Basalto
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Posts posted by Basalto
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18 minutes ago, Datam4ss said:
He doesn't trust hard mathematics so...
I deal with them weekly, but please, let's keep derailing.
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What I mean is, basically scrap holster speed (or maybe don't, just speed the default up enough for a fast-paced shooter and keep the mods, whatever) and use the same swap model used in the new melee system to swap ranged weapons. Putting it in a detailed example:
- You have a Braton and a Lato.
- You want to switch to the Lato while you're holding the Braton.
- You press the swap key.
- The Braton vaporizes from your hands and appears on your back the same way melee does when you switch to ranged, and ranged does when you switch to melee.
- You already pull the Lato while the Braton is vaporizing with the space magic.
- Lato on your hands and shooting happily.
Now this would not make a fast swap look weird (ever tried Vigorous Swap, Speed Holster and Streamlined Form together? It looks absolutely silly) and basically streamline the lengthy process of switching ranged weapons into a matching set of sorts, since your warframe kinda doesn't "manually" swap to melee or ranged, but it manually swaps between ranged.
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On 2019-03-30 at 2:16 AM, Xylyssa said:
I for one like that their color is based on the energy of what caused the effect, but I feel like something like this could be a toggled option in Display options for those who don;t like it.
I believe this might be the best solution to it. It doesn't remove it for people who like it, and adds and option to remove it for people who don't like it. Fits Warframe's excessive customization, after all.
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1 hour ago, Spookmineer said:
Balancing issues for certain frames: Hildryn with a -energy riven, Inaros and Nidus with a -shield riven, Loki with a -strength riven. These seem to be some obvious ones.
It's worth mentioning there's an equivalent to those, which is the -zoom Rivens.
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2 hours ago, taiiat said:
i think i've tried to use enough factual information to explain it to you. if that's not enough, then i give up.
I believe you should've given up the moment you decided to derail the thread constantly with your apologism to laziness, but that's just my two cents. Good riddance, really. Maybe this can finally go back to being a feedback thread instead of "ur bad if u criticize game".
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Joined mission in the middle of cutscene, was not invulnerable during it, two people go downed, me included, and to top it off, when I got up I couldn't do anything besides moving, crouching and typing in the chat. Missed an amber star and couldn't do anything to help my teammates. And this boss fight is how old, again? Yeah; disappointing.
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45 minutes ago, DatDarkOne said:
I kinda hate to say it, but the two builds you showed are kinda bad. Well bad is somewhat strong. Let's say they aren't as efficient as they could be. Sorry fellow Tenno, they are.
Of course they aren't as efficient as they could be. I never said they were some kind of ultimate badassery or the alpha and the omega of meta builds. I'm simply saying they work better for me than the dumb suggestions of putting Split Chamber on a semi-automatic weapon.
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38 minutes ago, moostar95 said:
It's funny when de takes away fun and player creativity. That Trinity nuke was awesome. They got rid of that and nerf ember in the process. But leave saryn in the state she is because reasons. De has no clue what game balance is.
It's specially worse when the "pls give power creep" part of the community seems to have such an influence on their decisions. Either that, or DE just really doesn't like the part actually concerned about Warframe not being entirely brainless.
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5 minutes ago, Datam4ss said:
As I said, did you even do the mathematics? If you can hit heads so consistently, Argon Scope would still give more of that consistency you insist on than Hammer Shot. Your argument is still a moot point either way.
I don't need to brag, but level 100 Eximi isn't anything to be proud about in WF.
I don't have Argon Scope. My argument didn't even need to exist because you people had to keep twisting and derailing the thread into anything but the actual topic. Kinda reminds me why I left this place all those years ago.
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3 minutes ago, Datam4ss said:
The amount of wrong ... just ... wow. I don't even know what I am even reading here XD
Of course, if it floats your boat. good for ya. But I will just say, if you do the math, the chance of a non crit (leading to base damage as your 9.6 multi is irrelevant) is 25% (assuming only Pointstrike), higher than the chance of a non crit AND non split (again leading to base damage that is the SAME as a non crit since the 7.5% multi is irrelevant and you shoot one bullet, as aforementioned) of 2.5% (25% of 10%) (assuming only Pointstrike and Split Chamber) as these are independent events. The conclusion is that only one in 40 bullets doing base damage is definitely better and more consistent than 1 in 4 bullets doing base damage, which is the exact same in both cases.
Elemental mods or Heavy Caliber would give the consistency you want, not Hammer Shot.
Heavy Caliber reduces accuracy; again, semi-automatic and headshots. And in case the native resolution picture was hard to read, I'm using three different elemental mods to get corrosive and cold. But hey, guess effortlessly downing level 100 eximi is just "wrong XD". It works, it works very well, I only have one gamble instead of two, and thus its consistency is way better than the "if u dont use split chamber ur rong lol" meme.
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13 minutes ago, Datam4ss said:
Uhh, maybe try Split Chamber instead of using Hammer Shot.
The Head multiplier is x2 on crit no matter how high you boost the crit damage. Crit modding doesn't give exponential increases to headshot/weakspot damage.
Sacrificing 30% elemental to slot a 60/60 instead of a 90 and putting Multishot gives more damage PER CLICK and more status per click with your build.
Taiiat is absolutely correct here.
Taiiat is absolutely wrong, because removing Hammer Shot on my Tiberon for Split Chamber would trade a guaranteed 9,5x crit damage for a 10% chance of not registering a shot on, once again, semi-automatic fire. I have to apparently unnecessarily keep stressing this because not having 100% multishot on a semi-automatic weapon is painful and a gamble, as opposed to the crit damage already being inserted in the gamble of a crit. My semi-automatic fire is enough for a non-crit to not interfere, but not enough for Split Chamber to not interfere. I'm not using Split Chamber on Tiberon Prime because my experience with Split Chamber and semi-automatic weapons screams that it's a bad thing, period.
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6 hours ago, taiiat said:
Maybe, uh, start clicking on heads before talking S#&$ about Hammer Shot and read again the part where I said I use semi-auto on Tiberon.
4 hours ago, Protera said:So... bullets are gonna get stuck in bodies, and most guns aren't going to ragdoll enemies the way you suggest on death. There's more to guns feeling powerful than that, and I feel like Warframe does a good job--audio, visuals, hit effects... I agree that more guns should bypass death animations, for exactly that reason--but is it really reasonable to expect it from every gun? A regular bullet, even Future Desert Eagle one, isn't gonna propel someone backward significantly. Bullets just don't do that, which is a bigger immersion issue, I think. From a more 'cinematic' standpoint, I can see where you're coming from, since it's pretty common in movies--but I still don't agree.
As for the point of dying enemies blocking bullets... I really, honestly don't mean to dismiss your concern with this, but this has never been a problem for me. Maybe it is a problem, because you're struggling with it, but I've never had enemies blocking one another like that in anything but the narrowest hallways, where that makes sense as an environmental complication, because in any other situation you can strafe into a clearer line of fire. I'm not likely to waste more than one shot's worth of ammo before I reorient myself. And in any situation where enemies are going to be swarming like that, I've got something to deal with the crowd. Rhino's Charge and Stomp abilities, my Staticor, or even just switching to melee to thin the crowd, as a few examples.
I'm not saying enemies should be backflipping with every weapon, really. I'm just using Corinth as an example of a weapon that triggers physics on every single kill I see, and never gives me any throuble with corpses blocking bullets. The Lex sometimes just punches the enemy hard enough on a headshot to make them drop dead even faster by giving them a starting velocity. It's more like semi-realistic physics that give each weapon a feeling of power, without straying from the weapon type's design. Hell, I'm pretty annoyed with my Soma slicing apart low-level enemies with a single crit headshot; it just feels so exaggerated to point one bullet out of 200 in their face and watching them behave as if I dumped 50 with the intention of making them into Swiss cheese. It's the little things that make a game entertaining, and KF2 is praised by its gore; I believe DE could learn a thing or two from Tripwire in that regard.
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8 hours ago, -Dajn said:
#vaubanrework! Hopefully Pablo does it 🙂
Hopefully one day. I'm confident we'll see an exalted turret.
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7 minutes ago, DatDarkOne said:
At his point I'm not sure if you want more realism or less of it. it's the statement about death animations that's causing my confusion on this one.
Then there's the referencing of Killing Floor 2. I just found and watched gameplay of it. then watched some gameplay of headshots in Warframe so I could slow both videos down to analyze. After doing this and viewing both games has lead me to believe one of two things: Either you are being extremely nitpicky or I'm missing your meaning.
I'm going to assume that I'm just missing something.
I don't care about realism nor do I care about the lack of it. Warframe has guns, I'd like guns need to trigger physics and not death animations, for both "I'm not wasting 8 to 15 capacity and a mod slot to not deal with that" and "it's fun" reasons.
I understand you not being able to see it from one video. It's not one video, it's five years. Not all guns fortunately trigger constant death animations, but not all guns do not trigger death animations at all. When it does happen, it's obnoxious. Curiously, you were the only person to actually raise the point of not seeing it as often as it sounds like I see it, so kudos for that. Using the brain is a rarity and all that stuff.
I actually went to record some footage to upload and demonstrate what I'm talking about, and for that I got a Braton and a Lato, which was my new player stuff. I'm actually surprised with the amount of ragdoll deaths, but also disappointed that there were death animations and they more than broke the flow of power the weapons had going on for them. Some animations exaggerate an enemy flipping sideways and smashing the ground, while others just pull a crappy faint, and it does not correspond to the power of the weapons. I mean, DE used such things for nearly any weapon I had. My Boar Prime used to trigger them constantly before I actually bothered changing it to blast (which is a very poor move for DPS, but I believe you can understand me wanting a shotgun, not a big pistol that fires a bunch of bullets together and makes enemies faint with the shot sound). Anyway, I'm not going to cherry pick footage and edit it to make it look like only death animations are a thing, just going to reinforce it's an issue that they do exist in a game where higher levels make it mandatory for you to kill everything as fast as possible, as well as that I have been seeing them on and on for years breaking any fun I had in weapons such the Drakgoon.
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The only Riven I need is Armored Agility. Sarcasm aside, Rivens already made this game even more of a hellhole than it previously was. I'd be severely disappointed with DE if a thing like warframe Rivens was ever introduced while they worked and reworked frame after frame to try (emphasis on "try") to remove the rampant power creep.
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1 hour ago, DatDarkOne said:
I was trying to get you o see that there are various factors such as damage type, special abilities, etc of weapons that do effect the behavior of enemies and their death throws. That you are blatantly ignoring the information we are giving you shows that you are only interested in what you want regardless of the larger picture.
I have considered the "larger picture" and the "larger picture" of "just waste mod space for it lmao" or "just use another weapon lmao" does not address any of the concerns I presented, not to mention intentionally missing my point, which was to not waste mod space for it and not have to resort to using another weapon. I'm a bit intrigued with how you feel the need to point out that I'm interested in what I want, though. Of course I am, it's why I made this topic; if I wasn't interested, I'd simply have kept shut. There also seems to be a misconception that I am trying to be convinced otherwise, but I spent 5 years not being convinced otherwise through playing this game. I'm not changing my mind because 5 years of the same thing speak more volume than people who appeal to realism on a sci-fi game and propose incredibly lazy band-aid solutions to a design flaw with an extremely simple solution.
1 hour ago, DatDarkOne said:Or just maybe you could make it into a hybrid crit/status build and still have a weapon that does even better against high level enemies without punchthru. using Dual stat mods instead of 90% ones would also give you more mod points/space to include Shred back in the build.
But this whole topic you have is basically that you want to use weapons with very high RoF while being extremely efficient with each bullet/projectile. If I am understanding his correctly, my responses will still stay the same.
Been there, done that. 5 years in this game and you think I wouldn't understand how to make more space for a mod? Like, come on, that almost sounds like an insult. The idea of a crit build is that you aim for the head and, indeed, are extremely efficient with each bullet because of it. That's how headshot crits work, really; they just deal massive damage and reward good aim, and that's how I like to play it. I hardly care about fire rate and damage per shot in a game where I get ammo by the bulk and only run out if I think shooting the foot is a good idea; what gets me is damage per second, and the very reason I gave up on Shred on my Soma Prime build was because of it. I could not have punch through, crit and status and damage on the same weapon, so I chose to give up one of those and made the weapon a single-target death machine instead of a conga line vanquisher, which severely outlined the death animation issue, as I was waiting for enemies to fall so I could hit the one behind them, as opposed to my Tiberon Prime with Shred, which just melts anything in a straight line.
All I ask is for weapons to properly trigger physics like the Corinth and remove this unnecessary issue in the game. Death animations, like having fun in games, are a thing of the past, of when computers used to bottleneck trying to run Source's ragdoll physics and FEAR was the top tier benchmarking game.
To quote a very good example I've been recently playing, Killing Floor 2 has exactly the kind of kills I want: you shoot, they drop dead and don't block your bullets with an outdated animation. Now I'll just wait for some smartass to come and say "then play Killing Floor 2 instead lolololo".
*: I took the liberty of taking some screenshots of both Soma and Tiberon to show why it's an issue:
Soma currently has Fanged Fusillade as a placeholder while I don't spend forma to make it the way I need it to be: corrosive and cold. That's 3 slots for crit and crit damage, two for Serration and Split Chamber, and three for the dual stat mods that will compose corrosive and cold. If I am to replace Split Chamber with Shred, which I have previously done, my DPS will suffer against the broken design of Grineer units.by reducing the status chance and not taking advantage of the already high fire rate to trigger Split Chamber without it being a hindrance, unlike in single-shot weapons.
Spoiler
Tiberon, on the other hand, allows the use of Shred because I mostly use semi-auto and the gun is, and I can't stress this enough, overpowered enough to not need Spit Chamber to outperform Soma Prime. I mean, look at the crit damage and combined damage. Headshots are absolutely lethal to any unit. I use Shred on it because I enjoy what it brings to me in terms of fire rate and punching through cover. I do not, in any form, force myself to use Shred to circumvent a S#&$ty issue with an extremely ordinary part of the game. Also, 10% chance to not deal double damage is how I see Split Chamber on my semi-auto headshot crits.
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6 minutes ago, Wolfglaive said:
If you never forma your gun, sure. And assuming you haven't used a forma on a weapon, you've got bigger problems than death animations being mildly annoying on a weapon with no punch-through.
That's still 8 points down the drain for something that could be solved universally, as well as making me have 6 mod slots instead of 7 (because Serration is still a thing, which is a testament to the laziness of the design) to use for something else. If something is mandatory everywhere, might as well integrate it, just like base damage mods should be integrated with the weapon's ranks and the respective mods removed from the game. I could go in-game to get a screenshot of my Soma Prime build later, which was actually one of the things that propelled me to create this topic, since it's one of the only weapons where I just had to dump Shred in favor of an increased DPS to deal with high-level content.
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1 hour ago, DatDarkOne said:
What? We are playing a PvE game in which our character vastly overpowers are enemies on a regular basis. We are winning as soon as Vor releases us from our stasis. Since we are already so powerful, the only real thing that can be offered is choice in how we do the "winning" in this PvE game. If you don't like how a certain weapon makes the enemies behave, either mod it to behave as you want or use a different weapon. It's that easy.
I don't like the huge recoil of the Lex Prime/AkLex Prime. So instead of asking for a change to be made to a weapon that everyone seems to like, I switched to the AkMagnus (a very underrated weapon IMO) and got exactly what I wanted (with tennogen skins to boot).
Edit: also should you want the enemies to have less stagger when hit, then either use a weapon without any Impact damage or mod it were impact has les effect. 😄
"Use another weapon" has always been the lazy solution people throw around when someone criticizes a specific weapon. Yeah, sure, let's leave old weapons to rot, nobody cares about them... except the new players who will inevitably use them, but it's not like we should care about those either, right? It's all about big numbers and brainless farming, not enjoying juggling enemies in the air with a machinegun, no; "having fun" is a dead expression.
And please, let's not try to change the subject to something irrelevant for the umpteenth time here. The issue is not stats; I couldn't give less of a S#&$ about how big my gun's recoil is or how big its damage numbers are. The subject is one, and only one: death animations and the mandatory punch through to mitigate them. I'm not asking for a change to any specific weapon "everyone seems to like", since the only weapon I mentioned at all was Corinth, in order to give an example of how I'd prefer every other weapon to behave. Corinth doesn't trigger death animations, or at least I haven't seen one so far, and therefore it just fits me. I deeply enjoy using it and wish for its level of enjoyment to extend to other weapons, because, as I'm trying to point out, a game is supposed to be fun and enjoyable even on simple things like that, not playing Overwatch's counter system with the death animations and the mods, which is just obnoxious.
I also have no idea where the stagger came from, but hey, just shows you are just throwing words around without actually trying to understand what I've been trying to say since the beginning, just like the other guy.
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Just now, DatDarkOne said:
Think if adding a mod in game as the same as switching ammo types for a gun in real life. You can have the same gun have different effects on hit/contact just by changing the ammo type. @taiiat already mentioned Full Metal Jacket ammo in comparison to expanding type ammo like hollow points or hydroshock rounds.
That said, just think of the weapon having default ammo of the expanding on contact type. Then you modify it with a punchthru mod to use non-expanding ammo.
Given this knowledge/reasoning, I have to agree with Taiiat that there isn't an issue. Meaning there isn't a problem because DE has given us choice in how we want our weapons to behave.
Then why don't crit damage mods reduce punch through? Warframe isn't a game about realism, so there's no reason to pull realism in the equation. What I'm asking is a simple solution to a simple problem that doesn't involve murdering 1/4 of the capacity of every single weapon I have to combat an issue that can be fixed as a whole by the developers, while simultaneously making every weapon feel more satisfying and meatier. It's a win/win situation for everyone, and I'd have it no other way, but people seem allergic to winning.
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31 minutes ago, taiiat said:
well, it isn't. Player Mobility in this game is very high, you could easily move when the Enemy dies to shoot the ones in the general area behind it. it takes about as much time to move positions for a different Line of Sight as it does to mentally acquire a new Target.
but, there are Mods that can offer alternatives to that.Yeah, let me just keep dodging and sliding and circlestrafing nearly every kill instead of actually having the problem rectified as a whole by a simple solution. What's wrong with just wanting to aim down the sights and kill enemies? Is that too much to ask from a shooter? And no, it does not take about as much time to move yourself to a position the death animation isn't blocking, as it does to "mentally" acquire a new target. Acquiring the target is a nearly instant input; you kill, you notice it's dead, you already move to another without thinking about what to do next. It's like getting your hand burned; you just move your hand out of the way because that's what you do. Meanwhile, a constant "did it trigger a death animation, if so I should move" is just going to be obnoxious and breaking the flow of the brain's automatic thinking for something that DE can just fix and get rid of the problem as a whole.
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2 hours ago, peterc3 said:
Bodies aren't intangible. That is part of the game to mitigate with your modding. Innate PT for all guns is just an extreme amount of power creep across the board.
Then the removal of death animations it is. DE already showed it can be done for guns, as is the case with Corinth. Why they don't do that is beyond me. Besides, if it's so mandatory, as the other guy here is hellbent on saying, what would be the issue anyway? Integrating base damage mods in weapons and removing the associated mods is one of those ideas that would work well, but people don't like it because "omg don't change my game", and DE is afraid of pissing people off by making a very necessary change in the game. If punch through is so mandatory to mitigate a dumb part of the game that hasn't been removed yet, possibly because of the people that keep chanting "just use 1/4 of your mod capacity for a punch through lol" and make it seem like something that is not up to DE to fix, but the player themselves, which is an absurd concept. It also reminds me of the people who chant "just use saryn lol" to everyone complaining about the annoying armor scaling.
2 hours ago, taiiat said:but then, why should any Mod provide some useful benefit to my Gameplay, so that i might highly desire to use it?
because that's the road we're falling down here. if it's something a Mod can solve, then it should be given automatically.At this point it just looks like you're missing the point on purpose. This is not some kind of "use it to shoot through cover", "use it to shoot through multiple enemies", or "use it to save ammo" case. It's about a completely ordinary "feature" in the game hindering the player and forcing them to use a mod that is not supposed to be mandatory, unlike the base damage ones. Again, the issue is the correlation between death animations and the consequent necessity of punch through to not be hindered by them, not "is punch through bad or not"? By so insistently putting punch through mods as the alpha solution to such a stupid issue, you're putting death animations on the same pedestal that defense types like armor and shields are, and I can't think of any word for it that isn't to express some kind of mix between insult and shock, because really, it's baffling to see such a simple change be opposed with such nonsense. Limiting the player's options in such a game that seemingly prides itself on freedom should never be encouraged.
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15 minutes ago, (XB1)Zweimander said:
I'm a 5 year veteran and I have been around for a lot of things being nerfed unrightfully because of outcry from new players (AKA EMBER...) and it gets old having to explain to people that some stuff will be far more powerful. It's just the reality of a game like Warframe and if they dont allow players to feel like Demigods by the time they have reached endgame they would lose players just as quickly as Anthem is now. It is okay to have frames and weapons that are massive outliers compared to their peers and some people just cannot accept that. Their is a risk to going into public missions of ending up with a seasoned veteran who will outkill most new players regardless of the gear they have, it does not have to even be top tier so regardless feathers will be rustled. I have outkilled Embers with Pre rework Hydroid on hydron with just a melee weapon and not using His puddle at all as a solid example, new players will be bad compared to a veteran no matter how you slice it, and that's okay because the point of the game is to learn and improve.
Warframe (and consequently DE) poorly specifies what's the "good" stuff and what's the stuff that's just there to help you go forward. For example, why does Tiberon Prime crush Burston Prime, despite the latter only being two MRs below? Why is the Hek MR 4, but also one of the most recommended weapons of the whole game? The Atomos is a death machine, but MR 5. The list goes on, and the point will be that DE wants Warframe to have the stats of an RPG game without actually using these stats the way they were meant to be used.
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Agreed. Recently I took the Paris Prime on a sortie and was absolutely shocked with how what used to be my best single-target weapon wasn't even one-hitting enemies on an orange crit headshot, despite me not actually changing anything about its build in ages.
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Just now, (PS4)maso_sage-mode said:
so nerf everything because this way i can play my useless titania/ atlas/wukong/ revenant and other frames in every mission wihtout being helpful. One thing, you dont know how i play and you tell me i am a press 4 to win guy....i honestly do not know how to answer because it just makes me laugh lol
Wukong is hardly useless. He's just a one-trick pony that is perfect at what he does. Ever tanked a whole sortie's third mission by simply existing with any other frame? Oberon's health regen doesn't cut it, Rhino's iron skin is weak, Nezha's halo has damage bleeding through it, and even Inaros has an end to his 1234567890 health. Wukong with a rage build is literally immortal.
Have ranged weapon switch follow the idea of the new melee
in Art, Animation, & UI
Posted
Cool. That's your opinion.