Quartakk Additional Fire Mode

[Psycho_Cadence]

I love the Quartakk design. It is always fun to see new ideas like this.

I do have one problem with it though... When I first saw it, I thought 'YES! a Primary that fires like the Grattler! FINALLY!' but this was sadly not the case.

The only thing I really want (and I think it would be a rather welcome addition to it) is to have an alternate fire mode that fires like the Grattler does. This would be a HUGE boost to it's usability with burst fire and sustained rapid fire as a toggle.

This may sound similar to the Hind, but I also think the Hind should be a toggle as well, instead of alternate fire mode button that just shoots.

 

A Friend pointed out that in line with other weapons, the full auto mode should be the primary and the burst would be secondary, though with the toggle, this isn't much of a difference.

I do like this more though and think it would be best if the full auto mode was the primary mode.

Edited November 23, 2018 by Psycho_Cadence
Additional Info

[Unholy_Ghost]

Upvote!

[OmegaVoid]

I can't agree. There are plenty of full-auto weapons in the game already. Why turn the Quartakk into something it isn't?

If what you really want is a handheld Grattler, the Tusk Heavy Gunners use just such a weapon; maybe you should petition DE to make them drop the bp like regular Heavy Gunners do for the Gorgon?

If the Quartakk had to get an extra fire mode, I'd rather see a single-shot semi auto with a faster fire-rate than the burst gets, on the alt-fire button like the Hind. None of that toggling.

But it's not needed. Quartakk is what it is, and it's fine as it is IMO.

[Teliko_Freedman]

How about full auto when you hold down the fire button, and semi auto when you tap the fire button? 

The full auto will be decent speed, but semi auto can fire faster based on how fast you tap it.

[MirageKnight]

When I first saw this gun, the first thing that came to mind was "Dakka! Lotz of dakka!". 

It struck me as being an assault rifle whose job is to fill the air with as many projectiles as possible. A serious bullet hose. Sadly, that wasn't the case.

20 hours ago, OmegaVoid said:

There are plenty of full-auto weapons in the game already

So? A lot of us like that type of weapon. Having an alt fire mode wouldn't affect people that prefer semi-auto / single fire. Switch modes with a simple click and done. Plus, it makes the weapon more versatile.

20 hours ago, OmegaVoid said:

Why turn the Quartakk into something it isn't?

Because some of us think the gun, as it is right now, is boring to use? I think that's a good enough reason as any to change it.

20 hours ago, OmegaVoid said:

But it's not needed. Quartakk is what it is, and it's fine as it is IMO.

Some people would disagree with you on that. In fact, they'd probably call the gun boring and uninspired mastery fodder.

Seriously though...How many of you out there honestly think the gun is fine and use it on a regular basis? On the flip side of that, how many people bought / built this gun, leveled it / used it for a week or 2, and now have it sitting on the proverbial weapon rack collecting dust because there are more interesting and fun weapons out there?

Edited November 26, 2018 by MirageKnight

[OmegaVoid]

15 hours ago, MirageKnight said:

...some of us think the gun, as it is right now, is boring to use? I think that's a good enough reason as any to change it.

......there are more interesting and fun weapons out there

Then use the weapons you prefer?

15 hours ago, MirageKnight said:

...How many of you out there honestly think the gun is fine and use it on a regular basis?

IDK if you can look up my in-game profile, but if you can you'll find it's number four in my most-used primary weapons list.

Quartakk lovers might be a minority (or maybe not, IDK), but a big part of Warframe's appeal is that it caters for a wide variety of tastes.

15 hours ago, MirageKnight said:

...Having an alt fire mode wouldn't affect people that prefer semi-auto / single fire.

Well, for one thing I don't prefer semi-auto; above Quartakk on my most-used weapons list are Buzlok, Kohm, and Ignis Wraith.

And for secondaries it's Stubba followed by Atomos, Twin Grakata, Prisma Twin Gremlins and Nukor, with the Brakk trailing in 5th place just ahead of... Dex Furis.

It's not that I find hosing down mobs unappealing -- it's that when I grab the Quartakk for a mission I do so because I don't want to give myself that option.

15 hours ago, MirageKnight said:

...wouldn't affect...

Call it a failing on my part, but it totally would. I'd totally switch to full-auto and hose everything down.

I enjoyed levelling the Tiberon, so getting the Prime seemed like it'd be a nice upgrade. But when I found it had select-fire? Spawn, toggle, DAKKA!

Tiberon Prime is currently 19th on my most-used weapons roster. It's effective, but I didn't find it engaging. And constraining myself to semi-auto or tri-burst when I had dakka on toggle? No chance.

Now, I might well find a dakka Quartakk to be good fun. But then I'd be stuck trying to find a semi-auto rifle which has a similar feel to the Quartakk I have right now.

Hmm... maybe a Quartakk Wraith with nuttin' but dakka would be in order? That would keep everybody happy.

 

 

 

Edited November 27, 2018 by OmegaVoid
Grammar tied in knots.

[MirageKnight]

5 hours ago, OmegaVoid said:

IDK if you can look up my in-game profile, but if you can you'll find it's number four in my most-used primary weapons list.

Just an FYI, I did actually and sincerely ask who still liked and used the thing and who didn't.

5 hours ago, OmegaVoid said:

Call it a failing on my part, but it totally would. I'd totally switch to full-auto and hose everything down.

This proves my point in that having a full-auto option would be a good thing for people and it would be a feature that at least some people would actually use.

5 hours ago, OmegaVoid said:

Then use the weapons you prefer?

I do. Sometimes however I like a bit of visual variety though. The Quartakk is a very distinctively styled weapon with an aesthetic I find to be appealing. The problem is that, yes, I find the gun boring to use. Now call me needlessly picky but if a weapon is boring to use, I have little incentive to use it. Now, if you gave it a full-auto option that lets you hose down a crowd, then you'd have something that's arguably less boring for some people, including myself.

[ExcaliburUmbra]

I personally love the Quartakk the way it is now. A slow firing semi-auto cannon that looks dangerous, hits hard with innate punch through, and sounds great. Plus that ragdoll on kill is really satisfying, and goes a long way towards making it one of the more interesting rifles to use. When DE reduces the damage and increased the fire-rate after its launch (while also reducing the size of the weapon itself slightly), I was pretty disappointed and actually stopped using it. We already have plenty of fast-firing spammy semi-auto rifles which were just not my taste, so I was stoked when DE reverted the changes in the giant weapon rebalance. 

Which kind of brings me to my point: there are around 4-5 weapons that can switch between semi-auto and burst/full-auto firing modes, do we really need more? While we only have 2 slow-firing semi-auto rifles as far as I know: Quartakk and Grinlok. Why not give other weapons alternative firing modes too, like those who like the look of Sybaris but want it to fire single shots only? Or maybe people who like the charged shot of the Tenora but prefer Gorgon’s aesthetics, why not give the Gorgon variants said charged shot as well? 

Personally I disliked it when Tiberon Prime was released with all 3 firing modes. Not only did it change the identity of the weapon series, but it also served to homogenize the aresenal (e.g. in this case, a future Stradavar Prime now has to compete with Tiberon Prime whereas if it only had burst fire there would be no overlap). Sure, “more options is better” as they say but in my opinion more options also make choosing between weapons less interesting. As an extreme example: if every hitscan (non-sniper) rifle had all three firing modes like Tiberon Prime, then the only reason to pick between them would be stat differences or preference based on looks - a prospect I find far more boring then how things are currently.

I’ll end this wall of text by acknowledging though that you do have a point. If Quartakk had an automatic firing mode I’m sure people would be liable to use it more, and maybe some would find it more enjoyable then they did before. The change wouldn’t even affect me much either as I just would ignore the auto mode (unless said change also brought nerfs). However since Quartakk isnt really in a dire state balance-wise I don’t see a change for the sake of change like this happening. Luckily, if you need that quad-barreled dakka the upcoming update to Archwing weapons might be your speed as the Grattler will be usable on land-based missions. I’ve even noticed that they seem to have changed the firing sound and size of the Grattlers that Tusk Heavy Gunners use, probably in preparation for the changes. Hoepfully things work out for you regardless of how they turn out!

[Unholy_Ghost]

OMG who the hell cares? if you want to play burst play burst and if you want to play auto play auto. Saying "go play other auto weapons because i cant control how i want my weapon to fire" is stupid!

[OmegaVoid]

On 2018-11-27 at 3:22 PM, MirageKnight said:

...and sincerely ask who still liked and used the thing and who didn't.

As I understand it, riven disposition is an indicator of usage; Quartakk's is 4/5, meaning it's not even in the bottom 20% of popularity. Clearly there are players who continue to use it after leveling.

On 2018-11-27 at 3:22 PM, MirageKnight said:

This proves my point in that having a full-auto option would be a good thing for people and it would be a feature that at least some people would actually use.

Sorry, I suppose I wasn't clear on what being 19th on my usage list actually meant; it's just below the Grakata -- a weapon which I used 'til it was max level, and then never picked up again. The inclusion of full-auto on the Tiberon Prime, for me, made it less enjoyable to use than the lower-powered Tiberon. As to why...

15 hours ago, Unholy_Ghost said:

...if you want to play burst play burst and if you want to play auto play auto. Saying "go play other auto weapons because i cant control how i want my weapon to fire" is stupid!

I think "undisciplined" might be the word you were looking for? In which case you'd be right. I am. I have little capacity to hold myself to a demanding option when there's an easy alternative right at hand. If I want to exert myself, I have to make that decision in the Arsenal, and be committed to it when I start the mission.

With Tiberon Prime, it seemed unnecessarily hard work to bother to aim each shot carefully when I could just toggle to full-auto and rub out the enemies in a sloppy hail of lead. Things died fast enough, I didn't run into ammo issues; there was no downside to copping out. And thus no satisfaction in having used the weapon.

That's why after it reached max rank I didn't take it out again. 'Cos if I know beforehand all I want is to do a mission and git mah Nitain as effortlessly as possible -- I'll just grab the Ignis Wraith.

A shame, really. 'Cos Tiberon Prime looks fantastic.

21 hours ago, OmegaZero633 said:

... I just would ignore the auto mode (unless said change also brought nerfs).

There speaks a man with more willpower than I have! 😄

Quartakk does good damage, but its low fire-rate puts a limit on how fast you can take out multiple enemies. It places the onus on the player to accommodate that tactically. It's not used by players who want a quick and easy fix.

So for the sake of discussion; how could a full-auto mode be added without it functioning as a "cop-out switch"? How to balance the two fire modes so they are both justified existing in the same weapon? A few ways I could come up with:

• Full-auto could deal such low damage that it would take just as long to kill a bunch of enemies by hosing them down as by shooting them one by one. That sounds a bit lame, and I'm not sure it would be appreciated by anyone.
• Full-auto could have crazy recoil -- providing a potential DPS boost, but only if if you're prepared to work really hard to keep the darn thing on target. That'd be more interesting.
• Full-auto could have an insane fire-rate; DPS out the wazoo, but too heavy on ammo to use constantly; more as a "panic button". Problem with that is while it provides an interesting dilemma for endless mission types, for missions where you can freely ignore most of the mooks, like capture or assassination, it might make the Quartakk blatantly OP.
• In full-auto mode (only!), bullets from the four barrels could follow divergent paths. At close range dakka mode would deal monster damage, but at mid-to-long range the shots would sail harmlessly past the target in the reticle, mandating burst-fire for distance work.

I like that last one best, since both fire modes would have a situation where they are the easier and better option.

[Psycho_Cadence]

I am pretty sure that they made each fire mode have different stats in the Tiberon Prime and other such weapons already though.

That's actually why I like the variety of modes on it. Semi has more punch vs targets that need it. Whereas full auto mows down the lil guys. Burst is a nice middle ground.

I am also fine with Quartakk being less accurate in full auto. Given barrel placement, it would make sense...

Anyways, stat placement is DE's thing and they have plenty of examples to draw on.

I guess Grattler would also work, but given what they have done with arch wings in-atmo, I don't know what's in store for it yet. I mean, I knew the scale in AW missions was a lie the day one started and my frame was HUGE for a split second and then went to "normal" AW size. I am just hoping they fix the scale discrepancy before porting over the weapons too.