(PSN)Zeylon Posted March 19, 2015 Share Posted March 19, 2015 You can try stripping off all mods including multishot, go into a survival mission and don't trigger the alarm, fire at a flat wall from mid-range, and record an off-screen video of yourself firing. Then you can rewatch the recorded and pause it when you see the pellet impact. Count how many pellets have impacted, and you're good. I don't know if PS4 has a way to record what's on your screen, but I'm pretty sure the XB1 has that feature. I've tried that, but the results just seem wrong. I think I saw 4 "once", but most of the time it seemed like 3. So, maybe it's at 5 and pellets are clustering exactly on top of each other at full spool a lot? Or something? The pellet count definitely is not higher than 5, and I'm sketchy on it even being that high. It seems "wrong" that I'd be shooting fewer pellets than rounds are leaving my gun. That's just cruel, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[DE]Grzegorz Posted March 19, 2015 Author Share Posted March 19, 2015 At full spool, it uses exactly 4 rounds per shot. That might explain why I'm losing ammo so much quicker? Assuming that it uses same ammo mechanics as on PC, it would have 12 pellet base at full charge then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunkingmachine Posted March 19, 2015 Share Posted March 19, 2015 (edited) So ammo consumption/shot was increased by 140%, firerate by 37%, meaning ammo consumption per second was more than tripled... Yeah that really was the strong point of the gun, being so ammo efficient, thanks for fixing it, great job. Can i have primed Shotgun Ammo Mutation now? Edited March 19, 2015 by Dunkingmachine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlueSilkMetallic Posted March 19, 2015 Share Posted March 19, 2015 Kohm is fine as it is. If they buff it now 30% it will be nerfed in the future 70% -_- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Zeylon Posted March 19, 2015 Share Posted March 19, 2015 Assuming that it uses same ammo mechanics as on PC, it would have 12 pellet base at full charge then. As near as I can tell from capture of me emptying clips into a wall in slow-mo, it's definitely fewer than 12 pellets at full charge. It may not even be 5, as near as I can tell. Did the Kohm have different launch stats than when we got it originally (15.10 I guess)? I'm not familiar with the history of the patches. I was trying to figure out what happened with this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiabolusUrsus Posted March 19, 2015 Share Posted March 19, 2015 The Kohm is still a perfectly decent weapon. I honestly don't see what the problem is, beyond "It's not what it used to be." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[DE]Grzegorz Posted March 19, 2015 Author Share Posted March 19, 2015 At least give it 3.7RPS it used to have because current firerate is atrocious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoeleVeerod Posted March 19, 2015 Share Posted March 19, 2015 And here I was thinking I was playing with an already good gun. The only thing that sets me off is the use of Vicious Spread that makes spraying extremely inaccurate. Shooting 10 pellets per shot was fun, but if it affects low end computers that much... it wouldn't be wise to return to that. But buffing the fire rate could work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Zeylon Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 [DE]Drew confirmed in the Kohm PS4 nerf/bug thread that the change to hitscan was intentional. It's not clear to me at the moment if this will be the first weapon that has a stat/trait fork between consoles and PCs, or if the PC will follow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Zeylon Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 Ok all you PC users, this just got more relevant for you, [DE] Drew just posted this to our update thread: I've added the following information to the patch notes: Kohm Changes - Kohm now uses traces instead of projectiles (to improve performance). - Stats reverted to original values. We will continue to monitor for performance and balance issues. The reason these were not added before is because consoles actually received these changes before PC, and so they were not in our notes. Sorry for the confusion. ^^ So, that would seem to suggest that some of these same changes were planned for PC? The hit-scan bit specifically is going over, but it's unclear from (stats reverted to original values) what those original values are in this case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[DE]Grzegorz Posted March 20, 2015 Author Share Posted March 20, 2015 And it got optimized once again... FFS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NyxOOX Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 As far as I'm concerned they ruined the Kohm. It used to be one of my favourite weapons because it actually had fun mechanics, but this latest set of "optimizations" just went and sucked all the character out of it like a giant mutant mosquito. It's basically just another generic shotgun now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[DE]Grzegorz Posted March 20, 2015 Author Share Posted March 20, 2015 (edited) Yeah... So far, as generic shotgun... Lemme think about changes. Damage got severely reduced, to less than a half (77DMG, 46.2/15.4/15.4 > 30DMG, 6/6/18 IPS) Firerate got slightly buffed (2.7>3.7) Is now hitscan with falloff, which basically killed this weapon. Consumes up to 4 units of ammo per shot and still shoots 5 pellets at most, which is crazy. Got much higher status (25% compared to 10%), which is okay-ish. Dear DE employee(s), what the hell were you thinking? Apparently it now shoots up to 12 pellets on full charge, which is kinda good? Would explain why it doesn't feel bad after these changes. Oh DE and your transparency... Edited March 20, 2015 by Mofixil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatzeputt Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 They butchered it ...simple as that we must use Paris P, Soma P, Boltor P, Dread everything else must be butchered, honestly whoever thought out this crap should consider drinking bleach. I demand my 5 forma and all the play time invested in leveling back, it is one thing to adjust stuff and another to nerf it into the ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4G3NT_0R4NG3 Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 (edited) They butchered it ...simple as that we must use Paris P, Soma P, Boltor P, Dread everything else must be butchered, honestly whoever thought out this crap should consider drinking bleach. I demand my 5 forma and all the play time invested in leveling back, it is one thing to adjust stuff and another to nerf it into the ground. Before the most recent nerf, the Kohm was the only weapon in the game capable of achieving higher DPS than the Synoid Gammacor. Nearly twice the Synoid's, to be precise. Before the nerf, I was of the firm belief that Warframe would have been a better game if the Kohm had never received any stat changes after release, becasue another crappy weapon is preferable to one that makes everything else redundant. I don't understand how anyone could possibly think that this nerf was a bad thing. The 5 forma wasted is really the only legitimate complaint here. I predict ANOTHER warning point for developer bashing in your very near future... Edited March 20, 2015 by 4G3NT_0R4NG3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluelitHalo Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 (edited) Apparently it now shoots up to 12 pellets on full charge, which is kinda good? Would explain why it doesn't feel bad after these changes. Oh DE and your transparency... Can confirm this. I've counted exactly 12 pellets when stripping off all of my mods and making Tyl Regor my volunteer bullet sponge. DPS and ammo efficiency are the same as they were JUST before the pellet count nerf. Now it's just hitscan with damage falloff. Edited March 20, 2015 by Sonitorum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OvAeons Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 Before the most recent nerf, the Kohm was the only weapon in the game capable of achieving higher DPS than the Synoid Gammacor. Nearly twice the Synoid's, to be precise. Before the nerf, I was of the firm belief that Warframe would have been a better game if the Kohm had never received any stat changes after release, becasue another crappy weapon is preferable to one that makes everything else redundant. I don't understand how anyone could possibly think that this nerf was a bad thing. The 5 forma wasted is really the only legitimate complaint here. I predict ANOTHER warning point for developer bashing in your very near future... i can copy and paste too!! are you really copy-pasting your butt hurt gammacor plea comparison everywhere? you cannot compare 2 vastly different weapons, shotgun with spool-up and progressive pellet count vs a single laser beam... PLUS DE-drew says they reverted the stats to the release version. What you fail to read is users of kohm are more at awe about the unique mechanics taken away then the damage (which kohm actually got a buff in dps) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Necr0Ra1se Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 are you Happy now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunamaniac Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 (edited) All I know is I use the kohm, and I have a toaster for a computer. It worked just fine Same here, WHY WHY WHY Before the most recent nerf, the Kohm was the only weapon in the game capable of achieving higher DPS than the Synoid Gammacor. Nearly twice the Synoid's, to be precise. Before the nerf, I was of the firm belief that Warframe would have been a better game if the Kohm had never received any stat changes after release, becasue another crappy weapon is preferable to one that makes everything else redundant. I don't understand how anyone could possibly think that this nerf was a bad thing. The 5 forma wasted is really the only legitimate complaint here. I predict ANOTHER warning point for developer bashing in your very near future... DPS isn't everything, the Kohm was unique and quirky with high damage potential in very specific situations. It actually encouraged the use of utility mods over pure damage mods, going full dps would have made it unusable. Now it's just a meh dps meh gun. Edited March 20, 2015 by Lunamaniac Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grom-84 Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 (edited) I dont understand how -> more pellets with grater fire rate and less damage per pellet "supposed to be easier to handle for the system" than -> less pelets, less, fire rate with higher damage per pellet) Edited March 20, 2015 by Grom-84 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[DE]Grzegorz Posted March 20, 2015 Author Share Posted March 20, 2015 I dont understand how -> more pellets with grater fire rate and less damage per pellet "supposed to be easier to handle for the system" than -> less pelets, less, fire rate with higher damage per pellet) Kohm is now hitscan, that's why. are you Happy now? Not at all, all I wanted was the Kohm before the latest 2 optimizations, not this... thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grom-84 Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 (edited) "Kohm is now hitscan, that's why." Yep multiple instant hits everywhere - on different body parts with different damage multipliers on them, on different enemies with increased fire rate seems legit and greatly "optimized" stuff to calculate rather than few projectile particles Lel) Edited March 20, 2015 by Grom-84 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[DE]Grzegorz Posted March 20, 2015 Author Share Posted March 20, 2015 "Kohm is now hitscan, that's why." Yep multiple instant hits everywhere - on different body parts with different damage multipliers on them, on different enemies with increased fire rate seems legit and greatly "optimized" stuff to calculate rather than few projectile particles Lel) Hitscan requires no physics calculations compared to projectiles with velocity, affected by gravity and being able to ricochet off surfaces. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Djego27 Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 Well damage falloff kills most of the guns anti group potential, together with the point that you can't indicate as good as before where the pellets land to get the spread to a optimal size to cover all targets it is a fairly big nerf. Also the ammo use should be looked at(again), it was changed because it did not only need ammo mutation but the ammo scavenger aura on top of it, yet tuned up again to the complete impractical levels it had a lunch, tune it down again, at least to manageable levels with ammo mutation. I mean this was the single reason why I did sell my first kohm after hitting L30, it was fun but way to impractical with the ammo consumption, even while running ammo mutation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
srlhama Posted March 20, 2015 Share Posted March 20, 2015 Just remove some of the heavy duty particle effects stop removing the stats that make kohm what it is. Come on! :\ I really can't understand why they didn't it ... If my pc dont suport the efects of the game I need to turn off MY fx not complaining the game lag on a @(*()$ old pc, cause my pc is old basic no memory left and i never lag cause graphics,so ppl who complaing use windows 98 and Internet Explorer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
![[DE]Grzegorz](http://content.invisioncic.com/Mwarframe/pages_media/1_InexpensiveGamer.png)
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