Energy Efficiency Is Mandatory (?)

[(PSN)Chino_Feo_1337]

Realistically, most if not all of the popular community builds need energy efficiency. You can leave strength, duration and range out without making much of an impact, but efficiency will always be needed. I'm sure you don't need it with something like Trinity, or this super speciefic end-game build, but realistically speaking, you're going to use it all the time.

 

If you think differently, please let me know, politely discussing has always been benefitial. Of course I will accept that as long as you have good reason to do it.

 

Edit: I do know it depends on the frame and its build. Probably mentioning it once wasn't enough. I don't run any efficiency on my trinity and my valkyr, and just a streamline for my invis loki build. I'm not negating it depends. of course it does. I'm not using the literal meaning of mandatory, you can of course go out and swap your efficiency with something else. But what i'm trying to say is that it is too punishing to go without efficiency, or without means of regaining energy.

Edited September 9, 2015 by (PS4)Chino_Feo_1337

[(PSN)Cerata_]

Eh, depends on the frame. Ember? Hell yes, Vex/Ward Chroma? Eh, maybe not.Frames with naturally high duration tend not to recast as often. You don't always need it as much as it might seem, but yes. Efficiency is very important to most builds, especially high level.

Edited September 9, 2015 by (PS4)spider59234

[painterman]

The thing is that usually efficiency>more energy, and being hable to span things like embers fireball, or keep pacemaker a while its nice, but there is some frames that dont need efficiecy unless runing some min-max builds with bind rage( my chroma buil, mirage, trin)

[Boatsniper]

You are correct. Energy efficiency is 100% mandatory on all Warframes, with a maxed Streamline at the very least. The same can be said for Energy Regeneration, through a mod like Rage or with the Energy Siphon aura. Capacity takes the least precedence, and can sometimes be forgone for 150 Energy frames.

[WilYen]

depends on the frame and build. so no not mandatory.

[Anatolius]

I dont think its mandatory on all frames but energy regeneration is.

 

For example: my Volt prime has no efficiency on his normal build because that is like 800+ energy right there

But I will use it if I know I will be in a mission where energy vampire enemies exist.

 

Warframes with alot of armor and health dont need energy efficiency when you got rage

 

My Mag, however, has all the efficiency because all I need is dat range

 

but really, like everyone said, it depends on the frame and build

[Epicagemo]

depends on the frame and build. so no not mandatory.

80-90% of builds can't work without it, i'd say it is mandatory

[WilYen]

80-90% of builds can't work without it, i'd say it is mandatory

 

to MAX efficiency you cut into alot of duration.  

[Malitias]

to MAX efficiency you cut into alot of duration.  

Do you somehow have an attention problem?

 

Yes, you do, and most of the time it's still better to go for efficiency (put in a constitution or something to compensate for those who need it), which supports the statement of OP even more.

Edited September 9, 2015 by Malitias

[(PSN)Chino_Feo_1337]

to MAX efficiency you cut into alot of duration.  

Do you write in italics and bold for something in particular? Or just when you disagree with something without using solid arguments?

[KillerXDLZ]

If the Warframe is not affected by duration, max it.

If the Warframe gets some minor downsides, just like excalibur or Sentry/Effigy Chroma, max it.

If the Warframe works with duration in most of his abilities, like Vauban or DPS Nekros, don't max it.

 

Sometimes higher duration can be more energy efficienct than maxing energy efficiency. Wasting 50 energy once with streamline is more efficient than spending 18.75 energy 3 times with maxed efficiency to get the same result (56,25 energy). It's a question abouth math, wich Warframe your using and what abilitys you want to affect.

 

Energy Efficiency can be a complete illusion and make you waste more energy if not used carefully.

Edited September 10, 2015 by KillerXDLZ

[00zau]

If the Warframe is not affected by duration, max it.

If the Warframe gets some minor downsides, just like excalibur or Sentry/Effigy Chroma, max it.

If the Warframe works with duration in most of his abilities, like Vauban or DPS Nekros, don't max it.

 

Sometimes higher duration can be more energy efficienct than maxing energy efficiency. Wasting 50 energy once with streamline is more efficient than spending 18.75 energy 3 times with maxed efficiency to get the same result (56,25 energy). It's a question abouth math, wich Warframe your using and what abilitys you want to affect.

 

Energy Efficiency can be a complete illusion and make you waste more energy if not used carefully.

Ah, but if you rebuild duration (which is how you'd build with FE and duration based powers) then the FE build becomes superior on a per-second basis again. With Primed Continuity and Constitution, you have +83% power duration. Throw in FE and you're back down to 123% base. 123% of base duration for 40% of the cost amounts to 307.5% energy efficiency over time. Use Steamline instead and you've got 183% duration and 70% base cost, which is only ~261% efficiency over time.

 

And FE builds have the advantage of better on-demand usage, as well. Sometime you only need a few seconds of an ability, and the leftover duration is wasted. Then you need it again. In a situation like that, being able to use smaller 'packets' of energy and duration allows you more control. Basically, being able to cast an ability 3 times for 10 seconds each is better than casting it 2 times for 15 seconds if you only need it for 10 seconds at a time.

[Misgenesis]

Pretty much, yeah. If there are minimal down sides to efficiency i will focus on it.

 

The thing is, i probably wouldnt focus on efficiency so much if energy pick ups picked up the amount you have missing and leave whats left on the ground. Same thing with the ammo system.

[Neogeo]

Not necessary, my max duration and strength Mirage build didn't even use streamline. Max duration buff will last for about 1 minute. Enough time to replenish the energy for recasting

[xLordKogax]

If the Warframe is not affected by duration, max it.

If the Warframe gets some minor downsides, just like excalibur or Sentry/Effigy Chroma, max it.

If the Warframe works with duration in most of his abilities, like Vauban or DPS Nekros, don't max it.

 

Sometimes higher duration can be more energy efficienct than maxing energy efficiency. Wasting 50 energy once with streamline is more efficient than spending 18.75 energy 3 times with maxed efficiency to get the same result (56,25 energy). It's a question abouth math, wich Warframe your using and what abilitys you want to affect.

 

Energy Efficiency can be a complete illusion and make you waste more energy if not used carefully.

 

You made soo much sense My friend +1

 

I hope yall read this he does have a point here

[TheBrsrkr]

Eh...."needs" is the wrong word here. Very few abilities are designed with efficiency in mind (Mesa/Chroma). I run with negative efficiency on most of my frames and I do just fine. People want efficiency because it's more convenient to recast whatever it is you want than not, especially on abilities not affected by duration.

[ThePredicament]

Not all of them. High efficiency is not even needed for most of the game, although there are some frames that are absolutely great with it. So, not mandatory but it's always good to have, especially having a Primed Continuity to stave off the duration hit.

[Naftal]

Build where you need to use a lot of abilities obviously benefit from the efficiency. At efficiency cap you're able to cast four times more abilities per energy you get. Saying that you can forget about using other power stats is not true in any way though.

 

Duration builds don't need efficiency at all however, since you only need to recast buffs every now and then. Examples of this are mesa SG/SS build, chroma ward/vex build and mirage HoM/Eclipse build.

[(PSN)thefndodge]

Efficiency mods are not mandatory, there are plenty of other ways to trivialize the energy system in this game. 

 

Personally, I don't use fleeting expertise anymore on any build that needs duration. Instead I often use a maxed primed flow on these frames. I use streamline a lot, but don't consider it mandatory because 30% efficiency is not that much, and I can often use those mod points on something else. 

 

I was strongly against the idea of a primed streamline, as I thought it would be such a powerful mod without any negative effect that it would be mandatory. Thankfully we were just being trolled and it is not for real. 

[Epicagemo]

Not necessary, my max duration and strength Mirage build didn't even use streamline. Max duration buff will last for about 1 minute. Enough time to replenish the energy for recasting

I agree, but if her powers didn't cost 25-maybe75-100 energy-you'd reconsider especially with blind rage.

[RealPandemonium]

They should just get rid of FE and Streamline and re-do power costs and durations from there.  The ubiquity of those mods just eats up slots.

[UltimateSpinDash]

I wouldn't say mandatory, but the fact is that energy efficiency benefits every ability in the game, so you can't really go wrong, unless you use a max rank FE on a Frame that needs duration (and even then, you can negate it with Primed Continuity).

[YasaiTsume]

Yea.... different builds require different elements

one good example is Disarm Loki vs Stealth Loki

one can afford Fleeting Expertise as it only cares about range 
the other cannot afford Fleeting Expertise as to prolong the invisibility time

So....not mandatory, but it is useful to have.

Halfway builds do exist so I don't see why any hooha should be made about Efficiency.

 

 

Whats next? DURATION IS MANDATORY COS ABILITIES LAST LONGER AND LONGER = BETTER YAY!!!

[RealPandemonium]

Yea.... different builds require different elements

one good example is Disarm Loki vs Stealth Loki

one can afford Fleeting Expertise as it only cares about range 

the other cannot afford Fleeting Expertise as to prolong the invisibility time

Recasting Invis every 12 seconds vs every 18 seconds for a quarter of the cost and being able to replenish almost its whole cost from one Energy Siphon in the meantime is no trade-off.  The only difference between a Disarm-focused Loki and any other kind of Loki is the presence of range mods.

[YasaiTsume]

Recasting Invis every 12 seconds vs every 18 seconds for a quarter of the cost and being able to replenish almost its whole cost from one Energy Siphon in the meantime is no trade-off.  The only difference between a Disarm-focused Loki and any other kind of Loki is the presence of range mods.

I think yu are forgetting the fact Loki is casting Disarm in addition to Invis

Also yu conviniently cropped out my mention of "Halfway builds"