Am I the only one who feels the Vauban touch-up was slightly lackluster?

[Rahetalius]

Let me clarify that I'm not saying "OMG the Vauban changes are terrible". I'm saying that they could have done something better with him. 

 

Point #1: Vauban's passive

For starters, the Armor passive. While I'm not a fan of it by any means whatsoever, I can live with it. Considering how squishy Vauban is, I'm honestly surprised they didn't give him some type of "Gain X% damage reduction when your health is at X amount", or at least a weaker Quick Thinking as a passive. Given his beefy appearance and engineer theme, I assumed DE would give Vauban a passive that would either increase the effectiveness of his powers when a certain requirement is met, or a passive that would make him harder to kill when he gets low on health. Instead, we got 25% bonus Armor for each nearby Warframe. To me, this passive fails on two levels.

-For one, it puts solo players at a disadvantage. I have no problem going on Public matchmaking when the situation calls for it, but why should I lose out on a passive simply because I prefer playing alone? 

-Secondly, the bonus Armor given is low. For example, if you're playing regular Vauban with 3 other people, you'd have about 87.5 total Armor, which is right around the 20-25% range of damage reduction. This might sound nice because "more Armor is always great", but the reality is that not only does the passive force you to stick near your allies, (which is a death sentence if Bombards, Bursas, or Infested Moas are around) but the tiny bonus Armor you get is meaningless in the endgame. Vauban's a great CC frame because his Bastille, Vortex, and Minelayer ignore enemy level. It doesn't matter if you're on Earth or in Sortie #3, if you throw down a Bastille into a crowd, they're ALL going to be suspended. However, while Vauban's abilities don't have a problem with enemy levels, his passive DOES. Bonus Armor doesn't mean a thing if you're up against level 100+ enemies that can 1-shot you, regardless of your bonus Armor.

 

Point #2: The uselessness of Tesla

Then there's Tesla. I understand that first abilities aren't supposed to be strong at all points of the game, but that's why they offer some utility. Volt's Shock may not do much damage, but it's a guaranteed stun that CHAINS off enemies. Frost's Freeze can also be quite weak in the endgame, but it can be applied onto surfaces with a single cast, allowing for multiple enemies to be slowed at once should they run over it. Even Hydroid's Tempest Barrage can be used to keep enemies pinned down, despite having absurdly low damage. The reason why Tesla is so unusable outside of level 10 is not because the damage is low, it's because the proc chance is NOT 100% like Volt's Shock, (which doesn't make any sense considering Tesla is also an electrical shock) meaning that you're forced to spam Teslas in an area to get the most out of them. That's not how first abilities should work. Moreover, Tesla was untouched in the touch-up to Vauban, confusing me even more. Does DE not realize that quite literally 85% of Vauban players if not all don't use Tesla in the Void, Sorties, or anywhere that isn't Earth?

 

Point #3: The mixed Minelayer bag

Minelayer's weird. I like it and I don't like it at the same time. When DE announced they were giving an Ivara-like mechanic to Vauban, I was thrilled to say the least. When they revealed Minelayer in Devstream 74, I wasn't sure what to think. 

-Bounce was kept, which I know satisfied those who DO use Bounce. I don't like Bounce, but I don't hate it either, so I just leave it alone for the most part, much like I did before Minelayer was added.

-Trip Laser. Let that sink in. Trip Laser is basically only viable against enemies that run and only run to attack you (basically Infested and to a smaller extent, melee Grineer and Corpus enemies), meaning that you're limited to ONE faction to use Trip Laser. Trip Laser only has a knockdown and a stagger to offer, having 0 damage on its own. Honestly I just see Trip Laser as some frivolous gimmick put in 'for the lolz'. Trip Laser DOES have some merit when put on doorways, since it stops enemies momentarily. Because Vauban is primarily a DEFENSIVE Warframe, Trip Laser's only useful against Infested, particularly on Defense, Mobile Defense, etc. In game modes like those, the objective is to keep enemies away from a certain location or it's game over. The thing is, if the point is to keep enemies out of your hair, a Repelling Bastille is better than Trip Laser hands down, and Repelling Bastille has been a staple in anti-Infested Vauban builds since its creation. 

-Shred could have been great, but the base Armor removal duration and ragdoll ruins it. While having an ability that temporarily removes enemy Armor is great, that ability is immediately counterproductive if it RAGDOLLS all the debuffed enemies everywhere. Even if you have the aim and quick reflexes of a god, you still have less than 6 seconds to make use of the Armor shred duration. I feel Shred could be a LOT more useful if the ragdoll were removed, but the base Armor shred and Armor shred duration be increased in order to compensate.

-Concuss is great. It's without a doubt the best Minelayer ability we got.

 

To summarize, I'm a little bit disappointed at what we got from Vauban's Minelayer, his passive, and the ignoration of Tesla. I hope I'm not the only one who feels this way.

Sincerely, a slightly disgruntled Vauban main.

[Voltage]

I only ever use Vauban for Interception. EVEN when it is infested I prefer frost with a long duration because that has better CC than Bastille imo. Vauban is a niche for very situational needs. He isn't bad nor is he the best CC frame he should be.

Edited May 29, 2016 by -CM-Voltage

[ashrah]

vauban is till same..stun grenade is nice wen is ancient or somthing near pod....good utility really

[Valiant]

His 1 needed some attention. Maybe even have the 2 treatment to really make him a diverse and utility frame. Also feel his stats needed a slight buff. 

His 1 isn't 'fine'. It's terrible. 

[Rahetalius]

3 minutes ago, Naith said:

His 1 needed some attention. Maybe even have the 2 treatment to really make him a diverse and utility frame. Also feel his stats needed a slight buff. 

His 1 isn't 'fine'. It's terrible. 

Not sure if I'm misunderstanding you here, but I didn't say his Tesla was fine.

[Valiant]

Just now, Rahetalius said:

Not sure if I'm misunderstanding you here, but I didn't say his Tesla was fine.

Nah it wasn't towards you it was towards De who deemed it as acceptable.

[Sixty5]

The issue I have with Vauban is that the switching on minelayer feels really bad to me, which is weird, given that I love Ivara, and have no issues with Quiver. 

When I was playing around with the rework, I found that I really wanted to throw my mines directly at enemies and having to hold to do so felt kinda iffy. 

Additionally I felt like there wasn't really enough difference between what each grenade does to really warrant using them. 

I'm sure if I played more vauban I would get the hang of him more, but I find it hard to justify putting that time into him when frames with better CC and damage exist. 

[-Fe-McHamm3rShot]

The gripe I have is with the selection mechanic on his mines.  The hit and hold does not lend itself to fast pace mine laying when you are in a nasty group.

Hoping the selection and execution gets swapped around.  I'd like the option to spam the bejesus out of mines to save my a$$, and hit hold to select the desired mine when setting up an attack.

Still need to play test more before I can speak on the armor passive, but agree also with the comment on Tesla -his #1 ability.

Unless you augment for it, and even then; it's pretty underwhelming.. I can live with lower than wanted damage output, but how about some better CC, longer shock duration maybe.. 

[GOLANX]

Perhaps they should reduce the cost of tesla down to 10 maybe 15 energy then give it a Prisim effect, I wish i could find a better video:

Basically before a tesla fires it would be charged by all nearby Teslas increasing its damage based upon the number of tesslas that are part of this effect this will not consume charges from the other teslas, only the one firing, once one has fired another will be free to fire using its charge while the first is recharging.

Trip Laser also really needs to do slash damage, Trolling is all and good but not worth the energy