Problem with ASH gameplay + LVL100+

[Blackopz]

Been trying to play ash in different builds, too squishy for melee builds with great mods only 150 armor. Ultimate slowed down its not bad, always lose either efficiency or duration or even power in builds. Narramon is the easy way, but with the SS augment does it mean hes meant to be more of a sniper role. Scout the area stay back and fire, smoke reposition and ulti to keep up kills. Very confused when it comes to keeping my melee counter alive past 2.5x and getting enough kills to spawn enemies/basic fun. Tips?

[-N7-Leonhart]

I would consider Ash to be the perfect balance between Stealth and resilience. If you look at Loki, what I absolutely didn't liked about it is that it's too squishy. Any AoE or whatever will bring him to it's knees, even if the invisibility lasts longer. And these days the game is filled with AoE attacks, while not as much 2 years ago.

[(PSN)fullblast35]

Stealth multiplier increases damage 6X.  Ash is a stealth frame, if your invisibility doesn't have duration ash isn't that useful.  as for your melee , if it's slash based you could use relentless combination in substitute for body count, but drifting contact always helps.  if its also a critical melee or has. decent start at the same time, condition overload and blood rush are a plus.   CO will add +60% damage for every damage type afflicted to the enemy.

[Blackopz]

 

11 minutes ago, -N7-Leonhart said:

I would consider Ash to be the perfect balance between Stealth and resilience. If you look at Loki, what I absolutely didn't liked about it is that it's too squishy. Any AoE or whatever will bring him to it's knees, even if the invisibility lasts longer. And these days the game is filled with AoE attacks, while not as much 2 years ago.

I still find him ASh gets raped by knockdowns, forced to use Handsprings or something to keep on the move. I have Arcane Momentum and I put Steel Fiber for max armor!

6 minutes ago, (PS4)fullblast35 said:

Stealth multiplier increases damage 6X.  Ash is a stealth frame, if your invisibility doesn't have duration ash isn't that useful.  as for your melee , if it's slash based you could use relentless combination in substitute for body count, but drifting contact always helps.  if its also a critical melee or has. decent start at the same time, condition overload and blood rush are a plus.   CO will add +60% damage for every damage type afflicted to the enemy.

Understood, stealth damage is effective as I do run Narramon when I have to...my only problem is fitting enough duration like you said its important but with Rage > Vitality > Steel Fiber > Fatal Teleport > Seeking S > P Flow > Transient Fort and P Continuity. Cant seem to get a perfect balance as I feel like both Fatal teleport and Seeking Shuriken is epic. Life strike on weapon for healing and pure crit build, Nikana Prime 2 forma.

Edited August 13, 2017 by Blackopz

[Nazrethim]

This is my usual go-to build for pretty much everything, including lvl100+ enemies.

Ash:

Note: the Augment slot varies depending on mission: Smoke Shadow for ally-focused missions, Fatal Teleport mostly for Solo and 'kill everythin' missions and Seeking Shuriken for Sortie Bossfights.

Note 2: The trick is NEVER use Failstorm, at all.

Spoiler

Nikana Prime (mostly, I have like 12 or so melee weapons I alternate)

Spoiler

And my loyal Bruno:

Spoiler

 

Edited August 13, 2017 by Nazrethim

[-N7-Leonhart]

23 minutes ago, Nazrethim said:

This is my usual go-to build for pretty much everything, including lvl100+ enemies.

Where is the duration? A lot of mods for mobility and survivability are good and all, but there is nothing that can compare to the Smoke Screen as the absolute form of defense.

Or do you depend 100% on Naramon? It's fine to lean on a crutch while it's still durable, but keep in mind that there is a great chance that Focus will soon change forms when Focus 2.0 hits, and a lot of buffs to the underused stuff and nerfs to the status quo.

That is why I prefer to make my builds 100% independent on what Focus I use, and I merely view Focus passives as a nice boost to have but nothing too special.

Edited August 13, 2017 by -N7-Leonhart

[Nazrethim]

2 minutes ago, -N7-Leonhart said:

Where is the duration? A lot of mods for mobility and survivability are good and all, but there is nothing that can compare to the Smoke Screen as the absolute form of defense.

8s is enough to wipe the floor with most enemies, the ones that aren't can be dispatched with Fatal Teleport. Or to retreat to a more advantageous position.

2 minutes ago, -N7-Leonhart said:

Or do you depend 100% on Naramon? It's fine to lean on a crutch while it's still durable, but keep in mind that there is a great chance that Focus will soon change forms when Focus 2.0 hits, and a lot of buffs to the underused stuff and nerfs to the status quo.

Funny thing, I spent a lot of time on Naramon's Shadow Step, then moved on to Zenurik's Energy Overflow. Nowadays I use Naramon with Shadow Step disabled, just using the +Crit passive. And I'm doing almost as fine, I only have to pay more attention to what is happening.

2 minutes ago, -N7-Leonhart said:

That is why I prefer to make my builds 100% independent on what Focus I use, and I merely view Focus passives as a nice boost to have but nothing too special.

I think frames should be balanced around default stats, if they work at default stats they are well designed. Blade Storm is designed around max efficiency (a broken stat I might add) so it's utter garbage, hence why made a point of not using it at all. It does have a function in my playstyle: highlighting enemies in dark areas to shoot them more accuratedly.

If you read the Ash Revisited Megathread, I make a solid point of the frame needing a touch again, a good one.

[Xzorn]

Stealth multipliers were nerfed,

You will cause 8x damage on the first hit with a 4 second CD. This translates to 0.5 - 2x DPS depending on your attack speed.

If you're intention is to take Ash to lvl 100 and beyond then I'd suggest forgetting about Defensive mods completely.

Ash is an invisible frame. They're immortal as long as you don't make a mistake and in case of scaling defensive mods will make little to no difference with that mistake. Focus on Duration, Efficiency and if using Seeking Shuriken 145% Power Strength for 100% armor strip. Ash's 4th ability doesn't scale well and it's by far his weakest ability. I personally never use it.

If you want to melee with Ash; focus on a bleed build weapon. Ash only does Bleed status effects and his passive gives a massive bonus to that status effect so it's ideal to Focus on this as his damage output.

This would be an optimized Melee Bleed build:

Spoiler

You can swap Primed Reach for Condition Overload or True Steel. I prefer hitting more than one target.

If you're using Seeking Shuriken then a Viral comp weapon is ideal and efficiency is very critical to spam the ability.

An Ash build can vary depending on your energy needs.  Just go Duration > Efficiency > Power and nothing more than a Stretch mod to counter Narrow Minded. My Ash builds might be more confusing than helpful because I incorporate Arcanes but you should not need Naramon to make Ash function well. I've taken him to lvl 1,300 without Defensive mods or Naramon. You just have to watch his Invis timers and know what you can and can't get away with. Two other crucial tips would be to roll away after using Invis and try to do it mid-air. Enemies will always attack where you became visible also never use Radiation on your weapons.

[Nazrethim]

19 minutes ago, Xzorn said:

Stealth multipliers were nerfed,

You will cause 8x damage on the first hit with a 4 second CD. This translates to 0.5 - 2x DPS depending on your attack speed.

If you're intention is to take Ash to lvl 100 and beyond then I'd suggest forgetting about Defensive mods completely.

Ash is an invisible frame. They're immortal as long as you don't make a mistake and in case of scaling defensive mods will make little to no difference with that mistake. Focus on Duration, Efficiency and if using Seeking Shuriken 145% Power Strength for 100% armor strip. Ash's 4th ability doesn't scale well and it's by far his weakest ability. I personally never use it.

If you want to melee with Ash; focus on a bleed build weapon. Ash only does Bleed status effects and his passive gives a massive bonus to that status effect so it's ideal to Focus on this as his damage output.

This would be an optimized Melee Bleed build:

  Hide contents

You can swap Primed Reach for Condition Overload or True Steel. I prefer hitting more than one target.

If you're using Seeking Shuriken then a Viral comp weapon is ideal and efficiency is very critical to spam the ability.

An Ash build can vary depending on your energy needs.  Just go Duration > Efficiency > Power and nothing more than a Stretch mod to counter Narrow Minded. My Ash builds might be more confusing than helpful because I incorporate Arcanes but you should not need Naramon to make Ash function well. I've taken him to lvl 1,300 without Defensive mods or Naramon. You just have to watch his Invis timers and know what you can and can't get away with. Two other crucial tips would be to roll away after using Invis and try to do it mid-air. Enemies will always attack where you became visible also never use Radiation on your weapons.

Really nice.

Also, I use Defensive mods, but I mentioned lvl100+. With the build I posted I hit my ceiling at 200-250 (mostly out of boredom, I'm confident I could reach further). Defensive mods become pretty much worthless at about lvl150.

I also like two things about your comment:

+You specify the levels the thing is designed around.

+You agree the Blade Storm is actually not worth using.

[rudman88]

1. Naramon

-> if you arer using naramon, you should try the 3rd skill augment. with anramon the damage scale up very high.

-> use a weapon with crit. With your smoke, is easy to chop a stunned target while invi

 

2. Ash build

-> in the past, people will go for str efficiency and spam blade storm.

-> now is better you go balance built. more duration efficiency, str range.

-> as long you got the smoke, keep your distance from eximus or shield people you will be fine.

 

3. Knockback

-> you can block knockback by simply parrying ( hold right click default in pc while using melee)

-> it will push you back but ignore damage.

http://warframe.wikia.com/wiki/Melee_2.0

-> if you cant catch up, use power driftt.

[DarthKadra]

After the rework Ash needs duration on Smoke Screen, you want to stay invisible at all times. 18-20 seconds should be your target, so that you don't have to recast too often.

Fatal Teleport is a nice augment which you can alternate with your weapons as the main way of killing things. Naturally, you'll want to pair it with a dagger and Covert Lethality. A dagger is actually the best weapon for Ash skillwise, because it will result in quick executions both with Fatal Teleport and Bladestorm. 

You can use Smoke Shadow for Kuva missions to help all those people who will go to any lengths just not to take an invisible frame and stand quietly waiting for Kuva, but prefer to create all kinds of chaos near the siphon.

Seeking Shuriken - good for boss assassinations at high levels. 

Bladestorm's usefulness has been limited, but it's still a very strong skill, if situational. If you pair it with a fast weapon with a bleed build (Sheev is great, cause it's also a very strong dagger by itself) and Relentless Combination you can build up the multiplier for Bladestorm within seconds (at high levels, where enemies are more durable, otherwise you'll just be killing them too quick). Add Zenurik and a little bit of efficiency and you can dish out lots of damage spamming Bladestorm with quick 360 turns even with moderate strength. 

My build (augments can be switched depending on the mission)

                   Steel Charge - Power Drift

Intensify -  Fatal Teleport - Streamline - Primed Flow           (Could use Transient Fortitude for some more power and a bit less duration)

Vitality - Primed Continuity - Narrow Minded - Stretch

Fatal Teleport and weapons for most kills, Bladestorm occasionally, Smoke Screen on cooldown. Zenurik focus.

As concerns Steel Fiber and Armored Agility - I can understand running Steel Fiber if you are not planning to use Smoke Screen on cooldown, but it's not gonna make much difference at high levels, if only leave you with a sliver of health now and then instead of dying, but you can just avoid getting hit altogether with Smoke Screen. As for Armored Agility - it's absolutely totally useless for Ash in terms of armor, in fact, even on a Valkyr it will change little to nothing.

Well, probably goes without saying, but if you use Naramon there's no point talking about builds, you can put on whatever mods you like.

[(PSN)MrNishi]

3 hours ago, Xzorn said:

Stealth multipliers were nerfed,

You will cause 8x damage on the first hit with a 4 second CD. This translates to 0.5 - 2x DPS depending on your attack speed.

If you're intention is to take Ash to lvl 100 and beyond then I'd suggest forgetting about Defensive mods completely.

Ash is an invisible frame. They're immortal as long as you don't make a mistake and in case of scaling defensive mods will make little to no difference with that mistake. Focus on Duration, Efficiency and if using Seeking Shuriken 145% Power Strength for 100% armor strip. Ash's 4th ability doesn't scale well and it's by far his weakest ability. I personally never use it.

If you want to melee with Ash; focus on a bleed build weapon. Ash only does Bleed status effects and his passive gives a massive bonus to that status effect so it's ideal to Focus on this as his damage output.

This would be an optimized Melee Bleed build:

  Reveal hidden contents

You can swap Primed Reach for Condition Overload or True Steel. I prefer hitting more than one target.

If you're using Seeking Shuriken then a Viral comp weapon is ideal and efficiency is very critical to spam the ability.

An Ash build can vary depending on your energy needs.  Just go Duration > Efficiency > Power and nothing more than a Stretch mod to counter Narrow Minded. My Ash builds might be more confusing than helpful because I incorporate Arcanes but you should not need Naramon to make Ash function well. I've taken him to lvl 1,300 without Defensive mods or Naramon. You just have to watch his Invis timers and know what you can and can't get away with. Two other crucial tips would be to roll away after using Invis and try to do it mid-air. Enemies will always attack where you became visible also never use Radiation on your weapons.

Stealth Melee Multipliers got both nerfed and buffed.

 

Stealth used to be 400% or 4x but some Damage over time status effects multi-dipping.

DE normalized Stealth Melee Multiplier to 8x (800%) for players that were not using Gas, Toxic, and Bleed procs they got a straight buff.

• Players using the multi-dipping status procs saw a damage Nerf, but it wasn't as horrible as being lowered to 4x (Plus the instant burst damage was buffed)

 

@Blackopz

When fighting enemies at higher levels (or any level where you can be 1-shot) the gameplay objective is to safely dispatch the enemy.

For melee that usually entails either CC'ing the enemies or being invisible to not be attacked.

For Ash..he more/or less relies on Invisibility and staying mobile.

Loki can remove guns so it is even easier for him to maintain a mobility advantage over the no-longer ranged firing enemies.

 

If you are looking at long endurance type play...this revolves more around picking a good spot to continually kill enemies with just enough room to be mobile to avoid AoE splash damage. Then using the utility portions of Warframe Abilities like Armor removal, support energy/damage buffs, and Invisibility/Invincibility. Keeping a rotation that allows some breathing room in case of the inevitable.

[Xzorn]

3 minutes ago, (PS4)MrNishi said:

Stealth Melee Multipliers got both nerfed and buffed.

Stealth used to be 400% or 4x but some Damage over time status effects multi-dipping.

DE normalized Stealth Melee Multiplier to 8x (800%) for players that were not using Gas, Toxic, and Bleed procs they got a straight buff.

• Players using the multi-dipping status procs saw a damage Nerf, but it wasn't as horrible as being lowered to 4x (Plus the instant burst damage was buffed)

 

Stealth Multipliers have always been 8x.

The double dip for Bleeds was x64 and Gas DoT x512

Stealth Multipliers were nered in U21 by giving the multiplier a CD of 4 seconds for general melee.

Some effects like gunblade shots, executes and none standard melee don't suffer the cooldown. I think consoles just got this update or it's coming up next but stealth now only gives around 2x overall DPS since melee attacks inside the CD don't get stealth multipliers.

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

@Blackopz The ideal Ash uses and combines all tools the game is giving you just like the ninja that he is.

Just build him for max efficiency, positive strength, balanced duration, preferably add the teleport augument and rage to the mix, use a carrier...everything else is a question of how you set him up.

Naramon is one of the choices you have, the other one is Arcane Trickery. You want to use both and i recommend you combining it with Arcane Strike for a decent Speed boost while in Bladestorm (speed>power on that one), one that is further amplified trough melee Riven mods (aim for 2+ 1- attack speed on a decent disposition), (Primed) Fury and Quickening (that one is optional).

 

You should aim to switch back and forth between melee and Bladestorm...Teleport in on enemys, melee a few, mark from afar while you're at it and activate it once you're done in close range. The teleport augument doubles the finisher damage of melee weapons so anything is fine, slash weapons are just to be prefered (his passive). This activates eather Trickery or Naramon, his smokebomb acts as a cover should none of those be active. The energy you loose in the process is hardly a problem with Bladestorm teleporting you physicly over a big area, what means instant pick up of orbs of this area, rage is still a rather nice energy source should you run low regardless. Activate smokebomb once you got enough or jump into one of those corpus ground mines and proceed.

You gain melee damage from the invisibility, combo from the melee, a damage boost trough the combo to your bladestorm. The damage shown on your ability screen is but 1/3 of what it actually does trough the slash proccs, this plus the combo does ridiculous damage for an "AoE" ability. Each additional mark on an enemy activates a clone after you attacked for 2-3x this damage...what the others told you is only partly true for ash who is a power house running finisher damage, which makes scaling irrelevant to an extend. Just stick to his basics, put less effort into him then you put into his tools and you're gonna do just fine.

[(PSN)MrNishi]

2 hours ago, Xzorn said:

 

Stealth Multipliers have always been 8x.

The double dip for Bleeds was x64 and Gas DoT x512

Stealth Multipliers were nered in U21 by giving the multiplier a CD of 4 seconds for general melee.

Some effects like gunblade shots, executes and none standard melee don't suffer the cooldown. I think consoles just got this update or it's coming up next but stealth now only gives around 2x overall DPS since melee attacks inside the CD don't get stealth multipliers.

Update 15.13 changed normalized weapon class Stealth Melee Finisher 

• Finisher damage will now increase based on weapon rank and enemy level. Finisher Damage for stealth kills capped at 8x damage with max rank melee weapon!

That 8x was said by DE Scott to be 32x because of 400% Stealth Melee Multiplier

(Will is wrong, but I'm tired of trying to get it corrected only to have someone revert it back to varying Finisher Multipliers for different melee weapon classes.)

 

So if he was wrong then it was actually 64x for Stealth Melee Finishers as they are the Melee weapon level multiple combined with the Stealth Melee Multiplier.

Previously most Melee classes were 1600% total which was from 4x  Stealth Melee Multiplier times 4x Finisher damage. Hammers were 2400% which would have been 600% Hammer finisher damage times the 400% Stealth Melee Multiplier.

Stealth Melee Multiplier used to match 400% Ground Finisher damage except armor ignore.

 

I was under the impression that Stealth Melee Multipliers base were buffed from 400% to 800% and previous builds like Gu13 gameplay match those number changes.

But it is good to know that they were 800% (8x)

[Xzorn]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)MrNishi said:

-Snip-

 

Melee Stealth Multipliers and Executes / Finishers are different things.

If the enemy cannot see you; You will gain an x8 damage multiplier on any melee attack,

Finishers are separate multipliers that are used for specific attacks (Prompted Executes).

[Blackopz]

Finisher damage is health damage based, goes through armor. But caps on health as enemy gets stronger, thus Covert Lethality needed. 

@(PS4)CoolD2108 I will try it, I build him for deffense and 0 efficiency because of Rage. Why have efficiency when I get all my energy back within 3-5 seconds of enemy damage.

[(PSN)MrNishi]

1 hour ago, Xzorn said:

 

Melee Stealth Multipliers and Executes / Finishers are different things.

If the enemy cannot see you; You will gain an x8 damage multiplier on any melee attack,

Finishers are separate multipliers that are used for specific attacks (Prompted Executes).

Stealth Finishers and Parry Finishers still use the Stealth Melee Multiplier for damage calculation.

Attacks that trigger Stealth/Parry prompted finishers also allow for Stealth Melee Multiplier combo/Quick-melee attacks dependent on positioning.

(Justice Proc, Blind, Non-Augment Paralysis, melee combos/charge attacks)

 

The Damage for Obex Finishers was 400% with 400% Stealth Melee Multiplier for a total of 1600% then update 15.13 buffed it to 800% (at Rank 30)with 400% Stealth Melee Multiplier for 3200% total Stealth Finisher Multiplier. Current in game on PS4 Obex deals 6400% Melee Multiplier; 800% at Rank 30 times 800% Stealth Melee Multiplier.

 

I'll try to find link showing DE stating old 400% Stealth Melee Multiplier

[Xzorn]

22 minutes ago, (PS4)MrNishi said:

I'll try to find link showing DE stating old 400% Stealth Melee Multiplier

 

I've already said I'm not talking about Finishers.

I assume console just hasn't gotten the update yet. I'm talking about the previous always on x8 multiplier you get for being invisible. It's no longer there. It will work with Finishers, Gunblade shots, Blind effects and abilities but when it comes to invisible melee combo attacks there is a period where you will not get the stealth bonus. You will do normal white number damage.

[(PSN)MrNishi]

45 minutes ago, Xzorn said:

 

I've already said I'm not talking about Finishers.

I assume console just hasn't gotten the update yet. I'm talking about the previous always on x8 multiplier you get for being invisible. It's no longer there. It will work with Finishers, Gunblade shots, Blind effects and abilities but when it comes to invisible melee combo attacks there is a period where you will not get the stealth bonus. You will do normal white number damage.

We on consoles just recently got the x8 Stealth Melee Multiplier it used to be 4x for Stealth Melee Multiplier non-finisher attacks

(Except Broken Scepter and Kesheg they were at 2x for Stealth Melee Multiplier until the recent change that Normalized Stealth Melee Multiplier at flat 8x damage)*

Referencing non-finisher Normal Melee Stealth Melee Multiplier:

Melee had a Range Problem around 16.5 (Fixed in PS4 17.1.4 Game Update)

Bug that happened during Melee Range being broken and DE trying to fix it:

That is when 800% Stealth Melee Multiplier was added to most weapons but not all. 

Most recently Kesheg and Broken Scepter were the easiest to test and see lower Stealth Melee Multiplier until the patch came that Normalized Stealth Melee Multiplier to 8x across the board.

Edited August 14, 2017 by (PS4)MrNishi

[(PSN)CoolD2108]

2 hours ago, Blackopz said:

Finisher damage is health damage based, goes through armor. But caps on health as enemy gets stronger, thus Covert Lethality needed. 

@(PS4)CoolD2108 I will try it, I build him for deffense and 0 efficiency because of Rage. Why have efficiency when I get all my energy back within 3-5 seconds of enemy damage.

Cause you wanna avoid it later on essencially, plus you can really have both ^^

[Xzorn]

43 minutes ago, (PS4)MrNishi said:

-Snip-

 

How exactly is something over 2 years ago relevant to the topic at hand?

I've explained the interaction multiple times and you start talking about Finisher damage and a change to double drip damage over time effects that was reduced Feb this year. For over 2  years it has been x8 damage. It was recently changed, nerfed, reduced in effect, less powerful. Just as I said. Yet you felt the need to correct that with nothing relevant.

 

7 hours ago, (PS4)MrNishi said:

Stealth Melee Multipliers got both nerfed and buffed.

Rhino used to be immortal to all damage but they added the Health Conversion changes so he can get a 200k Iron Skin. It got both nerfed and buffed though. Cuz what happened 4 years ago is relevant. Is that how this works?

[(PSN)MrNishi]

10 hours ago, Xzorn said:

 

How exactly is something over 2 years ago relevant to the topic at hand?

I've explained the interaction multiple times and you start talking about Finisher damage and a change to double drip damage over time effects that was reduced Feb this year. For over 2  years it has been x8 damage. It was recently changed, nerfed, reduced in effect, less powerful. Just as I said. Yet you felt the need to correct that with nothing relevant.

 

Rhino used to be immortal to all damage but they added the Health Conversion changes so he can get a 200k Iron Skin. It got both nerfed and buffed though. Cuz what happened 4 years ago is relevant. Is that how this works?

I was trying to state that their was a recent update that 'Nomralized' Stealth Melee Multiplier as 8x for every melee weapon and that also included boosting the Melee Finisher damage. 

Before that update some weapons were still using 400% (Machete Wraith, Cronus, Kestrel, Sarpa, Tonbo, Scoliac, etc.. or 200% Stealth Melee Multipliers (Broken Scepter & Kesheg)

Most of the popular Melee weapons were already 8x and that to me counted as a buff to most of the melee weapon class. However I see it was only a nerf because it lowered DoTs on the popular Melee weapons and no one cares that finishers got stronger as a result of the Stealth Melee Multiplier being made 8x as base.

(For PS4, this was April's 20.0.9 Update in 2017)

The stealth melee multiplier having a 4-sec cooldown, I assume must be in the 21.0.3 PS4 update which deploys today August 14th.

Edited August 14, 2017 by (PS4)MrNishi

[Nazrethim]

On 13/8/2017 at 9:18 PM, Blackopz said:

Finisher damage is health damage based, goes through armor. But caps on health as enemy gets stronger, thus Covert Lethality needed. 

@(PS4)CoolD2108 I will try it, I build him for deffense and 0 efficiency because of Rage. Why have efficiency when I get all my energy back within 3-5 seconds of enemy damage.

Because without Efficiency Blade Storm is flat out not viable. It drains, by default, more energy than the frame has capacity for on a single wave of enemies, let alone a whole mission. Basically DE balanced BS around having Max Efficiency, which means if you don't run with those two mod slots with that stat, you are flat out stripped of your "ultimate" ability, which isn't that bad as it's easily outclassed by Smoke Screen+GoodMelee and Fatal Teleport. Rage only serves if you get hit, which past lvl 120 is suicidal unless you leave a single enemy alive for a short period and absorb a hit or two while blocking (blocking reduces the damage but Rage gives you energy as if you took all the damage).

Without that Stat BS is useless, with the stat it becomes usable but still not worth using.

[Blackopz]

1 hour ago, Nazrethim said:

Because without Efficiency Blade Storm is flat out not viable. It drains, by default, more energy than the frame has capacity for on a single wave of enemies, let alone a whole mission. Basically DE balanced BS around having Max Efficiency, which means if you don't run with those two mod slots with that stat, you are flat out stripped of your "ultimate" ability, which isn't that bad as it's easily outclassed by Smoke Screen+GoodMelee and Fatal Teleport. Rage only serves if you get hit, which past lvl 120 is suicidal unless you leave a single enemy alive for a short period and absorb a hit or two while blocking (blocking reduces the damage but Rage gives you energy as if you took all the damage).

Without that Stat BS is useless, with the stat it becomes usable but still not worth using.

Zenurik is what I'm trying to incoperate, say smoke screen is 12 seconds duration and costs 35 energy, 4 energy per second = 13 energy gain after SS, when combining with Rage a single hit I suppose is enough. Healing with Life Strike is actually great at end game due to the damage you can dish, in 2 hits full health.

[Nazrethim]

24 minutes ago, Blackopz said:

Zenurik is what I'm trying to incoperate, say smoke screen is 12 seconds duration and costs 35 energy, 4 energy per second = 13 energy gain after SS, when combining with Rage a single hit I suppose is enough. Healing with Life Strike is actually great at end game due to the damage you can dish, in 2 hits full health.

That's what I do. It helps that for those endurance runs, I use Dragon Nikana instead of Nikana Prime. Why you ask? Nikana Prime has 55% block value, Dragon Nikana has 85%, while being just slightly weaker than Prime. Also, a Channeled attack with Fatal Teleport pretty much guarantees a full health. And if you bring a Rakta Dark Dagger you can rad proc someone first then also cap Overshields which come handy ( RDD lacks Slash sadly, though the charge attacks have guaranteed Slash Procs on all Daggers)

Edited August 15, 2017 by Nazrethim