some Projectile Weapons have minor or dramatically reduced Accuracy issues lately.

[Hiiamwilliam]

Hello. Chimera Update 23.10 brought "Weapon Aiming Changes", which affected particularly projectile weapons. The notes mentioned it would be, generally speaking, easier to hit where I'm aiming.

However, I'm confident this new behavior affected Rakta Ballistica charged shots negatively (I assume the same thing happens with normal Ballistica. Ballistica Prime doesn't have this problem). Currently, they have inconsistent spread at long distances, making it actually more difficult to hit things. From tests in Simulacrum, I verified that the charged shots hit quite close to where I aim only at less than 44 m. At distances greater than this, the bolts from charged shots begin to spread at random directions and won't even follow a straight line trajectory anymore. Here's an example: 3 charged shots at 70 m.

As you can (hopefully) see, it's difficult to hit a charged shot on a stationary point at 70 m away. Anything at greater distances, stationary or not, can only be hit with luck.

[Soupf8]

I have noticed that certain projectile weapons suffer from some kind of curvature in their trajectory.

Based on recent studies, this may be a bug resulting from recent changes to Magnum Force, affecting projectile weapons even if the weapon does not have Magnum Force equipped.

 

Edited January 26, 2019 by SoupCakes

[taiiat]

are you using Magnum Force? do you have a Riven that might be causing something? does Multi-Shot have any effect on it?

helps to.... give some information so anyone else that looks doesn't have to run the game to understand what the problem is.

[Soupf8]

1 hour ago, taiiat said:

are you using Magnum Force? do you have a Riven that might be causing something? does Multi-Shot have any effect on it?

helps to.... give some information so anyone else that looks doesn't have to run the game to understand what the problem is.

I removed all mods while using the acrid in the simulacrum. I also tested this out with bolto, and it experiences the same odd anomaly.

[Waveric]

Wow, that's weird... I though the Acrid was more accurate.

Maybe its just a natural lack of accuracy !

[CxLL]

9 hours ago, SoupCakes said:

I removed all mods while using the acrid in the simulacrum.

Acrid's unmodded ammo capacity is 210. Your video in the Simulacrum shows 262. Please inspect an unmodded Acrid.

[Soupf8]

5 hours ago, Waveric said:

Wow, that's weird... I though the Acrid was more accurate.

Maybe its just a natural lack of accuracy !

That is something I am trying to confirm. Currently, I have failed to find any reason why the bolts and darts sway. The default accuracy of the Acrid is 100. This should provide a perfect accuracy which is an accuracy I have experienced in the past with this weapon, but now it all seems impossible.

I am hoping this is just a patch fluke, much like a hit-scan issue that arose, I think, last year. If this is true, then I have further hopes that the issue will be resolved soon.

[IceColdHawk]

9 minutes ago, cxll said:

Acrid's unmodded ammo capacity is 210. Your video in the Simulacrum shows 262. Please inspect an unmodded Acrid.

Carrier Prime.

[Soupf8]

13 minutes ago, IceColdHawk said:

Carrier Prime.

I assumed this was the "ammo case". I am still uploading a second video to maybe make this more clear for some viewers of my post.

Edited January 26, 2019 by SoupCakes

[IceColdHawk]

1 minute ago, SoupCakes said:

I assumed this was the case. I am still uploading a second video to maybe make this more clear for some viewers of my post.

I don't need a second video. Everything is clear to me. To be fair, i thought you were using Magnum Force as well until i saw that your acrid still has the 35 base damage.

Went into the simulacrum to test it myself and i can confirm similar results.

From 49m afar:

There is nothing about 100 accuracy anymore. Multishot used to still be pinpoint accurate. Looks either bugged or stealth nerfed to me.

[Soupf8]

3 minutes ago, IceColdHawk said:

I don't need a second video. Everything is clear to me. To be fair, i thought you were using Magnum Force as well until i saw that your acrid still has the 35 base damage.

Went into the simulacrum to test it myself and i can confirm similar results.

From 49m afar:

There is nothing about 100 accuracy anymore. Multishot used to still be pinpoint accurate. Looks either bugged or stealth nerfed to me.

I currently do not have Boltor, or Boltor Prime. Could you go into the simulacrum and test if their bolts appear to sway in the same way? You might have to put on some recoil mods to view the shots better.

[Soupf8]

31 minutes ago, cxll said:

Acrid's unmodded ammo capacity is 210. Your video in the Simulacrum shows 262. Please inspect an unmodded Acrid.

 

[IceColdHawk]

4 minutes ago, SoupCakes said:

I currently do not have Boltor, or Boltor Prime. Could you go into the simulacrum and test if their bolts appear to sway in the same way? You might have to put on some recoil mods to view the shots better.

Primaries seem fine. But from what i could gather is that Akbolto Prime seems also affected 

Same with Prisma Twin Gremlins 

I can barely hit the corpus tech from that far.

Must be related to the new Magnum Force change somehow applying to some projectile-based secondaries.

[Soupf8]

11 minutes ago, IceColdHawk said:

Primaries seem fine. But from what i could gather is that Akbolto Prime seems also affected 

Same with Prisma Twin Gremlins 

I can barely hit the corpus tech from that far.

Must be related to the new Magnum Force change somehow applying to some projectile-based secondaries.

What an odd finding! Thank you for helping me look into this issue!

[Mathematicus]

Soupcakes brought this to my attention in the clan discord. Although I don't have any evidence/screens, you have my testimony that this is indeed an inconsistency amongst Secondary Projectile weapons. I have tested this separately and with Soupcakes himself.

Tested the [unmodded] secondaries with

Akbolto

Bolto

.

Compared with [unmodded] Primaries

Boltor

Dera/Dera Vandal

 

Secondaries were inconsistent with accuracy horizontally along the crosshair. Primary was consistent with accuracy and/or recoil.

 

Again, though I don't have screens or pics, you have my testimony.

 

[Ditto132]

Have been testing with various weapons for the pass two hours.
Secondary projectile-based weapons seems to be having issues, except for Tombfinger.

It was pretty obvious for me with Akbolto Prime, Prisma Twin Gremlins, and Hystrix.

Euphona Prime slug also seems to be "heavier".

[CxLL]

This is rather interesting. Mind making a list of tested weapons?
Include details such as 
- Build number
- Equipped warframe and its active abilities (if any)
- Location of testing  (include both simulacrum and regular mission)
- Companion and no companion
- Mods and no mods
- Additional info on circumstances specific to the testing itself
And save the log in which this was tested, just in case. Will likely not be needed but still, it's good to cover all angles.
Edit the first post with this information as it's being done.

Takes less time for the staff to cover it once they know what was already checked and what is yet to deal with.

[Soupf8]

3 minutes ago, cxll said:

This is rather interesting. Mind making a list of tested weapons?
Include details such as 
- Build number
- Equipped warframe and its active abilities (if any)
- Location of testing  (include both simulacrum and regular mission)
- Companion and no companion
- Mods and no mods
- Additional info on circumstances specific to the testing itself
And save the log in which this was tested, just in case. Will likely not be needed but still, it's good to cover all angles.
Edit the first post with this information as it's being done.

Takes less time for the staff to cover it once they know what was already checked and what is yet to deal with.

I have been evolving the structure of my post based on discoveries made regarding this issue. I can try and provide more information but it will take time for me to produce, devise, and structure the content for intelligibility purposes.

[CxLL]

@SoupCakes that's why the Forums are as convenient as they are - the entire community can assist in pinpointing the problem, making bug hunting easier, faster and even fun at times.
I will see to assist through gathering player reports. 
 

[Soupf8]

Just now, cxll said:

@SoupCakes that's why the Forums are as convenient as they are - the entire community can assist in pinpointing the problem, making bug hunting easier, faster and even fun at times.
I will see to assist through gathering player reports. 
 

Thank you. What I will do now is compare the accuracy levels of varying projectile based weapons, and look for inconsistencies.

[Sharkgoblin]

buzlok used to be pinpoint accurate now its spread its like a #*!%ing shotgun

[Soupf8]

1 hour ago, cxll said:

@SoupCakes that's why the Forums are as convenient as they are - the entire community can assist in pinpointing the problem, making bug hunting easier, faster and even fun at times.
I will see to assist through gathering player reports. 
 

I added another video to this post pointing out the details of the odd projectile behavior.

[Hiiamwilliam]

Here's the apparent reason, and a small Rakta Ballistica test (modded, but no Magnum Force). This bug still exists.

Charged shots used to have no arcing and near perfect accuracy, even when Rakta stats show accuracy 4.

[Soupf8]

Try using the weapon now, and see if this curvature in trajectory is worse. If there is a noticeable increase in the severity of this inaccuracy, please post a visual recording of it for me and the others who are looking into it.

[taiiat]

from this Thread, i was alluded into taking a look into Secondary Weapons, and from there Projectile Weapons as a whole.

i took a look at a wide range of Projectile Weapons, and found that some but not all of them have Accuracy that isn't the way they used to be not too long ago, and a few that might be different than they used to be but is hard to say.
some of my findings made it easily clear that something is wrong with some of the Weapons. i.e. Weapons that used to be pinpoint being... not.
these results are just ones that seemed to be incorrect, and not including Weapons that seem to be shooting normally or i could not determine if what i was seeing was outside of margin of error.

Spoiler

• Acrid
  • a lot of Horizontal Dispersion. Projectiles even seem to evenly space themselves w/ Multi-Shot - shots used to be pinpoint
• Bolto
  • a total Shotgun, shots even curve in the air away from the target - shots used to go straight
• Detron
  • might be lower Accuracy than normal but unsure
• Seer
  • has slight Spread - used to be perfectly Accurate
• Staticor
  • like a Shotgun, when quickfired. don't recall there being much for Accuracy concerns with this Weapon but not sure.
• Ballistica
  • Charged shots are a total Shotgun - shots used to go straight
• AkBolto
  • a total Shotgun, shots even curve in the air away from the target - shots used to go straight
• Angstrum
  • shots appear to curve away from the point of aim, rather than sticking strictly to their fixed Spread pattern like the Weapon was designed to do
• Kulstar
  • shots are curving in the air - shots used to go straight

 

• Buzlok
  • totally loses Accuracy if you try to fire in Automatic fire, way lower Accuracy than normal - shots used to be nearly pinpoint
• Boltor
  • seems to have some extra Spread and a lot of Horizontal Dispersion - shots used to have some Spread but go where you were shooting
• Miter
  • shots are offset from each other in a seemingly fixed pattern - shots used to fire perfect or just about perfect
• Panthera
  • shots have notable Horizontal Dispersion - shots used to have only very little
• Harpak
  • like a Shotgun, and a lot of Vertical Dispersion - shots used to have slight Spread
• Battacor
  • like a Shotgun, don't think the Accuracy was this bad before
• Astilla
  • shots are spread immediately from the barrel - instead of only spreading and curving after reaching a certain Range like it did since release
• Attica
  • shots have Horizontal Dispersion, though am not sure if it had some before and/or if this is increased from that (i think it's increased but can't be sure)

the differences on some Weapons are quite dramatic, making it easy to see that something is amiss.
can be reproduced in Simulation or any other Mission - Warframe, Weapons, or whether shooting at an Enemy, surface, or into open air does not seem to make a difference as to the result of these shots.

 

 

this Thread, suggests it may have originated in version '23.10' - i can't verify that as i haven't been comparing things across every version so i only know what things are now and that many Weapons are quite noticeably different from how they were in the past.

 

Edited January 27, 2019 by taiiat
title typo