Stealth 2.0

[TheLoneNinja]

Problem:  

-Stealth in Warframe (the game about space ninjas) is underdone and besides the affinity there isn't much encouragment to do it in the first place

 

My proposal:

-A cover system and maybe even cover kills - much like ours heavy sniper rifles may punch through thin cover

-Unaware enemies have increased drop chances

-Stealth Kills stat on our profiles statistics page as well as a leaderboard to go with it to add incentive for Tenno with a competitive edge

-Able to throw rocks or... ummm, snowballs? On non-ship tilesets

-Thinking on my last remark this may make ivaras noise arrow obsolete, but I'm keeping it for other to reply to if needed

-Besides alarmed and lockdown, there should be multible stages to alarms, each attracting increasingly difficult enemies the longer the alarm is on.

 

-More will be added as I think of them or as they are suggested in the comments.

 

EDIT: I see everyones point on why this is a bad idea.  I'm unsubribing now, feel free to keep discussing but please keep it civilized.

 

Edited September 19, 2016 by TheLoneNinja

[PrVonTuckIII]

1) Unnecessary gimmick that would never be used.

2) Not my place to comment, but it would mean that Exterminates would be the new farming locations. Not the greatest thing to do.

3) Eh.

4) Gimmick that wouldn't be used at all. Doesn't really fit with the gameplay also.

5) Depends on the mission.

[NinjaKitsune56]

1 minute ago, PrVonTuckIII said:

1) Unnecessary gimmick that would never be used.

2) Not my place to comment, but it would mean that Exterminates would be the new farming locations. Not the greatest thing to do.

3) Eh.

4) Gimmick that wouldn't be used at all. Doesn't really fit with the gameplay also.

5) Depends on the mission.

1) Cover... I'd use it if it were an option. Be great for setting up with Ivara or a sniper rifle in general.

2) Exterminates being the new farm? Nothing wrong with that, we use Intercepts and Defenses all the time, so why not Exterminates?

3) Stealth Kill stats... agreed... meh.

4) True... bit like dropkicking the enemy is a gimmick and rarely, if ever, used.

5) This (tougher enemies as time progresses) happens in survivals and endless defense missions anyways.

[PrVonTuckIII]

1 minute ago, NinjaKitsune56 said:

1) Cover... I'd use it if it were an option. Be great for setting up with Ivara or a sniper rifle in general.

But why do that when it's much more efficient to mow them down with [insert weapon]?

1 minute ago, NinjaKitsune56 said:

2) Exterminates being the new farm? Nothing wrong with that, we use Intercepts and Defenses all the time, so why not Exterminates?

Because the point is to make all missions viable to play, not just 1-3?

[Proxykon]

Spy missions were somehow designed to entertain stealthy players, I feel like DE should build on that and offer more variety.

At the same time, I believe the ninja theme mostly stems from the seemingly impossible movement and weapon choice of our Warframes and less from the stealthy hit & run mentality, as Warframe was never designed as a Stealth game in the first place. IIrc Steve said multiple times that he wanted to do "Left 4 Dead in Space" (correct me if I'm wrong) and that loosely translates to horde mode.

Doesn't mean that we cannot and should not have the possiblity for more stealth gamemodes, I agree. I wouldn't start with cover systems and distraction items though. First of all that AI needs to be fixed. Have you tried stealthing exterminations? Enemies clump up in really weird clusters. How the hell am I supposed to stealth that?

1. I'm not a fan of cover systems. I'd rather resort to the usage of Warframes who are more likely to get a stealth mission easier done than other Warframes.

2. The method of killing shouldn't influence the droprates, in my opinion. The stealth affinity bonus is already OP af (I mean I can easily level my buddy's Warframe to 30 in one stealthed exterminate). Have to disagree as well.

3. Leaderboards for stealthkills. I cannot comment on that because I'm not very competitive myself.

4. Distraction items. I already don't use Ivara's noise arrow, I believe I wouldn't use this option either.

5. Level of alarm. I believe that this is already the case, as Manics and Bursas appear constantly if the alarm isn't silenced and lastly, doors get locked.

[NinjaKitsune56]

4 minutes ago, PrVonTuckIII said:

But why do that when it's much more efficient to mow them down with [insert weapon]?

Because the point is to make all missions viable to play, not just 1-3?

Mow-em-down weapons (lookin' at you Soma Prime) aren't very effective in the long run (like 2+ hour survivals, if those're your thing.) Even brute force weapons, like the Opticor and Tonkor, become less-effective at that point, and Frost bubbles pop like soap bubbles at that point. By that time, cover is something even a Vauban would appreciate.

And all missions are viable... just that some have more farming potential... The Void used to be Farm Central... now people only go there when there're fissures there, or they need Argon Crystals.

Edited September 12, 2016 by NinjaKitsune56

[DarkDataStorm]

unfortunately warframe is a fast paced arcade shooter. I see which direction you want to go but it would take a lot more changes to make it compatible with stealth

[NekroArts]

Even though we're space ninjas, the game lean more towards the Ninja Gaiden series than Mark of the Ninja.

[SenorClipClop]

I actually find stealth to be incredibly rewarding in this game. There's a lot you can do with it, screwing up is punishing, successful plays feel awesome. Stacking the stealth multiplier is my favorite way to grind out exp; I leveled Ivara super quickly without even trying.

The issue with stealth isn't the game, it's the players. I have never dropped into a public mission and found a single other person using stealthy gameplay. You never really need to stealth in Warframe, it's more of a preference thing, and it seems the vast majority of the player base prefers to run-and-gun. Which is fine, but it's pretty much impossible to stealth a mission when others on the squad aren't. This can be solved with co-ordination, looking for like-minded Tenno in Recruitment or by clanning up with a stealth-appreciative group of Tenno.

[TheLoneNinja]

1 hour ago, SenorClipClop said:

 

The issue with stealth isn't the game, it's the players. I have never dropped into a public mission and found a single other person using stealthy gameplay. You never really need to stealth in Warframe, it's more of a preference thing, and it seems the vast majority of the player base prefers to run-and-gun. Which is fine, but it's pretty much impossible to stealth a mission when others on the squad aren't. This can be solved with co-ordination, looking for like-minded Tenno in Recruitment or by clanning up with a stealth-appreciative group of Tenno.

This is exactly why I was suggesting we add some more incentive to stealth in the first place.

[TheLoneNinja]

But I also get what everyone is saying, and if the Dev's say THEY want tit like L4D2 "In space" who am I to argue.

[SenorClipClop]

4 hours ago, TheLoneNinja said:

This is exactly why I was suggesting we add some more incentive to stealth in the first place.

In terms of  incentivizing stealth play, there arises an issue in regard to changing the game and player response, and it stems from the free and open nature of Warframe. Players have many different ways of accomplishing any goal, be it through tanking, stealth, burst damage or any number of effects or tactics. If DE makes stealth too rewarding, players will start to complain that they're being "forced" to play stealth or "punished" for not doing so. These complaints are a little absurd, but that's how a lot of the community would feel. However, if DE didn't reward stealth enough with new incentives, nothing would change. If DE rewarded effective stealth play by allowing players to further their stealth play (with exclusive mods, let's say), stealth would fall into a similar trap that all of Damage is falling into right now (certain upgrade paths become "mandatory", players will find the game too easy because of all the upgrades they have and DE will struggle to keep up with producing late-game content for players to further their play). Not to mention the exploits that might occur if they did this, considering that just one stealth Mod (Covert Lethality) is nearly game-breaking.

[Mario458]

yeah on the one hand its better that is an level where you can stealth likk but in the other hand when the Exterminate the best level of the best drop level its getting too hard for some players and it wouldn´t getting hard to find specific loot and then warframe is way to easy to farm loot i think it would be an bad idea when warframe add an stealth level and that the exterminate levels the best way to farm loot but it will be much easier when you wanna collect hard loot then players would much faster building their weapons and then they have much more fun.

[DSpite]

On 13/09/2016 at 2:26 AM, PrVonTuckIII said:

1) Unnecessary gimmick that would never be used.

2) Not my place to comment, but it would mean that Exterminates would be the new farming locations. Not the greatest thing to do.

3) Eh.

4) Gimmick that wouldn't be used at all. Doesn't really fit with the gameplay also.

5) Depends on the mission.

He obviously wants this game to turn into another game he likes better, like, FarCry.

Edited September 16, 2016 by DSpite

[TheLoneNinja]

On 9/16/2016 at 11:51 AM, DSpite said:

He obviously wants this game to turn into another game he likes better, like, FarCry.

No Warframe is great as it is.  I see everyones points.  Topic dropped.