It's Time To Stop Having Rare Event Mods That Sell For Upwards Of 500 Platinum.

[Shin]

Here's another wall of text.

I have, on Warframe Builder. You're just straight-up lying. The better ones are traded for hundreds of platinum for a reason, and it's not just because they're collectible.

What you lose in IPS, You gain in Elemental Damage. Its not going to make any difference. You are salty because you want IPS Event mods. Those mods are pricy because people willing to pay that much for it. Not because it makes that much difference in damage. Come up with something better next time.

 

No doubt there are plenty of F2P games that give away powerful equipment for a limited time only. Regardless, it's a crap practice no matter how many games do it, and "But other games do it!" is a crap argument. Warframe should be better than that. Aesthetics yes, "side grades" yes, but otherwise, no.

Not really. People likes events, New stuff but timed exclusive rewards are what hypes more than half of the community. As much as you need players to be entertained, you also need to reward them. Exclusives are a good way for it. They arent perma exclusive like the Founders either. 

 

 

You think a 20-wave Nightmare Defense was aimed at new players? What you're really doing here is making excuses for recent rewards that are nowhere near as good as those rewarded by earlier events.

Clans, Friends and Matchmaking. Everyone in Warframe carries the newbies to those missions. There are people asking for help, there are people who are responding to them or they can just click on the mission and join randoms to complate it. Its not rocket science.

 

Also some of those are simply now designed for Newbies. Why do they have to get everything anyway? If they are new, they should progress through the game like everyone else. Why should we treat them any different? In fact Warframe has been very tolerant towards those players.

 

Im not making excuses. I dont have to. There are facts out there that noone really complains except for those who thinks everyone should get a chance at something just because they play the game. 

 

 

Math and experience using the weapons we're discussing are enough to prove that they're mediocre at best. How I personally see them doesn't enter into it. The vast majority of people will either sell the weapons to make room for better ones, or they will sit and collect dust, because there are at least half a dozen assault rifles better than the Karak Wraith, several machine pistols/SMGs better than the Wraith Twin Vipers, and the Gorgon Wraith is absolute crap. I'd rather potato and forma a Lato than take a Gorgon Wraith into a mission

What you are saying is every event should bring out powerful weapons. What you are missing is if those weapons be as good or better than the ones we currently have, its going to be something like a slap in the face for the people who put time and forma into their equipments. Yes Half of the event weapons just sucks but they are good for Newbies.

 

I know what you are going to say, why would they even use it when they can get a Boltor prime? Thats the games fault. There is no sense of progression. A newbie should not have access to every weapon nor a mr8 should have access to Sancti Tigris. SMG's in this game are straight terrible. I dont know a single Smg that can hold its ground against other secondaries maybe aside from Twin grakata which i hate whole heartedly. They all suffer from the same problem, ammo efficiency.

 

Also its worth mentioning that Gorgon Wraith, Vipers etc are not worthless. Maybe they are not your cup of tea but i like them. I use them in Conclaves. You claiming that they are useless means nothing. They have their uses, they are good pvp weapons and good for Newbies. Not all event rewards are aimed towards Vets, not every event rewards are aimed towards newbies. Its not that hard.

 

 

Well, you can get nearly everything easily in Warframe, if you pay lots of real-life cash.

I have everything aside from Primed Chamber and Founders gears. I have not put a single dime into this game to buy myself something that can give me an edge. I bought cosmetics, slots. This game is not Pay 2 Win. Its Pay 2 Look Fabulous.

 

 

Yes, there are a variety of opinions out there. What I dislike (and always have; I've been playing online games since the late 1990s, and I've encountered the attitude a lot) are older players who are jealous of their imaginary game stuff. It's not enough that they have it; they don't want anyone ELSE to have it, either. That's understandable when it comes to aesthetics like badges and other honors, or special armor, or Excalibur Prime, for example (not a huge upgrade over Excalibur, but a nice exclusive).

I've only see people going crazy on just one topic. Primed Chamber. Whenever someone mentions it, people swarms over that thread and try their best to derail it. I dont even go near those threads because i get easily annoyed by the people who keeps saying the same things. And dont worry, everyone hates them.

 

 

However, I'm not going to pay platinum so that I can buy unobtainable event mods from older players, because I consider it a pyramid scheme, and I don't like it. So, I'll go without, and many of my weapons that can only be made better by event mods will remain the way they are.

You dont need to play money to get platinum. I made like 1k platinum when the Syndicate weapons first came. In just 1 hour. I havent even try doing it afterwards. I could've close the night with enough platinum to buy Primed chamber. If i can do it, so you can. Warframe's economy is Free Market. You can get rich easily if you are not trying to sell Sicarus Barrels that is.

 

 

PS: DE should consider newer players because new players are the lifeblood of any online game. Yes, veterans should be considered as well, but that consideration needn't include veterans' desire that someone else not be able to obtain a thing that has a substantial effect on game mechanics.

Newbies doesnt have to have the access to every single thing. Think about it, every now and then you hear people not having multishot mods. Hell most of them doesnt even have access to properly ranked Damage mods. They already have things that needs to be done first. 

 

Handing everything over them would be too much hand holding also it would be unfair to people who plays the events and get the mods. What would be the point of making newbies and Vets have access to everything? 

[Tyrian3k]

One thing that exclusives are for (in my eyes) is being able to show them off.

The event weapons have their unique appearance and sound which give them cosmetic value.

Event mods on the other hand are, just like most other mods, pure stats and nothing more. There is no value to them beyond that.

Timed exclusive is one thing but letting mods sit in the vault for ages is just not the right way to go.

[Onisa]

Here's another wall of text.

What you lose in IPS, You gain in Elemental Damage. Its not going to make any difference. You are salty because you want IPS Event mods. Those mods are pricy because people willing to pay that much for it. Not because it makes that much difference in damage. Come up with something better next time.

 

Not really. People likes events, New stuff but timed exclusive rewards are what hypes more than half of the community. As much as you need players to be entertained, you also need to reward them. Exclusives are a good way for it. They arent perma exclusive like the Founders either. 

 

 

Clans, Friends and Matchmaking. Everyone in Warframe carries the newbies to those missions. There are people asking for help, there are people who are responding to them or they can just click on the mission and join randoms to complate it. Its not rocket science.

 

Also some of those are simply now designed for Newbies. Why do they have to get everything anyway? If they are new, they should progress through the game like everyone else. Why should we treat them any different? In fact Warframe has been very tolerant towards those players.

 

Im not making excuses. I dont have to. There are facts out there that noone really complains except for those who thinks everyone should get a chance at something just because they play the game. 

 

 

What you are saying is every event should bring out powerful weapons. What you are missing is if those weapons be as good or better than the ones we currently have, its going to be something like a slap in the face for the people who put time and forma into their equipments. Yes Half of the event weapons just sucks but they are good for Newbies.

 

I know what you are going to say, why would they even use it when they can get a Boltor prime? Thats the games fault. There is no sense of progression. A newbie should not have access to every weapon nor a mr8 should have access to Sancti Tigris. SMG's in this game are straight terrible. I dont know a single Smg that can hold its ground against other secondaries maybe aside from Twin grakata which i hate whole heartedly. They all suffer from the same problem, ammo efficiency.

 

Also its worth mentioning that Gorgon Wraith, Vipers etc are not worthless. Maybe they are not your cup of tea but i like them. I use them in Conclaves. You claiming that they are useless means nothing. They have their uses, they are good pvp weapons and good for Newbies. Not all event rewards are aimed towards Vets, not every event rewards are aimed towards newbies. Its not that hard.

 

 

I have everything aside from Primed Chamber and Founders gears. I have not put a single dime into this game to buy myself something that can give me an edge. I bought cosmetics, slots. This game is not Pay 2 Win. Its Pay 2 Look Fabulous.

 

 

I've only see people going crazy on just one topic. Primed Chamber. Whenever someone mentions it, people swarms over that thread and try their best to derail it. I dont even go near those threads because i get easily annoyed by the people who keeps saying the same things. And dont worry, everyone hates them.

 

 

You dont need to play money to get platinum. I made like 1k platinum when the Syndicate weapons first came. In just 1 hour. I havent even try doing it afterwards. I could've close the night with enough platinum to buy Primed chamber. If i can do it, so you can. Warframe's economy is Free Market. You can get rich easily if you are not trying to sell Sicarus Barrels that is.

 

 

Newbies doesnt have to have the access to every single thing. Think about it, every now and then you hear people not having multishot mods. Hell most of them doesnt even have access to properly ranked Damage mods. They already have things that needs to be done first. 

 

Handing everything over them would be too much hand holding also it would be unfair to people who plays the events and get the mods. What would be the point of making newbies and Vets have access to everything? 

So let me get this straight.

To counter Kastorius' argument of recent events having lackluster rewards you said that they were aimed at new players and thus the rewards were OK. Then when Kastorius mentions Operation: Pheonix, a recent event with somewhat lackluster rewards you state that not everything needs to be aimed at newer players. So which one is it?

 

And BTW,nearly every piece of gear has been moaned over upon it's reintroduction.

[(PSN)KiloCrusher]

The huge quantity of best-in-slot, event-only mods is ridiculous for several reasons.

 

The first is that they aren't aesthetics, like accessories or badges; unique but very optional weapon variants; or simply nice mods to have. Most of them are ENORMOUS upgrades for quite a few mid-tier and top-tier weapons. They have a significant effect on actual gameplay, in other words.

 

Secondly, and related to the above, punishing people for not being around during an event is silly. It sends a message to newer players: "Sorry, you weren't here a year ago, so you won't have the opportunity to earn these incredibly powerful mods." In a F2P game, when we're talking about something significantly game-changing, that's a poor message to send.

 

Finally, event rewards for the five months following False Profit have been total rubbish compared to many of the event rewards in the months and years prior to that. Karak Wraith, Gorgon Wraith, Wraith Twin Vipers, all technically usable weapons but totally outclassed by cheap mid-tier stuff. Here's the part where someone will call me "entitled," as though feeling jealous about the rewards from an event you just happened to be around for isn't entitlement also. No doubt plenty of people also don't want their event mods to lose value—clearly not self-centered at all, right?

 

This situation has created a pyramid scheme of sorts. DE gives out all the great event mods and weapons in the first year and half or so of "open beta," then newer players in the years and months following have to either do without, or scramble (or pay) to get the huge amounts of platinum needed to trade for them. If this seems healthy for the game to you, you have issues.

 

How many more months will newer players need to wait for some rewards that aren't vendor trash or free potatoes? But wait, I'm forgetting about Fanged Fusillade being sold by Baro Ki'Teer. At least they can upgrade their Dreads, hey? Just keep playing, DE might dole out some more eventually... or not.

 

I couldn't say it any better myself. It's absolutely frustrating when I'm trying to get a good build for my weapons going, only to realize that I'm going to need one of the event mods that I don't have to do so. Punishing people who weren't around during a certain period of time, whether players are new to the game or were just taking a break when the event was taking place, is absolutely ridiculous.

 

If anything, event rewards should not include mods. Instead, event reward should just include weapons and badges instead of mods that won't be obtainable for many months (or unless you want to blow an absurd amount of platinum on these mods).

 

Why doesn't DE add some actual challenges to obtaining some of these crucial mods, instead of only making them obtainable through events and locking anybody who was not present during the event or who does not have a ton of platinum out of getting the mods.

[(PSN)DesecratedFlame]

No sorry, there is this thing called 75% platinum discount that you can get for free by logging on.

 

And if they would drop, who the hell would participate in the event anymore.

Consoles don't get those, and not everyone can afford platinum when they get the discount nor do they want to wait for a discount that may never come in order to buy platinum.

[rockscl]

i get a lot of 75%, and i perfectly understand why, thats all im gonna say... for now

Edited September 27, 2015 by rockscl

[Shin]

So let me get this straight.

To counter Kastorius' argument of recent events having lackluster rewards you said that they were aimed at new players and thus the rewards were OK. Then when Kastorius mentions Operation: Pheonix, a recent event with somewhat lackluster rewards you state that not everything needs to be aimed at newer players. So which one is it?

 

And BTW,nearly every piece of gear has been moaned over upon it's reintroduction.

Wasnt Phoenix Intercept the one we got the Tempo Royale? Yes that wasnt for newbies. But then again, newbies doesnt have to do every single event. There are open world events or bosses that drops important gear in other games, do you see newbies joining them? No. Just because there is an event, it doesnt mean you should join.

 

Also i carried several newbies through that Event. It was fun for me. They can play with their friends or clans or join randoms to complate that event and get the goodies.

 

No other game has this helpful interaction between players.

[crafturtoemc]

Not everyone could own a Lamborghini, right?

[Boltwin]

Most people tend to ignore that physical damage is inferior to elemental damage. 120% means S#&$ when it, first, only applies to one of the physical damage part and second, has lower damage multipliers than combined elementals, such as viral (50-75%)vs slash(25%) or puncture(50%) vs corrosive(75%). If the physical damge is only 75% of the total damage, the 120% mod turns to a 90% mod. Warframe builder only accounts for total damage and ignores weaknesses and strengths of elements. 

Edited September 27, 2015 by Boltwin

[Shin]

Most people tend to ignore that physical damage is inferior to elemental damage. 120% means S#&$ when it, first, only applies to one of the physical damage part and second, has lower damage multipliers than combined elementals, such as viral (50-75%)vs slash(25%) or puncture(50%) vs corrosive(75%). If the physical damge is only 75% of the total damage, the 120% mod turns to a 90% mod. Warframe builder only accounts for total damage and ignores weaknesses and strengths of elements.

When i say that they hang me by looking at the numbers in builder. They dont realize IPS is not that important.

[Boltwin]

There are several reasons why those event mods are so high priced (and it's surely not because of superiority over element mods):

 

Supply is  lower than the demand. That's the main reason. And demand is mostly dependent on the following people:

 

 

People that don't know the math: People don't think about how the damage in this game is actually calculated and use an heuristically approach (120% >90% = better and forget about that it only increases the damage of that particular phys. damage).

 

People that are collectors: pretty straight forward.

 

People that tend to follow other peoples or want things that other have: bandwagon-effect. Pretty much one of the reasons why Apple products are popular (even if they might be technically inferior to other products).

 

People that use event mods to flip platinum: In my opinion, one of the main reason why the price is that high. People buying event mods and sell it for a higher price.

Edited September 27, 2015 by Boltwin

[Unholyrequiem]

-snip-

Don't forget the people who release amount which determines the quantity per population which in turn contributes to low supply. 

[Boltwin]

Don't forget the people who release amount which determines the quantity per population which in turn contributes to low supply. 

Not sure what you mean, but hoarding them is a bad idea. The amount of event mods are still too high for people to manipulate prices on their own.

[Tyrian3k]

Not sure what you mean, but hoarding them is a bad idea. The amount of event mods are still too high for people to manipulate prices on their own.

He's saying that DE's the one managing the supply, therefore determining the price range of the mods indirectly.

[motorfirebox]

Most people tend to ignore that physical damage is inferior to elemental damage. 120% means S#&$ when it, first, only applies to one of the physical damage part and second, has lower damage multipliers than combined elementals, such as viral (50-75%)vs slash(25%) or puncture(50%) vs corrosive(75%). If the physical damge is only 75% of the total damage, the 120% mod turns to a 90% mod. Warframe builder only accounts for total damage and ignores weaknesses and strengths of elements. 

Well, yes, IPS mods are not the best choice on every weapon, but they are the best choice on some weapons—weapons that skew their damage very heavily towards one particular physical damage type. On Dread, for instance, slash accounts for 90% of the physical damage, meaning that Fanged Fusillade provides a total 108% damage boost. And of course, status chance for any given damage type is based on the amount of damage that type contributes to the weapon's overall damage, so putting Fanged Fusillade on Dread is a good idea if you want to make sure you get more slash procs.

[Onisa]

Wasnt Phoenix Intercept the one we got the Tempo Royale? Yes that wasnt for newbies. But then again, newbies doesnt have to do every single event. There are open world events or bosses that drops important gear in other games, do you see newbies joining them? No. Just because there is an event, it doesnt mean you should join.

 

Also i carried several newbies through that Event. It was fun for me. They can play with their friends or clans or join randoms to complate that event and get the goodies.

 

No other game has this helpful interaction between players.

Pheonix was an intercept, wasn't it. My bad, when I saw the nightmare part all I could think of was the last stage with the lvl 100+ start. What did we have that was a defense... oh, Emergency Exit. That makes more sense with it's abysmal payout on the last stage. Ironically wasn't it for the slash mods and rift sigil?

 

My first question still stands though. If the rewards are geared towards new blood why have some of the recent events been tedious at best for well equipped players?

[(XBOX)Archibald Jax]

Probably because so many veterans won't quit crying about needing a challenge.

[RealPandemonium]

My first question still stands though. If the rewards are geared towards new blood why have some of the recent events been tedious at best for well equipped players?

Which events are you referring to, specifically?

Edited September 28, 2015 by RealPandemonium

[Ninja-Kid]

thanks, and no, i didn't

 

I never said I disagreed with the customer reward program being irrelavent (in the case of player longevity mattering). I said your point could not be objective because the means of aquisition is separate from how long a player has been around. A player who is around at the time of the event and does it, regardless of how long they played, can get the event mods. Since that is the case, the reward is not connected to a player playing for a long time, it's connected to whether or not the player in question had the option to complete the event (i.e. being around at the time of the event's availability).

 

My arguement was never based on opinion of entitlement because there is an objective inequality between those who were around during the event, and those who were not. Making it by definition unfair to those who could not get it from the event, and still don't have the ability too.

 

Even if your arguement was valid, and the rewards were only givin to long time players, it is an unfair way to reward. Considering the fact that being a long time player doesn't mean you have contributed as much as a new player. Even though it is more likely for a long time player to contribute more, they are unrelated variables on a factual level. Correlation does not equal causation.

 

Saying something is objectively unfair is possible, however, saying whether it's justified is considered an opinion.

I never said whether it was justified or not, I just said it was unfair.

Yeah, you did totally miss it

 

No it is NOT unfair. Those were, by definition, event mods. So, again by definition, those who did the event, got them. Those who did not do the event, did not get them. Your argument that this is unfair rest on the presupposition that everyone should be given the opportunity to run the event (or get the rewards), even when they were not around during the event. In a way, you are right. But what you REALLY are arguing for is that those who were unable to run the event should get the rewards NOW. And that is where you are wrong.

 

DE, being the owner of this game and therefore the arbiter of what is good/bad/fair/unfair made the rules very clear.

1. Events are to be run on a limited time basis

2. Rewards are to be given upon completion of the event.

3. For those who are unable to complete the event, the rewards will be made available to the public after an unspecified period of time. <-Take note

 

So based on the rules that DE has set, and that we all abide by, what is FAIR is (somebody of authority has to define what is fair since everyone has their own definition of fair):

1. Those who completed the event will have limited-time exclusive access to the event rewards.

2. Those who did not complete the event will have an opportunity to get same rewards after an unspecified period of time.

3. DE reserves sole right to judge the length of time rewards are made exclusive.

And by virtue of economics:

4. Extremely limited supply and high demand results in high prices.

 

What you are doing is making a subjective judgement on the length of the limited time exclusive period.

[TheBrsrkr]

The creation of primed chamber is totally player controlled, a mod only hundreds have

The creation no, the PRICE, yes.

[Tyrian3k]

The creation no, the PRICE, yes.

The price is controlled by supply and demand. Period.

DE has a strong influence on both of them.

If they'd decide that Primed Chamber was suddenly as common as ammo drum it'd be just as worthless.

[TheBrsrkr]

The price is controlled by supply and demand. Period.

DE has a strong influence on both of them.

If they'd decide that Primed Chamber was suddenly as common as ammo drum it'd be just as worthless.

"Hey dude! How much are you selling that augment for?"

"50p"

"Oh, no thx man"

Hey you, other guy! What are you selling your augments for?

"20p"

"All right! I, the consumer, find this to be a reasonable enough price for the product that you earned in some way! I accept your offer!"

It's all a conspiracy, man.

[Tyrian3k]

"Hey dude! How much are you selling that augment for?"

"50p"

"Oh, no thx man"

Hey you, other guy! What are you selling your augments for?

"20p"

"All right! I, the consumer, find this to be a reasonable enough price for the product that you earned in some way! I accept your offer!"

It's all a conspiracy, man.

DE still decides in what range those mods are by setting how much effort is needed to get one.

Would these augments go for 20-50 p if they were available for 5 k standing instead of 25k? No, they'd be far cheaper than that because we'd have a far bigger supply of them.

[TheBrsrkr]

DE still decides in what range those mods are by setting how much effort is needed to get one.

Would these augments go for 20-50 p if they were available for 5 k standing instead of 25k? No, they'd be far cheaper than that because we'd have a far bigger supply of them.

Or they could still sell for 20p or whatever, because I say so, and it's my product, and if you don't like it try someone else. That's how the system works. Blaming DE because there are greedy people isn't helping anything.

"But 100 Primed Chambers exist, prices are outrageous!"

That outrageous price was decided on by the 100 people who fought or cheesed their way to the top 100 way back when. They earned it. You didn't. It's going to cost you. Why should DE re-release the mods specifically so you don't have to buy a mod that you want but absolutely don't need? If you want an overrated 120% slash mod or something, be prepared to buy it off those that EARNED it, and leave your tinfoil at home.

[Tyrian3k]

Or they could still sell for 20p or whatever, because I say so, and it's my product, and if you don't like it try someone else. That's how the system works. Blaming DE because there are greedy people isn't helping anything.

"But 100 Primed Chambers exist, prices are outrageous!"

That outrageous price was decided on by the 100 people who fought or cheesed their way to the top 100 way back when. They earned it. You didn't. It's going to cost you. Why should DE re-release the mods specifically so you don't have to buy a mod that you want but absolutely don't need? If you want an overrated 120% slash mod or something, be prepared to buy it off those that EARNED it, and leave your tinfoil at home.

So do tell my why the average price for a maxed Heavy Caliber is higher than that of a maxed Serration.