Dislike The Eight Player Raids

[bl4ckhunter]

Yeah, from the sounds of it you've not done an MMOFPS raid before. 

well i think that there are like 3 mmofps around and one is warframe, i dunno about destiny but raids in firefall don't require you to do any kind of puzzle ever, that aside i would be fine with it being hard if they where fairly rewarding but having seen those arcane "enanchements" the only thing i can say is, i'm outta here. not doing a long and difficult raid for those luckluster pieces of crap

Edited March 20, 2015 by bl4ckhunter

[Solandis]

well i think that there are like 3 mmofps around and one is warframe, i dunno about destiny but raids in firefall don't require you to do any kind of puzzle ever, that aside i would be fine with it being hard if they where fairly rewarding but having seen those arcane "enanchements" the only thing i can say is, i'm outta here. not doing a long and difficult raid for those luckluster pieces of crap

Sure, sure. That's fine. Then don't do them. It's simple as that. Meanwhile, those who enjoy it will.

 

Also,I meant raids in MMOs in general. I was half-asleep writing that so meh. (Also raids in Destiny do indeed have puzzles and have absurd timing requirements)

[ECaly]

anyone here that even knows how to spell raid knows that things aren't hand fed to you like they are in the main game. It took me alone no time to figure out each aspect of the puzzle and transfer that information to the game. Raids are an amazing addition to this game because it makes people think rather than just follow an objective marker.

 

TL:DR stop whining, raids are supposed to be extremely difficult first time.

[Monolake]

Well... its confusing af which is not any fun, need to have people who know what to do and explain to everyone and have capable lokis and trinities

[Cpl_Facehugger]

I think that a lot of your criticism will evaporate once players have tested raids out and figured out what has to actually be done.

[Deathman_Kenshi]

Ok where is fun in figuring out puzzle when you have to fight constantly and when you find out solution you are geting reseted all the time with cheap hits

[-BELLUM-]

Hello, i created a poll on this subject. Please vote!

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/421427-8-player-raid-feedback-poll/

[Th0rZer0]

Deleted

Edited March 26, 2015 by Th0rZer0

[Rayden_Tenno]

Removed? No way, i highly enjoy em, they are not a "get the best weapon and kill everyone without being touched" mission. This time you really have to play well and to play with good people, and synchronize between yourselves. The only thing i dont like its that 6 hour cd. Ofc it wouldnt be bad some tweaks here or there. Bug fixes (although i have not found any bug) but remove it? No way, it actually add challenge to the game.

Yes ofc those arcane things are not enough prize for the effort of completing the raid, but the lore, satisfaction when you done a stage, and taking revenge on vay hek, those things makes raids totally worth for me. Although i do agree that those arcane things are no reward for the raid, even more when they cost 500k to do em.

Edited March 20, 2015 by Rayden_Tenno

[MurakumoVance]

Man, I don't even like MOBAS. Don't have the patience for them.

 

But anyway, that wasn't your major point; Okay, even if we ignore the fact that you could...ignore the raids I think you're missing my major point. Which is that for some people, a lot of people actually, this kind of figuring out puzzles thing while constantly attack is fun. The main reason being that it requires them to communicate with their team, and no matter what you may say you've got to acknowledge that the main point of a multiplayer game is playing with other people and that these raids force you to actually, y'know, play with the other players.

 

Besides, it's not like this is the first "fast-paced third person shooter" to have raids of this nature; another recent one that springs to mind is Destiny (A game where, most players say, the raids are actually the most fun part). Honestly, you claim to come from a background of strategic shooters, you should be super into this type of thing. Getting together a group of friends so that you can all plot out how to tackle the difficulties before you. That's tactics man; the plan of "winging it" is no plan at all.

 

Final point, and it's the one I've been trying to get across the most. You say that "you couldn't win that thing on your own". That's the point. It's a multiplayer thing. Where you play with other people to figure out how to tackle puzzles that are bigger than any of you individually.

 

Also, you can direct your anger and frustrations at me sure. I don't mind.

 

Edit: Right! I forgot to mention. Raids, while a part of the future, are in no way the future. So you can still enjoy all the parts that aren't them. Those aren't going to change.

Well I've had the night to rest and cool off and I'm still upset.  Destiny is a really horrible comparison since Destiny was total crap in comparison to this. Go ahead and do a super hard epic mission where your equal loot is at a massive 5% where there's high risks low rewards.

Much like you feel I'm missing your point, you're missing my point entirely too. Maybe I was misinformed,  but I wasn't trying to do the whole thing on my own. It's the fact that I was doing most things and my effort was in vain.  I wasn't prepared to assemble my strategic team on that one because Tom Clancy games don't give you puzzles.  They give you patrols, snipers tanks, air strikes.  Things you can handle by applying brute force to certain spots at the right timing. Truthfully THAT is what I thought was in store for me. I had no idea what to expect and even with it being somewhat coordinated I feel like it's a giant mess.  The 1st part doesn't get to me as much as the second.  Once you get that first mission complete, it's really the 2nd part that royally angers me to my boiling point. Has there ever been a raid where one after the other the entire lobby has to stand on a pressure plate until everyone is eventually standing on one? Even if that has appeared in games prior to this, I bet you they didn't have BS enemies that literally knock you off and pull you off your spots.  If I try this again, I'm basically just going to order my clan to all be Limbos that way nothing can ever touch us. We'll just completely ignore the enemies while we solve the stupid puzzles. If this mode is staying I really want somethings fixed.  Like Lotus telling us what to do better that way people understand what it is they're doing. I don't expect it to be fully explained but my god.  I want that 1st part to not be draining your health. I also don't like the battery draining your energy.  We've done events somewhat like this before where the community responded negatively and I hope they respond this way again because I honestly hate the raids.  It's completely ruined my nostalgia for Warframe all together. I was excited for Dual Dex Dakra but after playing this mode I think to myelf  "What's the point? It's not like I'll actually be using them for anything."

[LeucienWeaver]

The point of a raid is that you go in not knowing how to beat it. You're supposed to have a team of players you're familiar with and you're supposed to fail over and over in order to discover how to beat it.

 

What would be really disappointing is if DE held our hands and explained how to do every little thing needed to beat it. That defeats the point of a raid, which is designed to be an extremely tough puzzle that players need to figure out.

 

That being said, there are players who have already figured it out, and there's a group that's already doing the whole raid at less than 20 minutes.

So what you're saying is that the 100k cost to craft the keys and the 6 hour wait is the Warframe equivalent of a repair bill?

[Skaleek]

The raid to me just doesnt feel 'warframe'. Thats all i can say. Too much standing still, waiting, the fighting was an afterthought. The only part that felt warframe was the hijack part.

[Solandis]

Has there ever been a raid where one after the other the entire lobby has to stand on a pressure plate until everyone is eventually standing on one? Even if that has appeared in games prior to this, I bet you they didn't have BS enemies that literally knock you off and pull you off your spots. 

Actually yes. There's Destiny's entrance to the vault of glass that worked...relatively similarly. Admittedly they didn't knock you off the plate but if you didn't kill them fast enough they destroy your progress.

 

I know there are others too...I just can't remember any off of the top of my head right now.

 

Mmm. Fair enough. I think I get what you're saying, you thought that the puzzles would be through placement of enemies and such (Note: yes those qualify as puzzles). Yeah, I get that, but honestly that pressure plate situation actually just sounds like an actual mission in this game. Interceptions.

 

I'll agree with you on this aspect though: there should be other endgame type of missions later on down the line. Where a bunch of people work together to kill a whole mess of dudes. I in no way think this should be the only type of raid, but I think it works quite nicely as the first one we get to experience.

[-SLX-J3tAc3]

 

 

 (quote)

Darn good post, Aiden. I'd redesign Raids. Ask the playerbase for ideas. Look at other games. Create my own ideas, then see how to mesh the three together, get a test group of 200 players to try it out, gather their feedback. Send the revised product back for testing to the 200. Then, I select 200 other players to try it out, taken as random samples from the playerbase. Continually refine the mission until I find something agreeable and enjoyable.

 

 

Well then in that case I should be aiming my anger and frustration towards you then right?  Warframe was my Ninja Gaiden meets Halo  shooter hack and slash, and you're telling me that League of Legend nerds and WoW players screwed it up for me....  It's people like you who ruin good games like this trying to bring your mobas into it.  I'm probably being an A****** because I'm assuming but if this is what you pushed for YOU RUINED MY GAME!!! 

Yep, that's what they do, them and that Dark Souls/anime/manga crowd - they're destroying this game. I've been saying this for awhile after getting to see how these people behave, their suggestions about "balance" and their general antisocial personalities. They're just destructive entities.

Edited March 21, 2015 by -SLX-J3tAc3

[-SLX-J3tAc3]

(double post)

Mods, please remove!

Edited March 21, 2015 by -SLX-J3tAc3

[lancerr11]

 I've never wanted to quit Warframe this bad.

 

Yup , i got that part covered . After spending hours , hundreds of dollars in warframe , it's kind of getting repetetive and a complete grind .

 

Well yes , warframe has always been a grindfest , but not like this . I miss the joy i had when i crafted a new weapon . Not this unfair pvp , impossible raid , pointless sanctuary crap 

[drunkpunk222]

     So I got a taste of the new 8 player raid crap just earlier, and needless to say I am EXTREMELY angry. DE not only dropped the ball on this one, but they made it down right ridiculous and a mess to even play.  If you ever manage to get some type of rhythm going, believe me, you will be shutdown in NO time.  It's not even that the mission itself is hard, its that there is no cooperation because there is too much to do and nobody knows where to go or what they should be doing. 

 Before I continue on with the rant, I will explain my experience and tell you why this needs COMPLETELY removed from the game. Right out the gate, the nostalgia is REAL. You've got 8 tenno dropping down and you're instantly met by level 72 enemies.  No biggie right?  Well then you get to this double terminal place where people hack and a battery is dropped.  The first time we played this, nobody knew what to do with this battery. We also didn't know that it drained your energy as you carried it and 5 seconds after its dropped because you have ran out of energy it explodes.  You've gotta get it through these doors that are triggered by 2 people standing on a plate at a time. Once through you have to stand on 2 more plates. ALL WHILE  the carrier of the battery prays to god his energy will hold out long enough to get to the injectors on the other side of the door.  Once you make it to the injectors,  SURPRISE SURPRISE,  there's 4 additional terminals to hack and you have to wait for the bomb to arm itself before you can even think about hacking because the injector is only vulnerable for a limited time after you hack.   How the Hell are new players supposed to know this.  In a fast paced frantic shooter like this, there shouldn't be any puzzle solving.

But wait it gets better.  You finally complete the thing and let out a sigh of relief...  Ok that was tough,  not cause the enemies were high level and CONSTANTLY attacking you all while you completed those stupid objectives, but it was just genuinely hard to get EIGHT PEOPLE on the same page. So it says mission complete, but its a complete lie!  It loads you into a Ceres tile set now where you have to hack certain terminals and look up at a screen displaying a symbol.  Somebody has to stand on the pressure plate with the matching symbol. You do this continuously until everyone is standing on plates.  My team and I couldn't even get past this part due to the fact that Grineer were CONSTANTLY downing us knocking us off our plates. The bombards and even worse, the damn scorpions yanking you off! If even 1 person goes down it resets the ENTIRE THING.  The level of frustration was so high we all began cursing each other.  Up until now,  I honestly felt like Warframe wasn't one of those games that people could get mad at each other in.  However tonight I've been rubbed the wrong way by MANY players.  So many people who are just as lost and confused as I was my first play through.   You want to desperately blame somebody but the only person you can blame is DE.  Shame on DE for putting PUZZLE SOLVING in a fast paced frantic shooter.    

 I surely hope this gets fixed or better yet just thrown out completely because its a BAD IDEA. Anyone who has played this or will play it will know exactly how I feel now. You WILL rage, you WILL die, and you WILL hate your co-op partners. All this trouble and for what?  Arcane benefits on your helmets or syandanas? If you ask me, that's not worth it.  Now I would've been more interested in seeing an 8 player defense where there's maybe 2 points to defend sort of like an interception where the enemies start out high leveled.  Maybe have a Survival where you're collecting resources prior to the defense that way if its a 3 part mission it somewhat makes sense and people know what to do immediately.  The confusion here is just too much.  I've said it before and I'll say it again. The enemies aren't even the problem. They're not hard.  It's these stupid crap objectives that just require too much work.  DE needs to understand that this isn't a World of Warcraft game, and I personally didn't start playing Warframe to have that type of experience.  I play shooters because I hate solving puzzles and that's exactly what this is.  And omg if you guys don't have TeamSpeak Skype or you're neglecting the Voice chat...... GOOD LUCK!  With all the choas going on, I couldn't find the time to even read the chat let alone protect my team-mates and myself. 

In closing, this SHOULD have been an easy to do objective but hard enemies to provide seasoned veterans a challenge. It SHOULDN'T have been impossible which is pretty much what it is. If it were a 3 tiered mission with survival leading up to defense and finally a boss battle.  I'd play that for 5 hours.  However, that's just me....  Some people out there have jobs and a busy lifestyle. Kids to take care of. They can't be expected to sit there and figure that mess out.  If 2 people go afk  it causes this HUGE mess that nobody can deal with.  No amount of power combinations can save you.  We had a Limbo, a Vauban, a Hydroid, Rhino, Trinity, Valkyr, Loki, and Ash but all of our time and efforts were completely wasted and I'm left so angry.  Update 16 is a disappointment entirely.  I'm sick of seeing these updates come out and them being less than advertised. The last time I REALLY loved a major update was melee 2.0  The syndicates were nice, but now they've just gone too far.  It's all complicated gibberish you won't really understand. The new Cephalon explains it somewhat decently but while he's trying to talk fancy you'll just be like O_o  and the conclaive offerings aren't even worth it given the trouble you'll go through trying to aim at players who are moving ENTIRELY TOO FREAKIN QUICK!!!  They need to slow it down a lot. Especially the carriers making off with your goal.  There's NO team cooperation what so ever. Update 16 is just a huge clusterjunk of garbage.  The new Ogris model is a little better than the last, and the new weapons are surely nice, but arguably the only thing GREAT about u16 was Chroma.  He is VERY interesting. It's such a shame he had to come during the worst update to date. 

Please DE, I STRONGLY advise you to just throw it the raids out entirely until a proper raid that's EASY TO COMPREHEND falls in its place, because this is a mess. People are angry and confused and I've never wanted to quit Warframe this bad. I've never wanted to quit Warframe at all in-fact. I understood that there were going to be some disappointments along the way, but this is way beyond a disappointment.  This feels more like DE has a vendetta against us the players. The raids are so painful to play its like DE wants to anger us. Do we owe you money?  Let me know what you guys thought about your experiences in the comments below.  Hopefully some ignorant fool isn't going to come along and say that these raids are good when they're clearly crap.

 

 

raid is worst thing ingame, bugged, super boring, randoms dont have a clue what to do there, there is no markers or any info  facepalm de, preparing can be neverending, because of leavers, why de bring this piece of "ärt" its not fun to play, map is copy paste from similar maps, when there is minimal lag manics unkillable, lots of mobs around standing still and u cant kill them, stupid neverending running back and forth, very long missions(each is neverending 1h+ with randoms) 4 parts, super useless reward, waste of time for addicts or masochists, mobs there is piece of cake even for solo so noobs can shut up, gameplay is so bad and boring and complicated, game looks better without this and archwing stuff and pvp,  nothing much to do after u16,epic fail + bonus new warframe , useless, good for mastery rank xp only, soon going to quit till u17, i always quit before update because everything is done, 2nd time i going to quit after update till better times, first time i quit after archwing update. There is still no endgame stuff, im bored to play hours to reach challenging mobs in t4s/d, i waited this 8 ppl  raid but so dissapointed, why u cant bring challenging mobs and bosses with tactics but this piece of       , de should fire person who ruin gameplay with archwing, pvp and this kind of raid and listen community better.

Edited March 25, 2015 by drunkpunk222

[drunkpunk222]

Yup , i got that part covered . After spending hours , hundreds of dollars in warframe , it's kind of getting repetetive and a complete grind .

 

Well yes , warframe has always been a grindfest , but not like this . I miss the joy i had when i crafted a new weapon . Not this unfair pvp , impossible raid , pointless sanctuary crap 

 

You read my mind.

[BlueSilkMetallic]

Yup , i got that part covered . After spending hours , hundreds of dollars in warframe , it's kind of getting repetetive and a complete grind .

 

Well yes , warframe has always been a grindfest , but not like this . I miss the joy i had when i crafted a new weapon . Not this unfair pvp , impossible raid , pointless sanctuary crap 

 

AMEN (Same for me)

[Dabluechimp]

Man, yeah. You've got no experience when it comes to raids. It's how it goes man. The thing is? This is what we expected and wanted when we asked for raids.

 

The idea of it is a major challenge that you can't bumble your way through. A mission where you actually have to play with people you know, and to have a strategy ahead of time just to have a chance. AKA fun.

fun fact buddy, most people don't have EIGHT people they know well, exluding clan members, and still having EIGHT people on the same page is supid, also raids are not ment to be a game mode that ruins the game so much for people that a number leave, I had over 10 people in the clan i was in (who avidly spend money on this game) said they were un-installing and quiting it for a verry veryy long time, raids should be like World Of Warcraft raids they are simple, they explain EVERYTHING, and they give a good number of people required do to it.

This is just getting jumped on by 8 heavy gunners 2 bombards a maniac, and having the battery explode after one or 2 people pick it up, I can go in to a WOW raid not HAVING to look up anything about it before hand I can do the raid 100% while staying in game, with this I have to break my immersion and go to the wiki just to figure out why they battery was falling out of my hands, AND also on top of all this being an avid Trinity player having to watch EIGHT people's HP is a PURE NIGHTMARE.

Something I have learned is that every update DE screws up SOMETHING, this is that ONE thing they screwd up (havn't played the new pvp yet cause I have no frames for it)