The Time To Kill With Melees Is Too Damn High!

[-dicht.ThanksFrost-]

Before the update and currently. There's an issue with the bo prime and it's time to kill. Normally in terms of spin attacks and normal attacks, it is just fine. But in combination with a stance mod and channeling these things kill in less than 2 seconds.

 

Now you can say "Well drop, you can just fly away or copter away from the enemy and get the shot" which is true in  some cases but unfortunately those are very few and far between occurrences. The issue here is that these stances can lunge at you doing multi hit power strikes and this is even more possible thanks to martial magnetism a mod that acts as an aim assist for melee. Making it really easy to get a melee kill, and im talking Halo 4 Bullet Magnetism easy. Not to mention dat reach...

 

You can also say " well the player needs to collect energy" energy is extremely abundant in this PvP build. It's really not that hard to get your hands on an energy orb.

 

And now the Gram is apart of this too, in conjunction with Martial Magnetisim the combo is so easy to perform and so effective that even now in this build, you see more and more players swinging bo primes and grams rather than using their actual guns. It can also knockdown.

 

In addition both of these weapons can block bullets. Let me just address this blocking in warframe is insane. On my 98 round Braton prime clip I see my self pumping a quarter clip or more on someone who is blocking before thay are open for the hit.

 

"okay those are the pros of melee but why does it make these melee weapons OP?"

 

 

In a game with high mobility and small maps the dynamic is focused on CQC, most encounters in warframe are up close and although there are wide sight lines, its so easy to get into someones face (with and without coptering) that it gives the close quarter weapons a clear hierarchy. These weapons would have a place in the game and a cosy one, the problem is that the maps are so small and its so easy to run into someone that CQC will always be dominant and with these stance mods and channeling its making them ridiculous.

 

I see what you were trying to do by buffing the bratons, gorgons etc... But even with this buff they do not compete with the current melee. The only way a fire arm will win is if the player is really far away, and even at that you have just a few seconds before he flys to you and can get the hit. Unless you get a well placed headshot with a paris prime or a lex.

 

Suggestions:

 

"The old man 1.0 style : Melee as a compliment" In conclave 1.0 melee was for one thing coptering. Gimping the melee to the point where it cannot be the go to weapon for PvP but in the midst of a fight can kill if the player is weak enough with a well timed slide attack.

 

This would augment gunplay, and increase skill gap.

 

"The 2.0 Style" Make weapons time to kill equal to melee. With melee you can get a full potential hit as long as your cursor is near him. As for firearms you have to get consistent head shots. In that case buff the weapons to almost insta kill like the melee weapons that way melee can be more situational and not the go to weapon. Players will be forced to utilize all three of their weapon types since now running and spamming combos can be taken down with some braton prime manstopper.

 

"The Zen Style" Nerf Melee. I do not know if you guys want fast time to kill modes or slower. But if slow is you thing then may I suggest to Nerf the melee, in the channeling and stance department. Make the Stance more of an pretty thing rather than an advantage. As for channeling dramatically reduce its damage multiplier, so that a player with a fire arm has a chance but if two players with melees fight the one who channels will win by a bit.

 

That's my 2 cents feel free to post any comments ,suggestions and questions as I know that my arguments can be somewhat vague at times.

Edited April 9, 2015 by DrOP_

[Darkmoone1]

I had someone with a gram(Tempo Royale) Two shot me....so I don't even know anymore....

[Sil3nc3r]

IMO,

 

I think we should start by either nerfing the range on Martial Magnetism or remove it completely. It completely eliminates whatever skill cap needed to wield and use melees effectively in PvP. Plus, that constant tracking like as if you're glued to your target (no matter how damn fast he's going) as long as you're spamming your melee attack is just ridiculous.

 

Another problem is the relatively low FOV (mine is set at max), which kinda makes your skin get in the way whilst you're aiming and moving. It gets worse if you're aiming at a maniac chasing you with a huge stick as your skin gets in the way and doesn't let you aim properly.

As for the damage? We need a non-biased melee system before we can get into that.

[rockscl]

melee was fine without martial magnetism imo, and stances are being a very unnecesary problem to keep, the weapons are balanced, and the stances unbalance them with mods that arent easy to get, actually where is any noob supposed to get tempo royale?, de should just remove stances

[Nighttide77]

I had someone with a gram(Tempo Royale) Two shot me....so I don't even know anymore....

Might've been me at one point, heh. Before the update, I'd just equip it, channel, and use the first two hits to take down most opponents, being careful to keep from getting stuck in the combos.

Personally, I've been able to take down blocking melee guys, and all sorts. not sure what's really gonna change with the update when players are probably still coptering like crazy.

[Thalahssalyst]

Maybe they need to nerf the channeling Damage, but im not okay with "1.0" style where melee was only used for move.
 

[Burnthesteak87]

I don't agree with the "CQC will always be dominant" there is first the issue of skills one/two-shotting, which atm is the meta given the fact, as you stated, that gaining energy is so much easy.
Also a melee fighter isn't that difficult to counter, given melee combos usually makes the user vulnerable since he/she's locked into the action without the chance of moving or parrying.
That's not the same for Quick Melee, which should be toned down.

For what concernes TTK, I'd slow it down or elseway it will become a Far West where who shoots first wins, then a race from the spawning point to the fight area.

The buff to Bratons was stupid. They had to bring down the upper weapons to the lowest's level.
I don't think this buff was meant to make gunplay more relevant over melee.

Also I don't agree with your suggestions.
The first promotes coptering, the second promotes Far West, the thrid nerfs the channeling which instead is a really nice mechanic to overturn melee fights.

The solutions to preserve the melee and the balance imho would be:
1) Martial Magnetism should be toned down or removed, it's like an Aimbot as I heard around, automatic mechanics in PVP are toxic.
2) The nerf to melee and coptering should be done with a Vigor overhaul, making melee attacks deal less damage when out of vigor and coptering less impactful.
3) Dodgerolls (Shift taps) and Melee Parry should be faster and more responsive, interrupting melee combos and whatever action performed. This way whoever can decide when to block and which attack to block. This would raise the skillcap and the chance to fight back.

[Rorgal_Sina]

"TTK is way too high."

 

TTK means time to kill. So you mean it takes too long to kill with melee? Or do you mean the TTK is too short? A lil' confusing.

[Educated_Beast]

I'm against this idea. I think melee should be an alternative and fully viable. I prefer melee combat, it's fun.

Gun kills are less fulfilling. I do agree that coptering should be toned down to give guns a equal footing. Reducing the propel distance / speed of copter would have that effect.

Whatever is done, don't jack up melee where it's only situational and I cannot pull out my sword and channel versus a guy shooting.

Edited April 9, 2015 by Educated_Beast

[Skeks]

I honestly can't believe they buffed the gram. It could already 2 shot entire teams with one channeled Attack. Also because it's quick kill can be activated while blocking it was already more survivable than most other melee weapons. I couldn't help but cackle maniacally as I read read the patch notes.

On a side note I agree with above poster that melee should be just as viable as guns. Not an afterthought used just for its movement. Still not sure buffing one of the strongest most well rounded weapons was the best choice though lol