How am I losing stealth multiplier on "sleeping" enemies?

[Calvyr]

I've been using Ivara to farm focus, but took a break from that for a little while. Since starting again a couple days ago, I'm finding that I'm not getting nearly the same gains as I was before. The biggest problem seems to be coming from the fact that I keep losing my stealth multiplier, even when killing enemies that were unalerted before I hit them with a sleep arrow. I'm even doing the stealth finisher moves, but still lose the multiplier. Am I doing something wrong, or is this some kind of bug?

[Irorone]

They've changed stealth just a bit.  If an enemy stumbles on a corpse they become "alerted" my guess is this is still happening even though they're asleep when the corpse of a nearby ally suddenly trips some proximity trigger in the code.

Edited November 27, 2016 by Irorone

[Cray]

It's far easier to alert enemies now, because of:

-Kills within line of sight

-Bodies within line of sight

-F#cking everything within line of sight

 

Also, even unalerted enemies will break your combo if you kill them within 5 seconds or so of them spawning.

[taiiat]

supposedly Enemies can notice others being Killed nearby, regardless of what state they are in, even incapacitated.

however, i have been unable to have this happen myself. incapacitated Enemies don't react to things. maybe if your Enemies are so close you're basically hitting both of them with your Animations, idk.

[Gelkor]

Because the message to people who use solo stealth to level weapons is clear: Stop using your weapons to level them up, go do an EXP farm instead. 

I can take the hint, no more max range max duration sleep arrow headshot leveling for me. I'll go spam Roar or EV instead.

[DatDarkOne]

Because of the changes and a few unintended glitches, you have to take stealth kills slower than before to keep the multiplier going.  Even then you will still have the problem of some glitches breaking the combo. 

Overall I like the A.I. changes as they make logical sense.  But I do think that we need some ways to completely destroy the bodies of enemies.  Ash is now able to do just that with Bladestorm.  Sadly he isn't able to get the stealth multiplier while doing it.  I recently suggested to Rebecca that maybe corrosive damage could destroy the bodies, and that adding an incentive in game to encourage using Stealth.  I got a reply back that suggests it will be taken into consideration. 

TL:DR- getting Stealth multipliers is much harder than before. 

Edited November 27, 2016 by DatDarkOne
corrected for clarity

[Xzorn]

2 hours ago, DatDarkOne said:

Because of the changes and a few unintended glitches, you have to take stealth kills slower than before to keep the multiplier going.  Even then you will still have the problem of some glitches breaking the combo. 

Overall I like the changes as they make logical sense.  But I do think that we need some ways to completely destroy the bodies of enemies.  Ash is now able to do just that with Bladestorm.  Sadly he isn't able to get the stealth multiplier while doing it.  I recently suggested to Rebecca that maybe corrosive damage could destroy the bodies, and that adding an incentive in game to encourage using Stealth.  I got a reply back that suggests it will be taken into consideration. 

TL:DR- getting Stealth multipliers is much harder than before. 

 

Eh, Loki / Ash get better Focus by rampaging through a mission swinging a polearm like a madman killing enemies before they can walk around and notice bodies than actually proceeding through the map slowly.  Not sure that really make sense.

Covert Lethality should dissolve corpses. Problem half solved.

The other half is that there's so many enemies clumped into one closet it's impossible to 100% play an execute play style without Sleep Arrow.

 

@Calvyr  It's likely the enemies you hit were already alerted or had just spawned. From my experience with Sleep arrow an enemy's alert status does not change under the effect of Sleep arrow. If they were alerted before you applied it, then they will remain alerted. I "think" this even goes for the 5s spawn as alerted status nonsense they added a while back. Also Noise arrow just flat out doesn't work the way it's supposed to. or used to. If you Noise arrow then sleep you will not get your multipliers.

It's also very buggy and doesn't always mind Line of Sight. I've seen enemies become alerted on the 2nd floor of a room without having LoS on the one I just killed. It also seems that the radius of alerted status you create when killing an enemy lingers far longer than it should.

[DatDarkOne]

15 minutes ago, Xzorn said:

Also Noise arrow just flat out doesn't work the way it's supposed to. or used to. If you Noise arrow then sleep you will not get your multipliers.

It's also very buggy and doesn't always mind Line of Sight. I've seen enemies become alerted on the 2nd floor of a room without having LoS on the one I just killed. It also seems that the radius of alerted status you create when killing an enemy lingers far longer than it should.

These are the glitches I was referring to.  You are also correct in what you said about rampaging through a mission getting more focus.  It's also why I suggested that there needs to be better in-game incentives for stealth gameplay.  Right now there aren't any.  Especially with the "smarter" AI and awareness glitches, there just isn't any reason to play stealthy.  Well outside of liking to play this way, which I do. 

edit: I just now realized that I wasn't specific in saying the enemy A.I. when I said changes.  :D

Edited November 27, 2016 by DatDarkOne
added info

[Calvyr]

Thanks all. It's very frustrating because I actually really enjoying doing the stealth exterminates and I agree that the changes to the AI are generally good and make sense. I was also using that gameplay to try to maximize my daily Simaris standing by scanning enemies before killing them. Unfortunately, it seems that I may have to burn more plat on a greater lens to put on an different frame to just spam Akkad or whatever. Sigh, so boring and cheesy.

[Shadow-Blades]

Also if you kill an enemy within (off the top of my head) 30 seconds of it spawning, it will not give a stealth multiplier and will therefore break any current stealth multiplier