Do You Ever Avoid Playing Certain Frames Because Of Others' Expectations?

[Syln]

I've got a music for this kind of people ! :

 

[Hallucinated]

Huh. I didn't really expect to get any responses. I actually wrote a longer and less angry post to begin with but then I hit backspace and the forum ate it, so what's up there is angrier than I intended. While I feel that some of the dissenters didn't actually read my original post in its entirety I think they still have some points that I should address.

 

Well you know, there is this one phrase

git gud

 

Yeh yeh I know, I know you want to be creative with your builds. Yeh I know you want that special snowflake feeling where you are different from almost everyone else except special snowflake people.

 

I'm fine with people bringing in their own build in a pub game, sure, no prob m8y.

 

But in a designed squad, for example we are doing a T4 Defense and we want to do it the safest way possible, come on man, don't be that one guy who has their feeling hurt cuz "muh build".

 

I know mods are hard to max out, sure, but they do function pretty well after rank 6, which is easy to reach. It's like 20 rare cores or something, try Cassini, Saturn. Bring a decent weapon and wolla, raining rare core.

 

All in all, I might sound mean but to be honest, people in this thread are meaner to min-max players like me. You are like the guy in League or DotA who buys 2 boots cuz "they have 2 feet".

 

And don't tell me to quit the session. If I could keep my drops I aleady have.

 

Lolololol.

 

"Special snowflake."

 

It's right there in the OP that if you ask, I'll either do it or just not join. I'm a big boy and I know what I'm doing.

 

Insofar as you feel persecuted as a minmaxer by all the scrubs like me, for better or worse, the vast, vast majority of content in this game is easy enough for anybody with the basic mods without actually minmaxing their build. Therefore, if you want to spend an hour pushing past that into the really hard stuff that requires your special team composition, the onus is on you to inform prospective teammates of this, and if you only start speaking up after you've already started, you've got nobody to blame but yourself, so don't take it out on your erstwhile teammates.

 

For example, I love going long on Triton, but if somebody wants to leave after 12 or so digs, I'm not going to *@##$ them out about it.

 

As far as farming R5s goes, it turns out I do have 800 of them, but there are so many other R10 mods (Kubrows, Archwing, Primed etc) that corrupted mods that require me to forma my frame enough to lock it out of other builds just to slot just aren't a priority.

 

Incidentally, isn't Cassini categorised as a low tier mission? Do R5 packs even drop there?

 

That final part of your sentence is a nice little bit of detail though, and something that is a little overlooked in this thread. I have seen MR1's with MK-1Braton going into draco long runs, boasting a cute little 200/200 shield/health total and then they wonder why they get flak... That is the other side of this argument, there are a good number of leechers around too that have no clue as to why certain requirements exist. Those guys often end up bleeding to death numerous times, at which point the entire group stops bothering with revives.

 

The funny thing about this is that I don't actually mind carrying a few n00bs. I remember when I was one and I know that getting onto the first rung of the progression ladder is actually pretty hard in Warframe, so if it's their first T3 or something and they're still stuck with those S#&$ty Mk-1 weapons I'm happy to let them get their feet wet. Too many people worry about leeching in this game when in reality it's easy enough for a veteran player to faceroll everything up to 40 minutes in a T4S that carrying people really isn't a problem. If anything I worry they're not actually learning anything because I'm doing it all.

 

Look man, I understand where you're coming from. You wanna enjoy the game the way you'd like, the game gives you dozens of warframe options, you shouldn't have to have your own fun taken away just to appease random players.

 

But consider the reverse. Your team composition has room for a specific frame to complement your current setup. Maybe you need a Frost for Defense, maybe a Trinny with a vampire build would help you most, whatever, the point is, there's a gap that a specific warframe can cover.

 

So when someone in a team full of killer/support frames asks for a Frost for a defense mission, you agree to join with a Frost, and insist on taking, I dunno, Ember instead once you join, no one's going to suddenly open their eyes and realize that Ember's the perfect Defense frame, everyone else will just be frustrated that their safe strategy won't work because you feel the selfish need to prove something. Ember can't contribute to their particular team dynamic the way Frost can.

 

It gets old. It really does. Host the keys yourself if you want to have total frame freedom, but for god's sake, -some- people ask for specific frames for a reason. You don't need to prove anything. Don't be that guy.

 

All you guys telling me to shut up and put up when asked for something are entirely missing the point.

 

This isn't about being a 'special snowflake'; this isn't about not doing what you're asked for. This is about expectations, reasonableness and most of all manners.

 

Most people are reasonable creatures that understand that if you ask for something you can reasonably expect to get it. I know there's a minority of trolls or desperate n00bs who try to lie their way into a squad for the reward, but on the whole, when you ask for Frost or Trinity or whatever, you'll get it. You might not get exactly the build you want, but barring very extreme circumstances, they'll still do the job as long as the player knows what they're doing. Scrubs, minmaxers, casuals, hardcores, whatever, I think we can agree on that.

 

Demanding a very specific build that requires lots of investment (urgh, formaing Trinity to fit in two R10 V polarity mods, kill me now) is sort of at the bounds of reasonableness: you can ask for it, but you shouldn't be surprised if it's hard to find a player that has it, and maybe you should give a chance to those players who don't have the specifics but think they can fill the role, because chances are, they can. This game really isn't that hard, and if you're trying to push the bounds of what's possible where you actually do need it, I really don't think a pickup group is the best place to try.

 

Expecting these niche builds or playstyles without telling the other players and then complaining after the fact in mission is beyond the bounds of reasonableness. End of story. If you do this, you're an A******.

 

And that, really, is what my frustration is about. So I suppose the moral of the story is: don't be an A******. Funny how that's the moral of most things in life. Funny how few people actually pay attention to it.

[The-Little-Fox]

Gah! I wanted to reply using my computer but i couldn't seem to get the reply option to cooperate. So I'm just going to reply via my phone and hope Autocorrect doesn't get the better of me.

Now back to the topic, I don't normally play Public Games unless I'm really really really in the mood for it, or if I'm participating in an event that I know for a fact I can't solo. In those cases I just played whatever Frames I liked and didn't have a care in the world about what those in my squad said about my Frame choices. Course those times I normally played Nyx or Saryn, so there probably wasn't much to say at those times.

Being the lazy butt I am. I finally got around to obtaining and maxing out a Limbo, and I figured out that I really enjoy playing as him. Now, like I mentioned above, I really have to be in the mood if I want to run in public games. So I'm playing as him either Solo or with my personal friends.

However there is just one er.....aquantence that I can't bring myself to play Limbo around. Anytime I mention in our group Steam Phone calls (there will be like 4 of us in these group chats) a tweak or change to my build, or anything really that just pertains to my Limbo or how I've modded or play him, he's always got to get really fussy about it. About how I'm somehow playing him wrong, when in all honesty, save for the augment mod for Cataclysm, I've modded my Limbo *exactly* like his, and play my Limbo *exactly* like he plays his so what is there to be wrong about???? Maybe it's my more liberal use of Rift Walk???? Is it the lack of Forma???? Or is it because he's no longer the only one in our little clan that has Limbo???

My buddy and I haven't figured it out yet and probably won't. All that we know is the instant I equip mine, he gets real huffy about it. Recently we've sort of been avoiding this dude in our games though so it isn't all bad.

[tinyranitar]

Huh. I didn't really expect to get any responses. I actually wrote a longer and less angry post to begin with but then I hit backspace and the forum ate it, so what's up there is angrier than I intended. While I feel that some of the dissenters didn't actually read my original post in its entirety I think they still have some points that I should address.

 

 

Lolololol.

 

"Special snowflake."

 

It's right there in the OP that if you ask, I'll either do it or just not join. I'm a big boy and I know what I'm doing.

 

Insofar as you feel persecuted as a minmaxer by all the scrubs like me, for better or worse, the vast, vast majority of content in this game is easy enough for anybody with the basic mods without actually minmaxing their build. Therefore, if you want to spend an hour pushing past that into the really hard stuff that requires your special team composition, the onus is on you to inform prospective teammates of this, and if you only start speaking up after you've already started, you've got nobody to blame but yourself, so don't take it out on your erstwhile teammates.

 

For example, I love going long on Triton, but if somebody wants to leave after 12 or so digs, I'm not going to *@##$ them out about it.

 

As far as farming R5s goes, it turns out I do have 800 of them, but there are so many other R10 mods (Kubrows, Archwing, Primed etc) that corrupted mods that require me to forma my frame enough to lock it out of other builds just to slot just aren't a priority.

 

Incidentally, isn't Cassini categorised as a low tier mission? Do R5 packs even drop there?

 

 

The funny thing about this is that I don't actually mind carrying a few n00bs. I remember when I was one and I know that getting onto the first rung of the progression ladder is actually pretty hard in Warframe, so if it's their first T3 or something and they're still stuck with those S#&$ty Mk-1 weapons I'm happy to let them get their feet wet. Too many people worry about leeching in this game when in reality it's easy enough for a veteran player to faceroll everything up to 40 minutes in a T4S that carrying people really isn't a problem. If anything I worry they're not actually learning anything because I'm doing it all.

 

 

All you guys telling me to shut up and put up when asked for something are entirely missing the point.

 

This isn't about being a 'special snowflake'; this isn't about not doing what you're asked for. This is about expectations, reasonableness and most of all manners.

 

Most people are reasonable creatures that understand that if you ask for something you can reasonably expect to get it. I know there's a minority of trolls or desperate n00bs who try to lie their way into a squad for the reward, but on the whole, when you ask for Frost or Trinity or whatever, you'll get it. You might not get exactly the build you want, but barring very extreme circumstances, they'll still do the job as long as the player knows what they're doing. Scrubs, minmaxers, casuals, hardcores, whatever, I think we can agree on that.

 

Demanding a very specific build that requires lots of investment (urgh, formaing Trinity to fit in two R10 V polarity mods, kill me now) is sort of at the bounds of reasonableness: you can ask for it, but you shouldn't be surprised if it's hard to find a player that has it, and maybe you should give a chance to those players who don't have the specifics but think they can fill the role, because chances are, they can. This game really isn't that hard, and if you're trying to push the bounds of what's possible where you actually do need it, I really don't think a pickup group is the best place to try.

 

Expecting these niche builds or playstyles without telling the other players and then complaining after the fact in mission is beyond the bounds of reasonableness. End of story. If you do this, you're an A******.

 

And that, really, is what my frustration is about. So I suppose the moral of the story is: don't be an A******. Funny how that's the moral of most things in life. Funny how few people actually pay attention to it.

Uhm...

 

You are playing with Public Matchmaking.

So why are you complaining about your team mates?

[NoeleVeerod]

Why should others tell me what or how should I play? Others' expectations will not make me change my builds.

If anybody is really bothered because I'm using a certain frame with a certain tactic, it is not my concern, nor do I care about it. As far as I know this is nothing that can be categorised as offensive.

Edited September 22, 2015 by -Vin-

[stoybot]

No, I play whatever I want and have rarely received any complaints. If I'm contributing to the squad dynamic, people don't seem to care much about the loadout I run. If someone behaves poorly, I just use the ignore function. Now that I think about it, I've ignored far more snowflakes that endlessly complain about meta builds and loadouts... There's also one benefit that comes with a high mastery rank - lower MR players generally feel reluctant to complain and most high MR players understand that you've reached a point where you need variety and lots of experimenting to remain engaged.

[Syln]

No, I play whatever I want and have rarely received any complaints. If I'm contributing to the squad dynamic, people don't seem to care much about the loadout I run. If someone behaves poorly, I just use the ignore function. Now that I think about it, I've ignored far more snowflakes that endlessly complain about meta builds and loadouts... There's also one benefit that comes with a high mastery rank - lower MR players generally feel reluctant to complain and most high MR players understand that you've reached a point where you need variety and lots of experimenting to remain engaged.

I did notice that ^ (about the mr) so much feelings of insecurity with some lad ;D

[Kaotyke]

There are those in the forums that say they hear Oberon is bad on missions, I dont know where they heard that. But I'm sure many squad-mates were thankful I was there when their almost empty health suddenly jumped 300 points and started to regen.

[Tatersail]

This is a Team game and there is reliance on other frames for synergy.

 

Communication is the key

While not always possible in PUGs and auto-grouping.... I almost think an option to swap frame/setup at the start of autogroups should be added, all those joyous 4x nova partys....

 

 

eg

 

Generally if I see a trinity in party I will swap to a frame setup with heavy energy consumption, and my entire setup and gameplay is reliant on that trinity to feed energy.  If that trinity communicates that they will not be using EV I can swap to a less energy reliant build.

 

If I see a Banshee in party I will assume that Sonar and even Resonance will be used to buff the groups damage to insane amounts, and will pick frames and weapons to complement this, Again if the Banshee Communicates that they are going to be using silence and knockdowns all Game I can shift frame.

 

If I see a Vauban in party I will assume he will Control the map, and I may consider Torid, and removing my defensive mods Again, if the vauban Communicates that he is a Tesla and bounce spammer .....  More defense mods!

 

 

Sadly there are "most effective builds" so in a long mission, I hope my team can be effective.

Playing with a frame that has no synergy can be fun, but it can also be very frustrating as your entire build can be rendered pointless by another player.

Communicate to remove other players expectations!

Edited September 22, 2015 by Tatersail

[Omnimorph]

Slova on a derelict defense works out rather well if the team is patient, keeps the pressure off for long runs. I've done it a few times myself, I just didn't relentlessly spam Molecular Prime.

 

The trick to Slova on ODS is not to max duration - just have a slighty-bigger-than-room-sized (about 150-170%) MP that's constantly spammable (high eff).  That way you're not slowing enemies that are spawning half way across the entire map from coming at you, they're only being slowed and weakened in the room where the team is.

 

The only time you really want to max duration on a Slova is on high level static Void defences.  In that situation you really want to be slowing down even the mobs that you can't see in the other rooms, so the total rate of incoming mobs is at a manageable rate when they really start swarming.  Even then, it's still wise to sacrifice a little bit of the potential max duration for high eff.  220%-ish duration is quite sufficient to cover the entire Void Defence map.

[(XBOX)Archibald Jax]

Only max duration Nova build I have is my glass cannon I ran to test an interception core farm for someone else. Most boring interception of my life, and I generally find them dull to start with.

[(XBOX)lolyman21]

I usually run on my choice of frames but if people ask nicely to bring a frame that is needed ( like vauban and loki for defence) then i do that because they are sincere about it and they need help. And not some jacka** typing in all CAPS TO BRING A SPECIFIC BUILD AND FRAME AND GETTING MAD THAT HE DID NOT GET A DROP HE WANTED.

 

Also a lot swearing about just one game.

Edited September 22, 2015 by (XB1)lolyman21

[(XBOX)lolyman21]

There are those in the forums that say they hear Oberon is bad on missions, I dont know where they heard that. But I'm sure many squad-mates were thankful I was there when their almost empty health suddenly jumped 300 points and started to regen.

Same situation in a raid that i did (one person was like "you sure oberon is ideal?") but in "when poop hits the fan" situations we were thankful for health boost and regen.

[(PSN)skydrive]

I haven't read through all of the posts, but it is rare for me to come across those issues that you have. To me, there are only 2 spots that should normally be requested, one of those is the optional Nova if the goal is to have a speed run in Defence. The other slot can in some cases become two instead of just one, but is basically a request for a frame to be there to defend the target, such as Frost (extending the range isn't really to keep the Globe from being destroyed, but to mitigate the damage inflicted by the explosive damage of the Bombards), Zephyr (I see no reason why not if built right), Limbo with a Volt or possibly just a Volt, and Vauban (usually best when the enemy is Infested). Players may also be wanting to try for a synergy setup such as the Banshee/Equinox, the Limbo/Volt, etc.

 

I feel like the only reason people think Oberon is bad is because they compare him to Trinity, which to be fair, when it comes to healing abilities it is like comparing the majority of guns to a Boltor Prime... 90% of the time the Boltor Prime will win. You just don't compare these things, but instead look at what it CAN do. Oberon can do Crowd control en masse and heal, seems good to me.

[(XBOX)Ghostayamu]

I play in with randoms often, and never have this problem. It's because when we're in the game, I'm not going to speak to you. You're not my friend, you're just a random in a game, and when this game is over, I'll never see you again.

So the solution is to simply not speak with randoms. Why would you even? Unless you're trying to make friends, then that's understandable.

[TheBrsrkr]

People don't expect much from Rhino or Chroma. But when I play Frost, I see where you're coming from. Excuse me for not babysitting the pod while I was too busy holding back the entire left side on my own while you try for another million Alloy Plate. I simply couldn't care less of what you want me to macro. Asking me to Roar or pop Effigy once in a while is all well and good, but I'm not your bot.

[-Vane-]

I'm getting alot of hate for using a hipster Vauban, built not for powers but for survivabilty, i simply like how he looks.

[YasaiTsume]

 

 

All in all, I might sound mean but to be honest, people in this thread are meaner to min-max players like me. You are like the guy in League or DotA who buys 2 boots cuz "they have 2 feet".

 

 

Mana Boots and Tp Boots best combo 10/10

[SolarDwagon]

Honestly, I haven't read EVERY post in here but I'm sensing some common themes. My replies;

First, if you build your frame around relying on certain parameters, DO NOT PLAY PUGS. If you do and get caught out, it's your own damn fault. Don't complain that the Trinity is the wrong build because you ASSUMED they had a certain build.

Second, never criticise key owners. Just don't. You're an A******.

 

Third, and I've been caught out with this lately, just because the meta frame and build for a role is one thing does not mean that there are not other ways of filling that role. Some of these may actually be better than the meta build, they're just not braindead.

 

Fourth, if you're not organising your squad at the beginning of a match, people can bring whatever they please. If they ask for your advice, then you can comment that other frames might be more suitable. Otherwise, shut your damn mouth.

 

 

Also, I don't know if it's been commented on, but pure desecrate-bot Nekros is actually a terrible waste of a frame now. Shield of Shadows/Despoil with appropriate modding is a far, far superior team member while still generating barely less loot (or in fact more because they're actually killing enemies)

Edited September 22, 2015 by SolarDwagon

[NoeleVeerod]

Communicate to remove other players expectations!

 

This is quality posting. But who ever communicates in PUGs anymore :(

[Greatheart]

I rarely play pure DPS frames because it always degenerates into a pi$$ing contest. I drop an AoE in one area so then the other player will run through it to beat me to the kills even though there's like 8 other directions to kill mobs. It doesn't even matter for gods sake, if he gets every single kill and I get none we both get the exact same affinity (xp) if we're close enough. Some people just like stroking their ego's an e-peens more than actually working as a team.

 

 

Wiki Source: (http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Affinity)

"Be near an allied Tenno when they kill an enemy. When within 50 meters of an ally when they kill an enemy, you gain the same total Affinity, split according to your own weaponry. This doesn't reduce the Affinity gained by the killing player, and doesn't reduce the Affinity gained by other nearby allies. This does not apply to Archwing and the Interception mode; they have much larger ranges for shared affinity."

[Attel_Malagate]

I got trolled until mission failure during the gorgon wraith alert because i didn't bring an EV trinity but a blessing trinity, (considering the no shield mode, it was a justified choice, i  was paying in pubs and i didn't knew what warframes would be my allys) and so the nova en the mesa i came acroos got angry and started afking so i was the only 1 defending ....)

[Findley563]

This is absolutely an issue, unfortunately other than telling these people off or not playing there really isn't much that can be done. I have had the same issues with people not wanting to run with X frame because of X reason. Nothing makes me laugh harder then for that to be said then I slaughter everything and they whine because they have nothing to kill. 

I play in the pub games because I don't always like to play alone. I use the weapons and frames that I want to use, when I want to use them. There is always going to be a jerky player, the key is to know how to deal with them. Normally, just ignoring them works. I personally like to prove them wrong. But these are the same people that not only insist that you have a specific weapon or frame, but will go into farming runs (which need specific frames to be an optimal farm) and use whatever they want at the detriment of the run. 

 

Edit: Also, the ignore button works for me as well. You an only be a #$&(% once that way.

Edited September 22, 2015 by Findley563

[8gbMoreRAM]

Just bring whatever you want.

As long as you can hold your own, I don't care.

[8gbMoreRAM]

I got trolled until mission failure during the gorgon wraith alert because i didn't bring an EV trinity but a blessing trinity, (considering the no shield mode, it was a justified choice, i was paying in pubs and i didn't knew what warframes would be my allys) and so the nova en the mesa i came acroos got angry and started afking so i was the only 1 defending ....)

Did you at least get the Gorgon?