Mastery Fodder. Enough?

[JohnKable]

Title. Definition of mastery fodder: weapon, warframe, companion or else worth leveling it only for the MR points. Maybe somehow viable engame, but still clearly underperforming compared to other weapons.

 

I am now MR15, used many weps and frames without actually keeping an eye on the Mastery Rank. Atleast since i got MR8 that not-so-long ago was giving access to any content of the game.

Was browsing my inventory today and wandering why so many of my weapons were lying there totally not worth any love (and formas with it)

 

As now, you can get to MR12 (more or less) by building and leveling ONLY mastery fodder weapons, whitout leveling ANY actually good stuff.

isnt this enough?

i mean, there's actually plenty of mastery fodders now, why DE keeps releasing stuff like that? The latest twin basolk fits the definition, but we got many others lately.

its easy to make a viable and forma worth gun: have its DPS range between 15k and 30k fully modded, giving it unique strenghts and weakpoints. And eventually considering build divercity in the process (that makes me think at the opticor that has high innate damage but basically REQUIRES fire rate mods to make up for the brutally long charge time)

seriously, its simple math.

i can understand they have to think twice when talking to rebalance all previous content but looks pretty easy to be to release already balanced new content.

Not saying every Gun must be a boltor prime (not even considering it the best weapon in game, but many do) but at least any NEW addition to the game should be worth catalyst and formas if you like its style.

 

what do you think about it?

[Rorgal_Sina]

I never liked the idea of Mastery Fodding, as I believe every weapon should have a use in and perhaps beyond their respective tiers.

[ValkyrWF]

My goal is try something new every day.  Mastery fodder is the new thing I try.  To be honest, not all of them are great, but they can be fun to use.  The Ogris is an example, it isn't as great as the Tonkor in terms of crit damage and is lethal to you if used improperly, but its the only rocket launcher in-game currently and frankly I love using it.

[BeastlyHusla]

All weapons have some use after 5 formas. Remember the max MR on this game will be 30. There will be weapons that outclass the current meta.

[evil_m3nace]

All weapons have some use after 5 formas. Remember the max MR on this game will be 30. There will be weapons that outclass the current meta.

nope, there is a secret room in the simirus area with even more MR ranks.

[(PSN)Ozymandias-13-]

My goal is try something new every day.  Mastery fodder is the new thing I try.  To be honest, not all of them are great, but they can be fun to use.  The Ogris is an example, it isn't as great as the Tonkor in terms of crit damage and is lethal to you if used improperly, but its the only rocket launcher in-game currently and frankly I love using it.

I love Ogris...but honestly I only ever used it in ODD....and that was before I got Synoid Simulor.

[JohnKable]

My goal is try something new every day.  Mastery fodder is the new thing I try.  To be honest, not all of them are great, but they can be fun to use.  The Ogris is an example, it isn't as great as the Tonkor in terms of crit damage and is lethal to you if used improperly, but its the only rocket launcher in-game currently and frankly I love using it.

 

Well ogris doesnt fit the "mastery fodder" definition to me. its a totally viable weapon with good damage even if has big downsides.

I understand that the comparison to tonkor is easy and ogris comes out totally wrecked, but its still a decent weapon viable for most engame content.

[Vandole]

We need fodder till MR 30. 

[BeastlyHusla]

nope, there is a secret room in the simirus area with even more MR ranks.

I'd say, show me proof

[--Nef-Anyo--]

Thats why alot of players come and go with WF. Release lots of useless content, most build it and lvl it up to rank 30 and either bin or let it rot in the inventory. Now if DE actually sat down and started to implement some new fresh ideas rather than spend endless time adding more worthless weapons then their player base would most likely grow and keep it sustained for longer periods of time. 

 

Some of the ideas I say may or not have been mentioned or DE may be working on them. Just jotting them down quickly. 

 

Different mission types within a quest. EG, defend against a hoard of enemies then hack a computer and mission changes to a survival type mission. 

 

Dojo is actually the clans mother ship, lisets are dockable and should be used in other space missions. Tenno landings in between missions, space flight would add something different. 

 

We have pvp, (currently on hiatus) dark sector but why not have it for pve? For example you literally park your dojo/mother ship so to speak in one of the faction territories. The longer you stay the bigger the attacks your dojo/mothership.  You could get specialist equipment from say the syndicates  that could help you out in these conflicts. This could add more purpose to synidicates rather than what is currently offered. Longer the loyalty with them the more special items you could have access. This would engage the clan members more to play and actually use it more than just trade post and labs for research. The more time you spend the more influence you have in the area not to mention this would be a great way of gaining valuable resources to clan and its members. 

 

Why not add new rooms/research areas to a clan dojo? Eg advanced genetic labs, build and grow different kubrows/kavats or what ever and can have them specialise in different things rather them having all the same stats. Why not have the animals you breed etc be the guardians on the dojo when you are unable to play? They can help towards defending against the incursions from grinner, corpus etc. 

 

Why not have stackable rewards for true endless missions? 

 

Why dont DE give out different rewards for weekly leaderboards? Eg get 100 gold cores for highest amount of cryotic for the week?

 

The list is really endless. 

 

Just my quick thoughts on matter. 

[evil_m3nace]

I'd say, show me proof

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/519600-top-secret-mastery-rank-room/

 

here you go

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKiDpZt9_JQ

Edited October 26, 2015 by evil_m3nace

[JohnKable]

We need fodder till MR 30.

We need enough things to reach mr30, sure, but why so many have to be mastery fodder only and not viable weapons ?

Thats my point

[(PSN)Kosis181]

One of the problems is that they've locked themselves in to the MR system, and scaled it to max at 30. The way MR EXP requirements grow, they need a lot of fodder to be able to get there. Think about it, two years in and we just recently hit MR 20-21.

Another problem with the MR is that they don't use it enough. Boltor prime may not be the best weapon in the game, but it is certainly way the heck up there. Aside from the new syndicate weapons, not much is really in the same league. Boltor P is available MR 6, was it? Tonkor is MR 5, and the new syndicates MR 12. I just stayed at Mr 11 for six months, back in the day, because I didn't see a point. I had gone from weapon to weapon, picking weapons that looked good, and all i was left with was more or less trash in comparison. You can go from MR to MR pretty much using warframes, pets and the MR locked equips. I mean, why use anything but the best DE will let you, right? Stretching them out over the MR isn't a solution either, but you end up peaking early under the current set up, and then it's all down hill.

Speaking of down hill, that's the real reason we're complaining, isn't it? A lot of us have been around long enough to hit the top of the power curve, and we're standing on top of the world. Not every new weapon can lead us higher as that just causes power creep, but not everyone immediately recognises that.

There have to be handholds to help us climb up here, but being at the top, we kind of lose perspective. Still, the current system makes MR something of a joke. To extend the analogy: there are a lot of places to get a grip in our climb, but they are just that, part of the terrain, and we leave them behind, rather than part of the climbing gear we take with us. That's not necessarily a bad thing, but there are so darned many of them that you can't get to them all before getting and mastering all the best gear, and once you are at the top, why go back down? For an extra trade per day? Bragging rights? Extra loadouts? Once you have three extractors and enough trades to make you comfortable, there really isn't much point, is there?

Like I said, I sat at MR 11 or so for quite a while because I didn't really care about it. Eventually I got off my duff and plowed through to MR 18 in a single afternoon. I noticed no difference in QoL.

[Lightsmith]

MR Fodder are just weapons and frames that don't fit with your preference

[UrielColtan]

All weapons have some use after 5 formas. Remember the max MR on this game will be 30. There will be weapons that outclass the current meta.

 

Never stated, and they are not going to commit to a Mastery rank cap that close to boot. DE releases new stuff to keep interest in the game and people spending money on it, not merely to reach a set mastery cap they have in mind. Some things are more rushed than others in order to pad out till they can release more content, but the main goal is to keep our attention and spending that money on plat for new stuff, no matter how minute, be it for slots, rushing, or buying the items or Prime Acess outright. People like you were saying the same thing about level 20 being the max before Mastery 20 was a thing. Stop confusing people with these statements.

Edited October 26, 2015 by UrielColtan

[(XBOX)MAXsandwich]

We need fodder till MR 30. 

Your saying we need enough garbage content to reach a meaningless number?

Yeah.. we totally need that.. cant wait.

 

[evil_m3nace]

MR Fodder are just weapons and frames that don't fit with your preference

Not really, there are weapons that are clearly not doing enough damage in the game. Sure, you can stick 6 formas on it like I did with the braton, but it will never deal as much damage as the braton prime. however the braton is a early game weapon, so arguably it does not need to deal as much damage as, say, the braton prime. But then you run into ''ok so all these weapons dont deal enough damage, are these are starter weapons?'' Many of these weapons are also clantech weapons.

Edited October 26, 2015 by evil_m3nace

[ValkyrWF]

Well ogris doesnt fit the "mastery fodder" definition to me. its a totally viable weapon with good damage even if has big downsides.

I understand that the comparison to tonkor is easy and ogris comes out totally wrecked, but its still a decent weapon viable for most engame content.

I tried other weapons such as the Kraken, or Magnus.  Ok, the Magnus is just bad.  The Kraken beats the Sicarus and Sicarus Prime.  I found a secondary that I find fun to use.  Partially because of those FRIKKIN LEVEL 30 SEEKERS THAT ONE HIT KILL YOU.

[undernown]

You do realise a MASSIVE redesign of all the mods is in the works right now?

Just think how much more viable other weapond could be once you have 1 to 2 more mod slots open for utility?

I agree that some weapons need a buff, but i have quite a variety of weapons which all see action in high lvl content on a regular basis.

I see a lot of people claiming that 9/10 weapons are mastery fodder. But in my experience its 50% at the very most.

I think the problem lies more with the "I wanna be have the very best" mentality that these complainers often have.

[Hypernaut1]

Not really, there are weapons that are clearly not doing enough damage in the game. Sure, you can stick 6 formas on it like I did with the braton, but it will never deal as much damage as the braton prime. however the braton is a early game weapon, so arguably it does not need to deal as much damage as, say, the braton prime. But then you run into ''ok so all these weapons dont deal enough damage, are these are starter weapons?'' Many of these weapons are also clantech weapons.

Not everyone uses a weapon only for max damage numbers.

I used and enjoyed the ignis before the buff. I use and enjoy weapons for its playstyle and variety, not because its the most powerful weapon in my inventory.

[JohnKable]

You do realise a MASSIVE redesign of all the mods is in the works right now?

Just think how much more viable other weapond could be once you have 1 to 2 more mod slots open for utility?

I agree that some weapons need a buff, but i have quite a variety of weapons which all see action in high lvl content on a regular basis.

I see a lot of people claiming that 9/10 weapons are mastery fodder. But in my experience its 50% at the very most.

I think the problem lies more with the "I wanna be have the very best" mentality that these complainers often have.

If i had to make a guess id say 60% atleast are mastery fodders.

No complainer here, just i would like to enjoy better more weapons as i do with an already good plethora of choice.

My point is that we just dont need more MR fodders, i would seriously like to see new weapons balanced on pre-existing content and ready to enjoy, not just build-level-delete stuff.

And its happening pretty often imho.

And every time we lose a chance to increase our collection and variety of viable weapons.

Lets see with the so called massive redesign, but still thats not my point.

[Osharchi]

One benefit that mastery fodder provides is that it incentivizes you to try different things.  Otherwise most people would just stick with one loadout the whole game.  And even worse, they might continue to invest in a bad loadout they've already previously invested in, rather than start from scratch with something new/different.

 

Personally, I'm glad I tried at least 1 weapon of all the melee types.  I thought I would love the hammer weapon-type, but they are just too slow.  And I thought I'd be "meh" about the sparring weapon-type, but they are awesome!

 

But yeah, after MR12 (unlocks syndicate primaries) there really is no reason to want to go beyond that, other than the "100 percenters" who like to absolutely complete everything in a game.  Nothing wrong with either path.

[Nihillian]

I feel weapon should have their use beyond mastery fodder and early level gear. 

 

The newest addition is just a waste of a good looking weapon. It's heat based, which isn't bad at all IMO, deals average damage and has terrible stats except for Status. Now, a average damage status weapon isn't bad if it is paired with fast attack speed, which it doesn't.

 

Ok, no problem, pair it with crit? Nope, 5%, no chance in hell. 

 

I know that this sounds power creep but take a look at it in another perspective: Zoren AND atomos as requirements? Should have been an amazing weapon. A high crit weapon paired with a high AoE utility weapon should create something great, instead it didn't.

 

If the weapon had the effect of the Atomos when you hit an enemy, that could have been the game changer for the weapon itself easily.

[BeastlyHusla]

Never stated, and they are not going to commit to a Mastery rank cap that close to boot.

 

DE releases new stuff to keep interest in the game and people spending money on it, not merely to reach a set mastery cap they have in mind.

 

Some things are more rushed than others in order to pad out till they can release more content, but the main goal is to keep our attention and spending that money on plat for new stuff, no matter how minute, be it for slots, rushing, or buying the items or Prime Acess outright.

 

People like you were saying the same thing about level 20 being the max before Mastery 20 was a thing. Stop confusing people with these statements.

Obviously they will have a mastery cap. How long do you think they can keep one game up for?

 

They are going to change how mastery works, so more weapons are behind mastery locks.

 

Not sure what you're talking about here..

 

I never said, MR20 was going to be last. Who are these people? Confusing who? Seems like you've confused yourself than anything else.

 

 

https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/519600-top-secret-mastery-rank-room/

 

here you go

 

 I feel as if this is just a troll attempt by DE.

Edited October 26, 2015 by BeastlyHusla

[evil_m3nace]

Not everyone uses a weapon only for max damage numbers.

I used and enjoyed the ignis before the buff. I use and enjoy weapons for its playstyle and variety, not because its the most powerful weapon in my inventory.

we arent asking for max damage guns, just asking to give a buff to weapons that arent quite up there with the others.