So, What Rewards exactly do y'all Want?

[blazinvire]

I have to say I haven't felt all that upset about the rewards -in that I don't feel strongly either way, like I feel with most resources in the game: I guess it's nice to have them when I eventually get around to using them, but I'm not chomping at the bit for these things.

I've mostly just been running sanctuary for Focus farming, since it's infinitely less painful and approximately 100x more PUGable since I can just click a button and then chill for a couple of minutes.

That being said, the moment I max my Focus for the day, I pretty much stop running sanctuary.  Yet I kinda want to keep running, I just feel I'm wasting time.
Maybe I just want the soft cap Focus implemented so I don't feel like it's getting wasted, but it'd certainly be nice to have something else like Focus to grind.

[PrivateRiem]

6 hours ago, JalakBali said:

I find it hilarious how a straight forward question like this couldn't even be answered (so far)

It's like if someone asked "What makes you happy" and all everyone did is either say they're not happy or list things they're not happy with.

Or just give a general abstract answer like "to feel fulfilled" like this answer:

What would be a decent challenge to you?

 

 

You know the trope of an annoying spouse/significant other when asked "what do you want to eat" and makes you frustrated when they couldn't give a definite answer and just act all wishy washy and passive aggressive about things they *don't* want to eat and just criticize your suggestions? Yeah, you're all acting like that. It's like it's hard to say "I don't know" because then the problem is with you and not on the people trying to make you happy.

 

Survival mission that starts at level 70-80, available on all planets against every different factions, and the mission node being permanent.

Elite onslaught is pretty close, but in an attempt to make it "for the elite" they ruined many of its interesting aspects. Elite map rotation is static while regular onslaught is not, and has leaderboards, pushing people into cheesing it to try and get their name further up the ladder.

We need more content like this before giving a darn about leaderboards.

[Trichouette]

Il y a 10 heures, DrBorris a dit :

From what I have gathered they want a reward they can get over and over again while still being useful but is not a massive grind to get.

The issue isn't with grind, players love grind. Look at the amount of kuva they're ready to farm for this pathetic feature called riven.

The issue is rather with RNG.

 

DE noticed players loved the ambulas and plague star event rewards, why ? Because it's about GRIND and not about RNG.

And yet they still refuse to add a token system to some things like sortie (or former raid)

 

Players don't mind puting hours of their time in the game, what bothers them is how they're rewarded with garbage.

The solution, let them choose their reward at the cost of more grind.

[BlackCoMerc]

13 hours ago, Tangent-Valley said:

Topic started thanks to the Sanctuary Onslaught posts and complaints I've seen, especially one complaint that pops up all the time in Warframe Forums:

 

~ Rewards ~

 

Folks always complain that "The Rewards are crap" or Rewards not worth it" or "Give us Rewards worth trying/farming/grinding for, DE"

 

So, this post is just that one simple question "What Rewards do y'all want?"

 

Nothing judging, nothing criticizing, I'm just genuinely interested in what Rewards players are talking about when they say they want something better, and I feel it'd be nice for DE to know from us as well. If you have posts already listing what Rewards you want from "This Mission" or "That Event", feel free to link them too. This isn't just a Sanctuary Onslaught thing, this is pretty much "In General/Overall".

 

EDIT: So far, so vague, y'all. This isn't really helping giving rough "You know....like....stuff" answers and expecting developers like DE to know exactly what you want.

Something that has presented itself to me off this Topic Post though:

Make the Valuable rewards (Vandal Parts, Captura, Etc) scale up Percentage-wise for drop chance per Rotation set players go through. In other words something like 5% goes up to 8%, then 12%, then 17%, etc. Not guaranteeing a Player the drop, but increasing the odd of favorable reward as they go through Rotation Sets. (Also, possibly implement this for Drop amounts as well for rewards like Credit and Endo, their drop Chance going down, but their drop amounts scaling up)

 

See, now there's someone asking for something they want, with less of a general "Eh~" wave in a random direction. Let's try answers like that, yeah? =w="

DE has run out of rewards to GIVE. Just look at Sorties: Riven mods (only needed for taking on the very enemies in the Sorties you get them from and unnecessarily overpowered outside of that mode). And a bunch of useless crap Vets dont need or even want.

DE is trying to make a looter/shooter with no loot. There is literally no useful loot left to give. Its over. Its done. 

And choices for fixing this are limited. Either variants of existing weapons dropping new BP all over the place (imagine an all-slash Grakata, pure elemental Hek, full auto/semi-toggle Latron, etc) or a complete rework of the mod system, building in the buff mods and allowing the mod system to become a side grade of playstyle tweaks instead of the progression system it is now, so DE can create new mods people will ACTUALLY USE and grind for. 

Right now, Warframe has no loot left to give. Relics have become a joke. You are not going to get what you are grinding for. Not without spending some plat in trade chat or fighting the same spawn list 1000 times in an increasingly boring repeat of essentially the same mission over and over. And neither one is either interesting or compelling. Quills and Zaws turned out to be a joke of a circular, boring grind. And Operators are mostly not worth using, hence, their being forced in new game modes so DE can say people are using them at all.

DE first needs to create an actual loot system. THEN they can worry about what loot to GIVE.

[Trichouette]

il y a 4 minutes, BlackCoMerc a dit :

And choices for fixing this are limited. Either variants of existing weapons dropping new BP all over the place (imagine an all-slash Grakata, pure elemental Hek, full auto/semi-toggle Latron, etc) or a complete rework of the mod system, building in the buff mods and allowing the mod system to become a side grade of playstyle tweaks instead of the progression system it is now, so DE can create new mods people will ACTUALLY USE and grind for. 

Imagine if they actually do that, so many mastery exp.....

You're right though, they're running out of ideas, which explains the "peculiar mods".

"if we can't find anything worthy to reward them with, let's reward them with something absolutely useless on purpose".

 

Also they should've taken care of the whole ressource mess way earlier.

They can't release anything without players having all the craft requirement ready, unless they add weapons/argon in the craft requirements...

 

The game is supposed to be grindy but you've nothing to grind for, and even when there is something you want, you're getting sick of the loot rate pretty quickly.

[BlackCoMerc]

Just now, Trichouette said:

Imagine if they actually do that, so many mastery exp.....

You're right though, they're running out of ideas, which explains the "peculiar mods".

"if we can't find anything worthy to reward them with, let's reward them with something absolutely useless on purpose".

 

Also they should've taken care of the whole ressource mess way earlier.

They can't release anything without players having all the craft requirement ready, unless they add weapons/argon in the craft requirements...

 

The game is supposed to be grindy but you've nothing to grind for, and even when there is something you want, you're getting sick of the loot rate pretty quickly.

Mechanically, the game is a masterpiece to actually PLAY from moment to moment. Well, until you shift into mostly useless kid mode, which is to me plays like an early alpha test of something like Mass Effect and should never have seen the light of day.

But that is symptomatic of a larger problem: The supporting (non-gameplay) mechanics of Warframe are an abysmal mess. As you stated, resource requirements are pointless. My clan was already researching the new weapon a scant couple of hours after the release. 

Likewise, scaling is forcing CC on EVERY Warframe, despite there being no way new CC abilities can ever measure up to existing ones, causing the very thing that was tacked on to generate interest in new frames to turn people OFF to them. 

We have no useful loot. I have 1300 hours in this game. For some reason. Despite the fact that, by 100, I had ALL the actually, truly useful frames. And until the release of Arca Plasmor and arguably the Argonak (for fun more than power level) I also had all the truly useful weapons. But I still had fun. For a while.

But with every release comes another frame nerf. Another enemy with power immunity. Or invulnerable phases. Or control and input robbing abilities. Or multiples of the above. Because DE cannot be bothered to balance their game and polish supporting mechanics, players are being outright punished with useless loot and knee jerk, implicit nerfs by enemy design because they dont have the guts to balance player power levels outright. 

The game is in decline. I think thats plain to see. Unless they can balance this mess, and come up with an actual, useful loot system that does not outright punish people for not skipping the tedium of using it, then its downward spiral and maintenance mode for sure.

[--LA--Vengeance]

I don't mind RNG, but this game has too much RNG. Relics, rotations, rivens, bounties, sorties, heck, even matchmaking.
I really don't see a point of putting Gara parts in rewards, same goes for Khora parts. More endo sounds fine on elite mode. Kuva. Something that is actually worth grinding for. Maybe even some mods that are not vitality. Rewards are better than usual, but not really worth getting my a$$ blasted by bombards after getting Khora.
 

[BlackCoMerc]

Just now, Vengeance_A said:

I don't mind RNG, but this game has too much RNG. Relics, rotations, rivens, bounties, sorties, heck, even matchmaking.
I really don't see a point of putting Gara parts in rewards, same goes for Khora parts. More endo sounds fine on elite mode. Kuva. Something that is actually worth grinding for. Maybe even some mods that are not vitality. Rewards are better than usual, but not really worth getting my a$$ blasted by bombards after getting Khora.
 

The problem there though is that both Endo and Kuva are useless for some people.

I have tens of thousands of Endo, and put Statues on display in my orbiter. And I dont use Rivens or participate in the disaster that is the Sortie/Riven/Unveiling tedium, so Kuva may as well be a non-reward for me.

[Trichouette]

il y a 6 minutes, BlackCoMerc a dit :

My clan was already researching the new weapon a scant couple of hours after the release. 

I thought I would go and start the research and I noticed the research already started... 1 player for a 30 players clan started it alone.

So much for cooperation.

il y a 6 minutes, BlackCoMerc a dit :

Likewise, scaling is forcing CC on EVERY Warframe, despite there being no way new CC abilities can ever measure up to existing ones, causing the very thing that was tacked on to generate interest in new frames to turn people OFF to them. 

I have no idea why DE decided being able to turn off enemies was a good idea.

Abilities are so strong they don't even know how to stop players anymore, which is why I laughed hard when I saw this in the patchnote :

Il y a 23 heures, [DE]Megan a dit :

An overuse of Warframe abilities can skew Simaris’ data. You may find he has different tolerance levels against ultimates than first abilities.

The only thing they can do is nerf warframes, but players wouldn't like it.

They still didn't learn that it's better to release weak abilities.

il y a 6 minutes, BlackCoMerc a dit :

The game is in decline. I think thats plain to see. Unless they can balance this mess, and come up with an actual, useful loot system that does not outright punish people for not skipping the tedium of using it, then its downward spiral and maintenance mode for sure.

I doubt they would do what is necessary.

Rivens are here to screw up balance and we're lucky warframe rivens won't be a thing.

They would've to nerf so many things in order to prevent players from cheesing everything, which is why they put time gate on rewards.

il y a 5 minutes, Vengeance_A a dit :

I really don't see a point of putting Gara parts in rewards, same goes for Khora parts.

Which is why I said that loot that is only needed once shouldn't be in endless table

Edited April 21, 2018 by Trichouette

[--LA--Vengeance]

4 minutes ago, BlackCoMerc said:

The problem there though is that both Endo and Kuva are useless for some people.

I have tens of thousands of Endo, and put Statues on display in my orbiter. And I dont use Rivens or participate in the disaster that is the Sortie/Riven/Unveiling tedium, so Kuva may as well be a non-reward for me.

It's not about getting something for using only, but selling as well. If u don't use rivens, u can try getting and rerolling then selling. Thats extra plat for u. Same goes for endo. Got 1400h in this game and still lacking of endo. Who has more than enough, u can sell sculptures or turn them into endo, buy primed mods and max them up to resell. I won't go into market issues right now, but rivens and primed more are for sure a better pay off than prime sets/parts.

Edited April 21, 2018 by Vengeance_A

[Trichouette]

il y a 3 minutes, Vengeance_A a dit :

It's not about getting something for using only, but selling as well. If u don't use rivens, u can try getting and rerolling then selling. Thats extra plat for u. Same goes for endo. Got 1400h in this game and still lacking of endo. Who has more than enough, u can sell sculptures or turn them into endo, buy primed mods and max them up to resell. I won't go into market issues right now, but rivens and primed more are for sure a better pay off than prime sets/parts.

Who said players need plat ?

It's like endo and kuva, some players don't need them at all.

(also please don't talk about riven market, it's the most stupid thing I've ever seen)

Edited April 21, 2018 by Trichouette

[--LA--Vengeance]

4 minutes ago, Trichouette said:

Who said players need plat ?

It's like endo and kuva, some players don't need them at all.

(also please don't talk about riven market, it's the most stupid thing I've ever seen)

Eh u are maybe too much subjective about this. 'I don't need' isn't the same as 'players don't need'. So if u don't need endo,kuva and plat, not sure what game can offer u that u don't have already.

Talked about market overall, but yes, that includes riven one as well (which I do agree is stupid but what can I do about it).

Edited April 21, 2018 by Vengeance_A

[Trichouette]

à l’instant, Vengeance_A a dit :

Eh u are maybe too much subjective about this. 'I don't need' isn't the same as 'players don't need'. So if u don't need endo,kuva and plat, not sure what game can offer u that u don't have already.

I'm not the only one in this case, you can't just add rewards to the table thinking "hey if players don't need it, they can still sell it for plats".

And see that's exactly the issue, "not sure what game can offer u that u don't have already."

Nothing, which is why we're in this thread ;)

[--LA--Vengeance]

5 minutes ago, Trichouette said:

I'm not the only one in this case, you can't just add rewards to the table thinking "hey if players don't need it, they can still sell it for plats".

And see that's exactly the issue, "not sure what game can offer u that u don't have already."

Nothing, which is why we're in this thread ;)

Not sure how many hours u have in game, but as someone who is in games for work, I can tell u that devs can't change at all or much for small player base. There is no that many players that are on 3-4k hours of play and if u are not interested in half of the things, while again other half u already have, it would be near impossible to find a right solution.
They could put something new that u don't have but what then? More endless grind for ppl who don't have bunch of other things (which is higher %)?
They def should improve rewards and make it worth putting hours in it but thing u are asking for or want is really hard to make it work.

[Trichouette]

il y a 1 minute, Vengeance_A a dit :

Not sure how many hours u have in game, but as someone who is in games for work, I can tell u that devs can't change at all or much for small player base.

You think only a small part of the player base doesn't need kuva or endo ?

I guess you're not often on the forum seeing your amount of posts, but there are plenty of thread complaining about onslaught reward table.

 

The thing is, they could work with what they already have, like how clan research could really be something cooperative and all that but since the requirements are very low and seeing how many ressources players stockpile passively, it's impossible.

And i'm not talking about making requirement as stupidly high as hema.

(this part about clan research is just an example)

[--LA--Vengeance]

10 minutes ago, Trichouette said:

You think only a small part of the player base doesn't need kuva or endo ?

I guess you're not often on the forum seeing your amount of posts, but there are plenty of thread complaining about onslaught reward table.

 

The thing is, they could work with what they already have, like how clan research could really be something cooperative and all that but since the requirements are very low and seeing how many ressources players stockpile passively, it's impossible.

And i'm not talking about making requirement as stupidly high as hema.

(this part about clan research is just an example)

Don't get me wrong, I don't need Kuva either. But bigger part asked for Kuva endless, which clearly means something. If I don't need it, that's because I wanted so. If I bought or got lucky with riven drops, I would need it. But pretty much as u, that part of the game is not in my interest. Again, who the heck knows, I might change my mind in 1 year and start collecting kuva/rivens.

Clan research I would blame on lazy players. Most likely 2-3 ppl gonna do all the work, rest just pick up new things when they are done.

But I do think they could make some clan rewards in it for stuatues, new colors or whatever literally. Maybe even some bp that requires specific material.

To me it seems that DE works on too many sides/tasks that some end up rushed (like I expected from Khora to have own quest).

Edited April 21, 2018 by Vengeance_A

[Trichouette]

il y a 5 minutes, Vengeance_A a dit :

Clan research I would blame on lazy players. Most likely 2-3 ppl gonna do all the work, rest just pick up new things when they are done.

That's not what I meant.

I meant "one player alone can complete the research with the ressources he already has".

It's not a team effort because we passively stockpile so many ressources we don't even have to farm them for newly released stuff.

il y a 5 minutes, Vengeance_A a dit :

To me it seems that DE works on too many sides/tasks that some end up rushed (like I expected from Khora to have own quest).

They're pretty hyped about releasing the next PoE, meanwhile the community is desperately trying to make them understand why PoE sucks.

As someone else said on another thread, khora got delayed AND rushed, I have no idea how they managed to do that.

She was supposed to have her own quest and to be released with a major rework, we only got her 4 months later and her kit looks pitiful.

Edited April 21, 2018 by Trichouette

[Ricknir]

Isn't there a case for "how you get rewards" as to "I want better rewards"?

Is the A A B C system getting very old by now?

Thought the new mode would give us a new reward system, that would count your score and give rewards out to represent a "good round". I was personally disappointed to hear about the A A B C rotation in the new mode.  

Wonder if people would feel different if the entire games reward system wasn't the same.  

 

[Trichouette]

il y a 1 minute, Donkey___R a dit :

Isn't there a case for "how you get rewards" as to "I want better rewards"?

Is the A A B C system getting very old by now?

Thought the new mode would give us a new reward system, that would count your score and give rewards out to represent a "good round". I was personally disappointed to hear about the A A B C rotation in the new mode.  

Wonder if people would feel different if the entire games reward system wasn't the same.  

 

You're right, a huge part of the reward issue is also "how you get rewarded".

I don't like the AABC but it's pretty much mandatory since DE still refuses to use tokens.

You can't expect them to reward you for a certain amount of kill. Why ? Because some frames / abilities / weapons are so good at killing everything, it would be way too complicated to balance a reward system around score.

Which is why they're forced to reward you for "how long you can stay", this way you get a reward every 5min, no matter how well you're performing.

 

However they should've changed AABC into a scaling system way earlier...

[--LA--Vengeance]

2 minutes ago, Trichouette said:

As someone else said on another thread, khora got delayed AND rushed, I have no idea how they managed to do that.

xD Truth. But that was more like 'lets put both in one, it's faster and easier that way'. Thats connected with issue I mentioned, just splitted on too many tasks and so many ends up rushed.

I am having hard time to understand what is her 4 supposed to do (from what I could see). It's like Vaubans 3, but pulls enemies and slap them on wall, so it's really messy to figure which one is dead or not (lol) and even worse if u want to hs them. xD
 

7 minutes ago, Trichouette said:

I meant "one player alone can complete the research with the ressources he already has".

Pretty much, so thats why I think maybe some new material to add, just not to go in extremes like with Hema. But still to need more than 1-2 ppl to complete the research.

[Trichouette]

il y a 1 minute, Vengeance_A a dit :

Thats connected with issue I mentioned, just splitted on too many tasks and so many ends up rushed.

Not really.

They had a planned IPS rework and they ended up changing it because for once they realized it wouldn't solve anything after reading all the comments.

il y a 2 minutes, Vengeance_A a dit :

Pretty much, so thats why I think maybe some new material to add, just not to go in extremes like with Hema. But still to need more than 1-2 ppl to complete the research.

That won't change anything.

They did it with nitain already and look at the result.

First few research are hard to do because nobody have the new ressource. Later, everybody have plenty of it and we're back to square 1.

The only way this would work is by adding a new ressource every now and then, which would be tedious to players.

 

(I still think ressources should work like argon, disappear after a while if you don't use them, this way you can't stockpile, but players hate me for that kind of idea :)  )

[Fallen_Echo]

9 hours ago, JalakBali said:

I find it hilarious how a straight forward question like this couldn't even be answered (so far)

It's like if someone asked "What makes you happy" and all everyone did is either say they're not happy or list things they're not happy with.

Or just give a general abstract answer like "to feel fulfilled" like this answer:

Its not that it cant be answered but more like the answers were out for soo long people dont bother typing them again.

But anyway heres my droptable of preferred rewards:

2K endo and 10K credits 30%

1200 kuva 20%

50 ducat 20%

1 mod token 15%

1 weapon upgrade token 10%

next market purchase 5% off and 1 fashion token

 

This is for rot A, the tokens can be exchanged at simaris who offers 20 new mods, 20 new weapon upgrades (like mods but give your weapon the cephalon prefix with some unique effect) and 20 new fashion items. 

[fluffysnowcap]

3 hours ago, Trichouette said:

The issue isn't with grind, players love grind. Look at the amount of kuva they're ready to farm for this pathetic feature called riven.

The issue is rather with RNG.

 

DE noticed players loved the ambulas and plague star event rewards, why ? Because it's about GRIND and not about RNG.

And yet they still refuse to add a token system to some things like sortie (or former raid)

 

Players don't mind puting hours of their time in the game, what bothers them is how they're rewarded with garbage.

The solution, let them choose their reward at the cost of more grind.

There where literally thousands of threads made asking for more kuva, scaling kuva or locking stats and DE said nothing about them.

[(XBOX)SweatyPick3L]

What rewards do I want?  That's a hard question to ask in a free to play game like Warframe. My first instinct is to say cosmetics, but DE makes money off cosmetics. Weapons are out. So what's left...endo, kuva, glyphs? We can get those now. 

What rewards are the most neutral that would be ok in a game like Warframe? The only thing I can think of is what Baro brings every two weeks, maybe introduce a token system that lets us access Baro whenever we have enough "tokens" to "buy" his attention. And have his whole inventory available for 1 purchase? 

 

 

Edited April 21, 2018 by (XB1)RDeschain82

[Trichouette]

il y a 1 minute, fluffysnowcap a dit :

There where literally thousands of threads made asking for more kuva, scaling kuva or locking stats and DE said nothing about them.

Of course they didn't, that would reduce the amount of grind and RNG involved in the riven feature.

You still don't get it.

Also I don't see how that is related to the post you quoted, if you could explain to me...