Gentleman's Guide To Defense Etiquiette.

[BETAOPTICS]

Yes quite indeed, this is something I must remember from now on.

Fancy having a cup of tea?

[GottFaust]

In a few defense missions, fighting on the pod can mean not taking advantage of exceptionally good positions elsewhere on the map that are both more easily defensible by fewer groups of people and also allows kiting mobs around the map, as they would not have seen nor have any interest in the pod.

 

One in particular is the two spawn doors on the side you spawn in on Xini.  A considerable number of the enemies spawn on that side, and at almost any level it is possible for a single player to gather up all the infested that spawn on that side aoe them down/stun ancients and then if they cannot outright kill them or can't kill the toxics,  you can kite them up along the catwalks above indefintately; and, because they have yet to lay sight on the pod, they will chase you and only you for as long as you need them to.

 

This leaves less than 1/3 of the remaining enemies to be dealt with by the rest of the group, and when they are clear they can all shift over and aoe down the ancients.

 

It's important to remember that while we are coming together on a same mission, our goals don't all necessarily align.  One person may be farming kills, another mods, and yet another experience.  To expect everyone to compromise their goals on a pub for your sake is absurd.  Individuals simply do not and should not act this way.  Each person should be pursuing their own goals and cooperating with others only in degrees that are useful to themselves.

 

You can only really expect things to go your way when you take the time to gather a group of people with goals similar to your own.. or simply ask them nicely.

That strategy has many, many down-sides.

1 - If the player "guarding" that door goes down (very, very likely in my experience) the other players have to abandon the point to rescue them.

2 - Mods and crafting materials drop where the enemies die. This means that all of the other players have to run half-way across the map to get the loot that the aforementioned player is farming. This also leaves the point unguarded.

3 - When enemies sneak past that point (there are 3 other exits from that same spawn-point) the "guarding" player will generally sit there and do thing lest they lose their "kill count spot" which can result in them losing xp, mods, and crafting materials.

4 - While xp is shared, it is only shared over a limited distance. This means that the player "guarding" that door is depriving the rest of the team out of some, if not all, of the xp that should be rightfully theirs because of his/her own selfishness. If players want to get the expected xp from kills they have to migrate closer to that spot and thus leave the point unguarded.

An unguarded point is a failed mission. Thus anything that leaves the point unguarded is a failed tactic. Thus fighting away from the group is a failed tactic. Learn to respect your fellow Tenno and cooperate in this cooperative game.

Because of this I will never, ever pick up a player who has gone down on the other side of the map. I will never, ever help those players out if they get swamped. I will never, ever go past wave 5 if they refuse to fight closer to the point. You don't have to be standing on the pod, but fighting across the map is a very, very bad idea.

Edited May 19, 2013 by GottFaust

[aza-industries]

I like to stand on top of the pod with my rhino's 1k shield and latron of destruction =P

[Roaran7]

That strategy has many, many down-sides.

1 - If the player "guarding" that door goes down (very, very likely in my experience) the other players have to abandon the point to rescue them.

2 - Mods and crafting materials drop where the enemies die. This means that all of the other players have to run half-way across the map to get the loot that the aforementioned player is farming. This also leaves the point unguarded.

3 - When enemies sneak past that point (there are 3 other exits from that same spawn-point) the "guarding" player will generally sit there and do thing lest they lose their "kill count spot" which can result in them losing xp, mods, and crafting materials.

4 - While xp is shared, it is only shared over a limited distance. This means that the player "guarding" that door is depriving the rest of the team out of some, if not all, of the xp that should be rightfully theirs because of his/her own selfishness. If players want to get the expected xp from kills they have to migrate closer to that spot and thus leave the point unguarded.

An unguarded point is a failed mission. Thus anything that leaves the point unguarded is a failed tactic. Thus fighting away from the group is a failed tactic. Learn to respect your fellow Tenno and cooperate in this cooperative game.

Because of this I will never, ever pick up a player who has gone down on the other side of the map. I will never, ever help those players out if they get swamped. I will never, ever go past wave 5 if they refuse to fight closer to the point. You don't have to be standing on the pod, but fighting across the map is a very, very bad idea.

 

You cannot say that, in principle, it will always be better to fight near the pod.  That means ignoring all strategic and any means to improve your position on the map.

 

Just because, from your experience, certain players could not or cannot perform certain roles that strategy is not then implausible.

[Datasaur]

It's important to remember that while we are coming together on a same mission, our goals don't all necessarily align.  One person may be farming kills, another mods, and yet another experience.  To expect everyone to compromise their goals on a pub for your sake is absurd.  Individuals simply do not and should not act this way.  Each person should be pursuing their own goals and cooperating with others only in degrees that are useful to themselves.

 

You can only really expect things to go your way when you take the time to gather a group of people with goals similar to your own.. or simply ask them nicely.

Dear sir, we are entering game theory territory here. Games with multiple actors and altering goals have been well studied. Equilibria with beneficial but not optimal results for all parties are achievable and often most likely. Especially with constant feedback on other actors actions. See Nash's bargaining game and its many iterations for theoretical and empirical proof.

 

Yes these rascals might get away with their misdeeds temporarily. But as can be seen both in game theory and evolution studies even fine gentlemen are very good at spotting cheaters and freeloaders. A gentleman will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger if you attempt to poison his brothers.

[Quetzhal]

Thanks for the heads up. I largely play Defense solo (I've played it Online all of once), but I've been planning to venture forth into Online defense and I'd rather not make a fool of myself, haha.

Would it be considered bad etiquette to throw Teslas everywhere?

[GottFaust]

You cannot say that, in principle, it will always be better to fight near the pod.  That means ignoring all strategic and any means to improve your position on the map.

 

Just because, from your experience, certain players could not or cannot perform certain roles that strategy is not then implausible.

No player can solo 20 + lvl 187 ancients in a timely manner. Your argument is invalid.

[Pendragon1951]

I completely agree with this thread, I mean it's not rocket science, if the pod dies you lose everything. Anyone who has played defense missions, especially on Kiliken know there are certain choke points, although that one map with the pod in the middle of buildings I'm still trying to figure out, if you have any players with good automatic weapons standing in those choke points, you can stand off wave after wave, especially the map with the long corridors and the pod is in the middle upstairs, love that map. Instead you have people going off all over the map or you have three guys in the same place, leaving one guy, back exposed to guard the pod and be overwhelmed. I sometimes get the feeling that they think your hogging all the kills, which is not the case, you have just placed yourself in a strategic area to defend. Unfortunately I think they really don't care what happens and are just there to Troll, but I completely agree with this thread and hope any who play with me on defense will understand what I am doing.

[Datasaur]

Would it be considered bad etiquette to throw Teslas everywhere?

Considering Tesla abilities honorable nod to one of the finest gentlemen ever existing I would say it is indeed a weapon suitable for gentlemen. Keep in mind the visuals might be harsh to ladies eyes. The Tesla can also be used in a more intimate manner so be careful and discrete when using them close to ladies. It is very important to get to know a lady well before even considering attaching your bombs to them.

[Lonestar96]

That strategy has many, many down-sides.

1 - If the player "guarding" that door goes down (very, very likely in my experience) the other players have to abandon the point to rescue them.

2 - Mods and crafting materials drop where the enemies die. This means that all of the other players have to run half-way across the map to get the loot that the aforementioned player is farming. This also leaves the point unguarded.

3 - When enemies sneak past that point (there are 3 other exits from that same spawn-point) the "guarding" player will generally sit there and do thing lest they lose their "kill count spot" which can result in them losing xp, mods, and crafting materials.

4 - While xp is shared, it is only shared over a limited distance. This means that the player "guarding" that door is depriving the rest of the team out of some, if not all, of the xp that should be rightfully theirs because of his/her own selfishness. If players want to get the expected xp from kills they have to migrate closer to that spot and thus leave the point unguarded.

An unguarded point is a failed mission. Thus anything that leaves the point unguarded is a failed tactic. Thus fighting away from the group is a failed tactic. Learn to respect your fellow Tenno and cooperate in this cooperative game.

Because of this I will never, ever pick up a player who has gone down on the other side of the map. I will never, ever help those players out if they get swamped. I will never, ever go past wave 5 if they refuse to fight closer to the point. You don't have to be standing on the pod, but fighting across the map is a very, very bad idea.

 

This is so true.

 

Who here has been in the scenario where in a single Infested Charger kills the pod because:

 

a.) Mod's have been way pointed across the room by THAT GUY and the entire group rushes to it since the round is almost up and you don't want to miss out on mods.

 

b.) THAT GUY bottle necking all the mobs evidently goes down and you have to cross a room the size of The Titanic just so he does not die.

 

c.) You feel left out having to baby sit the pod because THAT GUY is having all the fun and everyone abandons the pod.

 

 

Having the group together presents more opportunities for their abilities and weapons to be synergistic, productive too since you don't have run all over the place. Your intentions might differ from one another yet your goal is one and the same and that's to protect the Cryo Pod / Orokin Powercore. Kills Exp and Mods can already be achieved just by sticking together, why deprive everyone of their much deserved exp, the satisfaction of killing stuff or their long awaited rare mod.

 

 

Wave 5 you say? I wont even wait that long. I'll let the pod die and not participate at all just to point out to you THAT GUY's out there that what you doing is wrong.

 

 

Please do not be THAT GUY

be a team player

be that fine gentleman.

[cknives]

Also, don't break all the containers, leave them for health and energy after ancients start rolling out. It is 100 affinity, it is worth a charger and a half. You can live without it.

Or get a maxed out flow and sit on 450+ power

[Spinner187]

That strategy has many, many down-sides.

1 - If the player "guarding" that door goes down (very, very likely in my experience) the other players have to abandon the point to rescue them.

2 - Mods and crafting materials drop where the enemies die. This means that all of the other players have to run half-way across the map to get the loot that the aforementioned player is farming. This also leaves the point unguarded.

3 - When enemies sneak past that point (there are 3 other exits from that same spawn-point) the "guarding" player will generally sit there and do thing lest they lose their "kill count spot" which can result in them losing xp, mods, and crafting materials.

4 - While xp is shared, it is only shared over a limited distance. This means that the player "guarding" that door is depriving the rest of the team out of some, if not all, of the xp that should be rightfully theirs because of his/her own selfishness. If players want to get the expected xp from kills they have to migrate closer to that spot and thus leave the point unguarded.

An unguarded point is a failed mission. Thus anything that leaves the point unguarded is a failed tactic. Thus fighting away from the group is a failed tactic. Learn to respect your fellow Tenno and cooperate in this cooperative game.

Because of this I will never, ever pick up a player who has gone down on the other side of the map. I will never, ever help those players out if they get swamped. I will never, ever go past wave 5 if they refuse to fight closer to the point. You don't have to be standing on the pod, but fighting across the map is a very, very bad idea.

This ^

 

 

Please do not be THAT GUY

THIS +1000

Edited May 19, 2013 by Spinner187

[d1ru]

Also, don't break all the containers, leave them for health and energy after ancients start rolling out. It is 100 affinity, it is worth a charger and a half. You can live without it.

 

what does a charger and a half mean? and if you know that 90% of people who play defense missions dont stay past wave 10, whats the point in waiting? i have a maxed flow on my excal and i need to break em in the first 15 seconds of the mission to get my energy up

[Judgebanks]

What's worse is that even on Narcissus aka highest level defense mission you see people rambo'ing around. Or even rushing to the area you're covering, abandoning their own.

Narcissus isn't the highest level defense mission, Outer Terminus is. Congratulations you now fall into the same category as the OP.

[ThePresident777]

tl dr;  IM NOT UR @(*()$ OBJECTIVE BABY SITTER, A******, STOP SCREWING THE SPAWNS!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

P.S.  PUT THE STUPID @(*()$ BOW AWAY WHEN OBJECTIVE IS BEING MOBBED>USE UR POWERS AND A REAL @(*()$ WEAPON!!!!!!!!!!

Edited May 21, 2013 by ThePresident777

[TheGreyGuardian]

As you can see, Señor Sombrero, Lady Bow of Ties, and Harold Pipesworth liked to be as far away from the defense point as Tennoly possible. I held the Smiling Fiends at bay for as long as I could, but they bested me from all sides in the end, like so many angry bees stinging an ample bottom while delicate, yet forceful hands try to swat them away.

[Lonestar96]

Bump bump, theres still alot of tenno's out there who have no manners.

 

Just joined a Xini match with a Vauban bottle necking all the spawn.

 

Can a moderator please please please pin this somewhere.

[Snib]

Can a moderator please please please pin this somewhere.

 

Why? Because THAT GUY is gonna come here, read this and change his ways? Suuure...

[Deadly-Bagel]

Another less-known etiquette is to stick to your guns.

 

This means that when there is a slight lack of enemies on your side, but the two guys on the other side seems to be getting loads of kills, don't go help them unless it's the end of the wave and there are no more guys on your side.

 

On the flip side of that, if you're having trouble coping with the number of enemies you've got and need help, retreat a bit. This will allow you a little time and usually your allies will notice and back you up. On a more advanced note, if you notice someone has retreated to the cryopod, go help them with their side while your side catches up. Then you can still defend your side while also helping with theirs.

 

I was playing Kiliken with randoms yesterday, on the awesome map where the cryopod is up on a catwalk that runs around a pit. Two directions to defend, four Tenno. I could handle a direction by myself but so very often I had two or even all three other players come to knock up their kill count, completely ignoring the other side. In response to this, I'd just sprint over to to other side and pick up the slack, only to have them come back a minute later! A few times, one of the less-equipped players died right up in the bottleneck making for a tricky revive a long way from the cryopod, and mainly because his teammates had abandoned him in a momentary lapse in spawns.

Edited May 21, 2013 by Deadly-Bagel

[zorinho20]

tl dr;  IM NOt UR @(*()$ OBJECTIVE BABY SITTER, A******, STOP SCREWING THE SPAWNS!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

P.S.  PUT THE STUPID @(*()$ BOW AWAY WHEN OBJECTIVE IS BEING MOBBED>USE UR POWERS AND A REAL @(*()$ WEAPON!!!!!!!!!!

Well said.Score-whoring is a bi&!# at higher levels.

[Lonestar96]

Why? Because THAT GUY is gonna come here, read this and change his ways? Suuure...

OMG Your absolutely right! The best way to solve my problem is do nothing? Right...

 

Small topics like this help educate Tenno, it might not be the vast majority but a small percentage non the less.

 

You sir have clearly given up.

[Caladiel]

This needs to be stickied, cause I'm sick and tired of people going off on their own little adventures.

 

Online means stick with your team, and if you can't do that set the shtacko to private. -.-

[Snib]

OMG Your absolutely right! The best way to solve my problem is do nothing? Right...

 

Small topics like this help educate Tenno, it might not be the vast majority but a small percentage non the less.

 

You sir have clearly given up.

 

I still try to educate them in battle:

 

 

But as anywhere in life it is mostly hopeless. Those with anti-social tendencies do not exactly respond well to requests to better themselves, so the solution is to avoid them and play with decent people instead.