Update 16.11: Ash Prime + Hotfix 16.11.1

[animanera89]

I don't, but it makes life a lot easier :))

Don't feed the idiocy of these things (I won't lower myself into calling them "people").

If they are able to get to 60 minutes of survival without a Gmag, good for them. The thing is? WE NEVER FORCED THEM TO USE HER or other "super-useful" frames. If I'm not "dictating" the way you play, don't even dare to do the same to me. But now, thanks to their stupid mindless whining, WE are stuck with a very bad system (RNG) and no instrument to at least mitigate the damage it does to us.

Edited July 9, 2015 by animanera89

[-MLG.Pizza.DoG-]

Don't feed the idiocy of these things (I won't low myself calling them "people").

If they are able to get to 60 minutes of survival without a Gmag, good for them. The thing is? WE NEVER FORCED THEM TO USE HER or other "super-useful" frames. If I'm not "dictating" the way you play, don't even dare to do the same to me. But now, thanks to their stupid mindless whining, WE are stuck with a very bad system (RNG) and no instrument to at least mitigate the damage it does to us.

It IS possible to get to 60 without a Gmag but it will be a real pain in the.... and will be pointless :D

[animanera89]

It IS possible to get to 60 without a Gmag but it will be a real pain in the.... and will be pointless :D

Well, I was talking about the example that the tool made :P I know it's pointless, for enemies scaling and reward rotation. It was just to make an example of the innate idiocy of some things-that-pretend-to-be-humans.

[PoulsenJ]

Don't feed the idiocy of these things (I won't lower myself into calling them "people").

If they are able to get to 60 minutes of survival without a Gmag, good for them. The thing is? WE NEVER FORCED THEM TO USE HER or other "super-useful" frames. If I'm not "dictating" the way you play, don't even dare to do the same to me. But now, thanks to their stupid mindless whining, WE are stuck with a very bad system (RNG) and no instrument to at least mitigate the damage it does to us.

 

 

Well, I was talking about the example that the tool made :P I know it's pointless, for enemies scaling and reward rotation. It was just to make an example of the innate idiocy of some things-that-pretend-to-be-humans.

 

Looks like you are the one who is whining

[Thoronar]

I think nerfing the greedy pull is really against teamplay... Isn't it about finding the right combo for a specific mission?

 

There are other possibilities nerfing the gmag/mesa combo f. ex. limiting the range/max number of items pulled etc.

 

RIP mag.

[isyra]

lol i read every post in this topic, im as disapointed as all of u guys, but, i think u guys are missing the point here:

the problem WAS NOT the greed pull, WAS NOT mesa, the problem IS (because still is) sobe bugged maps, like draco and so on, want to nerf something worth? why not THESE maps??? there are A LOT of excavation maps, but, people only complain about draco, so, the problem is the frame u use? not likely! mag + mesa was something to easy the farming, but, u farm to do something ELSE besides that!

 

boo hoo, mag dont pull energy orb anymore!

i tought, ok, pulled everithing to myself and placed 2 greater energy refill on mesas feets and used mags ult, who IMOBILISES mobs for about 3s, 6s later, mesa was filled and ready to kill again! :D

 

so, the problem are the frames? NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

my sujestion: kill DRACO! as long maps like that exists, more unecessary nerfs will exists!

another thing: use macro is not agaist the rules, but, IF that IS a problem, make it against!!! 

 

this game is about grind and farm, realy nothing else, but, if u invest time and ressources to make it easier and u see ALL ur effort going down the drain, from one day to another, thats plain mean!

 

all frames are good the way they were/are, so, dont make this game be like CS were ur char was only cosmetic, nothing special about it!

[Pro3Display]

Looks like you are the one who is whining

you didn't get what he said, do you?

[Grom-84]

It IS possible to get to 60 without a Gmag but it will be a real pain in the.... and will be pointless :D

Lots of consumables and foolish runing around in hunt for blue orbs ignoring everything.

[Shriker_sh]

 

so, the problem are the frames? NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!

my sujestion: kill DRACO! as long maps like that exists, more unecessary nerfs will exists!

another thing: use macro is not agaist the rules, but, IF that IS a problem, make it against!!! 

 

Kill Draco??? DO you realize what that means? I know you can farm about 3k Standing with a Mesa 1 round on Draco.

But you can play Draco also with other Setups. I really like Draco, you have to be all over the place, you have to be fast, you have to be moving and just wave after wave is thrown at you. With hitscan weapons, snipers and Eximus its a good challenge and it is also good rewarded.

Whats the reward? It's affinity and standing. Is something wrong with that? I don't think so.

 

I play about 2 hours a day, what I consider much for a person who has a job and a life.

I normally do the 6 syndicate dailies with all the sigils and then some alerts/invasions, if theres good stuff and then I do some Void missions to get some prime parts and still formas. After like 1:45h I still have about 10-12k daily standing left.

The way DE wants us to play the game is just not very good to get your daily standing down to 0.

So at the end of the day I do 4 rounds of Draco with an unmaxed setup to level my stuff and get the daily standing to 0. Sometimes I need to do another round to max out.

I do that because normal gameplay is just horribly bad for leveling your gear and maxing your standing.

Sure T4D gives some standing aswell but I would never dare to make the life of other players hard because Im playing with an really bad setup on T4D.

Is it really that bad, that after 2h of daily playing I want to see some progess in my gear and get the standing maxed for my Voidkey supply?

Because I thing farmin for keys is even more tedious.

[MG45]

 

After this update, Orokin void became Dron & Ancients shooting game and there's no tier balance anymore. 

 

Your Soma prime, Boltor prime became useless.

 

Nobody want MAG in party.

 

Ash prime?  Just try public match for few days. Looks DE doesn't know or doesn't care why we playing warframe. 

Edited July 10, 2015 by MG45

[animanera89]

you didn't get what he said, do you?

There is a good reason if I define him a tool isn't it?

 

I play about 2 hours a day, what I consider much for a person who has a job and a life.

I normally do the 6 syndicate dailies with all the sigils and then some alerts/invasions, if theres good stuff and then I do some Void missions to get some prime parts and still formas. After like 1:45h I still have about 10-12k daily standing left.

The way DE wants us to play the game is just not very good to get your daily standing down to 0.

So at the end of the day I do 4 rounds of Draco with an unmaxed setup to level my stuff and get the daily standing to 0. Sometimes I need to do another round to max out.

I do that because normal gameplay is just horribly bad for leveling your gear and maxing your standing.

Sure T4D gives some standing aswell but I would never dare to make the life of other players hard because Im playing with an really bad setup on T4D.

Is it really that bad, that after 2h of daily playing I want to see some progess in my gear and get the standing maxed for my Voidkey supply?

Because I thing farmin for keys is even more tedious.

That's another problem that Gmag helped "resolve", or at least circumvent. Have you tried the Spy missions? If done correctly, they'll give you a lot of affinity... sure thing, they are far less efficient than the old Gmag/mesa combo on Draco, but still...

Edited July 10, 2015 by animanera89

[Pro3Display]

There is a good reason if I define him a tool isn't it?

elaborate?

[magusat999]

"snip"

 

DE have repeatedly said they don't want us to grind within the game (often to the point of nerfing viable grinds into the ground), so to see the most used power in a manner to assist grinding of course they are going to change it.

 If DE doesn't want us to grind then they shouldn't make the game grindy. If that's the case then they need to give guaranteed drops, stop hiding the drop tables, and remove rarity. Your comment makes no sense because it's totally up to DE how "grindy" the game is - and they made it one of the most grind-fests ever.

 

MOVING ON...

 

First of all ...

For the TL;DR people -

In a nutshell, this nerf has nothing to do with abuse (which it was not) or even people whining. Whiners are just a buffer for DE - notice when the whiners are out they let them do all the argument for them, and say nothing? Thus and other nerfs boil down to getting you out there, making the game grindy, so you will more likely get tired of it and start spending plat. You spend it, you will need more, you will buy more.

END OF TL;DR PEOPLE SECTION... YOU ARE FREE TO MAKE A HASTY REPLY NOW.

 

For the rest of us:

 

This and countless other ridiculous, fun busting, whiner satisfying nerfs all come down to the same thing - money. In order to effectively cash in on us, the game must be configured as to be impossible to reach a peak level of achievement. DE cannot get money out of you if all of your warframes are reliable - if you have no reason to grind it out and play with their horrible RNG. The RNG aspect is the numero uno money maker - it set you up psychologically to become a rabid farmer. Its a fact that the human impulse is to appear normal and equal, and this game feeds into that by constantly dropping you down a peg or three with nerfs.

 

The reasons we are given, for example the GMag nerf, don't sound right because they aren't. Our insticts tell us something is not right about the reasons, and it's true. Why would DE care if we "used the ability too much"? They don't care if you use Iron Skin on Rhino - yeah they altered that but it's still a useable skill. Did they take away Snowglobe? If they took the other three abilites away from Frost, most people wouldn't even notice. What about Loki's Invisibility? We use that for the entire mission if possible - that didn't get nerfed. GMag by comparison is in the same category - the "They are using it too much" argument is silly, and I doubt that even came out of the mouth of any DE staff - even so, they made an ability, and the reason it was often used is because it was popular. The reason it was popular is because there is a need - and needs will get filled one way or the other. We are trying to stay in the game but some of us are exhausted with the grindfest. You gave us a reprieve, but then you took it away. Casual players are not going to hold this game up, and since the game is designed to grind then you should either fall in love with farming players or take the grind out of it.

 

But the issue is not so much the farming and grinding. You cost DE money every second your playing. They have to pay for all that bandwidth, servers, server maintenance, account maintenance, fixes, etc., etc., etc. If you are not making them money they have to come up with ways to mae you make them money. Like taking you from hero to zero.  Take away your power. Make you weak. Make you grind to get stronger.

 

HOW does that make them money? Simple - for every 10 players grinding, at least ONE is going to give up and buy something that will relieve them of the grind. That means they need plat, and DE makes money from you paying for plat. Notice how little the expensive plat gets you? One look at mods like Life Strike ought to tell you how greed is in the mix. It isn't so much the seller's fault but the fact that plat gets you not uch for a whole lot of real dough. You could spend $10.00+ on a SINGLE MOD. That's highway robbery - but its capitalization at it's finest. You run out of plat faster, and you have to buy more. People will do it because of competitive drive (and keeping up with the Joneses). The same kind of rabid, blind impule can be seen on ebay - where like shaks in bloodwater bidders will often spend more than retail price just to "win". After the dopamine wears off they wonder what they just did - I even had people tell me they couldn't help themselves, they just wanted to win. Same concept here, and being used to pull your pockets at the expense of common sense gameplay.

 

The deal is - it's counter-productive to try and catch every penny. Which is what is going on here. You have to loosen up, and sometimes you have to bypass some juicy fruit in order to attract more gorillas and keep them happy. If you make this too tight, even you most staunchest yes-men might not say something - but they will leave. They will be too ashamed to say anything because they realized tyou made a fool of them - but they will leave the game - and many already have. It is about money - but it cannot be ALL about money and not let people have a good time.

 

It is evident and obvious that DE needs to make money - but if someone came to your house and said "I want to cut your grass, for $500,000.00 a week..." would you accept that or slam the door in thier face? There should be a limit, and when that limit is reached then you come up with other things to pay for. DE is obviously controlled by the money department now - it's tactics are old hat and very recognizeable. "Keep then 'em starving - they will pay up."

 

Every decision is running through the money department. "Should we nerf the Penta?" - "Well, 80% of the players are using the Penta and have no desire for the other weapons... nerf it. If they are grinding for other weapons, we can make money. Catalysts, Formas, rushing to finish, trying to get rare parts spending plat because you just cant wait... that all makes us money. The quicker they dispose of the current plat the faster they are buying new. So nerf away.".

 

People make the assumption that the small amounts they spend makes no difference, and why would DE make any difference in order to make a small amount, or even just a chance to get you to pony up some cash - because that's how finance people see it. If it makes a penny it is viable. Regular people don't see things like that. They think a company wouldnt do something just to make some cents off of you, but sorry - they do it to make LESS THAN a cent from you. As long as they got you for some cash they are happy. If they can get more then even better. They do not have acceptable losses (some companies do accept that but are looking for large low risk returns). DE is evidently under the gun to have virtually no "loss" whatsoever. They do not give you anything for free (you may think its free but its all cash bait)  - you are going to pay up eventually. The lowest amount of plat you can buy has already paid for everything you will ever do in this game - but your going to pay more.

 

For the TL;DR people -

In a nutshell, this nerf has nothing to do with abuse (which it was not) or even people whining. Whiners are just a buffer for DE - notice when the whiners are out they let them do all the argument for them, and say nothing? Thus and other nerfs boil down to getting you out there, making the game grindy, so you will more likely get tired of it and start spending plat. You spend it, you will need more, you will buy more.

Edited July 10, 2015 by magusat999

[PoulsenJ]

you didn't get what he said, do you?

 

Yes iI did and it sounds like whine to me ! And the disrespect... Why dont DE change the whole game so you peoble DONT have to get better. Greedy Poll has been in the game for how long ? 2-3 month, I never jused it OR will never juse it, dont need to, it's plane and simple peoble, BUILD YOUR SKILLS !

[animanera89]

Yes iI did and it sounds like whine to me ! And the disrespect... Why dont DE change the whole game so you peoble DONT have to get better. Greedy Poll has been in the game for how long ? 2-3 month, I never jused it OR will never juse it, dont need to, it's plane and simple peoble, BUILD YOUR SKILLS !

Sigh... Ok, I'll try again:

1) No one ever forced you to use that composition. If you are a Trve-hard-ultra-pro that can do a lot of things without the help from Gmag or other "famous" combos, good for you. But then again, do not dictate how other players should play or force a playstyle they don't have/like/are able to use onto them. And that's what the whiners anti-Gmag did.

2) That composition was an answer the gamers came up with to mitigate the tediousness of a lot of stationary missions and the problems related to the RNG, grindwall and enemies scaling (at high levels) of this game. Had DE "fixed" the RNG problem (with equal chance drop tables, for example, or other rewarding systems), Gmag would have been only "another possible frame to use and have fun with". With the problems that we have instead, she was basically A NECESSITY for a lot of players and teams. Now, they (we) are "unarmed" against this despicable situations, or if we are not totally unramed (because in recruiting you can already see "need mesa/ trynity/ mirage/ nova/ ecc), we still lack a proper solution. And at the same time we have one less instrument available. This also kills the variety of the game, because now Gmag in the eyes of a lot of players is useless (or has lower uses) for a team compared to other frames.

3) The move of turning Gpull into Selfish Gpull goes even against the "spirit" of this game: cooperation. An ability useful not only for one player but for his/her whole squad has been turned into a personal-gain-only power, and that should be the last thing to happen in a co-op game.

4) IT DOES NOT RESOLVE THE PROBLEM. Many players, still wanting the max efficiency possible to overcome the grindwall of this game, are already "researching" alternative combinations that will allow them to do pretty much the same thing they did with Gmag before. Do they have fun with this systems? Hell no. Are they FORCED somehow by game desing to use this systems? Hell yes, sadly.

The rework of Gpull would have been acceptable if they had looked into the messed up drop/reward tables of the game, and they surely as hell didn't. So I'll PROTEST (the whine I'll leave to others) exposing my points (that I'm sure are shared by a lot of other players) until something is done. It's the same thing that a lot of sh!theads used to have weapons and power nerfed, but with less idiocy and more common sense for the benefit of all players.

Edited July 10, 2015 by animanera89

[PoulsenJ]

Sigh... Ok, I'll try again:

1) No one ever forced you to use that composition. If you are a Trve-hard-ultra-pro that can do a lot of things without the help from Gmag or other "famous" combos, good for you. But then again, do not dictate how other players should play or force a playstyle they don't have/like/are able to use onto them. And that's what the whiners anti-Gmag did.

2) That composition was an answer the gamers came up with to mitigate the tediousness of a lot of stationary missions and the problems related to the RNG, grindwall and enemies scaling (at high levels) of this game. Had DE "fixed" the RNG problem (with equal chance drop tables, for example, or other rewarding systems), Gmag would have been only "another possible frame to use and have fun with". With the problems that we have instead, she was basically A NECESSITY for a lot of players and teams. Now, they (we) are "unarmed" against this despicable situations, or if we are not totally unramed (because in recruiting you can already see "need mesa/ trynity/ mirage/ nova/ ecc), we still lack a proper solution. And at the same time we have one less instrument available. This also kills the variety of the game, because now Gmag in the eyes of a lot of players is useless (or has lower uses) for a team compared to other frames.

3) The move of turning Gpull into Selfish Gpull goes even against the "spirit" of this game: cooperation. An ability useful not only for one player but for his/her whole squad has been turned into a personal-gain-only power, and that should be the last thing to happen in a co-op game.

4) IT DOES NOT RESOLVE THE PROBLEM. Many players, still wanting the max efficiency possible to overcome the grindwall of this game, are already "researching" alternative combinations that will allow them to do pretty much the same thing they did with Gmag before. Do they have fun with this systems? Hell no. Are they FORCED somehow by game desing to use this systems? Hell yes, sadly.

The rework of Gpull would have been acceptable if they had looked into the messed up drop/reward tables of the game, and they surely as hell didn't. So I'll PROTEST (the whine I'll leave to others) exposing my points (that I'm sure are shared by a lot of other players) until something is done. It's the same thing that a lot of sh!theads used to have weapons and power nerfed, but with less idiocy and more common sense for the benefit of all players.

 

How long ago did you start playing this game (No disrespect here) ? What did you do before greedy poll ? Because all i hear is how lazy peoble is, build your self a carrier, only loot when it's safe, use cover, leave 1 or 2 enermies alive in defense, if you are on Teamspeak/Skype or ingame voice tell others when you want to loot so you do it together, need energy / health or shield build pizza's problem solved, if you are dying in survival try other frames, disarm loki is a must in any try hard squad, a nova for cc (Dosent always have to be slova or ultra slova) a trinity for eather energy or as a tank and so on...

 

This greedy poll is just a mod that destroyed the game for alot of players, and combain that to mesa (wich should never have been in this game anyway, imo)  

 

I'am not dictating how any one should play, but maby you should just accept that ths mod is OP and there is a solution to this, change your play style. And dont forget this game is still in beta so DE can do what they want.

 

And maby you should consitter how you talk to and about other peoble/players and DE.

Edited July 11, 2015 by PoulsenJ

[Sargathan]

I wouldn't go as far as calling it destroying the game.

Having returned after a 2 month break just a few days ago (when ash prime got introduced/mag nerfed), i have not seen such a relaxed attitude in teamsetups in a while before.

Just pick whatever.

Heck, i finally got to participate in a felt meaningful way.

 

I for one, welcome our nerfing overlords.

 

It is far from wrong, people will adjust like they always did. For now.this i consider a healthy change.

In defense, everyone gets to contribute in more ways then just pressing a button and shooting bubbles.

Survival is finally played without camping! go figure. that is actually fun!

 

This is probably my 3rd post ever on this forum.

Imagine how much i approve of this nerf to actually take my time to post.

 

PS:

mr18, all frames maxed. rather confident with each. if that counts for anything, which i doubt. but anyway..

Edited July 11, 2015 by Sargathan

[Pro3Display]

It is far from wrong, people will adjust like they always did. For now.this i consider a healthy change.

In defense, everyone gets to contribute in more ways then just pressing a button and shooting bubbles.

Survival is finally played without camping! go figure. that is actually fun!

just so you know you don't need neither mesa nor gmag to camp survival in the void

there was few survivals in void this week and technically we still was camping the 3floored hall with valkyr rhino and excal, just a bit more scale than regular tube (120lvl mobs - EZ)

 

it is in nature of people to adjust to whatever the hell is thrown at them.

it is also in their nature to adjust whatever is thrown at them to their liking and this one comes before the attempt to fit in.

it is in nature of everything to find the way of least resistance, which gmag mesa combo was.

it means the game should be shaped so it was enjoyable itself - if i need to make myself being entertained, for what reason the game exist?

 

don't get me wrong- game got potential which i would like to see developed. i'd gladly invest into that potential but what is happening is not what i want to see

Edited July 11, 2015 by Pro3Display

[PoulsenJ]

I wouldn't go as far as calling it destroying the game.

 

 

I meant the game experience, my bad ;-)

[CareTaker00]

Is the change to the Greedy Pull mod the first time drop placement is tracked by user?  In other words, is there a precedent for a single drop to appear in different locations as seen by each player?

 

I haven't tested it yet, but what happens when a Mag uses Greedy Pull to move drops, like a mod, then places a marker/waypoint on that mod?  Does marker appear to be in the same physical location for other players, only the drop is not present at that location?  

[3thereal]

Loving Carrier/Sweeper Prime. Excellent buffs to Ash too. Thanks!

[GH0STP0ND]

R.I.P. Greedy Pull :( 

[Jalgorty]

• Fixed an issue caused by trying to host a Dojo while in a Squad, forcing players to disband their squad first.

 

In what was was this fixed ? Squads still disband when hosting a dojo and the dojo hosting if anything seems more buggy now than ever. The squad of 3 that I was in tried this and the squad was split after the host joined. Then the host invited the remaining 2 that were split and on them both now joining, one joined dojo and the other joined the dojo but instead of joining the dojo he was invited to he was instead now the solo host of a seperate instance of the same dojo and unable to after more attempts to join their hosted dojo.

[ManiekPL]

#RIP MAG :(

D:

[ManiekPL]

please withdrawal 

nerf mag skill 1