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Specters of the Rail: U2.1 - Nekros Changes

[DE]Danielle

By [DE]Danielle,
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Dan1lo

Dan1lo

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, Eldritchkitty said:

I feel like you and many others are missing the point- this isn't about arguing that the toggle isn't a good thing, at least I'm not arguing that, it just needs to be sped up and have its drop chances pushed back up again.

That's exactly what I understood from your point and what I got. You have to stand around a bit for it to work, but it does work. It's like a popcorn machine right now. It might be tweaked to desecrate just slightly faster, but it's not bad or unpleasant as is, especially on survival runs.

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(PSN)CoolD2108

(PSN)CoolD2108

Posted
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Wolfnrun said:

Are you telling me that the only way to go is melee volt with speed? Many of us expected more, not just me, it made many very excited, myself included and we should have not expected any less then the BEST

Melee is  A ALTERNATIVE TO GUNPLAY

he is even versale enough to go trough as BATTLE MAGE as melee most definitly goes amazingly well with his fast, well designed ability CC.

 

Like it or not but melee by itself is stronger then ability melee such as excals ult. It's the Features, like excals punch-trough that make the difference. Volt has a buff for the by default stronger damage type, CC good enough to take mirages place in Raids nowadays...

 

HE IS A ALTERNATIVE TO GUNPLAY, EASILY ON EXCALS CALIBER AND THEY MADE HIM VIABLE, AS PROMISED, SO ALL THAT'S LEFT FOR YOU TO RANT ABOUT IS THAT THEY DID NOT EXECUTE WHAT YOU SPECIFICALY HAD IN MIND. And this my friend is nothing one could rant about. It's theyr game, theyr Vision, not yours. Theyr stuff has to work and offer a certain Balance but everything exceeding this is 100% BS.

Edited by (PS4)CoolD2108
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(PSN)WINDMILEYNO

(PSN)WINDMILEYNO

Posted
Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, Matt89Connor said:

i'm not an expert with volt, but i like the new rework, mybe the cost for move with the shield is too high but i like the rest, what is the problem with him?

Volt has a kit that builds for speed or for discharge.

Volt has an ugly sheild mechanic. DE added a gimmick where you can knock enemies down.

People complained. Nothing changed.

If this is a the way they are balancing frames, they will add some gimmick to Souls of the dead and leave the health decay in, and change nothing else in terms of quality of life.

 

Edited by (PS4)WINDMILEYNO
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(PSN)WINDMILEYNO

(PSN)WINDMILEYNO

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, (PS4)CoolD2108 said:

Melee is  A ALTERNATIVE TO GUNPLAY

he is even versale enough to go trough as BATTLE MAGE as melee most definitly goes amazingly well with his fast, well designed ability CC.

 

Like it or not but melee by itself is stronger then ability melee such as excals ult. It's the Features, like excals punch-trough that make the difference. Volt has a buff for the by default stronger damage type, CC good enough to take mirages place in Raids nowadays...

 

HE IS A ALTERNATIVE TO GUNPLAY, EASILY ON EXCALS CALIBER AND THEY MADE HIM VIABLE, AS PROMISED, SO ALL THAT'S LEFT FOR YOU TO RANT ABOUT IS THAT THEY DID NOT EXECUTE WHAT YOU SPECIFICALY HAD IN MIND. And this my friend is nothing one could rant about. It's theyr game, theyr Vision, not yours. Theyr stuff has to work and offer a certain Balance but everything exceeding this is 100% BS.

Please Stop. When I see discharge, it just makes me sick..... What you are ignoring is that one 1) your delving into complaining about someone else complaining 2) Volt was changed into something he didn't start out as 3)If you compare Frosts changes and you compare Volts changes, you'll notice a lot more harm than good was don't to Volt for seemingly no good reason 4) Just for the sake of the argument, volt with speed feels closer to being a melee frame the same way Saryn is with toxic lash. Exalted blade doesn't have a timer, lasts longer, and gets more done. Now with shocking speed, volt comes close to Excal, just a little.

 

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(PSN)CoolD2108

(PSN)CoolD2108

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, (PS4)WINDMILEYNO said:

Please Stop. When I see discharge, it just makes me sick..... What you are ignoring is that one 1) your delving into complaining about someone else complaining 2) Volt was changed into something he didn't start out as 3)If you compare Frosts changes and you compare Volts changes, you'll notice a lot more harm than good was don't to Volt for seemingly no good reason 4) Just for the sake of the argument, volt with speed feels closer to being a melee frame the same way Saryn is with toxic lash. Exalted blade doesn't have a timer, lasts longer, and gets more done. Now with shocking speed, volt comes close to Excal, just a little.

 

Overload was allways radial CC, the original execution was just subpar in terms of: CC duration, damage and Effect speed. Speed got a buff for both, melee and gunplay now so the support doesn't go in vain on specific setups, while they got rid of the permanent buff aspect as this has been a permanent source of complain. His quantity of shields got reduced after they got a gain in size and useability, what's overall still a Frickin buff and shock is still the same. How is he not what he started out as? Everything still fulfills the same functions, more more then less effective.

He has better CC, Mobility and melee Speed on higher melee numbers where excal got a Nerf to his damage just recently...How is he only close to excal?...

 

And dude. I'll complain about people complaining for s**** reasons as long as these people expect the impossible of the Devs.

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LunarEdge7

LunarEdge7

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, (PS4)CoolD2108 said:

Overload was allways radial CC, the original execution was just subpar in terms of: CC duration, damage and Effect speed. Speed got a buff for both, melee and gunplay now so the support doesn't go in vain on specific setups, while they got rid of the permanent buff aspect as this has been a permanent source of complain. His quantity of shields got reduced after they got a gain in size and useability, what's overall still a Frickin buff and shock is still the same. How is he not what he started out as? Everything still fulfills the same functions, more more then less effective.

He has better CC, Mobility and melee Speed on higher melee numbers where excal got a Nerf to his damage just recently...How is he only close to excal?...

 

And dude. I'll complain about people complaining for s**** reasons as long as these people expect the impossible of the Devs.

I guess people just liked seeing a short as fudge ulti that only clears rooms for a certain lvl of enemies before becoming useless.

But there are some changes required from his current abilities like the energy drain on mobile shield and the Discharge health cap, maybe he's only complaining about those?

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(PSN)WINDMILEYNO

(PSN)WINDMILEYNO

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, (PS4)CoolD2108 said:

Overload was allways radial CC, the original execution was just subpar in terms of: CC duration, damage and Effect speed. Speed got a buff for both, melee and gunplay now so the support doesn't go in vain on specific setups, while they got rid of the permanent buff aspect as this has been a permanent source of complain. His quantity of shields got reduced after they got a gain in size and useability, what's overall still a Frickin buff and shock is still the same. How is he not what he started out as? Everything still fulfills the same functions, more more then less effective.

He has better CC, Mobility and melee Speed on higher melee numbers where excal got a Nerf to his damage just recently...How is he only close to excal?...

 

And dude. I'll complain about people complaining for s**** reasons as long as these people expect the impossible of the Devs.

He is only close, because Excal recently got a nerf.

Look, it's right there. Freedom of expression in a rework was shown through Excalibur, but it's been limited now. Now every rework is limited.

But to us (i am also "these" people) he was never a cc frame.

People wanted him to be a cc frame, because electricity was so lacking, and he was so vulnerable before/after using his ult, it was barely worth casting.

But for me, I loved the way discharge (overload) looked, I love damage abilities, I would flip into a crowd of enemies landing almost perfectly on top of a crowd and cast overload just because I could, a middle finger to enemy scaling, and it looked awesome to boot.

For me, personally, I hate watching enemies dance.

For me. For me I can only speak, my ideas are the only ones I have. But I'm not going to disregard your veiw point, by saying you can't love volt. If we could all put our personal feelings aside, maybe we could accomplish something.

Maybe nekros will actually get the help he needs

This rework is very personal for a lot of people(both of the frames being talked about). I could give you my whole life story, how Volt is the only reason I started liking warframe, besides Saryn, the only reason I play, because I hated it in the beginning when I first started. I'm sure I'm not much different actually from a lot of people.

In this game, the precedent has been that cc frames and damage frames do not mix. Cc frames always perform better due to scaling. Volt was a cc frame the same way Oberon can be considered a cc frame, because of his element, not the actual mechanics of his abilities. He was a damage frame at heart, just like oberon with a focus on elemental procs that granted light cc, and they changed him. He is different now, some say he is better, I say he is worse.

You are happy with these changes, but stills give suggestions on how it could be better? So at the very least you could say it's not perfect.

 

 

Edited by (PS4)WINDMILEYNO
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(PSN)WINDMILEYNO

(PSN)WINDMILEYNO

Posted
Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, LunarEdge7 said:

I guess people just liked seeing a short as fudge ulti that only clears rooms for a certain lvl of enemies before becoming useless.

But there are some changes required from his current abilities like the energy drain on mobile shield and the Discharge health cap, maybe he's only complaining about those?

They could have given it more utility, syngery with other powers, skill required.

But they made it into an Area of effect crowd stun with "synergy" to shock. I don't see anything ever happen. 

And they made it ground cast only.

But you can slide with it into enemies. I just go for maxed range, decent strength and fight the grineer. They dance, I watch. Its nothing special.

Edited by (PS4)WINDMILEYNO
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(PSN)meeeone

(PSN)meeeone

Posted
Posted

To all the players talking about volt.

This thread is about Nekros,go away.

You are OFF TOPIC in a DEV thread.

 

To DE:

When i first heard about the nerf to SOTD i glanced at Nekros' armor number and said "guess i can't ever use him on anymore serious missions".  (Sorties,SoS augment.)

Then i heard about the everlasting minions and said "ok i can still use him for casual".

[DE]Rebecca said:"You won't need duration anymore."   

She said it a minimum of 3 times.

Now i come to read about a PERCENT BASED "decay".

Lol how can shadows decay?  They're souls ffs.

If "decay" is really a thing shouldn't it apply elsewhere?  Like to the grineer?  

Shouldn't the grineer  (the race supposedly suffering from decay) auto die in their missions?

That sounds stupid right? Yeah well decay on SoTD is just as dumb.

DE are liars,DE has made Rebecca a liar so i lump her in with them.

 

I'll not be giving anymore money to liars,and i'll never watch another lie stream again.

And i may even uninstall warframe. (If you don't get it yet i loathe liars and want no part of them.)

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(PSN)WINDMILEYNO

(PSN)WINDMILEYNO

Posted
Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, (PS4)meeeone said:

To all the players talking about volt.

This thread is about Nekros,go away.

You are OFF TOPIC in a DEV thread.

Hey, I agree, it's frustrating, but your post might get the wrong kind of attation, at least spoiler the liars bit and take some time to edit that part...

And I brought up Volt, because he and Nekros have a very similar situation going on. If one is being ignored, the other probably will be too.

Edited by (PS4)WINDMILEYNO
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F4talFr4me

F4talFr4me

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, (PS4)WINDMILEYNO said:

It's not that the truth is wrong.

I like it.

But DE might not, and they have a ban button. I'll stick up for the truth, but I don't have an unban button.

Oh i know i had 2 warnings in the past 2 days because of some heated arguments towards them. they dont like the truth.

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(PSN)WINDMILEYNO

(PSN)WINDMILEYNO

Posted
Posted
Just now, F4talFr4me said:

Oh i know i had 2 warnings in the past 2 days because of some heated arguments towards them. they dont like the truth.

Just trying to keep things calm.

No one needs warnings. And this thread doesn't need to be locked.

We all generally agree (there's always that one person though) that health decay is wrong. 

We don't know why it was implemented.

The same way I don't know why Saryn lost health in her rework.

Or why volt has energy drain and a timer (sorry for mentioning other frames)

I strongly believe, if De explained their reasoning to us on some level, we could make more informed and reasonable requests.

Right now it feels like someone doesn't think we even deserve that much (banny statement)

But just keep trying. I will post in this thread everyday for the next 5 years until they change it. Because I'm willing to support my community. You guys. Funniest thing about me being here is I havnt even played the new nekros yet, but I have seen what they did to Volt, so it's not hard to get the picture.(and you tube videos)

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F4talFr4me

F4talFr4me

Posted
Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, (PS4)WINDMILEYNO said:

Just trying to keep things calm.

No one needs warnings. And this thread doesn't need to be locked.

We all generally agree (there's always that one person though) that health decay is wrong. 

We don't know why it was implemented.

The same way I don't know why Saryn lost health in her rework.

Or why volt has energy drain and a timer (sorry for mentioning other frames)

I strongly believe, if De explained their reasoning to us on some level, we could make more informed and reasonable requests.

Right now it feels like someone doesn't think we even deserve that much (banny statement)

But just keep trying. I will post in this thread everyday for the next 5 years until they change it. Because I'm willing to support my community. You guys. Funniest thing about me being here is I havnt even played the new nekros yet, but I have seen what they did to Volt, so it's not hard to get the picture.(and you tube videos)

I have played it allot past few days. its GOOD. but what they did to summons was wrong. also. they nerfed Desecrate to "dont bother with it anymore". why they bothered with QoL(quality of life) improvements to a overnerfed skill makes me scratch my head. not only is it almost tripple nerfed (desecrated bodys vanish wether they give loot or not/hp orb nerf with loot nerf in general/each corpse takes WAY too much energy in comparison to the previouse version). they ruined 2 skills in 1 patch. great.

 

People get annoyed because they feel they are ignored. clearly they must be ignoring us if this went live.

Edited by F4talFr4me
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Tizodd

Tizodd

Posted
Posted (edited)
29 minutes ago, (PS4)WINDMILEYNO said:

Just trying to keep things calm.

No one needs warnings. And this thread doesn't need to be locked.

We all generally agree (there's always that one person though) that health decay is wrong. 

We don't know why it was implemented.

The same way I don't know why Saryn lost health in her rework.

Or why volt has energy drain and a timer (sorry for mentioning other frames)

I strongly believe, if De explained their reasoning to us on some level, we could make more informed and reasonable requests.

Right now it feels like someone doesn't think we even deserve that much (banny statement)

But just keep trying. I will post in this thread everyday for the next 5 years until they change it. Because I'm willing to support my community. You guys. Funniest thing about me being here is I havnt even played the new nekros yet, but I have seen what they did to Volt, so it's not hard to get the picture.(and you tube videos)

I'm right there with you.  Whenever I see a new post complaining about the SotD health decay nerf, I make sure to chime in to try and keep the post active.  In hopes that DE eventually takes notice and reverts the awful change.

I have played Nekros since the nerf, and while it is still playable...it just makes absolutely no sense for tanks (they were even given extra aggro) to have a constant bleedout.

DE originally said they'd remove duration, but then they added it back in the form of a bleedout for the sake of "balancing".  Balancing is needed for OP abilities like Bladestorm, or pre-rework Miasma, Peacemaker, etc.  But SotD was never anywhere close to being OP.  It was decent ability that was nerfed TWICE: its cap was reduced to 7; and they're dying from the moment you spawn them.  It seems like it was nerfed just for the sake of nerfing something.

At this point, I'd be happy if they just went back to its original duration.  Tank minions with a constant non-stop bleedout makes no sense.

Edited by Tizodd
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ZiltoidiaAttacks

ZiltoidiaAttacks

Posted
Posted (edited)

They should add a special effect to the radius of desecrate where translucent arms/hands stick out of the ground to 'grab the souls' of the dead  they dissolve, in the color of the frame energy.  Otherwise, I really like the changes, it balances nekros, although desecrate should give an additional small health restore when it eats a soul, in addition to his passive.

 

Edited by FatsackTony
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Eldritchsqueaker

Eldritchsqueaker

Posted
Posted
8 hours ago, mindlord0013 said:

Let's be totally honest here: Desecrate and Pilfering Swarm are fairly unhealthy gameplay elements, especially Desecrate before the rework. The passions of all the people in the thread here prove that. People are complaining that it's now less effective, and should be changed to be as effective as before. People on the other side are saying, "well, at least now you're actually able to play the game". I'll be the first to admit that the RNG in Warframe is a little on the harsh side of things. Any gameplay mechanic designed to alleviate that fact will therefore become a mandatory part of high-level and min-maxed play. It therefore doesn't surprise me that any perceived (or actual) nerf or attempted removal of these looting abilities causes people to take up arms - despite the fact it's probably better for the metagame if they were removed completely.

For the record, I'm of the opinion that IF we absolutely must have them as a part of the game then they should be in a way that leads to a healthy metagame. The changes to Desecrate fairly achieves this, as it encourages players to be more active and play the game. After all, it's better than playing the loot tables.

My biggest issue is that it only gives a small loot increase, and it makes it feel like half a skill in my eyes. I'd be fine with the nerf if they gave it some actual in-mission utility, Nekros' whole rework feels half baked really, the frame still has wonky stats, meh skills and no clear role in my eyes.

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ZiltoidiaAttacks

ZiltoidiaAttacks

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, Eldritchkitty said:

My biggest issue is that it only gives a small loot increase, and it makes it feel like half a skill in my eyes. I'd be fine with the nerf if they gave it some actual in-mission utility, Nekros' whole rework feels half baked really, the frame still has wonky stats, meh skills and no clear role in my eyes.

Maybe they could make desecrate like a corpse explosion.  Where when you desecrate it, along with the small increase in loot/health/energy drops, it does a small aoe blast, gas, or toxin damage, and/or creates a small aoe slow trap like the infested moa's orange floor spit goo stuff.

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(XBOX)Nightseid

(XBOX)Nightseid

Posted
Posted

I don't not like desecrate as an ability because it lacks precision. There is too much RNG involved to be reliable; and the switch it into a toggle makes the ability uncontrollable. At least previously I could decide when to initiate-  if someone complained about me not casting the ability, then they can suck eggs and play as Nekros next time around.

Desecrate needs functionally than being a loot ability - loot should really be a 2nd function. Ivara has sneak (invisibility and looting), hydroid has a t.swarm (mod that allows loot to drop) and mag has pull (attracts loot).

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(PSN)CoolD2108

(PSN)CoolD2108

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, (PS4)WINDMILEYNO said:

-snip-

Oh OH i'm sry, i didn't realise we're talking about excals broken O.P. state.

 

Of course there's room for Progression when you measure on something that should not be in the game to begin with.

 

And..Freedom of expression but you have issues with me expressing myself? Go on.

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