I Find Myself Becoming More And More Bitter As The Days Progress

[Sziklamester]

They should know what effect new system should have on old ones. If they don't, they aren't so good, are they? And you can't just use "It's Beta", because RNG is more of a design decisicion than a bug. A droprate may be buggy, but inclusion of RNG in the whole process is a conscious choice. Also I'm fine with paying for cosmetics, I'm fine with shortcuts such as buying some frames and weapons, but when devs make it so you are almost forced to pay, then the game is no different from EA's Dungeon Keeper Mobile and many other titles from mobile market like that.

 

Another title which ruined. RIP DK series.

 

Maybe they knew what will be the affectation when they drop this new system under the older. I am sure they aren't enough good but they have at least ideas what would be good but sometimes they can't do anything better because they know their abilities and how much time need to spend on any part. RNG is a tool to keep us playing and keep us paying for this game if you haven't patience to this game then you will purchase which is not bad because at least you help to the development but that is a shame when they force the players to playing a game which is nothing but grind all time. If you spend money on any title "no matter beta or not" then you except your money for a game which enjoyable and relax you after work etc. They choosed this way because the free to play titles need less marketing and players to hear free will try out any game and if they feel enjoyable then they pay for it. The problem with this game is mainly the updates are just improve the differences from fun and make this game more grindy.  If they try with monthly payment then they couldn't improve this game well because brainded zombies doesn't want pay any small subscription fee just because. If we pay just a small amount money and more people do then we can keep the servers and there is no need any market and micro transaction. Advantages and disadvantages of course have in each idea but they know if they choosed the free to play then they should use micro's and make things almost unreachable because then who will pay?

 

With every updates the drop tables improve and the list of dropable things improving and the chances become more low. The main problem in my opinion is the lack of fun because the fact i just need to farm to reach a better stuff and grind again for better is for me sounds full of waste of time. I play only with this game when i feel i need to kill something and i don't care my mastery level and i am not greedy to reach everything fast as possible then the game become boring and barren.

[NalkorRN]

So DE knew how much we all hated RNG and grinding and what do they do? Vah Hek is behind all kinds of grinding, like Lephantis 2.0 and now the stances are mod cards that are dropped off of a certain pool of enemies, some of whom are rare.

 

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/lv?key=0AnM4PDSzbIn_dFpfLTRyUlBCNVlGSUl2T3E4WW1NX2c&toomany=true#gid=0

 

One of which is dropped by the Flameblade enemy. I rarely ever see those guys. Napalms though? Yeah I see them all the time.

[Mak_Gohae]

I got 2 stances before the update.

I think the drop rate was fine. People that head straight to the mob and start counting usually drive themselves mad.

[Sparrohawk]

I really do have to wonder at your expectations if all you seem to get out of the game is consistent disappointment. 

 

Before this update, I'd taken a hiatus from the game; mostly I felt that if I kept playing, I'd burn out, get all bitter and just be upset. That helps nobody. I've come back to the game now that the update is out, and while there are things that I'm not stoked about (that whole Nikana shenanigans, not even getting a single stance for melee weapon grips being the key ones), I find that these are Small Problems . Going in, I knew that there'd be things not to my liking; if it was *all* to my liking, I would hold up Update 13 a miracle of games design, life philosophy, and possibly the nature of the universe. Obviously it won't scratch every itch. 

Point being, if you actually leave the game because you find these things so absolutely damaging to your satisfaction that they're unbearable to you, then that is quite frankly Your Problem. It's not enough to make a comment for you, you actually have to leave the game (although it seems, not the forums. Which is a shame). I wonder why it is so difficult for you to go after those positive aspects that exist within the update, rather than the negatives (Funnily enough, you're reading this from someone who suffers from depression. Oh, the irony). If you don't want to focus on new content, the fact that there's funky new animations for a lot of weapons, learning to how to best use the Channel system, the new weapons (Repeating crossbow. Yeah, I fanboi'd a wee bit) and so on, then fine. But that is Your Problem, not the games'. Consider your expectations as being the thing to change BEFORE expecting the game to cater to your expectations. 

[Noble_Cactus]

I go in with no expectations. My problem isn't that U13 didn't scratch every itch. It's that it created new itches. Mainly because there was -so much more- DE could have done with the melee system.

 

Sure, it's leagues better than it used to be, and I'm cool with that. But I just got my first stance that works with one of my weapons - reaping Spiral, the one with the spinning scythe they showed off on stream - and I can't help but say I'm just a little disappointed.

 

For one, three of the "combos" aren't combos at all. They're basic melee weapon functions: slam attack, wallrun attack, finisher. The other two are actual combos, and one of those is the standard "Mash E four times." The other is the spinning scythe. E, E, E [pause] E, E. The spinning part is the last E, and it barely goes anywhere. I only got it to hit once. I was probably within five feet of the Grineer, and at that range you might as well just keep mashing. Maybe it's meant for huge crowds of Infested or something.
 

And that's all there is to the combos. I'll take it to a T2 or T3 later and see how I fare. I'm sure I'll have to actually be a little smarter about blocking and parrying, which may or may not be more engaging. Parry itself needs better visual indicators, combo counter needs more flash. It's just a tiny number at the bottom of the screen until you get to five hits, at which point it turns into

 

 

 

Damage multiplier/Number of successful hits

 

 

 

Kind of odd, actually.

 

I don't see much of a reason to use the combo over plain ol' quick attack. But like I said, I'll give it another chance. It's just that the vast combo repetoire DE announced  is almost nothing. There's no utility, no branching combos to spice things up.

 

And that's the other problem. Players get disappointed because DE hypes up new features and they come out half-baked. Will they add new combos, new moves, new visuals over time? Maybe, and that seems to be the intent. But as a whole, melee feels bland despite the funky new animations and better sound effects.

 

On another note, I do want to use the Attica that's cooking in the Dojo right now.

Edited April 11, 2014 by Noble_Cactus

[SirAuron]

The one good thing to come out of this is stronger blades and 1-2 new animations to toy with whether viable or not. All making melee only possible to an extent. Either nightmare or T3 or w/e.

[VampirePirate]

Do any of you think that they will do more with Melee 2.0 in the near future (or distant future), or will it remain the way it is now?

[Paradoxity]

Do any of you think that they will do more with Melee 2.0 in the near future (or distant future), or will it remain the way it is now?

 

From the track record we've seen?

 

We might get some sort of band-aid patch on it later. Maybe. Other than that? doubtful. 

[CBAROG]

What's even more sad is that there is so many things that could be amazing. Lots of different stances, combos. Unfortunately, DE will just go after quantity. They always do.

[azour]

Do any of you think that they will do more with Melee 2.0 in the near future (or distant future), or will it remain the way it is now?

 

Its like Abilities,every major update i expect new abilities for each warframe,even if its just one.

Things to improve the gameplay

But nope,guns and RNG

Yay

This game could be something so great so fun,i see a great potential in it!

I mean,@(*()$ space cyborg ninjas against robots,gramps and zombies!

How cool does that sound?

[SoloCreep]

Wow someone takes their Warframe a TAD too serious.. Sad really.

Edited April 11, 2014 by SoloCreep

[AscendantWyvern]

Wow someone takes their Warframe a TAD too serious.. Sad really.

You're on a video game forum lad. This is where people get serious about their video games. 

 

Especially ones that have the Beta title on them. AND even more when they deserve some necessary changes.

Edited April 12, 2014 by AscendantWyvern

[(PSN)luminousvoid26]

An article comes to mind in regards to some of the issues you bring up and I think DE should definitely read it.

 

http://www.cracked.com/article_18461_5-creepy-ways-video-games-are-trying-to-get-you-addicted.html

 

The psychology behind a lot of the techniques being employed are downright evil.

[Luminati07]

An article comes to mind in regards to some of the issues you bring up and I think DE should definitely read it.

 

http://www.cracked.com/article_18461_5-creepy-ways-video-games-are-trying-to-get-you-addicted.html

 

The psychology behind a lot of the techniques being employed are downright evil.

Very interesting article. Thanks for linking it.

 

Wow someone takes their Warframe a TAD too serious.. Sad really.

Yep, providing feedback to the developers is sad.

 

I guess I should just be a sheep and praise every little thing they do, right?

No.

A complaint is worth twice a compliment, my friend.

[Sziklamester]

Nice link.

[(PSN)azurdragon]

Excellent link indeed

[Hupf4]

There are a ton of good ideas for DE on the forum, why don´t they take those posts more serious.... So sad as i see you would give a better gamedesigner as some guys at DE do atm.

[LoneStar4]

The fact still remains that this game is free to play. Buying plat is the way DE makes money. I dont see this changing anytime soon. but the MOD packs suggested is something i could get behind.

[Tesseract_The_Pariah]

I completely agree with all the points you made, and wish to add a complaint about the instability of missions and how if you crash, you lose all progress.  Something must be done.  Sending in support tickets is not a solution.

[Gurzil]

I probably have more hours in this game than any of you, and none of this upsets me. I love this game, and I have no real issues with it, other than lack of features in some areas. (clan/dojo management - i would love a seriously deep amount of features for both)

 

RNG - Doesn't bug me . It'll come when it comes. I learned long ago if it isn't dropping, go do something else, then come back to it. Don't keep running the same mission under some belief that the odds are stacking in your favor.. They aren't, it's RNG..

 

Market resources - I learned long ago it's not the place to be. I'm also pretty sure DE has been made aware of this many times.

 

Design Council - I'm so glad people can't make posts on their own. I read the ability mods thread, and literally EVERY ONE put in game-breaking-personal-opinions, that they want for themselves. Not ideas that would work for ALL.

 

Mutagen samples? - Without even trying, and raaaaaaaarrrrrely doing derelict missions. I have tons of them. Not sure what the issue is..

 

Tutorials? -I agree that the tutorials across the board need to be more informative. They also need to add a feature to the initial tutorial with suggestions for spending initial plat. I've seen so many 0 level players running around with syandanas, and when asked why they didn't buy slots instead.. They state they didn't know any better. So not cool, as this is usually the wall most players run into.

 

Grind? Take a break from doing YOU, and help out some of the new players.. Go run some missions with them, support them, teach them things. Many times this seems to give me a boost, and when all is said and done.. I know I've done a good thing, and potentially helped someone in the world, enjoy something just a little more.

 

I'm cut from a different cloth than 98% of the community though. I only say this because I don't start megathreads. I have patience. I look for info rather than spamming channels. I know that DE is working on this badass game, and they often stay late to patch things. I have an awesome clan that I created, and I teach people about the game. I will always go out of my way to revive someone.. I will come back for a player that is lagging behind while everyone goes to extract. I'll provide cover when the oxygen has ran out, to allow every one to get to extract. I don't pick one corner in a defense to man myself. I work the entire level for every one. I don't have such levels of dislike in my heart to make these threads. Pointing out features, issues, errors, et cetera, is one thing. Text wall mad hatting is another.

 

I feel i'm about to enter into a piece on merits such as; patience, honesty, selflessness, and more.

 

Being a decent human first, and a gamer second.

 

Instead i'll POOF

 

*Ninja vanish*

[arche]

I probably have more hours in this game than any of you, and none of this upsets me. I love this game, and I have no real issues with it, other than lack of features in some areas. (clan/dojo management - i would love a seriously deep amount of features for both)

RNG - Doesn't bug me . It'll come when it comes. I learned long ago if it isn't dropping, go do something else, then come back to it. Don't keep running the same mission under some belief that the odds are stacking in your favor.. They aren't, it's RNG..

Market resources - I learned long ago it's not the place to be. I'm also pretty sure DE has been made aware of this many times.

Design Council - I'm so glad people can't make posts on their own. I read the ability mods thread, and literally EVERY ONE put in game-breaking-personal-opinions, that they want for themselves. Not ideas that would work for ALL.

Mutagen samples? - Without even trying, and raaaaaaaarrrrrely doing derelict missions. I have tons of them. Not sure what the issue is..

Tutorials? -I agree that the tutorials across the board need to be more informative. They also need to add a feature to the initial tutorial with suggestions for spending initial plat. I've seen so many 0 level players running around with syandanas, and when asked why they didn't buy slots instead.. They state they didn't know any better. So not cool, as this is usually the wall most players run into.

Grind? Take a break from doing YOU, and help out some of the new players.. Go run some missions with them, support them, teach them things. Many times this seems to give me a boost, and when all is said and done.. I know I've done a good thing, and potentially helped someone in the world, enjoy something just a little more.

I'm cut from a different cloth than 98% of the community though. I only say this because I don't start megathreads. I have patience. I look for info rather than spamming channels. I know that DE is working on this badass game, and they often stay late to patch things. I have an awesome clan that I created, and I teach people about the game. I will always go out of my way to revive someone.. I will come back for a player that is lagging behind while everyone goes to extract. I'll provide cover when the oxygen has ran out, to allow every one to get to extract. I don't pick one corner in a defense to man myself. I work the entire level for every one. I don't have such levels of dislike in my heart to make these threads. Pointing out features, issues, errors, et cetera, is one thing. Text wall mad hatting is another.

I feel i'm about to enter into a piece on merits such as; patience, honesty, selflessness, and more.

Being a decent human first, and a gamer second.

Instead i'll POOF

*Ninja vanish*

First, TL;DR. Second if you really believe you have more hours in this game than any of us? You are sorely mistaken Edited April 13, 2014 by arche

[gnat6]

I probably have more hours in this game than any of you, and none of this upsets me. I love this game, and I have no real issues with it, other than lack of features in some areas. (clan/dojo management - i would love a seriously deep amount of features for both)

 

RNG - Doesn't bug me . It'll come when it comes. I learned long ago if it isn't dropping, go do something else, then come back to it. Don't keep running the same mission under some belief that the odds are stacking in your favor.. They aren't, it's RNG..

 

Market resources - I learned long ago it's not the place to be. I'm also pretty sure DE has been made aware of this many times.

 

Design Council - I'm so glad people can't make posts on their own. I read the ability mods thread, and literally EVERY ONE put in game-breaking-personal-opinions, that they want for themselves. Not ideas that would work for ALL.

 

Mutagen samples? - Without even trying, and raaaaaaaarrrrrely doing derelict missions. I have tons of them. Not sure what the issue is..

 

Tutorials? -I agree that the tutorials across the board need to be more informative. They also need to add a feature to the initial tutorial with suggestions for spending initial plat. I've seen so many 0 level players running around with syandanas, and when asked why they didn't buy slots instead.. They state they didn't know any better. So not cool, as this is usually the wall most players run into.

 

Grind? Take a break from doing YOU, and help out some of the new players.. Go run some missions with them, support them, teach them things. Many times this seems to give me a boost, and when all is said and done.. I know I've done a good thing, and potentially helped someone in the world, enjoy something just a little more.

 

I'm cut from a different cloth than 98% of the community though. I only say this because I don't start megathreads. I have patience. I look for info rather than spamming channels. I know that DE is working on this badass game, and they often stay late to patch things. I have an awesome clan that I created, and I teach people about the game. I will always go out of my way to revive someone.. I will come back for a player that is lagging behind while everyone goes to extract. I'll provide cover when the oxygen has ran out, to allow every one to get to extract. I don't pick one corner in a defense to man myself. I work the entire level for every one. I don't have such levels of dislike in my heart to make these threads. Pointing out features, issues, errors, et cetera, is one thing. Text wall mad hatting is another.

 

I feel i'm about to enter into a piece on merits such as; patience, honesty, selflessness, and more.

 

Being a decent human first, and a gamer second.

 

Instead i'll POOF

 

*Ninja vanish*

I have 1511 hours spent in warframe and I only started playing about 2 weeks before update 10 I think you are seriously underestimating how much time some people have spent in warframe and personally I agree with most of the original post.

One thing that's important to remember is we are not complaining because we hate warframe we are complaining because we love the game and we hate it when DE keeps missing the massive potential that the game has.

[Althix]

I probably have more hours in this game than any of you, and none of this upsets me. I love this game

well it's a case and point. However i don't really think that time played or mastery rank can actually serve as indication of something. ironically enough i can't really name any stat that could be considered as indication that this particular player is good or bad.

 

You see. As it now i can name at least 5 issues with the game that still not fixed. And this issue are months old. From 4 to 6 months really. So if we are talking about quality of this product. Well... it can be better. And it's not just some things like clipping or something small, these issues are actually have direct impact on a gameplay. And these issues were reported many times with screenshots and videos but... i can see it every day. I am currently playing 2nd day after U13 and i already saw 4 of these issues. I could find 5th one, but i really don't wanna go and play Derelicts.

 

Now. Hatred. Hatred is bad. Also this word is overused. Like abusing, for example. Like you point out that flaw is in the game for half of the year - you get yourself a warning. Anyway.

 

What i see what DE are doing with this product is not really gives me much hope. Because all work done with this game was aimed to make it look better, without adding much depth in the gameplay. For example my friend list consists of 150 players. 127 of them are not playing. and the rest of them are MR15 players. So in general sense they have it all. And reason why they playing this game avoids me. But i guess for each his own. Not for me to judge.

I am not playing this game, i just logged in recently to see Rail systems and how they will work. And reason behind my attitude is rather simple. Game have no goal or purpose or challenge. And i didn't saw any work towards that direction in almost half of the year. Yeah i am kinda tired of brainless steamroll of the mobs. Which can't even kill me. No high level content.

 

And with comsetic augmentations of the game i have a feeling that this game is simply created to look nice for first couple of weeks. I don't buy arguments about "this game only one year old", take a look on Dragon Nest for example, what they did in one year. Such comparison shows very clearly on how game is designed. Cosmetics vs. content. Content wins for me any day. But how awesome it would be to have both. Oh wait...

 

U13. I will skip all grinding thing with Hek. I will concentrate on melee system alone. There is no single purpose to use melee weapon as your main weapon at all. Damage is irrelevant.. Blocking is irrelevant. Because all that comes with the price of time and energy. You don't have much energy and you most certainly don't have time. However i am looking on this from a perspective of player who prefer to play surivals for hour or more.

So from my point of view, melee 2.0 is just pointless cosmetic redo. Because on a level of solar system i can't even see mobs because my Ember is killing them outside my field of view, or i can't actually go to melee because my sentinel is killing mobs faster.

On survival or ED, i can't allow myself to waste energy and/or time to play around with a pointy stick.

So what's the purpose of all this but for visuals? I don't even care about stance mod. Because i will not use melee weapon as my main weapon. No point or sense behind it.

 

You know in order to make melee 2.0 viable or to justify damage 2.0 entire game mechanics must change. Which means developer must change how powers are working, how mobs interact with player and surroundings. How mobs and player take damage. There should be mobs which actually will force player to use melee weapon(these grineer guys, i don't even see them, they just keep dying somewhere ahead of me).

 

So yeah kinda this. In order to make this game fun and changes justified, many things must be reworked and i don't see it happen. If you like this game - play it. I still like this game as well, but for me there is nothing to do.

 

If for some reason DE will make some work on actual content and depth of gameplay for this product i may even create another forum account to praise them and i will even buy some platinum. But as it now... nah. Game have too many flaws and direction where this product is going is not very suits me. I am way past Solar system or Void level gameplay and regular content and current mechanics are just not good enough for me. And grind another frame or weapon for another MR is not a reason enough.

Edited April 14, 2014 by Althix

[CBAROG]

bla bla bla Look at me. I'm the only decent human being here.

If you didn't know Nugget does help new players. I don't. So I will be the evil one and say. Again. DE must listen to people. If they can't stand criticism they should quit game development.

The longer they ignore such threads and the problems these threads point out the more people they lose. If they take a break from reinforcements and work on improving the game people will come here. Because now Warframe is known as Warfarm. And the amount of grind is too close to korean mmorpgs. 

[LukeAura]

I probably have more hours in this game than any of you, and none of this upsets me. I love this game, and I have no real issues with it, other than lack of features in some areas. (clan/dojo management - i would love a seriously deep amount of features for both)

The only difference between player with 200 hours and 1500 hours is that the 1500 hour player probably has a slight advantage in power. There is nothing in this game that having more hours beyond what we have means anything.

 

RNG - Doesn't bug me . It'll come when it comes. I learned long ago if it isn't dropping, go do something else, then come back to it. Don't keep running the same mission under some belief that the odds are stacking in your favor.. They aren't, it's RNG..

RNG is a problem, you just exist in the sweet spot of having enough things to grind you can switch over, but also enough general power that any more is fairly meaningless. A lot of players only have one thing they want to grind for at a time at this point.

And that's not even the real issue with rng. RNG is our direct tie to power growth, meaning it's random. A new player first thing in game might get a heated charge drop, while another may leave mercury without even knowing he can find it there. The first player has a significant amount more power over the second for the same time played. The inconsistency is especially damming to new players. 

 

Mutagen samples? - Without even trying, and raaaaaaaarrrrrely doing derelict missions. I have tons of them. Not sure what the issue is..

If you've been here as long as you say you have then you have a stockpile built up from when the infested were free in the solar map.

Derelict locked samples effectively halves their acquisition rate, while forcing players to run the same map tile, against the same enemies, of the same level of difficulty increasing the feeling of grind compared to running for Detonite and Fieldron in the map. There's also no reason they should be rarer than Fieldron or Detonite, the bio weapons aren't superior to the chem or energy lab ones. 

 

 

I'm cut from a different cloth than 98% of the community though. I only say this because I don't start megathreads. I have patience. I look for info rather than spamming channels. I know that DE is working on this badass game, and they often stay late to patch things. I have an awesome clan that I created, and I teach people about the game. I will always go out of my way to revive someone.. I will come back for a player that is lagging behind while everyone goes to extract. I'll provide cover when the oxygen has ran out, to allow every one to get to extract. I don't pick one corner in a defense to man myself. I work the entire level for every one. I don't have such levels of dislike in my heart to make these threads. Pointing out features, issues, errors, et cetera, is one thing. Text wall mad hatting is another.

I hate that analogy. Different cloth. As if there are only two materials in all of existence and one is strictly better than the other. It takes all kinds of people to make the world go around....  Dibs on being Bamboo.

And someone needs to text wall mad hat, because DE tends to not take an issue to heart unless enough anger is brought in to the forums about it. Although Nugget hardly text wall mad hats compared to some of the rage that goes on.