Nightwave vs Alerts

[MallocErr]

Developers:

I understand why you wanted to move the Alert-specific rewards to a non-time-gated system, but could you have not left the Alert system in with rewards of just credits? 

The Alert credit rewards were how I made most of my money in the game. To me, the Index is the embodiment of everything I dislike (except escort) in a computer game objective: A timed arena fight that requires a group. I don't play Fortnite and I'm not going to start here. If I was patient and diligent, I could still make decent money by running Alerts. Not any more. With the removal of most of my revenue as a contractor for hire, are the prices of everything going to drop, too? Or am I going to need to scavenge every credit from every box and barrel to be able to buy new blueprints and upgrade my mods? Because I'm not doing the Index.

With Alerts, I would see low-level missions and say "I can train my new weapon there, and get some credits for doing so." I would see a mission type I don't particularly like (like 10 waves of defense or 10 minutes of survival), but sometimes I would do it anyway because the money was good or the reward was worth owning. I look at the objectives for Nightwave... complete 3 Capture missions. Why would I not just pick the lowest level Capture mission on the star chart and run it three times? What's my incentive to travel the system, experiencing different opponents and different mission types? Gone.

Finally, the removal of Alerts destroys for me the immersion that I got from pretending to be a bad-ass space ninja for hire. You want some dirty work done? Show me the credits and tell me the job, I'll think about it. Warframe feels utterly static to me now. Nothing changes. I have no incentive to visit Corpus worlds at all: Grineer give better affinity and do not endlessly spawn Bursas. By removing Alerts, you've removed the "Job Board" and all sense that there is a dynamic economy that needs contractors to solve problems for money.

From now on, I'm going to play Warframe to complete the Syndicate missions that still give me a sense of being needed for something, and that's about it.

Leave the Alert-specific rewards as being available only from Nightwave, I get why that's desirable. But the removal of Alerts takes away my source of money, any sense of a game world that changes more than once a day (except invasions), and any reason I had to leave the game running.

[TerrahFyrefly]

totally agree with this post..i too feel that my *job* has been taken away and im just meh about even wanting to do nightwave. least its not permanent and for 6 to 8 weeks so i read

[peterc3]

3 hours ago, MallocErr said:

The Alert credit rewards were how I made most of my money in the game.

You get you are playing the game in a way they probably would consider niche, at best?

[GinKenshin]

1- you’re being pushed by Nora to do these somewhat, so that for hire feel is still kinda there 

2- pretty much everyone considered those to be useless

3- if you’ve made bank doing alerts, then I’m sure you’ll think of something to get them again while not doing index 

 

  A few ways to counter this though is make a 100k/50k credit cache for X amount of wolf creds, I think that’s a pretty good option and kinda needed for newbies who are usual low on credits 

[MallocErr]

2 hours ago, peterc3 said:

You get you are playing the game in a way they probably would consider niche, at best?

I played Warframe because it supported my desire to play the way I wanted to play. I weighed risk vs reward on offered contracts and took the ones I wanted. I was not forced to grind out what would qualify as "mini-achievements" that have nothing to do with objectives that I set for myself. Why would I do 9 Invasion missions when none of them offer something that I want? I wouldn't. Why would I run 3 Capture missions unless they were paying me money to do it? I wouldn't. I've gone from being an independent contractor to being a game show contestant doing a bunch of meaningless things that don't interest me because that's what I need to do now to progress.

[(NSW)Grimwise]

I think it's a valid point that Digital Extremes didn't have to take away a type of content to add this, even if it is only played by a niche group. (is this true? I used them frequently) I agree that they could have stayed in with just monetary rewards, but in my opinion having small Nightwave rep rewards in alerts would be even better and appeal to those folks who aren't interested in the achievement hunting aspect of Nightwave. It would also resolve the issues I've read about here where people are concerned they won't get enough rep by the end of the episode to get the good stuff unless they increase their gaming habits to levels they aren't comfortable with.

Everything I know about DE, it just seems unusual for them to take something away from the game.

I should note, too, that I love Nightwave. I'm very happy with it.

[MallocErr]

5 hours ago, TerrahFyrefly said:

totally agree with this post..i too feel that my *job* has been taken away and im just meh about even wanting to do nightwave. least its not permanent and for 6 to 8 weeks so i read

THEY TERK ER JERBS! 

😞

[MallocErr]

7 minutes ago, Fnar79 said:

I think it's a valid point that Digital Extremes didn't have to take away a type of content to add this, even if it is only played by a niche group. (is this true? I used them frequently) I agree that they could have stayed in with just monetary rewards, but in my opinion having small Nightwave rep rewards in alerts would be even better and appeal to those folks who aren't interested in the achievement hunting aspect of Nightwave. It would also resolve the issues I've read about here where people are concerned they won't get enough rep by the end of the episode to get the good stuff unless they increase their gaming habits to levels they aren't comfortable with.

Everything I know about DE, it just seems unusual for them to take something away from the game.

I should note, too, that I love Nightwave. I'm very happy with it.

I like your idea even better than my idea. Having randomized missions that grant money and Nighwave rep would allow the same for-purchase aspect for the rewards, and would also let people who play Warframe to do the missions not be forced into playing Achievement Hunter 2.0.

I used to play Warframe for the missions, because they rewarded money and items. I have never played Warframe to grind out random achievements. I doubt that I will be much missed, but I think I'm done with this game.

[TheSkunkyMonk]

On 2019-02-27 at 10:45 PM, MallocErr said:

Developers:

I understand why you wanted to move the Alert-specific rewards to a non-time-gated system, but could you have not left the Alert system in with rewards of just credits?

It is time gated though, you can only get 4 ranks in a week netting you 15 nitian if you dont buy anything else until the weekly resets and then the rewards rotate in about 10 weeks or so meaning players wait even longer if they miss something they wanted till we are back on that season again. Alerts though I could get 3/4 a day along with multiple other items, yeah Id miss a few but they would of no doubt popped up at somepoint again while I was on over the course of the week.

Nightwave is a great addition it just should of never been treat as a replacement unless DE's idea was to slow down progression.

What I would like to see with Nightwave is it being on a player by player basis, your "season" doesn't expire until you have completed it and your unspent credits rollover to the next. This would give a nice sense of progression, no hard work would be lost, people could work at their own pace and we would all get the rewards sooner or later. Considering they claimed the alerts had to go because of people "missing out" its quit sad they've added a system that requires a lot more time and work and still people will miss out, only this time also loosing everything they put in if they can't get the tier rewards in time.

[TheSkunkyMonk]

On 2019-02-28 at 2:43 AM, GinKenshin said:

1- you’re being pushed by Nora to do these somewhat, so that for hire feel is still kinda there 

2- pretty much everyone considered those to be useless

3- if you’ve made bank doing alerts, then I’m sure you’ll think of something to get them again while not doing index 

 

  A few ways to counter this though is make a 100k/50k credit cache for X amount of wolf creds, I think that’s a pretty good option and kinda needed for newbies who are usual low on credits 

You obviously don't need much nitian to build things or the mods we used to get not to mention it broke the game up inbetween relics and bounties making it fun by giving you those rewards. 15nitain a week is not a lot and as you progress through the tiers the credits get further apart, it also means I miss out on all the other stuff I might want and could of had.

This is not a upgrade it is a serious downgrade no doubt designed like that on purpose to get us to spend more.

I like Nightwave, the tier rewards look awesome but it is not a replacement for alerts.

They claim its because people would miss out on the alerts, well guess what if I don't get to rank 30 in time I will also miss out on the rewards and loose a lot of extra work plus this time I will have to wait even longer for them to rotate again! If anything Nightwave "seasons" should only progress onto the next one once youve completed the first on a player by player basis allowing everyone a chance to get the things they'd like from it while also going at their own pace.

Now back to looking at my build queue waiting for that weekly reset so I can get some new toys to rank up, thanks DE good job taking away something I enjoyed and broke up my game time.

[GinKenshin]

20 minutes ago, TheSkunkyMonk said:

You obviously don't need much nitian to build things or the mods we used to get not to mention it broke the game up inbetween relics and bounties making it fun by giving you those rewards. 15nitain a week is not a lot and as you progress through the tiers the credits get further apart, it also means I miss out on all the other stuff I might want and could of had.

Yes I don't need it. I have 100+ nitain currently, all the auras, pretty much all the helmets. 

I did some quick calculations: you need a total of 180 nitain to build every item that needs nitain in this game today (the highest items needs 5 nitain), every week gives you 15 nitain if that's the only thing you're getting from your starting wolf creds (the ones on the tier rewards), 180/15=12. that's 12 weeks of you only getting 15 nitain, means it's 3 months roughly and you're pretty much set up for the rest of the game 

That doesn't count the fact that most of the nitain rewards are of higher MR, doesn't count that you can farm nitain with ghoul bounties which appear twice a month roughly

Wanting to get other stuff is total fine, but what you're not seeing is that this is the very first week of the very first series, we don't know what the prestige stage after you reach the max tier math would be, so talking about it is useless. this is also a pretty big game, focusing on just one thing and wanting it now, especially for newbies is silly and dumb, plain and simple. do other things while you wait 
 

28 minutes ago, TheSkunkyMonk said:

This is not a upgrade it is a serious downgrade no doubt designed like that on purpose to get us to spend more.

if we're talking nitain, you can't buy that. alt helm is an option but I doubt anyone buys them, it's just cosmetic and this is f2p, potatos are in a better states, they hardly dropped from alerts anyways so nothing changed there and so far I haven't see aura prices go up in the trade market yet 
 

30 minutes ago, TheSkunkyMonk said:

I like Nightwave, the tier rewards look awesome but it is not a replacement for alerts.

I feel like both should exist tbh, alerts for credits and endo and NW for the current rewards 

31 minutes ago, TheSkunkyMonk said:

They claim its because people would miss out on the alerts, well guess what if I don't get to rank 30 in time I will also miss out on the rewards and loose a lot of extra work plus this time I will have to wait even longer for them to rotate again! If anything Nightwave "seasons" should only progress onto the next one once youve completed the first on a player by player basis allowing everyone a chance to get the things they'd like from it while also going at their own pace.

if you can't reach r30 in 10 weeks then you didn't have time to get everything from alerts, simple as that. you can't claim the old system is better when it also relied on your play time. rotation is way better than just hoping something will arrive or missing out when it does show up 

they already explained it, you could just stock up in the first series/season and then not do jack when the next ones come, since you'll have plenty of currency to spend, this is a good call by them and makes sense design-wise 
 

34 minutes ago, TheSkunkyMonk said:

Now back to looking at my build queue waiting for that weekly reset so I can get some new toys to rank up, thanks DE good job taking away something I enjoyed and broke up my game time.

again, it's f2p game with an abundance of content to go through, I once had like 9 frames in my foundry back when I started in 2014 because I was outta plat and slots and I used pretty much the same setup for the first 100-200h of the game, it's totally fine since I was playing for free 

the 'toys' are there, go build other ones or play with your current ones instead of waiting and looking at a clock ticking 

[TheSkunkyMonk]

29 minutes ago, GinKenshin said:

 

12 weeks of doing all the challenges and only buying nitain, that really sounds like fun to me! Its cool you've got plenty, how did you get it all, alerts by any chance because I doubt it was bounties! Im max rank with Solaris united and Cetus plus got all the bits from them so im no stranger to bounties and I don't think Ive got a nitain reward once, I know its their but it is the top tier so incredibly rare to get it on them.

What if I enjoyed getting my aura on mission instead of through trade? what if it gave me a little excitement and broke up the grind, may I ask how you got most of your auras?

Nightwave should definitely exist not for one minute am I asking for them to take it away I'm just asking for our alerts back in the from they were before they got removed so I can also have the same opportunities you did.

Depends on what you enjoy, I liked the little surprises that popped up on my scanner.

Yeah I could stock up and buy plenty aura's, nitain and whatever else thats my reward for not spending them but Nightwave isn't really about that is it, its about those tier rewards or o it should be anyway so allowing someone to progress at their pace harms no one in reality and makes it a more fun experience, specially considering they were saying people got upset by missing alerts, now when we miss the tier rewards we could be waiting a year if the name seasons is anything to go by.

Erm I've completed Cetus, max standing with the Quills, Maxed Solaris united and bought all the bits they sell to go along with it apart from a stone statue and spice rack, all I've got left is Vox Solaris(last stage im putting off), Vent Kids and my MR grind which I was quite happy doing until now but I can no longer get the resources to do it.

Once again vet happy to make others work harder and halt thier progression because they already have it all and are bored of that part of the game, nice work.

 

Oh and the clock isn't ticking on my foundary, Im all out of nitian.

Edited March 3, 2019 by TheSkunkyMonk

[ADM-Ntek]

for me alerts where also they main source of credits since i don't like the index. sure it is not the most efficient way but it was fun for me. and that is why i play.

with nightwave however i am forced to do things i don't really like or miss out. meaning instead of having fun i'm doing a chore.

and with the exception of the umbral forma i don't even care about the rewards. 

Edited March 3, 2019 by ADM-Ntek

[IllogicalLogic420]

1 hour ago, GinKenshin said:

they already explained it, you could just stock up in the first series/season and then not do jack when the next ones come, since you'll have plenty of currency to spend, this is a good call by them and makes sense design-wise 

Do you have a source for this? Because ingame in the nightwave menu, Wolf Creds say "use it or lose it" and that they expire when the program ends. Not sure what it means by "program" if it counts this season of WoS6/Nightwave as a full "program", or if ALL the seasons are the program.

[GinKenshin]

3 hours ago, IllogicalLogic420 said:

Do you have a source for this? Because ingame in the nightwave menu, Wolf Creds say "use it or lose it" and that they expire when the program ends. Not sure what it means by "program" if it counts this season of WoS6/Nightwave as a full "program", or if ALL the seasons are the program.

That’s basically what I was saying, they won’t let you keep them because *look at my previous post* 

 

 the guy I was talking to wanted them to stay, I was explaining why they shouldn’t 

[TheSkunkyMonk]

Just now, GinKenshin said:

That’s basically what I was saying, they won’t let you keep them because *look at my previous post* 

 

 the guy I was talking to wanted them to stay, I was explaining why they shouldn’t 

Yup he doesnt think its fair we keep the creds we earn, I get the resetting the tiers that is a neccesity but if we decide we don't want anything out the wolf cred pool what is the issue of letting us keep the credits we worked hard to get, not as if we are getting anything extra since we didnt spend them the first time. I did reply but I never got a respone.

[Tails_lol]

i think this is true i think the alert system should be back but it should give nightwave standing or tokens .

it will be the best of both worlds.

[TheSkunkyMonk]

20 minutes ago, Tails_lol said:

i think this is true i think the alert system should be back but it should give nightwave standing or tokens .

it will be the best of both worlds.

along with the items it used to as well though...

[Tails_lol]

2 hours ago, TheSkunkyMonk said:

along with the items it used to as well though...

yep that is the idea

[Nyx219]

On 2019-02-27 at 9:43 PM, GinKenshin said:

1- you’re being pushed by Nora to do these somewhat, so that for hire feel is still kinda there

They could have added more context for Nora. Right now, she strikes me as the bossy new neighbor that for some reason I am being a Zombie Housekeeper to. I don't remember agreeing to anything, let alone what her backstory is.

 

I'd rather listen to Vey Hek yell at me for breathing his air than put up with someone who popped in out of nowhere with no in-game context.