor, dealing heavy damage, every 3 seconds. The other idea I had was having as an alternate name, or for an alternate helmet, naming her Daphne. You know, because of the Daphne and Apollo's myth. i was planning on adding some alternate skills Ill add yours to the list! if its liked more than her current 4 i will change it! I've never heard of the daphne and apollo myth but i'll look it up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyVik Posted January 13, 2015 Share Posted January 13, 2015 Very cool concept and you clearly put a ton of work into this but it has an uncanny resemblance to a digimon. The second I saw your concept art I pictured this: http://dma.wtw-x.net/dexlilly.shtml Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPigman Posted January 13, 2015 Author Share Posted January 13, 2015 Very cool concept and you clearly put a ton of work into this but it has an uncanny resemblance to a digimon. The second I saw your concept art I pictured this: http://dma.wtw-x.net/dexlilly.shtml Gotta love Digimon :) however funny enough i did not have this in mind while designing flora though the similarities are uncanny! petals and leaves are just so easy to mend into just about any apparel! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LinkGetsuei Posted January 14, 2015 Share Posted January 14, 2015 O.O love the archwing! looks great :D you really made it pop and feel its own. and I could see this looking great on Saryn as well as your Flora here. Stats look a lot more balanced out now. still feel an extra 25 energy would be nice only cause of her 3, but 150 will work ( especially with primed flow in the game anyways) If people keep saying her one is still a bit strong, I may crunch some numbers to. just to give a second brains feedback about it. Easy way to maybe make it seem less strong would be to add a cast range. As of right now it looks like it has no set cast range. that might take the edge off for people. also applying a duration number might make them feel it is not to strong also xD for 3, you might consider applying what you feel a cost per second would be. examples of frames who have toggles: Mesa:(4) Peacemaker: cost 25 - drains 15 a second Mirage:(4) Prism: cost 50 - drains 10 a second Nyx:(4) absorb: cost 25 - 7/6/5/4 a second Banshee:(4) Sound Quake: cost 25 - drains 25/18/15/12 a second. Hydroid:(3) Undertow: cost 15 - drains 6/4/3/2 a second Oberon:(3) Renewal: cost 25 - drains 5 a second (All the warframes who currently have toggles) I would say with A: make it something like drain 20/18/15/10, or B: flat 10. since power efficiency mods affect drain, it can be lowered that way. Last not, Consider adding what each buff can do for an ability maybe? it might help you feel better about adjusting some numbers xD like for her (I have no idea how DE calculates this so I have no numbers for these as I write this xD) 1: -Duration: increase the debuff/buff duration. -Strength: increases effect (I have no idea how DE calculates this so I have no numbers for these xD) -Range: either does nothing( has no cast range) or increases cast range -Efficiency: lowers cost to X 2: -Duration: increases how long it stays -Strength: increases either the slow, damage, or both so long as the increase isn't to high for either -Range: increase size of the ring -Efficiency: lowers cost to X 3: -Duration: has no effect on it -Strength: either have it increase the heal, but make it a very small increase for going max strength. or have it have no effect -Range: increases the range at which allies are healed -Efficiency: lowers cost to X and channel(toggle:on) cost to X a second 4: -Duration: how long it lasts, small increase to stagger time could also be put here if desired -Strength: how much damage it deals or if it will have a high base maybe have it make the stagger stronger by a bit. -Range: increases the range of which enemies are hit. -Efficiency: lowers cost to X Just some food for thought suggestions. I tend to look it over while seeing what others say before making these posts to have plenty of constructive data xD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPigman Posted January 14, 2015 Author Share Posted January 14, 2015 O.O love the archwing! looks great :D you really made it pop and feel its own. and I could see this looking great on Saryn as well as your Flora here. Stats look a lot more balanced out now. still feel an extra 25 energy would be nice only cause of her 3, but 150 will work ( especially with primed flow in the game anyways) If people keep saying her one is still a bit strong, I may crunch some numbers to. just to give a second brains feedback about it. Easy way to maybe make it seem less strong would be to add a cast range. As of right now it looks like it has no set cast range. that might take the edge off for people. also applying a duration number might make them feel it is not to strong also xD for 3, you might consider applying what you feel a cost per second would be. examples of frames who have toggles: Mesa:(4) Peacemaker: cost 25 - drains 15 a second Mirage:(4) Prism: cost 50 - drains 10 a second Nyx:(4) absorb: cost 25 - 7/6/5/4 a second Banshee:(4) Sound Quake: cost 25 - drains 25/18/15/12 a second. Hydroid:(3) Undertow: cost 15 - drains 6/4/3/2 a second Oberon:(3) Renewal: cost 25 - drains 5 a second (All the warframes who currently have toggles) I would say with A: make it something like drain 20/18/15/10, or B: flat 10. since power efficiency mods affect drain, it can be lowered that way. Last not, Consider adding what each buff can do for an ability maybe? it might help you feel better about adjusting some numbers xD like for her (I have no idea how DE calculates this so I have no numbers for these as I write this xD) 1: -Duration: increase the debuff/buff duration. -Strength: increases effect (I have no idea how DE calculates this so I have no numbers for these xD) -Range: either does nothing( has no cast range) or increases cast range -Efficiency: lowers cost to X 2: -Duration: increases how long it stays -Strength: increases either the slow, damage, or both so long as the increase isn't to high for either -Range: increase size of the ring -Efficiency: lowers cost to X 3: -Duration: has no effect on it -Strength: either have it increase the heal, but make it a very small increase for going max strength. or have it have no effect -Range: increases the range at which allies are healed -Efficiency: lowers cost to X and channel(toggle:on) cost to X a second 4: -Duration: how long it lasts, small increase to stagger time could also be put here if desired -Strength: how much damage it deals or if it will have a high base maybe have it make the stagger stronger by a bit. -Range: increases the range of which enemies are hit. -Efficiency: lowers cost to X Just some food for thought suggestions. I tend to look it over while seeing what others say before making these posts to have plenty of constructive data xD point taken, will look into it. again thanks for the feedback! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LinkGetsuei Posted January 14, 2015 Share Posted January 14, 2015 point taken, will look into it. again thanks for the feedback! Of course ^^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlazeBigBang Posted January 14, 2015 Share Posted January 14, 2015 For her 4th ability, what do you think of this: Flora casts an animation for a couple of seconds. While she's casting, a big tree grows in front of her (5 metes ~). In a medium range radius, the roots of the tree start coming out of the floor, dealing heavy damage, every 3 seconds. The other idea I had was having as an alternate name, or for an alternate helmet, naming her Daphne. You know, because of the Daphne and Apollo's myth. Cupid shoots Apollo with his arrow, and so Apollo falls in love with Daphne, a Nymph. Daphne wanted to live and die as a virgin, and so Apollo chases Daphne through the forest. Daphne asks his father, the river Peneus, to do something to help her. He then transforms her into a tree, and that's the origin on the Laurel. Well, that's the story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPigman Posted January 15, 2015 Author Share Posted January 15, 2015 added Lore and I plan to add some skill demos in the near future! if there are any critiques or whatever about the lore please do say so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LinkGetsuei Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 I like where you are going, but feel it ends a bit abruptly. Seeing as to obtain frames, you generally have to do a mission a part, I have a proposal. Now I know the grineer aren't the brightest bunch, but I don't think they would be dumb enough to take each piece of a frame on the same ship. They would call it a victory to make it out with 1 piece.So for the last leg, say lotus scans the piece and finds three energy signatures around earth. but can only zone in on one. You go back to everest and do a dual mission like you have. but have the lotus instruct to reclaim what you can find and capture a grineer soldier. The mission will have one capture target which is the grineer Guarding the piece, upon capturing him you are told you have recovered the piece, head for extraction. You get the head, and the lotus says she was able to find out through the captive where the next piece is, do the same thing. obtain chassisAgain, same thing is told, but you are warned that something seems wrong. Upon this last mission you fly for the ship like normal, but the ship doesn't look right, upon entering you find that the ship has been infected and infested are inbound. this time instead of capturing a target you are looking for a "data cache" sort of item, you must fight your way through infested and grineer to the cache and then escape with your life. upon finishing you receive the systemsReason the last one is different is, if there was a tenno inside and they killed it half hazardly, there is a chance for one of them to be infected with the virus, or bring it on board on accident. considering how long it might take to do the first two missions (games world time not so much how long it actually takes us) then there would be enough time for it to infect and take over on the ship. Also I thought it could spice things up xD Alternatively, the corpus could have intercepted a message from this ship, and instead of infested you enter to seeing the corpus and grineer fighting, with both sides willing to ignore each other and fire at you if spotted.Just an idea I had while reading it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SprinKah Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 VERY NICE!! You put alot of effort into her! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arch111 Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 This has moved fast. Incredible how this warframe concept feels so close to being finished. Must be a record of some sort. You have done a really good and solid concept here, the powers feel strong and the frame has a freshness to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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