Enough Of The Nerf Cries. Buff Lacking Frames Instead.

[fatpig84]

Ok we know armor 2.0 is in the works.

 

This will help up Frames that use elemental damage as their core hurting element.

Then after that DE can move on to look at each Frame again.

 

BUT, if you are screaming for nerfs, those frames that genuinely need help won't be able to get the attention first.

Mainly Saryn, Nyx, Volt, Ember, Ash and Frost.

 

 

So instead yelling for nerfs, suggest buffs for these frames instead. 

Let's all join the buffing bandwagon and not the nerf train ! :3

Edited November 4, 2013 by fatpig84

[ScrubbyDubDub]

What are you talking about? Saryn is already a good frame. So are Nyx and Ember. I don't even know what you could possibly do to frost to make him better.

[Drazhar14]

Buff Nova! On high levels, she can't make the room instantly explode! You actually have to kill enemies one by one! 

[Cwierz]

This is literally the worst idea ever. What do we want this game to be?

something that plays itself for the player.

 

God damn, where do you people get this logic, if we buff everything then the game will become Easyframe or Wareasy, which ever one floats your boat.

[legionprobatio]

I agree! Except for nova's mprime

[SquirmyBurrito]

What's wrong with Saryn? Also, Loki should be on a secondary list. His brand of utility (while useful) is overshadowed by pretty much every other utility-based frame. 

[SquirmyBurrito]

I agree! Except for nova's mprime

 

How do you propose they nerf Molecular Prime without making it useless? As it stands, its only use in higher level content (or high-mid for that matter) is the damage buff and the speed debuff. Don't look at what it does in low level missions, look at how it fails to hold up later on.

[KvotheTheArcane1]

What are you talking about? Saryn is already a good frame. So are Nyx and Ember. I don't even know what you could possibly do to frost to make him better.

How many of Frost's abilities are honestly useful outside of <40 (at best)? 1, Snowglobe

[Plasmapause]

God damn, where do you people get this logic, if we buff everything then the game will become Easyframe or Wareasy, which ever one floats your boat.

Why not buff the enemies then? And leave the warframes as they are. Edited November 4, 2013 by Aadil

[123Olympian]

Something offence for Frost would be great, maybe something else than the uber, freeze, and ice wave. He needs offence as much as defense.

[123Olympian]

Buff Nova! On high levels, she can't make the room instantly explode! You actually have to kill enemies one by one! 

 

 

I agree! Except for nova's mprime

I made a previous forum on Nova, they need to have her on a rank requirement of at least 6 or 7. 

 

They have it for Rhino & now Soma, why not Nova?

[TheStag]

Leave nova how she is but reduce explosion radius on m prime. Buff volt, frost, and change/fix ember.

[__Kanade__]

This is literally the worst idea ever. What do we want this game to be?

something that plays itself for the player.

 

God damn, where do you people get this logic, if we buff everything then the game will become Easyframe or Wareasy, which ever one floats your boat.

Guess you missed the part where Scott said he wanted every frame to be more on par with Nova and Vauban, which almost all of us disagree with. Essentially making every frame God tier instead.

Edited November 4, 2013 by __Kanade__

[Cpl_Facehugger]

God damn, where do you people get this logic, if we buff everything then the game will become Easyframe or Wareasy, which ever one floats your boat.

Not really. Rhino's arguably the most powerful frame in the game and high level play is not 'easy mode' for people of average skill.

 

What's wrong with Saryn?

Contagion is kind of worthless.

which almost all of us disagree with.

Who's us? I don't know about you, but I like feeling powerful in a video game.

Edited November 4, 2013 by Cpl_Facehugger

[fatpig84]

What's wrong with Saryn? Also, Loki should be on a secondary list. His brand of utility (while useful) is overshadowed by pretty much every other utility-based frame. 

 

Saryn is a damage frame but she isn't doing a heck load of damage.

 

Venom is still poor compared to it's original iteration.

Molt still does it's job some what.

 

Contagion.

This skill is a mixed bag, it gives her a good melee damage buff, but only to herself.

But her average shields and lack of CC immunity makes it risky to melee. 

 

 

Miasma.

Just another press 4 skill. But with a very short range.

Granted it deals the highest damage so far, 

 

But that isn't enough to save her.

She is basically a 1 dimensional frame at best, with only 2 skills are really needed.

 

 

The same issue applies to Frost.

Currently people only care about Globe globe globe. 

They don't even care if you don't have his other skills.

 

Even with Armor 2.0, people will keep Globe and Avalanche only for team games because Avalanche finally can kill higher level stuff.  But Freeze and Ice wave still needs more work.

Edited November 4, 2013 by fatpig84

[Drazhar14]

Okay time to provide a serious response. 

 

I made a previous forum on Nova, they need to have her on a rank requirement of at least 6 or 7. 

 

They have it for Rhino & now Soma, why not Nova?

 

Hmm not a bad idea. A rank requirement would prevent new players from nuking their way through all the low level missions. Nova is perfectly balanced for end game content. 

 

BUT, if you are screaming for nerfs, those frames that genuinely need help won't be able to get the attention first.

Mainly Saryn, Nyx, Volt, Ember and Frost.

 

Saryn feels very underwhelming compared to other frames. I'd like to see Moult copy Saryn's health, armor, and shields so that it can survive longer on higher levels. Moult should also shed Saryn of all her conditions (poison, fire, etc) when she uses it. 

 

Nyx's Mind Control needs to convert the targeted enemy into an ally, to prevent it from being killed by other tenno. 

 

Volt's Shock needs to be turned into a full AoE stun that lasts longer. Overload need to make him invincible during the cast animation since he turns into a sitting duck. 

 

Ember I can't comment on since I haven't used her. As far as I know, they are looking at fixing her. 

 

Frost is a one trick wonder. His other abilities need to made more interesting. Freeze is useless in group play and needs to be reworked. At least make it an AoE freeze if targets will just become unfrozen as soon as they are attacked. Avalanche should stun all enemies hit by it for several seconds if they do not die. This would make it better on high level missions where it doesn't do much damage. 

[Magister_Zel]

I don't think anything should be done, perfect the way it is.

[Silraed]

As a few others have pointed out, the "Nerf nothing, buff everything else" mindeset is so flawed. It basically creates power creep from content that is already in the game, and we sure as hell do not need any more power creep.

[Cpl_Facehugger]

and we sure as hell do not need any more power creep.

I disagree with this premise, actually. Power creep in the form of new content is what provides a sense of progression in successful PvE games.

[Silraed]

I disagree with this premise, actually. Power creep in the form of new content is what provides a sense of progression in successful PvE games.

 

While I agree there are some games that have survived off power creep, they do not have blatant power creep like we have at the moment with new weapons and some 'Frames (Nova, Rhino) that trivialize all current content.

 

Power creep can work if it is introduced very slowly, but DE don't seem to realize that. If they do to every 'Frame what they did to Rhino with his last run through then the standard would be raised so high that the current content wouldn't hold up to it. That then requires new content that CAN stand up to the new super powered items and then the cycle starts all over again.

Edited November 4, 2013 by Silraed

[ra9una]

This is literally the worst idea ever. What do we want this game to be?

something that plays itself for the player.

 

God damn, where do you people get this logic, if we buff everything then the game will become Easyframe or Wareasy, which ever one floats your boat.

In all fairness, call me psycho-bat-crazy, but, I'd totally be into easyframe.

 

 

Now, you can't just buff everything that isn't considered top tier, otherwise, well, it becomes easyframe and as much as I would love it, it's not great for the game as a whole. What's important is that each frame remains viable. Nerfing isn't the answer. Balancing, is. You nerf what seems to be too tough, a little, A LITTLE. then what's to weak you buff, a little, A LITTLE. And you reach equality, then it's just a matter of tweeking.

[GeoffFromAccounting]

I don't think anything should be done, perfect the way it is.

 

so, Volt should stay useless and Rhino and Nova should stay the only viable endgame frames? (from what I've heard, this is most likely wrong) I'm just going to have to say something that can only be sufficiently said in a image

 

[SquirmyBurrito]

While I agree there are some games that have survived off power creep, they do not have blatant power creep like we have at the moment with new weapons and some 'Frames (Nova, Rhino) that trivialize all current content.

 

Power creep can work if it is introduced very slowly, but DE don't seem to realize that. If they do to every 'Frame what they did to Rhino with his last run through then the standard would be raised so high that the current content wouldn't hold up to it. That then requires new content that CAN stand up to the new super powered items and then the cycle starts all over again.

so, Volt should stay useless and Rhino and Nova should stay the only viable endgame frames? (from what I've heard, this is most likely wrong) I'm just going to have to say something that can only be sufficiently said in a image

 

 

Nova isn't good for late-game (higher level) content. She becomes a glass cannon that's lost most of her damage. AKA pretty bad. Yes, she still provides damage buff and a speed debuff. But Banshee does the damage buff better and Frost can flat out freeze people in place. NOVA ISN'T THAT GOOD. Stop watching her nuke level 30s for a second and take her to some high level'd stuff (go fight some grineer *hehe*), watch how well she 'nukes' things when her ult fails to kill things. Rhino's damage on stomp also falls-off (later than Nova's though), and his Iron Skin eventually stops preventing the enemies from oneshotting you. He too becomes little more than a support-CC frame. 

TL;DR- This game shouldn't be balanced around low level content. Nova may shine in low-mid content, but she sucks later. Rhino also falls off, but not as hard as Nova does.

Also, why do I keep seeing calls for Nova to get nerfed but no one seems to want to nerf powerhouses like Ash (have you looked at what his shuriken can be turned into? or how much damage bladestorm does?). It seems like its only the flashy, AoE, low-level nuking, frames that people want nerfed.

[fatpig84]

Okay time to provide a serious response. 

 

 

Hmm not a bad idea. A rank requirement would prevent new players from nuking their way through all the low level missions. Nova is perfectly balanced for end game content. 

 

 

Saryn feels very underwhelming compared to other frames. I'd like to see Moult copy Saryn's health, armor, and shields so that it can survive longer on higher levels. Moult should also shed Saryn of all her conditions (poison, fire, etc) when she uses it. 

 

Nyx's Mind Control needs to convert the targeted enemy into an ally, to prevent it from being killed by other tenno. 

 

Volt's Shock needs to be turned into a full AoE stun that lasts longer. Overload need to make him invincible during the cast animation since he turns into a sitting duck. 

 

Ember I can't comment on since I haven't used her. As far as I know, they are looking at fixing her. 

 

Frost is a one trick wonder. His other abilities need to made more interesting. Freeze is useless in group play and needs to be reworked. At least make it an AoE freeze if targets will just become unfrozen as soon as they are attacked. Avalanche should stun all enemies hit by it for several seconds if they do not die. This would make it better on high level missions where it doesn't do much damage. 

 

I try not to turn this into a "lets look at this frame and why does it suck" topic but whatever.

I go with the easiest offender.

 

Frost.

1 trick pony literally.

The slowest frame in the game (no Vanguard Q_Q).

Only good for Globe.

 

 

Freeze

IMO upon impact, there should a small Freeze shockwave that spreads out from the original target in about 5 meters. 

So Frost can freeze a bunch of targets in a small radius for 4/5/6/7 seconds.

A little more damage won't hurt like 200 ice damage for some light nuking (yes freeze actually does damage but it is so little that no one counts).

Attacking the frozen target will cause it to break after 3 seconds.

 

 

Ice Wave

You know the icy patches in the void ?

It would be great if Ice Wave left that behind ! For like 5 to 8 seconds.

Damage I will just leave it as 500 for now.

 

 

Avalanche

More freeze duration dudes !

12 seconds isn't too bad.

Edited November 4, 2013 by fatpig84

[Cpl_Facehugger]

While I agree there are some games that have survived off power creep, they do not have blatant power creep like we have at the moment with new weapons and some 'Frames (Nova, Rhino) that trivialize all current content.

Diablo II is one of the most successful aRPGs of all time and has gameplay that consists almost entirely of power creep. Blatant power creep. Like "I've found a sword with a much more favorable statline in an hour of play. Time to toss this gemmed level 6 sword that I've put a lot of effort into gemming into the trash heap."

And yeah, it's entirely possible in a lot of other RPGs to get gear that trivializes all current content.

Edited November 4, 2013 by Cpl_Facehugger