mejulio Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 And for that I am happy. When I started playing I was very positive surprised how friendly the monetization was and still is. So I will stick to the situation we have now and keep waiting. Edit. So if the Focus System would give the player in general a possibility to evolve his character beyond the normal lvl 30 gear and Mods. One thing I could Imagine are personal mods wich only you can use and are not tradeable. These mods could be inserted in the frame to further enhance their powers. But if these would come I would support a lvling system independent from affinity. In game live challenges could be a way to gain tokens which could be used in exchange. Like killing 1000 corpus in one week. Next week you have to collect 20 caches or data logs. I would like that. This concept sound very interesting but I am not exactly sure if I understand all of it . Can (if you want to) you elaborate on this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockscl Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 focus will come togheter with half life 3 at the current this step :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mejulio Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 Read the rest of the thread, bud. We already covered that. We didn't 'need' Excalibur Prime, either. Part of gaming, if not all of gaming, is 'want', not 'need'. Nobody wants to be a scrub. Everyone wants the best gear. Getting the best gear 20 hours into the game does not "kill" the experience. Anyone who has quit would've quit regardless of what gear they got when. I play with my Excalibur (Prime) with potatoes I am able the Blind which kills most swarms, I use a regular Frost, Limbo and other warframes and use many other non-prime Warframe and run Void missions with them. If you can't use these non-prime Warframes a least up to lvl 1 & 2 Void missions then you have to ask yourself why? I am not for locking all the great gear because placing limits like this takes away from players who just want to play (casual). This is just my opinion maybe I'm wrong or right. But what if I am right? If you think it might be right but needs to tweeked than say so, if someone think its wrong than that's ok too. But to say nothing is a problem. If it's true that we can some influence DE then we have to be careful to take a look at all views and not dismiss them. I am saying this in general to all players. There are many that do voice there opinions but I implore them to consider other opinions so they could think of something that's inclusive. The insults for me can now begin... be gentle... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elele Posted February 12, 2015 Share Posted February 12, 2015 (edited) I'm a whale so my opinion is what matters so either way your argument sucks. Well whales are by definition irrational and impulsive when spending their money --I'm no whale but I'm pretty irrational and impulsive when it comes to spending $1 on random things. I'm sure the $1 to my budget is probably $100 to your budget. And since you're irrational and impulsive with your spending and budget, you really can't draw any valid conclusion based on your own behavior. Also drawing conclusion on one sample (which is you yourself)? Geez I thought you're a "scientist by trade"? They taught you that in science school? Edited February 12, 2015 by elele Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)DanteVincent Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 That was sarcasm, not rudeness. Prime Access and the trade channel exist for a reason. If people want to spend money to jump right into the top of the power curve, then they are free to do so. Being a vet player who "earned" your gear the hard way does not, in any way, give you the authority to limit how others "earn" their gear. I think he just means, in the end of the day, the same as we do, that this game lacks a progression feeling, sure i could start with some real money and get that boltor prime, or even farm it with vet players, the void has no restrictions after all, 1000 hours later this person will probably be MR 18 and have tens of multi formad weapons, like you and me, but, can we really call that a progression? Eh, I wouldn't quite say so. The game does need a progression line other than planets with 0 lore and repetitive rooms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PainKiller6891 Posted February 13, 2015 Author Share Posted February 13, 2015 This concept sound very interesting but I am not exactly sure if I understand all of it . Can (if you want to) you elaborate on this. Yeah sry my English is rather bad :) I would like personal enhancement mods wich you can't trade. You power them up with Tokens from special events happening the whole week. So the evolve through playing the game and not just putting cores and credits into it. These events could be anything from minibosses like arctic front event or sleign enemies etc. One could say we have another waitwall because of that but I would be fine with it. As a casual player I can not effort the time to play many hours a day so I am very happy with the current time model the mission and event have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Opellulo Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Also it´s kinda strange that you can buy the prime stuff with less plat in the trade cahnnel than the normal versions of the frames in the shop. 300 plat (ok -40 for slot and potato) for frost? Let´s get Frost Prime first for less. Exactly! Using the market prices as basis, a prime Warframe should cost non less than 500 Plat, but this doesn't happens because there's no real scarcity of resources since prime parts drop like rain once you get in a clan or a good build. I personally think things are going to change soon, probably in form of quest chains for the juicer equipments: just watch at the "hidden messages" quest you can get only One Mirage, no matter how much you play. I expect that newer equipments will follow a similar path. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr.Northy Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 To echo previous comments, prime gear has been repeatedly lauded as the "end game" weaponry, the best of the best. Not to mention they intentionally made it so you can't just buy all of the prime gear from the market, it is something that was originally hard to acquire but there should definitely be a MR restriction on some of the better prime weapons and frames to avoid one very rich new player coming in and buying absolutely everything he'd need to win at MR1 then get bored instantly. It's literally a massive hindrance to themselves to try to buy the best gear to start off with, then you've got nothing to aim for and defeats the entire point of the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanaskinoah Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 I am sorry, I am a "Newb" too, but I would like to add that the Mastery Rank experiences wall should be smaller or less but we should also limit certain weapons to rank; not only this would prevent HUGE weapons accumulation for grinding Mastery Rank experiences, but it would make more sense that player should be able to progress and feel like they are doing something in their free time. I am talking through experience from grinding my &#! off on Mercury several runs till 35 mins just to level up weapons, and that get pretty old pretty quickly. (also played infestation and several other game mode). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)MoRockaPDX Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 (edited) I have suggested on my own thread that instead of gear gating, let's introduce a stress mechanic and stigma (some form of temporary debuff) system that is mitigated by progressing through the game. Either make the system tied to mastery rank or some other metric in the game. As the Tenno awoke without there memories I reason that there ability to cope with their void energy driven power is driving them insane. Only through the discipline of battle and the mastery of their tools of war can they keep the bedlam at bay. I was inspired impart by the Darkest Dungeon that uses a stress mechanic to inflict verious degrees of panic and dementia on characters. I thought that a similar system could be a progression system to delineate between new and vet players. Essentially a fresh Tenno would have a stress attribute that would increases in combat and goes crazy in the void. Letting the stress peak will cause a stigma effect, tremors temporarily mess with aim, vision could blur, screams of Orikin ghosts could distract, etc. This would mean that new players could feel free to aquire higher tier gear, but only through game progression do they hope to be free of the madness that beckons from the void. Edited February 13, 2015 by (PS4)MoRockaPDX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)tampa-db Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 So let me get this straight, you create a post that is complaining about equipment that other people have? I don't see how this affects you. What's the word the kids use now-a-days? Hater? Did you get upset when people bought the Game Genie back in the day? Rhetorical question..... generation entitlement.... 'nuff said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xylia Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 That's rather extreme. Just because you can't get Boltor Prime when you're clearing Venus doesn't mean you'll have this problem. Karak, Twin Gremlins, and Amphis carried me a LONG way. And as they progress they'll get better weapons. Ignis at rank 4, Soma, Penta, and Ogris at rank 6 for example.The same way it is now but progressing further. Still doesn't change what a newbie feels when they have for example, a Karak, Twin Gremlins, and Amphis leveled up and decently modded when they still do 10% or less of the total damage done in your average public match because of all of the other established players running around with Boltor Primes. I dunno about you, but if I join a match and I see that I did less than 10% of the total damage done, I feel damn useless, like I'm just dead weight. Unless, of course, I'm running a Trinity or something then I make excuses that I'm support or something. *shrugs* But yeah... joining a match in some newbie frame and ending up doing <10% of the total damage.... one tends to feel useless. Feeling useless does not make you enjoy the game. After awhile you wonder why you even bother when you can't really contribute to anything and you always feel like dead weight because of pure numbers alone. You can play as awesomely as you want, but pure numbers dictate that you're not going to be doing jack for damage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerrorofDeaths Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 You can have all prime stuff or rare mods without skill means nothing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)MoRockaPDX Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 You can have all prime stuff or rare mods without skill means nothing Well it doesn't mean nothing, and certainly isn't everything. It is hard to quantify the effect as it is largely a perception issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)MoRockaPDX Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 You can have all prime stuff or rare mods without skill means nothing Well it doesn't mean nothing, and certainly isn't everything. It is hard to quantify the effect as it is largely a perception issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmforeman02 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 Well whales are by definition irrational and impulsive when spending their money --I'm no whale but I'm pretty irrational and impulsive when it comes to spending $1 on random things. I'm sure the $1 to my budget is probably $100 to your budget. And since you're irrational and impulsive with your spending and budget, you really can't draw any valid conclusion based on your own behavior. Also drawing conclusion on one sample (which is you yourself)? Geez I thought you're a "scientist by trade"? They taught you that in science school? The definition of a whale is someone who has money and is willing to spend it. Not that they are irrational and impulsive. And I was just following your logic that whales are what keep this game going and therefore what they want is the way it should be. It was your argument, sorry it just works against you more than for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elele Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 The definition of a whale is someone who has money and is willing to spend it. Not that they are irrational and impulsive. And I was just following your logic that whales are what keep this game going and therefore what they want is the way it should be. It was your argument, sorry it just works against you more than for you. I think even you recognize the key words here "is willing to spend it [on virtual digital stuff that may or may not have real value]". Rational or not? I don't know. Either way, I have no further interest arguing semantics and neither should you. But since we're at this stage of "following your logic", you might have noticed that by your logic -- you're a whale spending tons of money, DESPITE the fact that Boltor Prime is unlocked to you early in the game -- the game is apparently working fine, because you're happily spending money, DE is happily making a lot money from whales, and everyone who is not a whale either won't spend enough money on this game for DE to give a damn, or just doesn't have the luxury of getting Boltor P early anyway thanks to the grind wall. So what are you complaining about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmforeman02 Posted February 13, 2015 Share Posted February 13, 2015 (edited) I think even you recognize the key words here "is willing to spend it [on virtual digital stuff that may or may not have real value]". Rational or not? I don't know. Either way, I have no further interest arguing semantics and neither should you. But since we're at this stage of "following your logic", you might have noticed that by your logic -- you're a whale spending tons of money, DESPITE the fact that Boltor Prime is unlocked to you early in the game -- the game is apparently working fine, because you're happily spending money, DE is happily making a lot money from whales, and everyone who is not a whale either won't spend enough money on this game for DE to give a damn, or just doesn't have the luxury of getting Boltor P early anyway thanks to the grind wall. So what are you complaining about? I haven't spent "tons" of money as you suggested. But I've spent more than the $20 you think is the minimum whale limit. Also I didn't get the Boltor Prime early in the game. I was at least a mastery 10 before it came out. If I had gotten it early in the game, I think I would've gotten bored quickly. You certainly do make a lot of unfounded assumptions and you're elite argument seems to be based on them. Edited February 14, 2015 by jmforeman02 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dillon_J Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 everyone seems really torn on this but i assume there will be MR restrictions for all gear eventually based on the fact they have gated weapons already and have now even made hydroid require MR 5. i do feel there should be some more MR requirements even if it is simply between MR 3-5 which you get to very quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay.ID Posted February 14, 2015 Share Posted February 14, 2015 I do agree that some (very few) weapons, frames should be rank restricted but at the same time i belive that it should not i mean, anyone remember being rank 5 and see other people use weapons like the Hek, and then wanting to obtain it and play hrs. after hrs. getting burned on the game to get you rank up and by the time you obtain it more than loving the weapon you would rather hate it because it was disappointing for the standards we had in mind. So i do not belive that new players should have the weapons/frames restricted, plus to get any of them properly working you need mods, rare ones, expensive onece wich you need to grind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luminna Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 Leave the current weapons/frames untouched, but apply mastery rank locks behind the newest weapons/frames depending on how effective they are in practice. Why? 1. The fraction of users that uses the forum are actually a minority compared to how many people play Warframe right now that don't use the forum and just want to have a good time. Implementing drastic changes like bringing MR of Boltor Prime and the likes of other "Oh so overpowered" weapons to much higher levels (2 to 8?) will only make you lose players and more importantly, potentially paying customers because they find that one day their weapons were no longer usable until they grind more? Look at Runescape for example, raising requirement of Rune equipment from the classic 40 to a new high of 50 undoubtedly drove away a lot of players/potential customers. 2. Again from a business perspective (since nearly all video games are made for profiting), if you can't satisfy everyone, who would you rather keep? New players who buys platinum right away, either get hooked on (continually paying) or quit after already spending on 'ultimate newb set', both already made DE money, or the people who supposedly 'drive the economy of Warframe, but never actually contributed to DE's pockets because all they do is grind and trade for their own platinum use' (supposedly also argues for being able to get Prime Access cosmetics for platinum)? The choice is so obvious you don't even need to think about it. 3. Some common arguments for raising MR to popular weapons/frames (correct me if I missed a few) a. Unfair to veterans who had to play so much hours and they get to have Boltor Prime for 50 plat at low mastery I dare say some of you who supports this argument were also those who were strongly against bringing back event dual-stat mods and retired weapons like ether daggers (which made its return) because you wanted to remain 'superior' having things newer players don't? Instead of wanting DE to force the change onto new players for your benefit, you could take actions by refusing to sell primes to low-MR players to get your points across, or are you just hypocrites being anti-newb and still want to profit off them at the same time? And again, which customer is more beneficial for DE: Those who buy platinum and trade for things they need, or those who refuse to spend a dime ever and instead makes all their platinums by selling prime parts? b. They get bored quick after having the best gear already, it's in their interest to keep them from having access until they play more As many have already mentioned, if they get bored of Warframe that quickly, then it most likely means they weren't that interested in the game in the first place, it's wishful thinking that you think it's better for them to play it the way you want them to play (by grinding more), who are you to tell them that? c. Boltor Prime/Rhino Prime is cheaper than standard equipment in the shop and new players shouldn't be allowed to bypass that And whose fault is it to have the market flooded with over-abundance of prime parts that sets of Boltor Prime and Rhino Prime are both obtainable for a maximum of 50 platinum (which is even less than the cheapest plat package) each? That's right, everyone who are selling parts on trade channels across various servers. Also, you still need to wait 12 hours (excluding time taken to farm cells which may vary due to RNG) for Boltor Prime and three and a half days (minimum) for Rhino Prime, they don't get pre-made robots and weapons "ready to use" on their purchase. Having friends will make it a lot easier, not having them still means a tough time since most nodes don't have pub sessions. d. I see too many many Boltor Primes/Rhino Primes in pub games There's a few solutions for that - Don't play pubs, only with friends/clan members/alliance members/premade groups - Quit the games whenever you see them, just because you hate those loadouts and the thought of seeing new players having them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deathbricked Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 Oh right. We are all soooo concerned for the new player that we want to restrict what they use for their own good. We shouldn't allow new players to have any fun until they slave in the mines of mercury for at least 200 hours, then they are allowed out into the light of day. good lord man. no need to be so sarcastic about it. we have damned weapons like the soma and the dang PENTA i mean come on.. PENTA!. OPs point is valid. there does need to be a type of rank requirement on higher tier weapons. anyway anyone knows the boltor and rhino P are pretty OP early game so newer players will indeed get bored playing with that gear. its like playing any game with godmode without actually playing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davoodoo Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 (edited) Why do people think that good stuff is boltor and rhino prime?? sure its way stronger than similiar gear but its about 1.5-2% as strong as what high rank players have at their disposal. If you want new players to not get burned out from oneshotting enemies then 1)nerf the mods finally 2)introduce enemies which can actually withstand that kind of firepower without having that high firepower themselves at non endless modes while giving incentive to actually attempt to kill these, 50k hp lancers with 50% dmg reduction would be good start imo. 3)prevent lower rank players from ranking up mods and prevent them from buying them for plat, btw im sure latter will happen and theres absolutely no sarcasm here at all. Either one is fine, except that one of these is $&*&*#(%&, decide for youself which one. Edited February 15, 2015 by Davoodoo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elele Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 If I had gotten it early in the game, I think I would've gotten bored quickly. YOU would have gotten bored quickly. But DE doesn't care just about YOU. DE looks at their statistics. They're obviously happy with the amount of money they're earning. you're elite argument seems to be based on them. "your" not " you're ". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archistopheles Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 good lord man. no need to be so sarcastic about it. Read the rest. I already addressed that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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