Should the Rotation C be reduced to 15th Minutes and Waves

[AuroraSonicBoom]

3 minutes ago, Niliam said:

What?

They're fixing your problem by making sure you keep your rewards on D/Cs. Fixing it again by changing reward tables is unnecessary.

[Niliam]

29 minutes ago, AuroraSonicBoom said:

They're fixing your problem by making sure you keep your rewards on D/Cs. Fixing it again by changing reward tables is unnecessary.

They can take years to implement a system that recognise genuine mission fail and fake mission fail.

Change AABC to ABC can be done in a quick fix patch.  

[Specific.Zod]

what this? from connection issue (which happen for everyone outside void) change into drop fixing? is OP's connection only a fake one? and op's real intention is asking for drop fix? I see no relation over connection issue and drop table.
simple fix:

- Host yourself.

- Ensure everyone has good connection.

- Ask for a dedicated server (Soon^TM)

[AuroraSonicBoom]

1 hour ago, Niliam said:

They can take years to implement a system that recognise genuine mission fail and fake mission fail.

Change AABC to ABC can be done in a quick fix patch.  

 

No, it's not a quick patch because the consequences of changing drop tables ad hoc like that take careful consideration. They're working on a fix, no change to drop tables necessary.

[xethier]

2 hours ago, Niliam said:

There is certainly not a problem for a player or a group of player to challenge themselves to a 20+ run.

But these challenge should not be force to ALL other player, and suffer the wraith of fake mission fail and fake disconnect.

 

For all you want, no one is stop them from challenging themselves to a long run.

If you're there for the challenge of it, why care about the drop rotations?

Currently, most folks run to 20 minutes and quit. Mainly because after that you're risking your host or isp hiccup leading to mission failure and loss of key and rewards. (which is the issue you're upset about, afaict)

Changing the rotations after each 20 minute set to incrementally weight the drops to the "better" slot would actually give players who are after the rewards a reason to stay beyond trying to "save" a key or two.

I have hundreds of keys. Survival more than most. (i have 40+ of each tier of survival keys) So why bother staying past 20 minutes? There's no real tangible gain unless I'm there for the aformentioned "challenge" in which case I'm not there for the rewards.

[CY13ERPUNK]

On 2/23/2016 at 4:55 AM, CY13ERPUNK said:

gonna quote myself here :

ive said it before and ill say it again, tho im pretty sure at this point it only falls on deaf ears

new reward table : ABCD

A - the cheap stuff : creds, cores, resources, etc, maybe a rare chance at a good unc/rare mod or a forma bp

B - the 'common' prime/whatevs parts, packs of cores, forma bp, could also have better chances for ultra rare mods like stances or whatevs

C - the 'uncommon' parts, better chance for common parts, ultra rare chance for 'rare' parts, small chances for forma or core packs

D - 'rare' parts, better chance for 'uncommon' parts, better chance for 'common' parts, also possibly ultra rare chances for super-rare mods like past event mods and the like {talking like <1% chances tho, basically low enough to dis-incentivize grind/farm for them, but still there for the occasional "WOW" factor}

with the above system, guaranteed at least 1-2 parts per 20 min/wave run, no more than 2-3 forma max, simple rotations, ABCDABCDetc, no need for convaluted/complex things like AABCABCBCCCC and/or other such nonsense {staying in a mission longer for more rewards is already incentive enough with a decent reward table rotation like the ABCD system}

also by adjusting the common/unc/rare parts DE could easily fill up these charts with tons of options, diluting the pools to their desire, while still allowing the players to gather parts at a reasonably consistent rate {unlike the current system}

 

Edited March 2, 2016 by CY13ERPUNK
=/ apparently cant add anything outside of the quote box =/

[Niliam]

38 minutes ago, xethier said:

If you're there for the challenge of it, why care about the drop rotations?

Currently, most folks run to 20 minutes and quit. Mainly because after that you're risking your host or isp hiccup leading to mission failure and loss of key and rewards. (which is the issue you're upset about, afaict)

Changing the rotations after each 20 minute set to incrementally weight the drops to the "better" slot would actually give players who are after the rewards a reason to stay beyond trying to "save" a key or two.

I have hundreds of keys. Survival more than most. (i have 40+ of each tier of survival keys) So why bother staying past 20 minutes? There's no real tangible gain unless I'm there for the aformentioned "challenge" in which case I'm not there for the rewards.

Can you please show some respect? By read properly.

I am not there for challenge, I am talking about the work and time wasted by the fake mission fail and fake disconnection issue.

And to reduce the time and work that can be wasted if the cause can not be eliminated immediately.

 

[Eidolon_Slayer]

I vote no... Some people benefit from rotation A.

[Niliam]

50 minutes ago, AuroraSonicBoom said:

 

No, it's not a quick patch because the consequences of changing drop tables ad hoc like that take careful consideration. They're working on a fix, no change to drop tables necessary.

So, there is consequence by simply removing one A rotation, to help the innocent tennos who suffer at the hands of fake mission fail and fake disconnection issue?

What is the consequence?

Less Grind? Less fake mission fail? Less fake disconnect? More runs with time saved?

Or, some people just want others to keep suffer?

[Niliam]

2 minutes ago, RevivedEdgeLord said:

I vote no... Some people benefit from rotation A.

AABC, ABCA, 20 minutes, still the same two Rotation A.

[Eidolon_Slayer]

Just now, Niliam said:

AABC, ABCA, 20 minutes, still the same two Rotation A.

But then I'd have to waste 10 minutes getting to rotation A again.

Edited March 2, 2016 by RevivedEdgeLord

[Noabettiet]

Ever since rotation A and B rewarded all those sick "rewards", they have been basically the biggest waste of time ever.
Worse even, is the fact that some people actuality support this and that it is intentional. 

If anything, i don't think that would help anything. You could still lose it all in a blink of eyes.

4 hours ago, Kao-Snake said:

60 Mins to get to the Double Cs? I dont think I can play that long without boredoom starting to settle in at 35 mins.

Maybe not, but it would be rewarding to who ever tries it. It is quite the kick in the balls when rng in the last rotation is as awful as the others.

[Niliam]

4 minutes ago, RevivedEdgeLord said:

But then I'd have to waste 10 minutes getting to rotation A again.

Right, didn't know there is still people who's intention isn't at Rotation C.

[AuroraSonicBoom]

Just now, Niliam said:

So, there is consequence by simply removing one A rotation, to help the innocent tennos who suffer at the hands of fake mission fail and fake disconnection issue?

It's being worked on. The issue you have is not a droptable one but a technical one that has a much larger impact on the game than just survivals and defenses. Your try to fix a problem with the wrong tools, simple as that. What about the few players that lost progress after getting Vengeful Revenant? Increase drop chance or fix players loosing what they got during a mission? What about anything else in the game that players lost? Increase drop chances for everything in case someone might D/C one day and has to farm the 3000 nano spores they lost again?

Your way of fixing things would be messy to say the least. What DE is trying to do right now is eradicating the reason you are having problems, not leaving the problem alone and giving you a lollipop for every drop you missed.

[Niliam]

2 minutes ago, Noabettiet said:

Ever since rotation A and B rewarded all those sick "rewards", they have been basically the biggest waste of time ever.
Worse even, is the fact that some people actuality support this and that it is intentional. 

If anything, i don't think that would help anything. You could still lose it all in a blink of eyes.

Maybe not, but it would be rewarding to who ever tries it. It is quite the kick in the balls when rng in the last rotation is as awful as the others.

It can still lose it all, but with reduced loss, since the issue can't be eliminated immediately.

Instead of losing 15+ or 35+ minutes and waves; we can reduce the loss to 10+ and 25+ minutes and waves.

[Niliam]

3 minutes ago, AuroraSonicBoom said:

It's being worked on. The issue you have is not a droptable one but a technical one that has a much larger impact on the game than just survivals and defenses. Your try to fix a problem with the wrong tools, simple as that. What about the few players that lost progress after getting Vengeful Revenant? Increase drop chance or fix players loosing what they got during a mission? What about anything else in the game that players lost? Increase drop chances for everything in case someone might D/C one day and has to farm the 3000 nano spores they lost again?

Your way of fixing things would be messy to say the least. What DE is trying to do right now is eradicating the reason you are having problems, not leaving the problem alone and giving you a lollipop for every drop you missed.

I am not sure you heard of this or not, cause you sounds really trolling to me right now. Its the basic OHS knowledge that you need to know when you goes to work.

Eliminate

Reduce

Control

If a problem can not be eliminated, then reduce it, if it can not be reduced, then put control around it.

You have even said yourself, the problem is being worked on(By DE's definition, worked on can be 3 years+), while its being worked on, implement something that reduce the loss tennos suffer, and that is all I am asking.

 

And you are not ok with that, but want more suffering with longer runs.

 

[EmptyDevil]

This would probably require a drastic increase to difficulty at every 20 minutes but, How about this for a rotation tweak:

5 waves/mins - A - 1 reward.

10 waves/mins - A - 1 reward.

15 waves/mins - B - 1 reward.

20 waves/mins - C - 1 reward.

25 waves/mins - A - 2 rewards.

30 waves/mins - A - 2 rewards.

35 waves/mins - B - 2 rewards.

40 waves/mins - C - 2 rewards.

45 waves/mins - A - 3 rewards.

50 waves/mins - A - 3 rewards.

55 waves/mins - B - 3 rewards.

60 waves/mins - C - 3 rewards.

Alternatively, making it so only the C rotation increases in reward count would help as well.

[AuroraSonicBoom]

Just now, Niliam said:

And you are not ok with that, but want more suffering with longer runs.

 

Your implementation is messy and can cause many problems with the game economy. I'm not okay with it because your suggestion is a bandaid that doesn't need to be in place because of pessimistic expectations that the real fix will take much longer than you're willing to tolerate.

The issue isn't rampant enough to warrant temporary unpredictable fixes until the real solution arrives.

[Niliam]

36 minutes ago, EmptyDevil said:

This would probably require a drastic increase to difficulty at every 20 minutes but, How about this for a rotation tweak:

5 waves/mins - A - 1 reward.

10 waves/mins - A - 1 reward.

15 waves/mins - B - 1 reward.

20 waves/mins - C - 1 reward.

25 waves/mins - A - 2 rewards.

30 waves/mins - A - 2 rewards.

35 waves/mins - B - 2 rewards.

40 waves/mins - C - 2 rewards.

45 waves/mins - A - 3 rewards.

50 waves/mins - A - 3 rewards.

55 waves/mins - B - 3 rewards.

60 waves/mins - C - 3 rewards.

Alternatively, making it so only the C rotation increases in reward count would help as well.

This does not reduce the loss at the hand of fake mission fail and fake disconnection issue, only increasing it.

[Niliam]

34 minutes ago, AuroraSonicBoom said:

Your implementation is messy and can cause many problems with the game economy. I'm not okay with it because your suggestion is a bandaid that doesn't need to be in place because of pessimistic expectations that the real fix will take much longer than you're willing to tolerate.

The issue isn't rampant enough to warrant temporary unpredictable fixes until the real solution arrives.

ABC is messy, while AABCABBCABCC is not?

You're kidding, 

No, you're TROLLING.

[AuroraSonicBoom]

42 minutes ago, Niliam said:

ABC is messy, while AABCABBCABCC is not?

You're kidding, 

No, you're TROLLING.

No, changing the drop tables of everything players might potentially be mad about loosing as opposed to fixing them loosing the stuff in the first place is.

Edited March 2, 2016 by AuroraSonicBoom
typo

[taiiat]

if you refuse to have a discussion about a suggestion that has many connotations that you were unaware of and now refuse to acknowledge, why did you make a post on the Forums?

changing Reward Pools to fix a Networking issue (of which is very, very rare?) is not the correct course of action.
and it's not about how you change the Reward Pools - it's that you're changing them at all, for completely unrelated reasons.

[EmptyDevil]

31 minutes ago, Niliam said:

This does not reduce the loss at the hand of fake mission fail and fake disconnection issue, only increasing it.

I believe DE said they are going to have a solution for disconnects in the most recent devstream.

[xethier]

1 hour ago, Niliam said:

Can you please show some respect? By read properly.

I am not there for challenge, I am talking about the work and time wasted by the fake mission fail and fake disconnection issue.

And to reduce the time and work that can be wasted if the cause can not be eliminated immediately.

 

 

I did show respect, I did read your postings. I also responded in a fair and reasoned manner.

You are advocating a shift in drop rotation composition due to something you're referring to as "fake mission failure and fake disconnection".

I assume you mean being dropped due to network or system instability. (either yours, theirs or an ISP in between) -- (keep in mind that there is absolutely nothing FAKE about it)

DE has no control over this. None, Zip, Zilch, NADA.

You advocate the concept of "eliminate, reduce, control".

Elimination :: Have DE supply a system and network connectivity to all their users. <-- good luck with that.

Reduce :: Stabilize code and make network connections more bulletproof. <-- they've made tremendous strides in the last two years on this front and I have no doubt they will continue to do so.

Control :: Your solution is to make acquisition of drops easier to combat flaky connectivity / system stability. This would not solve the problem that you're defining. I.E. It would be an ineffective solution and would simply make acquisition of drops easier, it wouldn't "control" the situation at all. 

As for showing respect, I would ask that you be somewhat more conscientious about your grammar and phrasing. I find your writing style very difficult and tedious to interpret. I would also humbly ask that you stop claiming that everyone who disagrees with you is "trolling".

[Niliam]

7 minutes ago, xethier said:

 

I did show respect, I did read your postings. I also responded in a fair and reasoned manner.

You are advocating a shift in drop rotation composition due to something you're referring to as "fake mission failure and fake disconnection".

I assume you mean being dropped due to network or system instability. (either yours, theirs or an ISP in between) -- (keep in mind that there is absolutely nothing FAKE about it)

DE has no control over this. None, Zip, Zilch, NADA.

You advocate the concept of "eliminate, reduce, control".

Elimination :: Have DE supply a system and network connectivity to all their users. <-- good luck with that.

Reduce :: Stabilize code and make network connections more bulletproof. <-- they've made tremendous strides in the last two years on this front and I have no doubt they will continue to do so.

Control :: Your solution is to make acquisition of drops easier to combat flaky connectivity / system stability. This would not solve the problem that you're defining. I.E. It would be an ineffective solution and would simply make acquisition of drops easier, it wouldn't "control" the situation at all. 

As for showing respect, I would ask that you be somewhat more conscientious about your grammar and phrasing. I find your writing style very difficult and tedious to interpret. I would also humbly ask that you stop claiming that everyone who disagrees with you is "trolling".

You were claiming I am there for challenge, which is completely opposite of what I am talking about.

Everyone in the mission failed, when the objective still have Full health. DE has no control over this, which part of this is not FAKE mission fail?

Everyone disconnected to their ship, while whispering the host, he is still in the game, which part of this is not Fake disconnection?

If DE supplyies a Dedicated server, great, if not, eliminate this fake thing keeps going on.

This fake thing has kept going for two+ years, and it still there,

Acquisition is not eaiser if rng is still playing with you, if you not getting it in 10, 20 runs, you still not getting it it 10 or 20 runs, only thing is 5 minutes reduced grind every run.

 

And you serious that ABC is messy, and AABCABBCABCC it not?

I did not call everyone troll,  only this post, if you do read properly.

 

And wow, I have disclaim that English is not my language, and my native language grammar is totally opposite to the English.

In my language, we say: You are how, and in English: How are you.