Conclave mods in PvE

[Simmml]

As the headline says: Why can't we use conclave mods in PvE? Balancing? bad excuse. That stuff is in the game already, why not let us use it? Because lets be honest: Only maybe 2% of the players give a S#&$ about conclave, the rest hate it with a passion or just ignore it. Which means DE wastes cool ideas and dev time on something that is basically never used.

[Weidro]

there are quite some pvp mods that can be used in pve

kinda proofs that DE actually does include allow the useful ones on pve
or maybe just the ones that make sense in pve

I'm part of the 98% that hate pvp with a passion not just in warframe but in all games
and i don't like the idea of allowing all pvp mods in pve simply for the reason that it would force me to play pvp to get the mods
the pvp mods that can be used in pve can be farmed in pve content which is fair

[Nazrethim]

The idea has been proposed pretty much since DE introduced Conclave mods. The only ones I can't see moving to PvE would be the +/- Mobility mods due to such stat not existing in PvE (unless DE adds it and tweaks +bulletjump mods to instead give Mobility).

The only "problem" is the debate if they should or not drop from PvE sources, with ProDrop (mostly PvE players who hate Conclave and don't want anything to do with it) stating the mods should drop from grunts or crewmen or Rathuum/Index/Sentients and Conclave players pointing it the mods not dropping avoids the problem of PvP mods clogging PvE droptables (like what happens with Sentients already) as well as giving an incentive to play Conclave. And of course the bunch of PvE-only AND Conclave regulars who don't mind either result.

[Nazrethim]

1 minute ago, Weidro said:

and i don't like the idea of allowing all pvp mods in pve simply for the reason that it would force me to play pvp to get the mods

the pvp mods that can be used in pve can be farmed in pve content which is fair

Here we go again.. (no offense to you ^^)

You can trade for the mods. And SpringLoaded Broadhead can be used in PvE but only obtained trough Conclave standing, so there's a precedent (same way applies to slide-shoot mods though).

It's not really fair, as if you want to use a weapon or frame in Conclave you HAVE to get it trough PvE, or platinum, there's no way around it. Getting something only trough PvP wouldn't be different. In PvE we have similar thing with Nidus (salvaje only) and Ivara (spy only).

[Simmml]

I mean... Yes some mods can be dropped by the sentients already for example. My main point tho are the warframe augment mods. 

An option for drop locations could be endless missions for example. Now hear me out before you scream murder.

You pick a warframe of your choice and hop into an endless mission. In rotation C this mod has a 2% drop chance (just placce holder numbers, please..). If you go to 40 minutes (also rotation C) that chance increases to 5% for example. The mod that will drop will depend on the warframe yoo used. So a Volt can only drop volt augment mods.

The problem I have with the already available mods is that they are just boring stat increrases. What I want are mods like http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Rumbled

 

 

[Skaleek]

I would especially love if the mods that convert one IPS to the other would be usable. Could turn my impact shotgun into a slash shotgun, oh baby.

[Simmml]

7 minutes ago, Skaleek said:

I would especially love if the mods that convert one IPS to the other would be usable. Could turn my impact shotgun into a slash shotgun, oh baby.

I can see that becoming a bit of an issue, but capping it to for example "converts 50% of Impact and puncture damage to slash" would be neat

 

[KirukaChan]

31 minutes ago, Skaleek said:

I would especially love if the mods that convert one IPS to the other would be usable. Could turn my impact shotgun into a slash shotgun, oh baby.

It's only a 20% damage shift. It's not enough to change a weapon's focal point, more to just kind of balance it out.

I would love some of the Warframe Augments, as well as some of the weapon-specific mods (like the one for Supra that gives it +100% accuracy when aiming down the sights).

[Skaleek]

3 minutes ago, KirukaChan said:

It's only a 20% damage shift. It's not enough to change a weapon's focal point, more to just kind of balance it out.

I would love some of the Warframe Augments, as well as some of the weapon-specific mods (like the one for Supra that gives it +100% accuracy when aiming down the sights).

Yep, I know, its enough to shift a weapons proc chances though. I think they'd be great in PvE, and they dont actually add more damage so there's that as well. The PvP mods are fairly well balanced, especially when compared to our current meta mods.

[Nazrethim]

10 minutes ago, Simmml said:

I mean... Yes some mods can be dropped by the sentients already for example. My main point tho are the warframe augment mods. 

An option for drop locations could be endless missions for example. Now hear me out before you scream murder.

You pick a warframe of your choice and hop into an endless mission. In rotation C this mod has a 2% drop chance (just placce holder numbers, please..). If you go to 40 minutes (also rotation C) that chance increases to 5% for example. The mod that will drop will depend on the warframe yoo used. So a Volt can only drop volt augment mods.

The problem I have with the already available mods is that they are just boring stat increrases. What I want are mods like http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Rumbled

The augments are synd rewards, I think they should stay that way. They are tradable after all, like the PvE Warframe Augments.

Gunmods on the other hand are random chance end-of-match rewards, so they could be added to droptables that make sense, like Techs dropping the Supra mod Directed Convergence or Kuva Lancers (armed with Grinloks) dropping the Grinlok mod 'Grinloked'

Stances are dirt cheap rank 1 rewards so they should be fine as they are, or could be added to Rathuum, and Rathuum always rewarding a Stance or Endo, with the stance pool including all PvE stances and all Conclave stances.

[Simmml]

1 minute ago, Nazrethim said:

The augments are synd rewards, I think they should stay that way. They are tradable after all, like the PvE Warframe Augments.

Gunmods on the other hand are random chance end-of-match rewards, so they could be added to droptables that make sense, like Techs dropping the Supra mod Directed Convergence or Kuva Lancers (armed with Grinloks) dropping the Grinlok mod 'Grinloked'

Stances are dirt cheap rank 1 rewards so they should be fine as they are, or could be added to Rathuum, and Rathuum always rewarding a Stance or Endo, with the stance pool including all PvE stances and all Conclave stances.

That would dilute the droptables even further. Which is why I am not a big fan of it. I can see the appeal tho

[Heckzu]

10 minutes ago, Skaleek said:

Yep, I know, its enough to shift a weapons proc chances though. I think they'd be great in PvE, and they dont actually add more damage so there's that as well. The PvP mods are fairly well balanced, especially when compared to our current meta mods.

Increasing your status chance or equipping a +IPS mod would probably provide a bigger shift to procs than the 20% IPS conversion mods, especially since the IPS conversion mods ignore elemental damage in the calculation.

Edited April 13, 2017 by Heckzu

[Skaleek]

2 minutes ago, Heckzu said:

Increasing your status chance or equipping a +IPS would probably provide a bigger shift to procs than the 20% conversion mods, especially since the IPS conversion mods ignore elemental damage in the calculation.

Why not both? In fact if the conversion mod worked first then it would make the 120% mods even more powerful. Also if a weapon has 0 slash and you use the conversion mod, it adds more than the 120% mods, just sayin.

Edited April 13, 2017 by Skaleek

[Nazrethim]

Just now, Simmml said:

That would dilute the droptables even further. Which is why I am not a big fan of it. I can see the appeal tho

Well, Techs and Kuva Lancers don't really drop anything worth atm. Stalker could get Heavy Impact replaced by Despair mod 'Draining Gloom'.

I did point out that adding Conclave mods to PvE droptables would dilute the whole thing. You idea isn't any better either, a 2% dropchance on RotC's is extremely grindy, compare that to having 5% chance (standard for rare mods) of getting Supra mod from Techs (which are fairly common enemies). Basically, add gunmods to enemies that wield the same weapon (that would leave tenno weapons only obtainable from Conclave matches, but that's acceptable)

[Skaleek]

3 minutes ago, Nazrethim said:

Well, Techs and Kuva Lancers don't really drop anything worth atm. Stalker could get Heavy Impact replaced by Despair mod 'Draining Gloom'.

I did point out that adding Conclave mods to PvE droptables would dilute the whole thing. You idea isn't any better either, a 2% dropchance on RotC's is extremely grindy, compare that to having 5% chance (standard for rare mods) of getting Supra mod from Techs (which are fairly common enemies). Basically, add gunmods to enemies that wield the same weapon (that would leave tenno weapons only obtainable from Conclave matches, but that's acceptable)

Could make them mission rewards from rathuum/index.

[Nazrethim]

Just now, Skaleek said:

Why not both? In fact if the conversion mod worked first then it would make the 120% mods even more powerful. Also if a weapon has 0 slash and you use the conversion mod, it adds more than the 120% mods, just sayin.

You missunderstand how the conversion works. If a weapon has NO damage of the type you are equipping, the mod doesn't work. ie: your weapon needs at least 1 point of Slash to convert damage to it.

[KirukaChan]

35 minutes ago, Skaleek said:

Yep, I know, its enough to shift a weapons proc chances though. I think they'd be great in PvE, and they dont actually add more damage so there's that as well. The PvP mods are fairly well balanced, especially when compared to our current meta mods.

Honestly, I'd love if ALL of the PvE mods were balanced like PvP's are. It'd be a hell of a lot easier for DE to balance their game. Not to mention modding (particularly for weapons) would involve a lot more actual decision-making than it does now. I'd love to see the DPS calculators become obsolete and for modding to become more of a matter of complimenting one's own fighting style.

[Skaleek]

5 minutes ago, Nazrethim said:

You missunderstand how the conversion works. If a weapon has NO damage of the type you are equipping, the mod doesn't work. ie: your weapon needs at least 1 point of Slash to convert damage to it.

Yeah you're right. Well, still, even if a weapon had 0.1 slash it would add more (proc chance) than the 120% ips mod, point stands. Or the 5/5/90 or the 10/10/80. Dont feel like getting bogged down in the minutia, i want the conversion mods in PvE. You don't have to use them if you feel like they arent worth the slot.

Edited April 13, 2017 by Skaleek

[Omnipower]

1 minute ago, KirukaChan said:

Honestly, I'd love if ALL of the PvE mods were balanced like PvP's are. It'd be a hell of a lot easier for DE to balance their game. Not to mention modding (particularly for weapons) would involve a lot more actual decision-making than it does now. I'd love to see the DPS calculators become obsolete and for modding to become more of a matter of complimenting one's own fighting style.

First i agree with what you said but it also requires the changing many other mechanics in the game and at the top of that list is enemy scaling/EHP/Armor

[Nazrethim]

Just now, KirukaChan said:

Honestly, I'd love if ALL of the PvE mods were balanced like PvP's are. It'd be a hell of a lot easier for DE to balance their game. Not to mention modding (particularly for weapons) would involve a lot more actual decision-making than it does now. I'd love to see the DPS calculators become obsolete and for modding to become more of a matter of complimenting one's own fighting style.

You mean making mods convert damage (and add the type if it's missing) instead of adding damage. Like, instead of say, Infected Clip adding 90% Toxin damage it would convert around 30% of the weapons damage to Toxin. So if you have a weapon that deals 100 IPS, it would deal 70 IPS+30Toxin

[Simmml]

An IPS conversion mod would be amazing. Look at the Tiberon for example. It has its damage spread evenly over all 3 types. Now if I could convert 50% of both Impact and puncture to slash that would be great!

The percentage drop numbers were place holders. If yyou did read all I wrote in that sentence you'd know that.

In general I am not opposed to tehm droping from Rathuum for example. More reason to play those nodes.

[Nazrethim]

Just now, Omnipower said:

First i agree with what you said but it also requires the changing many other mechanics in the game and at the top of that list is enemy scaling/EHP/Armor

Not really, just tone down the level scaling rate. Instead of enemies gaining 5-10 levels per wave they would gain 1.

[Nazrethim]

Just now, Simmml said:

An IPS conversion mod would be amazing. Look at the Tiberon for example. It has its damage spread evenly over all 3 types. Now if I could convert 50% of both Impact and puncture to slash that would be great!

Tiberon is a Puncture weapon, you are thinking of Sybaris.

[Skaleek]

4 minutes ago, Nazrethim said:

Tiberon is a Puncture weapon, you are thinking of Sybaris.

15/30/15 is puncture but still rather balanced in the grand scheme. 25%/50%/25%. Would be a good candidate for conversion mods. I know theres a 33/33/33 weapon i just cant remember what it is...

Edited April 13, 2017 by Skaleek

[Omnipower]

Just now, Nazrethim said:

Not really, just tone down the level scaling rate. Instead of enemies gaining 5-10 levels per wave they would gain 1.

See thats where you are wrong some enemies only spawn(reasonably) at certain lvls lets use corpus techs for example if you were to go to venus you wouldnt see a tech until probably around 20min mark 15 if you lucky and only 1 every minute probably(RNG amirite) and since some mobs spawn on only one planet that would make it a hassle farming many of them so no enemy scaling/armor/ehp needs to be altered not the lvl scaling its a nicce idea when you wanna farm low lvl mobs though like prodmen that stop spawning after a while.