Kaffeebohnson Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 I feel like the archwing should be freely accessible (if you have one) – it seems like a vital tool to navigate the huge area. It also ties the seperate game modes together nicely. Having to craft it all over again seems weird. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurbak Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 You can get over 500 fishoil in one night by just fishing for Mortus Lungfish, they spawn frequently in the small lake on the right side when you enter plains (there's a little stone in the lake you can stand on). Large Lungfish spawn frequently aswell so you get a ton of them (most i've gotten during one night is 52) and yeah well you can cut some up and get a nice chunk of meat and oil for launchers and bait. The rest you just turn in for standing and then upgrade your S#&$ so you can catch the bigger and more rare fishies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fallen_Echo Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 14 hours ago, ENGINEEEEER said: Why are the archwing charges a consumable at all? And while 50 is considerable compared to the cost of building and the 1 hour build time, 50 is not enough. Finally, Why is an archwing launcher require fish oil?? Archwing is a primarily combat and navigation tool FISHING IS A NON-COMBAT, STANDING, IMMOBILE ACTIVITY These don't belong together. Fishing is a great option for low key standing gathering. Fishing should not be a required activity to navigate the Plains quickly. At least advise on the decision process. This seems like a huge miss. P.S. Making the purchased Archwing Launcher segment require further farming to even use is kind of insulting. If someone paid ~$10 in plat to use archwing on the plains, maybe throw them some charges? It shouldnt even use charges, if we can deploy our sharwing for free in the water maps why do we need to make a consumable in the plains? It doesnt make any sense! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Temp0- Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 (edited) 8 hours ago, Sir_Millsalot said: OK guys i am seriously not getting what the problem is here i went fishing for one night and got enough fish oil to make 100 charges easily...its not like you are having to constantly grind for this for nothing Yes you are. You have to constantly grind in order to use archwing. For nothing. Just to be able to traverse the gigantic map. And fishing 1 boring 2 depends solely on your luck. I spent a day fishing didn't even get enough to make 1 set of charges. Quote i have spent more time farming for plastids Plastids you can get PLAYING and playing different missions on different planets. And can even get via extractors. So again speak for yourself. I have like 150k plastids if not more atm after building everything in dojo by myself (incuding decorations requiring plastids) just lying around and passively get about 500-700 a day. Edited October 14, 2017 by -Temp0- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wathor88 Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 consumable archwing is very bad ... and i dont want to go fishing..so i guess i ll just walk around Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UltraLYT Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 (edited) It is like in order to ride your horse in Red Dead Redemption - you must keep winning the poker game and use the money to feed the horse. Edited October 14, 2017 by modalmojo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syrade Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 i support DE in this decision i want a challenge i want something to work for i dont want it easy you know what would be really dope, is if the arch wing only had so so much fuel in the atmosphere it burnt up alot of it really quick so it couldn't be used for long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MirageKnight Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 I'd much rather see "Skywing" deployment on some kind of cooldown, because having this as consumable gear that's costly in terms of time and effort to acquire is a good way to get people to not want to use the "Skywing" feature. Leave the segment on the Orbiter...that's fair enough I guess. I have a feeling though that DE's going to want to leave this untouched, so as not to "invalidate the time and resources that other players have spent already on this." When I first saw the teasers and streams for POE, I was lead to believe that Archwings would be easily accessible via the gear menu to travel long distances. That this is a feature the devs WANT us to use. I fired up WF, only to find out the hard and tedious and barely explained way that first I need to add another segment to the orbiter...then I need to craft charges out of new resources that require a fair bit of time to aquire...and one of those resource requirements makes absolutely no sense. The cost of using said feature is needlessly arbitrary and expensive, and it's very off-putting. Few people in their right minds are going to want to deal with that and are going to put up with bullet jumping, sprinting and sliding around all over the place to traverse long distances. And yes travelling all over the map is extremely tedious and time consuming, even with Speed Volt, Nova, Zephyr, and Titania. Come on DE, make "Skywing" an infinite use deployable gear item with a reasonable cool-down. You know you can do it and players will love you for it. You want us to use a feature, right? Then make it fun to use and reasonably accessible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VoxGray Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 (edited) You use fish oil because it's the fuel for the Archwing. In space, we use ion propulsion. It's a weaker force, but theres no air resistance or significant gravity to worry about in space. In Sharkwing mode, we use electrolysis to turn the water into Hydrogen fuel, which is partially why we move so slowly. Largely inefficient conversion to fuel means we have to run slower. In open air, however, we need an actual fuel for propulsion. And this is where the fish oil comes in. That's why the charges have limited timers, as well. Each charge contains a small amount of the total fuel converted from the fish oil, so it only lasts a couple minutes. Edited October 14, 2017 by EmissaryOfInfinity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ealonex Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 14 minutes ago, EmissaryOfInfinity said: You use fish oil because it's the fuel for the Archwing. In space, we use ion propulsion. It's a weaker force, but theres no air resistance or significant gravity to worry about in space. In Sharkwing mode, we use electrolysis to turn the water into Hydrogen fuel, which is partially why we move so slowly. Largely inefficient conversion to fuel means we have to run slower. In open air, however, we need an actual fuel for propulsion. And this is where the fish oil comes in. That's why the charges have limited timers, as well. Each charge contains a small amount of the total fuel converted from the fish oil, so it only lasts a couple minutes. Can't tell how much of this is made up but makes sense to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volinus7 Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 Plains of Eidolon is just an advertisement for MH World. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horonelius Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 Maximum range Excalibur with energy efficiency doesn't need no Archwing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eternal_torment Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 So why can't we use our Archwing on the plains? Why do we need to craft Archwing Launchers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MirageKnight Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 3 hours ago, Horonelius said: Maximum range Titania with energy efficiency doesn't need no Archwing Fixed that for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FierceRadiance Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 On 10/12/2017 at 9:24 PM, DiabolusUrsus said: Are you kidding? We're already overfishing the seas simply to EAT them. No way will fish oil provide anything even remotely approaching a sustainable automobile fuel source even IF we found a way to convert it into usable fuel. ...for older gamers (and with apologies to Charlton Heston)... "Fish Oil is PEOPLE!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir_Millsalot Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 15 hours ago, Riot_Inducer said: I went fishing just once, got 10 fish for the achievement and generally had an enjoyable time with the system. But I was a bit miffed that my catch only yielded enough oil for 1/3rd of one batch of archwing charges. How long did you spend fishing? How many fish did you catch? Are rarer fish worth more oil? As someone who's only got a casual interest in the fishing system, the oil req for the archwing charges is really the biggest problem for me. If I need to dedicated hours upon hours to fishing in order to keep myself stocked with archwing charges this could be a more serious issue. i will agree with most peoples point that i don't think that a charge system that you constantly run out of is a long term viable system, and i really hope that DE fixes it but, the point i was making is that 150 fish oil is not that hard to get... i spent 1 single night cycle in the plains to get the achievement for staying out for a whole night, while doing so i went to a pond in the way back of the map where the enemies are more difficult; just fishing for that single night cycle (without the dye) i was able to catch over 100 fish split between S, M, and L. that was enough for me to get almost 300 fish oil, plus get all of my loyalty points from the fish lady. It is partially up to luck; but tbh it is mostly about patience and working with the system that DE gave us. its not like using an archwing to get across the map is necessary. so if you don't enjoy fishing in game then don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir_Millsalot Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 (edited) ...and i personally find fishing fun. As i know many others do as well. Edited October 14, 2017 by Sir_Millsalot duplicate post had to write something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FierceRadiance Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 19 minutes ago, Sir_Millsalot said: i will agree with most peoples point that i don't think that a charge system that you constantly run out of is a long term viable system, and i really hope that DE fixes it but, the point i was making is that 150 fish oil is not that hard to get... i spent 1 single night cycle in the plains to get the achievement for staying out for a whole night, while doing so i went to a pond in the way back of the map where the enemies are more difficult; just fishing for that single night cycle (without the dye) i was able to catch over 100 fish split between S, M, and L. that was enough for me to get almost 300 fish oil, plus get all of my loyalty points from the fish lady. It is partially up to luck; but tbh it is mostly about patience and working with the system that DE gave us. its not like using an archwing to get across the map is necessary. so if you don't enjoy fishing in game then don't. I'm one of the few people I know that don't mind the grind, so long as it will get me what I want; put another way, grinding for a chance at what I want frustrates the poo outta me (and everyone who knows me says I'm FULLA poo!) So that's a lot of frustration. But a question occurs to me, which may not be answerable at this early point: How quickly are the Archwing charges used up, compared to how long fish oil takes to collect? I'm thinking you're going to be using at least two charges per mission -heading out and heading back- PLUS however many you use during the mission. If the ration between how much time it takes to collect fish oil vs. how fast you use the changes up is even CLOSE, then the system needs tweeking. If it takes a half-hour to accumulate enough fish oil, but the resulting charges get used up in an hour.....that's a bad deal, and one Tenno should take a pass on. IF that's the case - I haven't built any yet, so I don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Temp0- Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 (edited) 39 minutes ago, Sir_Millsalot said: ...and i personally find fishing fun. As i know many others do as well. You know what fun is? Fun is something that you do not have to do. Then yes. Many things are fun. When you have to grind like a slave to achieve something anything will turn into torture. Many people still haven't figured it out but this is the grindiest sht ever. Not just resources, focus is absolutely trashed. I had 3 millions points in Madurai for example, this was by far my most leveled school. Know what I got for 3 million points? I leveled exactly 2 paths to lv4. And pretty much evrything in PoE needs as much grind. I have not in my life seen game that bad. Edited October 14, 2017 by -Temp0- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MirageKnight Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 (edited) 37 minutes ago, Sir_Millsalot said: ...and i personally find fishing fun. As i know many others do as well. No offense intended, but what does this have to do with the topic at hand? We're discussing the fact that the requirements for using Archwings in PoE are expensive and nonsensical, not if fishing is fun or not. Besides, you're merely providing anecdotal evidence and a weak "mass appeal" argument to justify a bad design decision. 37 minutes ago, Sir_Millsalot said: its not like using an archwing to get across the map is necessary. so if you don't enjoy fishing in game then don't. It's not necessary, but it's highly convenient. Given the sheer size of the map, simply bullet jumping, sliding, and sprinting gets really tedious when you have objectives that are easily half a kilo apart at least and that might put you a huge distance from the entrance. Leaping around like a rabbit on speed is tedious and dull. This is why I've consigned myself to using Titania. Fishing should NOT be a requirement for convenient travel. EVER. There is no logical reason for this at all. Fish oil is primarily used as a food supplement and is sometimes used as a lubricant or salve in primitive cultures. Although oil in general is used in the production of plastics, fish oil specifically is NOT. DE, if you have to have Archwings in PoE as consumable gear...at least change Fish Oil to something else that makes sense. I get that you want us to use the new resources, but Fish Oil makes no sense. You changed the Kuva requirements for Glass Frame, so please do that here as well. Edited October 14, 2017 by MirageKnight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir_Millsalot Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 2 minutes ago, FierceRadiance said: How quickly are the Archwing charges used up, compared to how long fish oil takes to collect? that is a question i have been wondering as well, unfortunately i still haven't been able to make any either, the other resource needed eludes me still. if they are not going to take it off of a charge based system then they should defiantly make it so that you only have to use one charge per mission or one charge per cycle something like that; where once you use a charge you can call the archwing and put it away any amount of times within that time frame Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Temp0- Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 Quote How quickly are the Archwing charges used up, compared to how long fish oil takes to collect? If you do nothing but fishing it takes roughly 2 hours of fishing for 50 charges currently. I don't have archwing yet but i used Titania. You're looking at 5 to 15 flight sessions in one mission. So as you can guess. 50 charges is nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir_Millsalot Posted October 14, 2017 Share Posted October 14, 2017 1 minute ago, MirageKnight said: ..and i personally find fishing fun. As i know many others do as well. No offense intended, but what does this have to do with the topic at hand? We're discussing the fact that the requirements for using Archwings in PoE are expensive and nonsensical, not if fishing is fun or not. Besides, you're merely providing anecdotal evidence and a weak "mass appeal" argument to justify a bad design decision. as stated in the reason it was edited i posted that because of an accidental double post that it wouldn't let me delete so i had to post something and honestly that was the only thing i could think of atm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arugula420 Posted October 15, 2017 Share Posted October 15, 2017 On 10/12/2017 at 9:24 PM, DiabolusUrsus said: Are you kidding? We're already overfishing the seas simply to EAT them. No way will fish oil provide anything even remotely approaching a sustainable automobile fuel source even IF we found a way to convert it into usable fuel. I've been saying for years that we need to start farming the whales. Oil crisis: solved Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AkiraFangs Posted October 15, 2017 Share Posted October 15, 2017 lol when people don't like the grind. I have caught soooooooooooooooo many fish in the Plains since it came out. You just have to quip your spear and wait. the fish will come. and the luminous dye helps you see them under water. I didn't even begin to think that fish oil was a stupid requirement. Just git gud I guess. I already have over 500 fish oil cause fishing is fun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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