Dual Decurion needs a buff in the worst of ways

[Cortanis]

Every player I've encountered so far has has similar experiences so far with the Dual Dec's. Why have they not received a serious buff so far? Their damage is total garbage, the recoil/inaccuracy is so bad that you can actually miss with a solid body aim while within 50m in game, and the mag capacity is painfully low. This is all in the face of the fact that the rounds have travel time to them. With the inaccuracy alone, that makes them pretty useless at any range besides in your face. Even when you're fireing at stuff in your face, they still lack the rof and damage to really be of use. This weapon literally made me want to quit the game entirely and I'm already at MR20/almost 21.

[Autongnosis]

Heh, i found the damage to be decent enough.

What baffled me was the incredible recoil and the extremely violent screen shake they induce.

[Cortanis]

You'd think that the recoil would be a bit more manageable with something made to hold onto weapons designed to cut through personal aircraft, but apparently not. And the damage doesn't even justify how bad the recoil is on it. Even the Lex is better than that and it has proper stats to back up that recoil.

[GinKenshin]

iirc, in the first week or so when they were introduced, they were originally a laser weapon, both guns shoot laser with no recoil, but after a few days, DE just changed them outta nowhere and for no reason, they weren't that OP at first (and I don't think anyone every got them from farming in the first week....since you know, RNG) this is still one of the most confusing changes DE did to date, at least for me 


they should at least buff the mag size, lower the recoil a bit and they're be a decent weapon to use 


I wish DE stopped making cool looking weapons or with new mechanics with bad/unplayable stats. I mean sure, if you love a weapon that much, u can play it (ex: stradavar) but the dual dec has crossed that thin line and needs some QoL changes.....although, DE recently payed attention to AW, and it's gonna be another 6 months/ 1 year until they look at it again 

[Djego27]

The problem is that they made it full auto when it was designed around semi automatic.

- make it semi auto again

- double the damage, since it is very lacking for the Interception on Uranus(to date the only mission left in the game where snipers make sense), you need 2-3 hits for small units what removes all the advantage such a sniper could have against hordes of smaller targets compared to the Velocitus(that one hits all big targets as well)

- give it a changeable zoom level like every sniper in Archwing should have

Edited July 27, 2016 by Djego27

[Cortanis]

16 hours ago, Djego27 said:

The problem is that they made it full auto when it was designed around semi automatic.

- make it semi auto again

- double the damage, since it is very lacking for the Interception on Uranus(to date the only mission left in the game where snipers make sense), you need 2-3 hits for small units what removes all the advantage such a sniper could have against hordes of smaller targets compared to the Velocitus(that one hits all big targets as well)

- give it a changeable zoom level like every sniper in Archwing should have

Dual Decurion is terrible twin smg style ones and not the sniper at all. That being said, yeah Velocitus could use some love too.

[PrVonTuckIII]

18 hours ago, Cortanis said:

Every player I've encountered so far has has similar experiences so far with the Dual Dec's. Why have they not received a serious buff so far? Their damage is total garbage, the recoil/inaccuracy is so bad that you can actually miss with a solid body aim while within 50m in game, and the mag capacity is painfully low. This is all in the face of the fact that the rounds have travel time to them. With the inaccuracy alone, that makes them pretty useless at any range besides in your face. Even when you're fireing at stuff in your face, they still lack the rof and damage to really be of use. This weapon literally made me want to quit the game entirely and I'm already at MR20/almost 21.

1) Damage is actually pretty great. High crit chance, and fast recharge rate really help with DPS. Not Velocitus or Cyngas levels of DPS, but still pretty good (Cyngas needs a serious nerf IMO).

2) Accuracy is actually fine. The problem is the effing screen shake. That needs serious fixing. The actual spread of the shots is manageable. But the damn screen shake is painful to use.

3) Use an ammo mod. It's not like they're a lot of mandatory mods for Arch-weps anyways. Besides, they have the fastest ammo recharge time, so that kinda obliviates the small ammo capacity.

4) They do not have travel time. The bullets are hitscan. Learn to play.

5) They have good damage, good rate of fire, and high crit chance. I don't know what else you really want (other than fixing that screen shake). Stop making a drama out of one weapon. We all know that you're not going to quit a game that you've apparently sunk hundreds of hours into simply because you don't like one weapon. If that was the case, you should have quit after playing the MK1-Strun.

[Cortanis]

5 hours ago, PrVonTuckIII said:

1) Damage is actually pretty great. High crit chance, and fast recharge rate really help with DPS. Not Velocitus or Cyngas levels of DPS, but still pretty good (Cyngas needs a serious nerf IMO).

2) Accuracy is actually fine. The problem is the effing screen shake. That needs serious fixing. The actual spread of the shots is manageable. But the damn screen shake is painful to use.

3) Use an ammo mod. It's not like they're a lot of mandatory mods for Arch-weps anyways. Besides, they have the fastest ammo recharge time, so that kinda obliviates the small ammo capacity.

4) They do not have travel time. The bullets are hitscan. Learn to play.

5) They have good damage, good rate of fire, and high crit chance. I don't know what else you really want (other than fixing that screen shake). Stop making a drama out of one weapon. We all know that you're not going to quit a game that you've apparently sunk hundreds of hours into simply because you don't like one weapon. If that was the case, you should have quit after playing the MK1-Strun.

I would highly contest the damage scale on them as I can plug away at most grineer targets and have to waste at least half the mag doing so.

Accuracy isn't fine by a long shot. Part of the accuracy is the ability to aim which you also call out the screen shake on as well. We also know very good and well that the recoil throws a lot of the shots wide even at a moderate range.

I do use an ammo mod on them. The mag capacity is still garbage.

If they're actually hitscan, then yes the accuracy is still garbage as I can actually use the Veloctus as a sniper with out a scope and the rounds do have a huge travel time. Gee, sounds like I've used most of these weapons.

Even with all the stats on them, they don't really top out with any real comparable damage as what shots do actually land at any kind of range are offset by the 4 other rounds that don't land.

You know how I got through the MK1-Strun? CC, endless missions while using secondaries, and spy missions. I didn't actually have to fire the thing and especially since I knew very good and well that the thing was garbage in the first place.

[Djego27]

7 hours ago, Cortanis said:

Dual Decurion is terrible twin smg style ones and not the sniper at all. That being said, yeah Velocitus could use some love too.

It is a sniper. This is the reason why it does not have damage falloff and it was possible to play the hole earth Interception from just one point in the middle and shoot stuff 2km away(all weapons with damage falloff can not do that at all in archwing) that tried to capture points. The full auto did mean that you did need to shoot it in small bursts(since it does not properly reset to zero after single shots) and at least on earth it was viable for that since 1 out of 3-6 projectiles was sufficient to kill a target that tried to capture a point.

The damage is not high, the Imperator does 66% of the damage per shot with twice the fire rate. If you add that multi shot and rof mods actually directly buff a weapon like the Imperator since it is pin point accurate while on the dual decurion it is mostly used to narrow down the spread for short bursts and add 1 more projectile to a 3 round burst to increase chances of a hit. Even in situations where accuracy is not a issue(solo golem runs) because your target is massive I need around 30-50% more time to kill it with my dual decurions compared to other weapons(assuming you compare them with catalyst and 4-5 forma on each like I do).

The reason it needs more single shot damage is not even on paper dps but practicality for sniping. Even if it becomes semi auto again and allows for precise shots at high ranges if you need 2-3 hits to kill a target in Interception you lose any kind of advantage over the delay with charge mechanic of the Velocitus. The advantage of not having travel time or a charge mechanic makes it more flexible when shooting down a huge number of smaller targets at range, while the Velocitus allows you to even take down big targets in one charged shot and use uncharged ones vs smaller units with the travel time drawback(what is actually much worse in AW then on the normal maps, because targets move often unpredictable and ranges are much bigger). There is also the punch through on the velocitus that makes it much better when taking out units that are directly on capture points and might be obscured by objects in your way.

Edited July 28, 2016 by Djego27

[Cortanis]

By no means is it a sniper any more than any of the other full auto guns. By definition, sniping is, "shoot at someone from a hiding place, especially accurately and at long range." The hiding part is negligible, but the duals are anything but a long range or accurate weapon. Just because you can hit a target with a good bit of effort from range doesn't make it good at it. You said it yourself, you're using it on a low level interception mission. It doesn't really work on anything farther than lower levels.

[Djego27]

Other full auto guns got damage falloff, what means they become useless beyond 500-1000m by the damage falloff. I never claimed that it is good at sniping, it is actually horrible at it because of the full auto change, it is just the only thing where it makes any sense to use. You can use a 5 forma dual decurion even to solo the Jordas golem(done it but it is agreeable slower then with any other archwing weapon in the game) and you can spray and pray at lower ranges with it(at all levels), however all of this is better done with other archwing weapons. What it needs is being returned to semi auto trigger, a proper return to zero after a shot(because the gun does not do this currently) and a sufficient base damage to make single long range shots good enught to take down smaller units in one hit.

[13QZXXTTX]

Well AW Weapons are fine as they are, the biggest problem I'm running into are considerably dealing with Level 50s+ AW enemies in Nightmare alert.

Likely my problem is with AW's armor for Itzal, my go to is just not there yet. Higher version of AW would be welcome, but I rather have DE's releasing content and fixing Bugs and buffing weapons. And I hope DE continue their trek to their positive dreams/goals.

[Cortanis]

On 7/29/2016 at 1:55 AM, Djego27 said:

 What it needs is being returned to semi auto trigger, a proper return to zero after a shot(because the gun does not do this currently) and a sufficient base damage to make single long range shots good enught to take down smaller units in one hit.

Most people seem to have a consensus on this part. Why did they even change the semi auto to begin with? That alone really hurts the viability of the guns and it's not like the damage was so terribly large that even if it's hitscan with pinpoint accuracy that it would be terribly op or anything.

[(XBOX)Twinna25]

On 28 July 2016 at 2:08 AM, Cortanis said:

Dual Decurion is terrible twin smg style ones and not the sniper at all. That being said, yeah Velocitus could use some love too.

Dual decurion could work quite well as their original form with a slight damage buff, i must agree.

 

Also, Velocitus doesn't need a buff really. If you build them properly(3 forma at most) They make a very crit viable weapon which is even better with Odonata's energy shell which doubles crits and adds bonus damage, to where they can one/two shot Jordas in JV

[Cortanis]

9 minutes ago, (XB1)Twinna25 said:

Also, Velocitus doesn't need a buff really. If you build them properly(3 forma at most) They make a very crit viable weapon which is even better with Odonata's energy shell which doubles crits and adds bonus damage, to where they can one/two shot Jordas in JV

Been there and done that. It's not the damage I have issue with on it. It's the charge time and projectile flight speed. Even with mod, the charge time is kind of on the longer side to make use of the charge shot constantly. It's about the same issue as Paris Prime vs Rak Cernos. The projectile flight speed is also a bit of an issue for accuracy on it at range too. Trying to shoot normal things with it can be problematic as you have to lead your shots and with how tiny things get at range and the lack of a scope on it can make that very hard.

[(XBOX)Twinna25]

Just now, Cortanis said:

Been there and done that. It's not the damage I have issue with on it. It's the charge time and projectile flight speed. Even with mod, the charge time is kind of on the longer side to make use of the charge shot constantly. It's about the same issue as Paris Prime vs Rak Cernos. The projectile flight speed is also a bit of an issue for accuracy on it at range too. Trying to shoot normal things with it can be problematic as you have to lead your shots and with how tiny things get at range and the lack of a scope on it can make that very hard.

I would just love for the mod to actually half charge time flat out to be honest, to see if that would work, along wifh some flight speed buffs.

[Djego27]

I do agree that the flight speed of projectiles on the Velocitus should be a bit higher or there should be a mod for that, since there are no useful applications for 64k crits anywhere in archwing outside the Jordas Golem fight.

My biggest issue with the Velocitus always was the lack off adjustable zoom levels and some kind of aim assist like displaying the movement vector of the target, to allow a good player to precisely find his point of aim after taking travel time and distance to the target into account.

[(PSN)MrNishi]

I used to use Dual Decurions as Semi-auto long-range engagement.

Then console got the update that changed them to Full-auto (PC players complaining about the Semi-auto not being as effective as Full Auto weapons...or something like that)

Full Auto came and recoil stayed...giving us the worse handling Archweapons ever.

4 Forma in and the Dual Decurions are just annoying as Full Auto.

Strongly Agree they need Semi-auto.

I never understood why Velocitus damage got buffed, 3 times consecutively.

-Players were complaining about Velocitus not hitting where aimed ...DE buffed Damage...Players still complain Velocitus not hitting near reticule & DE buffs damage again...then after Players still complaining they finally address Velocitus not properly hitting reticule and also buff damage and Crit multiplier.

I swear of all the weapon it was Dual Decurions that needed the Crit multiplier buff (& be reverted back to Semi-auto or reduce/remove the massive kick/recoil/screen shake)

Almost Surprised Dual-decurions don't assist with Archwing mobility...they seem to have enough kick to counter-propel an Archwing (like reverse thrusters)