(PSN)GEN-Son_17
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Posts posted by (PSN)GEN-Son_17
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4 hours ago, Aruquae said:
I too do something like this, but I believe we are the minority
Worth to note that this post isn’t about wanting to change overguard to make it easier for CC frames, it’s about changing Eximus overguard to make them immune to damage abilities. If there’s one thing the devs try to stop constantly, it’s AOE, and Eximus units completely trivialize (just by themselves) the only thing that was was worth considering against AOE (frame wise, not weapon wise).
Only thing is, with a good glass cannon build (such as Banshee and Limbo), you would have a greater risk, yes, but you would at least have been able to deal with it. And no, I’m not referring to normal Star chart. I’m bringing up things such as SP endurance (and by that I just mean 10 min or longer) where you start to notice more Eximus.
Of course my little rant on CC being completely useless against Eximus is beside the point.
So, to ask the question… would you be fine with Eximus units being immune to damage abilities? Why, or why notAhhh, I see. That's a tough one but I would say no to eximus being immune to damage abilities but yes to any damage procs in the IPS area. I say this because I think anything that has forceful, physical impact onto the overguard should count towards it's depletion (especially impact and blast based), but we shouldn't have any after effects the procs offer. I also agree with DE's decision to keep cold as the only elemental proc to have an effect since cold truly effects everything. I especially love that even that has a limited effect. That was a nice attention to detail.
On a side note, I am very happy you specified your referencing to SP endurance. I honestly have a bias against longer endurance gameplay being included into game changes and balancing. Making it easier for that side usually further trivializes the normal chart and non endurance SP sides and that is very bad for all of us, IMO. In fact, I lean towards giving the enemy even more leverage over us as soon as levels get to level 301 (aka right after 10x our max rank). More toxin eximus, more slash based enemies and more magnetic eximus. Players are too comfortable not having to use resistance mods and arcanes and try a little too hard to push DE even further away from using nearly all of them. I want level 301 to be damn near impossible and force endurance players to make even larger sacrifices for power, have better results from gaining resistance defense over power, or experiment with even more creative tactics to try and find a great balance.
This would help to solve a HUGE issue for me and maybe the forums in general: where and when in the game do these heavier discussions regarding balance, overguard, challenge, difficulty and "meaningful rewards" normally take place. It's a rant, sorry, but I think this separation can refine a lot of the game from all sides.
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On 2024-04-05 at 6:28 PM, Waethan said:
Hello everyone! First time posting here... I don't know if I'm in the good place for what I want to talk about.
A little bit of context first : I've been playing Warframe for a long time now, but I'm just unlocking stuff to get mastery points, playing for fun, discovering new updates, etc. Not really into making the strongest builds. I just get what's necessary for me to complete the things I want and that's it. Now that I've been working a full-time job where I got a lot of responsibilities, I end my day being exhausted and playing Warframe is the easy way for me to think about something else for a couple of hours...
Recently, I've been encountering some really toxic players on public lobbies. During the event Gargoyle's cry, for exemple, I wasn't fast enough for some players who started insulting me and telling me they would report me for ''grief'' or something like that. And today, while I was leveling up Dante, a frame I don't even really know because I tend to just get the new ones to lvl 30 then forget about them, other players started harassing me because I wasn't doing a good job? I mean, I finished working and I'm tired. I'm not gaming to get insulted by others on a coop game, even though I might not always be that good, but I didn't die and wasn't a burden for the others during the mission... I reported the player for harassment this time, because even after the mission was over I told them to chill out and I'm just there to have fun and I got an answer in private like ''cry me a river'' or something... But I don't know if that report will do anything.
And in all my years of playing the game, I never noticed that sort of behavior, so I wanted to know if something changed in the community without me noticing recently or in the last few months (or even years)? What are your experiences with public matchmaking?
I'm finding a lot of those type of players tend to be what some call "Rushframe" players. They just want to get the rewards and leave. No exploration, no teamwork, no mechanics learning. It's all about selfishness in a public setting. Unfortunately, that's just people being people. Nothing we can do about it, regardless of the game we play.
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40 minutes ago, Berzerkules said:
Sure I can slap armor shards, health and armor mods/arcanes, adaptation, and DR helminth on any frame and build them as a tank but at that point why not just pick a frame that is designed to tank. I'd rather build towards a frames strengths and not gimp their kit by building to make up for their deficiencies.
I've also always hated playing tanks in every game. I get bored quickly straight face tanking. I like crowd control and glass cannon casters, I find it a more engaging experience when everything poses a threat until I deal with the situation.
I gotcha...but do you think our two choices of frame building define the challenge of the eximus units instead of their lack of CC susceptibility?
A glass cannon build always come with greater risk and make even a more basic unit seem more threatening. Meanwhile, I begin to sweat much later in the game where perhaps greater ability duration or range would come more in handy, but the frames can still take hits before I have to go into recovery.
Often, I tend to already have a class of weapons that supplements a particular frame's abilities and features, so I go a little hard when balancing the kit. Frames like an Ember, Frost or Nidus, for example, get types like the Parasitic bow, Incarnon Atomos, Incarnon Sancti Magistar and a Moa to help keep enemies close while creating faster opportunities to do finishers. Meanwhile, a Limbo or Nyx type would get more like the Trumna, a beam secondary like the Synoid Gammacor, glaives and a robo doggo, of which all are VERY good at clearing eximus, Acolytes and mobs nearly instantly but also spreads some aggro via a bit of radiation and the robo doggo's separation precept (forgot the name).
So basically, one style likes to keep enemies close while the other accounts for the lower eHP of some frames and has an arsenal that can keep enemies occupied or at a distance, in case I need to recover.
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16 hours ago, Berzerkules said:
Look at Banshee, the brief 2 second stagger on enemies as they enter silence range was enough time to deal with most enemies including eximus before the eximus rework. Now even though eximus abilities as nullified they still have their weapons and will kill you with them.
Or look at elemental casters like gyre and ember, they are both capable of mass spreading status effects. Electric tesla chain and heat ignite effects are good soft cc but it doesn't matter how many fodder enemies are effected when the dangerous ones give zero #*!%s.
Then we have frames like Revenant, he doesn't care that he can't enthrall an eximus because mesmer skin exists. We also have Rhino with iron skin and roar, he never needed to cast stomp to cc eximus because he tanks and buffs damage. Eximus pose little to no threat for these type of frames.
There is a huge difference between frames that rely on cc for survival and frames that don't, everyone should be able to realize this. If a frame is designed around cc abilities then there are key parts of their kit that do absolutely nothing to some of the most dangerous enemies in the game and since we are "forced" to build to brute force our way through overguard we melt standard trash mobs and they don't really matter.
And this is what I don't get. There aren't enough eximus units at a time for the frames you mentioned to be in such a bad position that we can't concentrate our fire on them while the mobs are under CC. To me, it makes perfect sense in this game to have weaker enemies succumb to room lockable abilities while the far fewer and much stronger "mini boss" style enemies can power through them. It would feel pointless to have EVERYTHING pose a minimal threat, especially in endurance SP, where I think this argument is stemming from. Even then, we're talking about much higher endurance levels where the game SHOULD be trying to wipe you out faster with more out of norms tactics like adding significantly more eximus enemies. At that point, very few frames are relying on most abilities and, instead, are using everything cohesively....or should be.
On a side note, I am assuming it is the squishiness of some of these frames that is part of the issue? Ember aside (who is a mega tank), I can see your angle but that's why we have mods and arcanes to balance that. This could be why I am not seeing the CC frame issue as an issue. I hate the low shield gating method, so I build every frame to at least have high health and at least 1500 armor (arcane guardian's 900 armor is added to get there for some frames) so they can take some hits and allow mods like Adaptation and Shock Absorbers to get me to a comfortable, consistent level of defense. Maybe I'm in the minority by doing this, but this keeps frames like Limbo, Nyx, Yareli and Volt in a tanky enough spot for me to have a lot more fun with my full arsenal.
16 hours ago, (PSN)slightconfuzzled said:Bad take. Only because it doesn't go far enough. We should extend it to every source of harm everywhere.
I have a family friend, older guy, two cloned kids, a Kubrow, solo father. Wife left him for a rich Corpus tinhat. Worked the night shift in the Kuva Fortress for 2 decades. No overtime pay, no pay rises, no sick leaves, no vacations, and nothing for his commitment and loyalty to the Queens. The stuff he had to endure... You know the Hyekka Master's just let their Hyekka's piss where ever they want? Yeah my buddy had to clean up that piss, even though it wasn't in his contract. Grineer may like to advertise they are a family of brothers and sisters, but thats only so they can have BS work policies and take advantage of you.
Anyway, my main point is, he finally made Eximus last year, and he earned that resistance and near immortality and you want to take it away? Instead we should make him immune to everything, including the sun eventually dying and going super nova, and the heat death of the Universe. The only things left in existence will be Eximus, floating through the cold cold vacuum of existence, trillions of years in the future, in a time so dank and lifeless, that nothing will really much anyway, including terms like existence, or CC, or Hyekka piss.
Wait what?
I freaking love this story. Always cooking through with the fun my friend. 😂
It's just too bad clones have such a short lifespan. Sadness
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On 2024-04-05 at 2:36 PM, Aruquae said:
The amount of times I mention overguard (for eximus in particular) making ANY CC reliant frame's life miserable is always met with "Just shoot them"
Alright, completely fair and valid, I do shoot them, and they die. It's niceBut then I look at damage frames... and realized just how severely punished CC frames are compared to them
DE talking about how they don't want to nuke rooms, understandable... so why do you keep on indirectly buffing nukers?
Why not make overguard (for eximus in particular) immune to ALL types of abilities? That'll even out the playing field, CC frames can't CC, that makes the eximus a priority. Nuke frames won't be able to nuke the entire room along with eximus, which also makes them more of a primary target that you can kill with your weapons.I am ready for the large amounts of "Bad take"
I don't get it. Are these eximus dudes so powerful that they just destroy you guys? C'mon, spit out: which CC frames are going through such a hopeless, dreadful, absolutely horrendous time that this discussion needs to keep coming up?
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8 hours ago, Skoomaseller said:
Which goes back to my first response to that: what you consider trash is not what I, and others, may consider trash. Beef up your arsenal, utilize the bane mods, throw some armor on your frames and take the challenge head on!
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9 hours ago, NeDesitVirtus said:
I like my new eyeball sumdali from using my fully modded Rhino, Stalhta, Cyanex (modded for cold for nechramechs), and Bo Prime. It was cool seeing people take a little more time and a bit more strategy. Was it a little harder with no operator and the increased Elite conditionals yes.
But I also saw a lot more synergy and buffing each other intentionally, watching where each other was at and waiting before popping the dockets into conduits til we could handle the dual Voidrigs.
And this was in a public lobby, which makes it all the more rewarding - breaking the stigma of public runs.
And I think this was the intention: to reintroduce a real team element back into the game. As it stands, SP Circuit, the Archons and the new cell modes have all been geared towards that direction and, if I remember some of the play style preferences some of the primary commenters in this thread prefer, it looks like solo style players are having a harder time feeling the update. The pessimist s will never be happy, but I'm curious to get more insight from the team loving players.
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23 hours ago, Skoomaseller said:
base hind is trash no matter who is looking at it. MANY weapons are just genuinely, factually speaking, bad.
the point I make absolutely works because my difficulty depends on what I am offered. That isn't a "challenge."
again, you can like this garbage if you want. I cannot stop you. just don't call it a challenge, because it isn't one.
So, a challenge to use a random loadout is not a challenge? Honestly, think about that for a second guys. You guys are literally saying a challenge isn't a challenge. We're asked to do something unique and, if we accept and meet that challenge, we get a full rewards package.
If this is not what a challenge is, then what is a challenge to you?
Also, if I recall correctly, the system allows for the variants to be used. Is this correct? I'm still traveling so I haven't tried the update yet.
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On 2024-04-02 at 5:22 PM, 2wentyThre3 said:
I've spent over a month in focussed preparation for the last update. All my spare time - of which I have a lot, granted - spent on Dante.
I saved plat. Traded for it. Bought some. Farmed forma, new Rivens, watched Devstream 177 multiple times for clues to the correct path for building Dante. Tested a bit, experimented. Time in Sim. Multiple weapon loadouts.
And now, all my resources spent, I could be looking at rebuilding him at best and binning him off at worst. I had a secondary frame and now it's at threat.
I was maining Sevagoth before this... And my experience as a Sevagoth main was that people referred to him as the Gloom Helminth. I love Sevagoth - He got help in his augments. I love how complex he is when you actually understand his kit. He has 7 spells. Just like Dante. And the community called him the Gloom Helminth, some still do. What's my point? Sevagoth is still largely ignored because of how he was treat and how people view him. Some people had their hands burned by how he felt before augments and won't touch him again. Despite how good he is, people will never know and will most likely not take my word...
Dante works out of the box. It was literally like magic. Dante appeared and there it was, a new playstyle that just felt like everything I've wanted. No augments needed. Now we've had a nerf announced. Crippling his build now for a fix we will be sold later perhaps? He is the exact opposite as Sevagoth from a community and mechanical standpoint. But Dante could end up with the same fate if this nerf goes too far. 7 abilities. Nerfed, with maybe one good ability left? A Warframe stands to possibly be shelved because of bad management of his identity. And a Helminth ability that's more useful on other frames than it's progenitor. Looking at you Nezha.
This leaves an incredibly bad taste in my mouth DE. I want you to know this. Being made to feel regret even before we know what the nerf holds. Feeling regret for investing so much in such a small period of time and then being told it can be changed so quickly.
This really blows... Even if I have it all wrong and the nerf is minor, I've still been made to feel like this. I imagine others have too. It's not right.
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[EDIT:] Below are my findings for Dante Pre and post nerf with my findings based upon my build.
Overguard generation using Light Verse and Triumph.
Cast strings, amounts and times pre and post nerf:
2,2,4 - 2,2,4 // Maximum OG in 6 casts costing 310 energy in total and approx 5 seconds cast time.
2,2,4 - 2,2,4 - 2,2,4 - 2,2,4 - 2,2,4 - 2,2,4 // Maximum OG in 18 casts costing 930 energy in total and approx 20 seconds cast time.
(128% Duration 45% efficiency 175% Range 343% Strength) Build was not changed after Nerf.It's us players that cause the nerfs. We provide the feedback to DE in the workshop and the devs then adjust. It's more rare for the devs to nerf stuff on their own. Even still, the nerfs are never so big that the investment into the frame or weapons is wasted. It's only when the change makes absolute sense (AFKong, Skynax, Borderless Whipclaw Khora, etc), and, usually, the players already knew the nerf was going to arrive and secretly know it should've been nerfed.
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41 minutes ago, Skoomaseller said:
session 1 I get base hind, kuva kraken, and ether daggers on caliban
session 2 I get tenet arca plasmor, laetum and xoris on revenant
session 3 I get trash primary, garbage secondary, mediocre melee on mesa
which ones seem the best to conquer most content?
when the "difficulty" hinges on a dice roll, it isn't difficulty. you can enjoy this slop if you like it, by all means don't let me stop you, but don't call it a "challenge" because it isn't.
unless of course praying to rngesus is the challenge
Again, the point you're trying to make doesn't work. What you consider trash is not what I may consider trash. Doing millions of damage means nothing if you only need thousands or tens of thousands and the right build for the enemy you're fighting...which is EXACTLY why we have multiple loadout options for every single weapon we use. If we're too lazy to create a proper build for the new mission that has a specific enemy faction that we have (should have) scanned data on, then we should not be complaining about weapon quality.
What I'm seeing a lot of is this pattern of players that just want to jump in and win, full stop. At lower levels, that's fine but not at higher levels and SP, where we're supposed to put some thought in and respect to the harder hitting, tougher enemies. The arguments are literally against applying an effort and I don't quite understand that. Is Warframe the only game that goes through this?
In regards to difficulty, again, there will be players who will find this game mode very hard to do. Subjective talk about what is or isn't difficult won't matter for a while and most certainly won't be an important consideration on the forums...aka the place where we could claim our skill is better or worse than it actually is. More importantly, I think this game mode will 100% cause players to take a look at their inventory and, just like the Circuit, they'll have to pay some attention or possible get wrecked.
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15 minutes ago, Kaiga said:
Well tenno, Deep Archemedia is finally here.
Here's your "endgame" lmaoCan't wait to try it!! It looks like they watered it down to address the complainers but we'll see.
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7 hours ago, _Eclips3_ said:
Rather than just lazily spawn a few dozen weak enemies and give the player the ability to fly across the map by spamming CTRL+Spacebar, make the game boots on the ground, make it more tactical. The game feels more like Minecraft creative mode where you can just fly around and throw around random stuff you downloaded from a mod website. The parkour update was a massive mistake. Also make the amount of enemies realistic and a lot tougher, real militaries don't just scatter 20 random troops in all directions, they need to use tactics. The Ai needs to be improved so they behave like an actual soldier.
Honestly speaking, your idea is absolutely not the way to go. Warframe is exactly what it should be: a horde, looter shooter with a proudly overpowering arsenal. The AI in this game is better than you think, but nothing in the game is going to be allowed enough time to see us, take cover and initialize the tactic before dying. Nothing should be faster and stronger than us, unless it's some sort of boss that has what we have, or better.
That last part is important because there are still a LOT of players that feel some of the normal content, and most of SP, is difficult and has ai actions that are too good. Of course, this is more due to knowing how to build and shoot but the concerns are there.
If we really want to create a newer feeling gaming experience, then the world would have to find a way for forums and content creators to no longer allow the spoiling of the game.
5 hours ago, Nero.DMC said:DE needs bosses and enemies with engaging mechanics, 99% of enemies do not require any kind of interaction, those few that do are either not worth the trouble or pretty me.
The fragmented one was a decent try but it lacks interaction we kill him the same way we kill everyone else, and that is where WF needs to iterate add mechanics to bosses, force players to interact with bosses and reward them accordingly
We have that already. The Archons, the Eidolons, the orb spiders, the ropololyst, the infested emissary, Oroworm, and the Fragmented one all have special mechanics and interactions to them. Actually, I think only the Sargent and the Acolytes didn't have a special mechanic.
The issue for a lot of you guys is just that you're accustomed to the game and anticipate something different.
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On 2024-03-30 at 9:19 AM, _Anise_ said:
Guns were given arcane adapters because they were behind melee in hard content _/
Melee got better with hold to attack _/
Melee have been given arcane adaptors because ... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Melee are now vastly superior in hard content _/
why?
ps:Guns with single chambers that need to be spammed still exist
I think the mistake is that people keep referencing hard content as the metric. It is not and should never be. We're supposed to assemble our best arsenal and go for it. It's just that DE has done a great job of making a liar out of OP, as melee is not vastly superior to guns.
My Spectra Vandal, for example, has such a potent output, that I have to constantly remind myself that it only requires a half second press of the fire button to destroy fully armored SP gunners. I demo'd this to friends and blew their mind...because they were told the weapon was trash. I then used the old Veykor Hek and Dex Sybaris to prove similar strengths.
I say all of this because we are already in a GREAT, FANTASTIC place in Warframe where 99.5% of every weapon, every frame, every companion is very much high performing, even in SP. It's the user who determines how good a weapon is and we are supposed to understand when a utility is more important than how fast to a kill. I think we need to stop trying to get some sort of boost to things all of the time. Eventually we'll just be at a mundane standstill because every weapon is asked to perform nearly the same. Do we really want to end up there?
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5 hours ago, CrownOfShadows said:
Maybe it's the toxicity of the forums getting to me but whenever someone says 'tell us how you'd do it' that's a red flag - 99% of the time they don't care and they just want to bash whatever idea you might throw out there. Anyways, just posted some quick thoughts for the wolves to mock and shred a couple posts above this.
Yep, just read it and I think we're on the same page, especially the visual pulsing syncing with the audio.
Regarding the potential insulting replies, I wouldn't worry about it too much. I mostly see strong pushback when the person with the Idea decides to bash DE first, and then insert their idea. At that point, everyone is going to expect an epic idea that backs up the bash talk.
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2 hours ago, CrownOfShadows said:
Saw the bait. Didn't take it. You only wanted a suggestion so you could ridicule it.
Actually, I was curious about your solution as well. You did suggest DE could've fixed the issue another way, which means you must've had a thought on it. Otherwise, why just say that?
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6 hours ago, TARINunit9 said:
No and yes. Jackal isn't hard, but he can be very unfun and tedious in one specific circumstance: solo Steel Path Duviri if he shows up too early before you get any good decrees
I find the "can be unfun and tedious" comment to be a "workaround" type of way to say that the content is actually hard. I don't know why saying something is difficult is such a taboo thing to say in here. I've seen countless people get wrecked by the Jackal and they always say something similar...but I quickly point out to them that they just can't try to take the lasers and expect to survive.
Like any game, it is difficult until the pattern is learned. After that, skill and timing does what it does best. It's a hella fun fight, and the "unfun and tedious" part of it is what makes it fun...IMO. That wasn't a dig on you @TARINunit9, it's just an observation of whenever that phrase is used, I notice it coincides with a part of the game that could be considered difficult.
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On 2024-03-27 at 12:56 PM, Binket_ said:
The only thing of relevance here.
If the lowest performers aren't progressing, it's most likely because they're either too stubborn to actually try or they were never actually challenged once in the game.
Honestly, the biggest "challenge" I've had from the newest Disruption is telling people what the icons are and what conduits are going up.You can make content that's engaging without "challenge" too, but so far only Disruption has managed that.
It's a great gamemode, but it's not the ONLY gamemode.
When most of my gameplay devolves into pressing the same button with the same tactic with the same outcome? Over and over?It. Gets. Boring.
DE, do your job. Said this every update because it seems the "lighting engine" is the top priority every time.
Tell the team in charge of that this: "IT WORKS, STOP TOUCHING IT. Go give those resources to the departments that NEED it, like balancing!"
No debate, it's getting annoying where all our fashion and hardware falls apart when somebody decides to touch the lighting engine.
Yet our builds devolve further into laziness and mediocrity. If we can't do fashion and we can't play the game-- we'll go elsewhere!Honestly, this is why we're in this back and forth with community opinions. There's a select few that feels the way you do. A gaming company has to move with the biggest crowd so, if you think the game is mostly boring, you're actually in the extreme minority. Otherwise, DE wouldn't be doing this seesaw style of adjusting.
To be fair, neither your wish for upping the challenge (and challenge types) nor the other players wanting to ease up on the challenge throttle are bad (except for your "no debate" comment. You lost the war right there). The problem is DE is handling both sides pretty well and most players just don't see it. The "turn it up and then dial it down over time" model is literally a player base voting metric for DE to use for that adjustment. It's just that the majority wins and there isn't enough of your type of player to to win the debate. Going your way may cost serious revenue loss.
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On 2024-03-24 at 2:00 AM, Arniox said:
my wording was exaggerated. Every weapon with a good build can handle the entire star map. It's when you get to SP that a few odd weapons here and there start to drop off.
Kunai are kinda crazy not gonna lie. Even the normal and mk1 variants.
I'd say maybe:
- Normal ballistica if you don't have a good build on it.
- Normal Cestra is similar
- Carmine Penta is eh. It struggles a bit in steel path, but I have a 9 forma build for it that makes it sufficient
- Daikyu is a bit weak compared to other bows. Especially in SP
- Cossowar feels a bit weak now days
- Cerata also feels a little weakThat's just a few that I can remember recently reformaring and not really liking
Keep in mind as well that I only recently came back after a very long break so have only 3 incarnon adapters installed atm. I'm sure once I get them all, all weapons will be good.
My apologies for the late response but your list kinda proves what I am saying. Your list of lesser performing weapons is completely different than mine, and you actually love the weapon I thought wouldn't be considered strong. That just sums up the message that it's just not a strong point to make regarding which weapons or warframes are trash and which aren't (and I'm DEEPLY upset that you placed my beloved monster Daikyu on your list. You...you take it off your list THIS INSTANT!!! GRRRR!!! 🤣). DE has simply done an incredible job of not wasting a players time with their inventory, even in SP.
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5 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:
Overall yes, but not specifically what I mention. It's only level increases between those modes, which does not solve the problems of lacking engaging content. And even with Netracells being higher levels well above the norm, it isnt at a level high enough to really handle the power we've obtained over all these years. That is why DE needs to consider adding mechanics to the mobs that might requires us to slow down a bit, aim properly and even prioritize targets. In Netracells and SP for instance I slide through things, hack and chop it with my melee or aim somewhere at the mob with my gun to kill them. And mostly the things die in a slide or a hit or two, which kills another bunch of enemies close by aswell. And this is because they are just lumps of health.
So premades resulted in trivializing something? Wow, what an unsuspected shocker! Of course that will eventually happen, which is fine, they were still challenging at release, that is the whole point. What you mention is just normal for games and new content. The problem with most WF content is that it isnt challenging even the day it is released. Atleast Eidolons managed to be.
But you are thinking of what it is like now, not how it could be. We dont have what I ask for in the game. Things for instance do not properly stack for enemies, they lack debuffs etc. You practically ignore what is actually said and use the current game as a basis for what a future game would be with the things mentioned added. All those things you see as issues could be solved by applying the correct debuffs and buffs to enemies. Scramble abilities that bring players out of stealth, nullification auras that add a chance to enemy bullets to dispell abilities (like Mesmer Skin etc). There are a multitude of affixes out there in the arpg world to take inspiration from, affixes that work well in games already to combat power creep, meta and so on. It would for instance be very hard for Kullervo to wipe out a massive amount of mobs if one of them suddenly makes them all immune to abilities through an aura, then if that mob also has a weakpoint it wont just be for him to teleport and prison shank it. It isnt like WF is a brand new genre defining game, it is a game among multiple others with a 30 year long past to look at and take inspiration from at this point. I mean DE have already implemented counters to some of the things you mention wouldnt be possible or worth it (not really sure which you imply), we can see that on the Fractured One, which counters stealth and defense buffs in different ways. No need for that to stay to only a boss. So the mechanics are there, they just need to be guarded aswell versus a farting Saryn or a cannon happy Zarr user.
It isnt pretending, it is knowing from experience. You talk as if you are under the impression WF is in some unique power creep dilemma. I also get the feeling you think that the weakpoint enemies must be hard to kill. No, they need to be hard enough to kill only so we dont wipe them out with passive splash damage or a tendril linking to them, they need to be hard enough to require us to stop and aim and prioritize them among the rest of the mobs. They dont need to be mini-bosses, just things that make it harder for us to wipe out their friends while they are up, so we take a moment to prioritize targets.
Ontop of such things DE could always add jailer mobs and similar aswell to screw us over in our other fast paced combat. Which like in other games would require us to build to avoid it, which would also mean we give up power for utility. Just that we are able to ignore knockdowns is an issue on it's own currently. Which is something DE should rethink imo. However, since people hate to lose what they have it is likely better that DE adds other CC effects that arent covered by knockback/knockdown immunities.
In the end WF is just another arpg, so no reason why the things cannot be solved without taking away our arsenal preferences. Deep wont be difficult, since it will just be Circuit lite because we will have access to both operator and companions aswell as certain trivializing Helminth options. In addition to that it will also all take place within the labs, so we'll face some of the most trivial mobs in very simple missions. Assassination and disruption are the only two to really consider, but those will also be instantly trivialized the moment we get to pick atleast just one free choice while maintaining research. All the other modes wont matter, since in a worst case scenario with the weapon/frame rolls you can still fall back on operator and pet and just make sure to bring Breach Surge on your frame to sync with them. But that would also require 12 bad rolls.
Actually, all of the newly released content, that was designed to be more difficult, actually was proven to be so...to the majority of the player base. Forum "elite" don't count and should NEVER be counted. We share tips, tricks and builds as soon as one of us figures out the meta. We should know this thanks to the infamous amp numbers for Eidolon hunts. We constantly ruin our own experiences and then point to the devs for not making something challenging enough.
In contrast, we see many pub players, chats messages and the forum posters struggling with Eidolons, begging for Railjack taxis, hunting for SP builds, upset about common sense nerfs and changes, etc. All of this isn't a bad thing, but it should be used as indicators as to why DE balances the challenge and domination aspects of the game. A select few of us post about how easy the game is...and the names are SUPER common. Maybe 10-15 posters tops...out of millions of players and thousands of registered forum users. Meanwhile, a FLOOD of first time posters write about nerfs like Wukongs, void dash and the AOE changes. This easily tells us why DE's decisions not as bad as we portray.
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I think a bottom floor option could work. Similar to the purchasable room on the Zariman, DE could offer a special elevator that gives access to three additional rooms for decorating only. Since it is cosmetic only and doesn't effect any part of the game's progression, it definitely would not hurt to have it.
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On 2024-03-21 at 3:59 PM, (PSN)rexis12 said:
Honestly if Warframe wants their weapons to be played by all and is confident to have a another RNG weapon system, then have the modding be 60/60 at base so that we can actually mod the weapons and see their 'potential'
God knows some weapons are absolute ass until you slap a Potato on them. Like even the sheer difference between a Castanah with and without the reactor is insane and I HATE IT.
But that removes a critical income source to sustain the game. Neither DE nor the players could afford to have that as an option.
On 2024-03-21 at 3:03 PM, SneakyErvin said:They can do it for new modes, or add al alternate "path" to both SC and SP for instance. No need for anyone to complain then. Those players can ignore the new mode, and for an alternate SC or SP path they can just do the old. The new paths would just have more loot, like add elite units and give those paths the scaling fissure reward unlocks aswell. With elite versions of say an eximus dropping two times their natural loot aswell
I think this is what this Neutracells, and SP in general, are already designed to be, so you're definitely aligned with DE with the Idea. The issue is that some players want to be able to partake in every mode AND keep it as easy as possible by not allowing compromises or restrictions. They want the old way and the new way you mentioned to be virtually the same way.
Looking at some of the comments, the issue comes all the way back to the tired difficulty/challenge debate. Someone is always going to try to convince others that the game has some sort of design issue because *insert talking point here*. The reality is that DE is doing exactly what you mentioned, and it is working, so they should just stay the course and maintain the two path system: Normal star chart/SP star chart, Circuit/SP Circuit, Eidolon/Tridolon, standard Eyes/60 Eyes, etc.
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On 2024-03-20 at 3:38 PM, SneakyErvin said:
Weakpoint mobs and units with specific defenses are the solution. I'm not sure why you are hung up on Eidolons. Yes they are trivial, now. But they are also content released in freakin 2017... 7 damn years ago. Sure they got trivialized before that, but not by a wider part of the community until years later. This is something that happens in all games, but it is also a type of mechanical setup that doesnt get trivialized as quickly as just walls of standard HP that can be blasted into nothingness with poorly aimed AoE or a melee button held down while you press or let go of your forward movement on and off.
So the main point of weakpoints and mechanically unique units is to allow new content to actually be new for a while. It doesnt matter if it at a later point gets trivialized, what matters is that it is relevant when it releases, to match the current power of the player better. Cells for instance did not achieve that, since all we face are just regular standard "rank and file" trash.
A thing they should really combine across all factions are Guardian Eximus mechanics and Glassmaker enemies. A unit that is both hard to take down due to specific weakpoint locations on the body while it also makes all allies around it extremely resistant to AoE damage. And there are several other combinations of ally buffs that could be added, things that make it annoying for the player to handle trash aslong as the buffer is still alive. I mean other games manage it well even when the player deals absurd amount of damage, so no reason why WF couldnt be able to have the same potential. And WF has the benefit of being a shooter, so can utilize the idea of weakpoints to achieve these mobs that shake up combat on the fly.
Another thing DE seems afraid of using enemies with debuffs. A heavy enemy unit that has a "Roar" aura, which applies max puncture stacks on players/companions and buffs allies with a damage multiplier. You can just see how much a damage multiplayer can shift thing by going to Mot in the void instead of another survival mission of the same level. Adding damage multipliers as a occuring effect from mobs as a mission progresses would also help shift things up. And while at the same time inflcting players with lower damage output, that target would become a priority, since you have lower TTL and worse TTK aslong as it is alive. And combine that with enough enemy debuffs because you decide to not handle those targets quickly and you might start to struggle. The main point is that the provider of these buffs and debuffs must be durable in some way to make it a threat.
The issue here is the player base would explode on the forums about being "annoyed" at the tougher enemies, using every talking point possible as the reasoning: too bullet spongy, to hard to hit the weak point, why must I use magnetic damage, why must I use my operator amp, why damage attenuation, why this and I don't want to do that. We've all seen these patterns before and nothing DE does is going to change that.
I think the solution is for DE to just keep going forward as they were. There are just too many players, of too many genres of gaming, with way too many emotional states, and at too many different levels of play in this game for any harder type of play or any restrictions based gameplay to go unscathed.
Fortunately, DE is actually doing a terrific job of trying ideas and players are coming up with great ideas for DE to try. As long as that's the preferred path, (instead of the insults), then I say let's enjoy and try to stay within the reasonable bounds.
On 2024-03-20 at 11:34 PM, Kaiga said:Using RNG as a bandaid for endgame, to get around the monstrous power meta they created, rather than addressing it either with appropriate challenges or rebalancings, is bad for warframe, and is just bad design in general.
What if i told you RNG loadouts doesn't actually solve any of these problems with player power or difficulty? It's not a balance change or new tech to master, or anything other than less choice- Sometimes you do get revenant/torid/glaive prime anyway, which lets players reveal the (actual) hollow difficulty of the new mode, and then complain about braindead ez modo happens anyway, while the rest of the time you can't use whatever gear you want in the name of difficulty that also isn't really there some weeks, also because of RNG.I think this is the major disconnect of some of the players vs what the game actually is trying to do. What you think is bad game design is actually you trying to paint the RNG as something it is not supposed to do for us.
What the RNG is doing is giving us the challenge to use the weapons we claimed we mastered, according to our inventory. The game doesn't care if a player decided to call a weapon fodder or trash, and that is because that is a very, VERY subjective statement. Instead, the game is saying "you mastered this weapon/frame? Ok, prove it! Let's see what you can do with this combination. If you can prove yourself, then here's a prize". That's all.
That's important to keep in mind because nearly every weapon and frame is going to have players who favor them. Further, there will be players that will have builds that would greatly simplify the missions. In fact, this would be where the skilled builders and the meta players will be exposed. We've seen this before in SP Circuit, and this new mode will be lower leveled so it will be even more apparent. Either way, being asked to use what we chose to keep is not bad idea. After all, we kept the weapons/frames, mastered them, and used them for about 98% of the game...so why should the system not honor us with a mode like this?
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22 hours ago, Hexerin said:
You do realize that award shows are PR stunts, and the awards go to whatever developer/publisher wins the auction for them, right?
It's the same with any other award show in any other industry. Including the big ones like the Oscars.
First, that is a MAJOR lie. That is not how the industry works. Yes, there are biases, but not to the level of what you are suggesting (and yes, I work in the industry and have been behind the scenes of the Emmys, Oscars, CMAs and VGAs).
Honestly don't like when people throw stuff like this out. In DE's case, Warframe has earned its right to be top tier enough to win awards. The game has kept a very large audience happy and has done so for over a decade. I don't know what your definition of success is, but managing an omnidirectional player base for over 10 years is a stratospheric accomplishment all gaming companies would kill for.
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3 hours ago, TheBlingKing said:
You want a Warframe.
Dang, beat me to it! 🤣
We need the CC immunity talk. Again
in General Discussion
Posted
I think DE has a pretty good path to a solution: Take this current overguard system and introduce it at SP level 301. Level SP 301 is right after 10x our max rank and is also where I would reduce enemy damage output a bit, but increase eximus presence (to warm players up to what is to be expected going forward). Many players wouldn't like this because it increases the challenge...and that is a very good thing.
As I said in another thread, this CC issue is exclusively an issue in SP/endgame levels, particularly endurance and the latest, hardest game mode DE offers. All other lower leveled modes have enemies that can't take our firepower. These issues SHOULD exist at the highest levels and cause us to rethink every build we have. We are seriously too comfortable with our offense and meta builds and I'm happy to see stun lock style CC take a hit and make us think twice about our protections, our over reliance on CC and not diversifying our arsenals enough to prepare for the eximus mini bosses.
Don't get me wrong, I also don't like having to take on overguard protected enemies...but I love that they exist and work hard to keep me from being overly dominant. I can still shut down every other enemy with an Avalanche, but I better be ready to focus on the eximus while everyone else is frozen. That sounds right in line with how late game should be.