Sunder
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Posts posted by Sunder
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Most of my work was done with blocking and reflection, but I waited for them to get pretty low down, like when the corpus head is spitting, or the scythe is swinging or what have you, and coptered at them. Then I hoped for a blade proc.
No matter how much I've tried, even dead on it's been impossible to hit him with melee spin attacks.
I brought it up in Council chat when running it and everyone just repeated to me that it's impossible unless you use a throwing melee weapon.
I decided to try and lo' and behold it was just as they claimed.
And I tried blocking and reflecting. The spores they shoot out never reflect.
One head shoots the spores that grow into the spawners for lesser enemies
And the other things shot, even when blocked, just stick into the ground at your feet and detonate
Wasn't even able to get the Scythe/Grineer head to spawn =/
EDIT :
I'm in the fight at this very moment.
I have the parry mod on (Deflect 96% damage back at attacker)
The infested Ancient spits the exploding bombs which don't deflect
The Infested Corpus head spits the "eggs" that spawn more enemies. This too, cannot be deflected.
I've attacked all sides of the rock formation that pops up around them with no luck, no damage is being dealt, even with the "mouths" open
I've continued to try and jump atop them with no luck as I encounter the dreaded invisible barriers
I've gotten spot on slash-dash and spin attacks on the heads but again...invisible barriers just push me out of the way when I connect the attack
Can anyone actually enlighten me on how it's possible to take this thing out with JUST melee?
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I always took Lephantis as more of a "final boss" sort of character.
Big
Three heads
Two stages to the fight
Spawns lesser enemies during battle
Plus it's the only way to get Nekros which essentially doubles your chance at farming with desecrate.
Like when you beat a game and get some item that gives you infinite secondary ammo or something
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I managed to get past them, I did tend to notice that sometimes my attacks just didn't land for some reason though. Perhaps that was why.
Get past what? The barriers? If so you'll have to enlighten me on how it's possible...cause I couldn't wall run and slash dash the heads, I couldn't do the wall attacks, I couldn't super jump up to them. Nothing. And this was with the Nikana which if I'm correct has longer reach than the Skana.
Lephantis is the last boss in my roster to take out melee only and it's driving me bonkers that he's melee proof (Least his first stage)
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Didn't do the entire star-chart but I did do a boss rush with just the Nikana and Excalibur Prime.
No guns equipped and my sentinel was the carrier with no attack. Just vacuum cause I'm lazy and didn't want to miss any loot that might pass me by.
I had tons of fun with it. So much that I've taken up just using melee weapons for now (Till I get platinum to buy more weapon slots. 26 weapons in the foundry waiting to be claimed...) Gave him stamina mods and such to keep the fight going and now I usually come out with most kills in a mission. Hell it's possible to do T3 missions with just a properly modded sword.
That being said, every boss IS completely possible to take out with JUST melee. Save for Lephantis which has silly invisible barriers...
https://forums.warframe.com/index.php?/topic/242857-lephantis-and-unnecessary-invisible-barriers/
(Feedback thread regarding said invisible barriers)
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Somewhat related but since this is a thread regarding the Color Pallets...Can we please have a labeled grid along the pallet?
Across the top would be A, B, C, D, E and down the side would be 1 - 18
It would make sharing color patterns sooo much easier =p
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While expanding the audience is a good thing and more players = more payout for DE and the opportunity to expand upon their game...
I do hope the Xbox One will have it's own dedicated team working on it as to now slow down the current team of Devs from having to work on issues that will undoubtedly come up.
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Sounded more like the basis for enemies/bosses was that you yourself would have to adapt in order to defeat said boss. Not all enemies are created with the intent that they can be engaged in every single way possible.
I could've sworn Scott or Steve said something along the lines of melee being a viable option now with melee 2.0.
What I get from that is I should be able to play through the entirety of the game with just melee. Sure tactics and planning would have to change, my approach towards certain bosses/enemies but regardless, that it was to be very possible.
To me Lephantis is like...the "final boss". You've got all these smaller lesser guys, then a giant three headed beast with two stages to his fight.
I just wish something as silly as invisible barriers didn't stop such a potentially epic fight
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This b silly.
Needs fix now.
Silly? Yes.
FIx now? Definitely not a priority on anyones list I'm sure
Just would be nice to actually have melee 2.0 as a viable option for ALL bosses =p
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THE PROBLEM
Lephantis can't be harmed via melee. No not because his weak-points are high up. I had superjump and was prepared for lots of wall attacks on the heads. I knew this wasn't gonna be a quick fight. But lo' and behold...invisible barriers.
When any of the heads pop up it has a barrier that cannot be passed by any means.
Clear super jump over the rocks? Nope!
Wall dash near the ceiling high to fall onto it? Nope!
Stand still and super jump in place waiting for him to pop up under you? No, no and no.
Even when I managed to glitch myself IN the rocks with him, A barrier prevented me from even getting close to the weak spot.
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THE SOLUTION
Remove the bloody barriers. Shorten them, Something!
Let us hop atop the rock shards, let us dash-slice its head!
I realize that pink internal parts of these heads are the weak points and I'm willing to take my time fighting him as such to take him down with nothing but my sword.
When melee 2.0 was introduced I remember hearing that it was going to make melee combat a viable path to take regardless of the situation or mission.
These barriers only serve as evidence against those claims by our beloved Devs
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Ever since the Melee 2.0 update I've worked to get my primary and secondary weapon leveled and out of the way so I could focus on melee. Well yesterday I finally did just that and leveled my Nikana to rank 30. Slapped some mods on and had a pretty decent weapon in my hands.
I ripped through and carved a path from boss to boss.
Vor - Comical really. Slice, shield, slice, shield, slice shield, dead.
Jackal - Stupidly easy...stood under him and hacked between his legs
Vay Hek - Time consuming...but with Excalibur it was possible
Alad V - Again...comical. He goes down in a single combo. Not even. Zanuka followed shortly after
Nef Anyo - I felt bad...near instant death
Ruk - Easy, but a little time consuming, just gotta keep on the move
Kela De Thaym - Took her down before she could properly react
Raptor - The hardest of them all...bloody rockets and him flying made it very difficult. But luring him down and waiting for a reload helps
Vor & Kril - Vor again comical, Kril was easy enough. Get the tube, dance around him blocking bullets, let him ice 3 times and have a kick-@$$ melee fight when he takes the hammer out. Found out you can even parry him!
Tyl Regor - Easy enough, just annoying with all the other grineer sticking their noses in
Hyena pack - Separate and conquer. Agility helps lots.
Lech Kril - Same as above, easy enough
Ambulas - I actually died on this one once. Corpus weaponry just decimates my shields...still, killed him and won though
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Now as you can imagine...I was feeling good about myself. Each and every boss taken out. My inbox is filled with messages from stalker (Who still hasn't shown up) and I was running just normal missions waiting for him when I stumbled upon an infested mission on Earth. Then it hit me.
Lephantis
I missed one! Not on the star chart so I decided to make a key and go for it. While waiting me and others even ran melee only T3 keys successfully. No one dying. Safe to say I was pumped. The biggest boss just waiting in the Derelicts...I was gonna pull a "Shadow of the Colossus" and take down the massive beast. I was gonna play the part of David and free the land from Goliath. I got my key, used it, made it safely with full energy, full heath and went on to fight the infested legend in his chambers. Then the dreaded barriers...
This is not something I'm doing for bragging rights, I have no evidence or video proof I've done these things.
I have no one watching me or accompanying me in-game to observe such actions.
I'm doing this for myself. Cause cutting through missions with just a sword, blocking bullets, taking out the bosses with style made me feel like a freakin' ninja. But with these barriers....it just seems silly.
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I think it's time DE takes a look over their filters. Both the censoring one and the auto-kick one.
My guess is these words and such were just dumped in from some older list without much effort. As just a way to censor the obvious words from being used. I'm sure they could get someone to write a quick script or something to use with the filter to detect improper use of certain words
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Even if it was terraforming, shutting down the terraformer wouldn`t cause the oxygen to suddenly vanish. It`d be a couple of hours before it`s gone, not minutes.
Could be done so in sectors? Areas of earth that's divided up and given it's own atmosphere providing machine
Which in theory sounds ridiculous and like magic but how's that saying go? "What is magic but technology we've yet to understand"
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I'm more concerned why the oxygen on Earth keeps running out while in a forest.
Earth on the Star Chart - "A desolate, ruined world."
Sometime long ago humans likely waged war and destroyed the planet making it impossible to live on. The only reasons forest and such grow could be the same reason we can go to the other planets AND the same explanation in most sci-fi movies/books/games. Terra-forming.
There's probably some big ol' machines and such that generate a hospitable living environment.
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Zoom in with your weapon,walk backwards and than tap shift
if you move left or right you´ll perform a side-flip
if you move forward you´ll perform a roll
These reduce the amount of damage recieved and prevent any stuns/knockdowns
This
Also if you jump the split second you go to do a front/back flip you'll do it but gain some air as well. Looks fancy too!
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I think what he's looking for is more engaging, unique boss fights. The new J3 Golem boss fight will have those tentacle things that pull people in and spit them out elsewhere on the map. So that should bring some change to what we're used to.
Got me thinking though...
Boss wide levels
Split the Tenno up. All of them. Unleash the boss in the level and have it roam around looking for us.
Via radar you only see the blue lotus symbol for a team mate so you'll have no idea if you're heading to the right person or not
Imagine the chase when you're unprepared for a boss that could possibly vary in it's defense/immunities. Running to allies so you don't die. Them fighting their way through lesser mobs to reach you. Find a room big enough and hold him off there till everyone shows up.
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It's just one idea but variable boss fights like this, that really stand out would definitely bring me back to fight them again after farming them for parts.
Aside from getting the Stalkers attention that is.
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Also one thing that'd be pretty cool in my own opinion...have them bother us through out the planet.
Let them insult us, send in additional units, be the reason the ship's cooling system malfunctioned or the reason it's under attack (They're firing on their own vessel in efforts to kill you), have them set up a self destruct sequence when we accomplish our mission. Little things that just make us want to exact revenge upon them.
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And of course...scaling them better is a must.
Number of players
Mastery Rank
Number of weapons equipped (Primary, Secondary, Melee)
Rank of said weapons
Sentinels
Conclave rating
All these things should contribute to the leveling of the boss and enemies.
Hell, could even make it so if you kill a boss enough times, you not only have a chance to get Stalkers attention, but the assassin of that faction
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Perhaps only appear when you swing your weapon?
Or only kick on when you draw your melee weapons. Honestly I've avoided elemental mods for melee weapons cause of how cheesy it looks....excluding things like, Ember with a flaming sword or Frost with an ice one. I just think -as you said, it takes away from the actually seeing the weapon rather than energy in the shape of a weapon.
I've started using the Nikana and for the first time I've really focused on adding in some elemental mods. The amount of damage it does is great and I've seen what I'm missing out on. The thing is though with the Nikana the effects aren't seen since the sword is in its sheath all the time unless attacking. So I guess this is the exception for me
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Or better yet...
No energy blade on the arrow.
Just the stick.
When you notch the arrow and draw it back THEN it'd appear.
Doing so would at least prove to us it's a laser edge rather than a sharp, metal one. Honestly in doing this the tip thickness could either be adjusted or left alone.
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My Tenno? Scared? Nervous? Ha!
Maybe your Tenno. DE could include a craven animation for set for the un-stoic. Me? I like going out like a butt-scuttling Hindu cow.
Precisely why it should be implemented.
Getting downed should be something embarrassing for Tenno. Our strong silent stoic frames reduced to crawling on a floor.
Or even if they don't look scared/nervous. Just make them actually look hurt...as there is actually a reason they can't simply stand up.
Tenno are badasses. They calmly wait for the end of for a teammate to find them.
If they can maintain that composure and amount of focus to be aware of their surroundings and handle firearms....why not just stand up?
Badass would be knowing you're in pain and going to die, but drawing the weapon out and taking as many enemies as you can with you regardless. Butt scootin' just looks silly...
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Anyone else find it kinda funny that we simply lay on the ground when we get downed?
They never look in pain, they never look tired or like they're struggling.
We're bleeding out and going to die yet we sit there calm as Hindu Cows.
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How about altering it?
Body language tells quite a story and to see someone struggling to stay awake and crawl away both scared and/or nervous I feel would be more appropriate than some Rhino kickin' back, scooting his butt along the ground while calmly picking enemies off.
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I've always wanted to see new infiltration and extraction animations.
As it is we either get dropped out of a ship, or it flies in close, we disembark and sneak through vents to the part of the ship where the mission starts.
Extraction? Always the same...dropship waiting. We just walk in, take off, and that's that.
There's SO much room for mission and events between that stuff!
Boarding the ship from the outside, finding a way in, sneaking through and dropping into place. Or maybe the ship sorta pulls a slingshot moves and opens its hatch, heads directly towards the vessel and immediately pulls up and brakes, sending us flying in through a window or something that shuts behind us (Could be used for missions that are under fire and starts pre-alarmed)
Extraction? Make it more interesting or something. Open a hatch and free fall while dodging space debris towards your ship. Or having to take a leap of faith in which grineer/corpus follow and jump after us, having us fight them while falling as the ships speeds up to catch us.
Just SOMETHING other than entry via grate, and exit via drop panel so conveniently placed...
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No, Infested are already so much cannon fodder it's unbelievable. Might change when the enemy of the Tenno thing comes in, but no. If anything they should be made harder by generating better options for them to use not simply bum rushing you every, single, time.
After watching Aliens and the Thing last weekend I wouldn't mind Chargers climbing the walls to get the drop on you. Ancients, need resistance to CC not nerfs.
Smaller infested yes. I agree they're but cannon fodder. Ancients however are a huge problem if trying to do melee only.
If you bring guns into the mix, then yeah, ancients are easily dealt with and need behavioral changes and possibly some new attacks to buff them However as it stands, DE claimed melee would be a viable option. A "path" you could take if you so choose. With ancients as they are? That just isn't so...
The changes I proposed are but small ones. Something simple to make melee possible against them.
Ideally? I'd love to see more attacks other than their two punches.
Attack 1: Normal punch, instead of flooring the Tenno, just stagger them back a second and do the same damage.
Attack 2: Using the tentacle arm they raise it up high and sweep it across, sending any Tenno that doesn't hop over it or block onto the ground
Attack 3: A charging attack with a nice wind up strike of that tentacle arm. Would be spotted by the movement and wind up but deliver lots of damage if it lands.
Smaller infested?
I've love to see them on walls and ceilings.
Add in a basic slash while wall running, and some way to keep our wall-dash-slash and combat could be more on the move rather than sitting in a single place just pulling off combos and button mashing.
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However these ideas would take time and effort. In the meantime things like Disruption taking place regardless of blocking or not should be fixed. And of course...we currently have no way to melee Toxic Ancients safely at this point which needs a solution. Any melee weapon should be available to combat them.
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Meanwhile, on other side of the board there's valkyr warcry to slow enemies down...
Frost bubble to slow enemies down
Saryn molt to distract and miasma to stun then contagion to buff your melee if using corrosive or heat/lightning dmg
Ember accelerant to stun and increase fire melee dmg
Banshee to sonar and knockdown
ash to cloak and cut
rhino to stomp
nyx to absorb and chaos.
hydroid to puddle or knockdown
Trinity link+vampire+well build
Add any of these+galatine whirlwind+channel and you can get up to lvl 100 infested like it's nothing without making it to much of a hack nd slash, but honestly, who fights infested without expecting it to be a hack nd slash i mean c'monnnnn
i was also just playing with the serro and it's also pretty capable of reaching at least lvl 80's
with infested i typically prefer the melee weapons with reach so that i don't get zapped or poison proc'd
using stuff like dakra/nami/nikana will just get you killed in style.
Your claims infer we have to be a specific frame to deal with these problems when in turn, the Devs stated melee was to be a viable option against all enemies/factions. How is this so if we have to use a crutch to make it happen?
But for fun (Assuming you're playing JUST melee, no primary/secondary)
Valkry - Warcry will slow them down but again, high levels? Touching a toxic = Death
Frost - Same thing, slow, but still have to touch them to kill them
Saryn - Effective , but fighting them hand-to-hand shouldn't rely on being a specific frame or frame specific powers
Ember - Even when stunned you still gotta get close to the Toxics...
Banshee - Even on the ground...yeah you see where I'm going with this
Ash - Unless cloaking deters poison damage...yeah...now you're just invisible and down. Even harder to revive
Rhino - Stomp, Enemy floating in air, get close to melee, blargh
Hydroid - Like Saryn, effective, but frame specific. plus higher levels is mostly ancients. Gonna be lots of puddles...
Trinity - Frame specific but a damn good method.
As for using a specific weapon? That's lame man...not everyone wants to use the Galatine or something. Hell maybe someone wants to play like Hayden from Dark Sector and go full on melee with the Glaive! Should they be restricted of playing how they wish cause of enemies that have a clear unfair advantage?
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My point here is that regardless of your frame
Your melee weapon...
Should you have modded it right and ranked it up
Perhaps Forma'd it and such...
Melee SHOULD be a possible solution.
That was the purpose of Melee 2.0
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Oh yeah I forgot poison ancients used to be that way I miss the poison cloud traps
The problem was it was instant and did so much damage that scaled WITH the ancient that anyone even close to it when it died was instantly downed and trying to revive them was a gamble unless they could crawl away from it.
It just seems silly we can't even bump into them without being poisoned. The toxic poison should be INSIDE the ancient. Let us fight them sword to arm...tentacle...thing. That arm should be what is used to deliver the poison, not their over-sized pores just exhausting the fumes.
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I've recently taken up going pure melee from time to time and with each faction comes a different sort of strategy while fighting.
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THE PROBLEM
- Grineer - Hitscan weapons, blocking and cover plus maneuvering is essential to survival
- Corpus - Projectile weapons, dodge and weave, close distance, be weary of shields
- Infested - Not prepared for melee 2.0?
Lower class infested swarm us, granted we have a multi-hit weapon or something strong enough to one-hit them we're solid. The games becomes hack-n-slash but while still fun, doesn't offer any tactics or strategy other than how to get away when our stamina is down.. Infested Ancients while fine on normal missions, become a hassle during Defense or Survival. Unless you beat them to their sucker punch, they're gonna floor you.
This becomes unfair and quite a hassle, very quickly.
How? Why?
Being able to block only from the front opens up our sides and rear to that instantaneous suck-punch they so love to deliver. While it can be blocked and therefore introduces a bit of tactics to the slaughtering of infested...Disruptors and Toxic Ancients become a huge problem that ruins the flow of gameplay and all around seems broken.
- Disurptors energy steal can effect you THROUGH your block.
- As a melee fighter touching a Toxic Ancient is a death sentence.
- Ancients Punch attacks even when blocked, leaves a Tenno stunned, open for more sucker-punches
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THE SOLUTION
I don't have a suggestion/idea to deal with the smaller hack-n-slash aspect of the infested but the Ancients need some sort of adjustment...
My proposal for the meantime...
- Blocking prevents the Disruption effect
- Ancients initial sucker punch reaction time reduced a second
- Toxic Ancients can be touched without poison being applied
- Toxic Ancients need to attack in order to deliver poison payload
- Upon death, 1-2 delay before Toxic Ancients body releases noxious fumes
NOTE: Remember this is proposed and suggested based on playing a pure melee build.
(Anyone can easily say, "Just shoot them from afar" or "use X power or Y weapon instead but again....melee should be a viable option against all enemies as intended. Regardless what you wield.)
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Could be when you kill the boss and get your "Savior of <Planet>" in-game achievement (Not steam to make it easier) you get your special piece of gear too. In addition to that those who already cleared the boss simply need to re-kill him/her once more to get it.
Hell would give new people some incentive to clear the star chart. Maybe lock the boss node till all other missions on that planet were cleared. As though from each mission the Lotus is extracting data which leads up to the location of said boss.
I support this idea of boss armor, cosmetics and trinkets.
Nyx's Body
in Art, Animation, & UI
Posted · Edited by Smac
Excalibur got Hayden Tenno's Proto-armour
Nyx = Female Excalibur