Warframe speculation: Joe mad's werewolf

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

Just now, Pakaku said:

Styanax was a pretty good "ace" frame, good at a lot of things that are valuable to the usual gameplay like armour stripping. So it could definitely go either way. I am very unexcited for another melee, though

Yeah, Styanax was probably the best frame of the last 4, but even then he could’ve used a few touch ups but instead DE chose to nerf him and give a half hearted apology for it.

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

3 minutes ago, Pizzarugi said:

 Maybe they're releasing (what we consider to be) sub-par frames, because they're making an effort to tie down powercreep. If they start putting an upper limit on new frame capabilities, they can spend more time toning down all of the broken ones.

In an older era, frames like Hydroid, Grendal, Yareli, Styanax, etc would've been perfectly balanced. Today, in a game where everyone's meta is AoE nuke cheese, of course they're terrible, just because they don't have cheese.

Releasing half baked new frames doesn’t tie down power creep. It just makes those frames a waste of development as nobody wants to play them and they just stick to the older frames.

[Pizzarugi]

3 minutes ago, (XBOX)GearsMatrix301 said:

Releasing half baked new frames doesn’t tie down power creep. It just makes those frames a waste of development as nobody wants to play them and they just stick to the older frames.

Until they, maybe, nerf those older frames to make them more in line with the ones I mentioned, hence my point.

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

6 minutes ago, Pizzarugi said:

Until they, maybe, nerf those older frames to make them more in line with the ones I mentioned, hence my point.

What reasons would they have to nerf frames like Nezha, Equinox, Ash, Mag, Ivara? Those are unproblematic frames that happen to be quite good.

the idea of nerfing them simply because they’re better than the newer frames being released is absurd and would only piss off the community.

[(XBOX)DragonMan 2700]

I'm still hopeful for Voruna even if she doesn't look 100%-82% like I thought she would, I'm holding out for her kit to still be at least ok/good but I'm not expecting S tier or anything. 

And I think her sig Axe looks dope.

[Alchemist_Moth]

1 hour ago, (XBOX)GearsMatrix301 said:

It’s no secret that DE’s been dropping the ball when it comes to new frames recently. From subpar kits, to never touching up the frames after release, to not even putting up a feedback thread for them. It’s an unfortunate trend that I’m not really seeing an end to.

So do y’all think Voruna will be good or bad?

Yareli has been buffed and is getting buffed more.

Caliban isn't actually a bad frame, just a bit boring in how he plays.

Gyre was nerfed because that particular ability was doing a bit too much damage that put her above other frames with a similar role, but she still deals good damage.

Styanax wasn't nerfed, he had a change to how an ability functions so it can't be spammed while his most potent ability, his shield bash that strips armor and restores health, wasn't touched at all. Removing his ability to fly has been overblown.

Not every frame is going to fit every purpose. Gyre doesn't have any intrinsic survivability, but even with the nerf she's stellar at endless missions as long as she has something helping her stay alive. Yareli is also nowhere near as bad as people keep complaining, since her first impression wasn't very good.

DE's recent warframes have been fine, especially with the downsizing of their Warframe team in favor of Soulframe.

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

46 minutes ago, Alchemist_Moth said:

Yareli has been buffed and is getting buffed more.

Caliban isn't actually a bad frame, just a bit boring in how he plays.

Gyre was nerfed because that particular ability was doing a bit too much damage that put her above other frames with a similar role, but she still deals good damage.

Styanax wasn't nerfed, he had a change to how an ability functions so it can't be spammed while his most potent ability, his shield bash that strips armor and restores health, wasn't touched at all. Removing his ability to fly has been overblown.

Not every frame is going to fit every purpose. Gyre doesn't have any intrinsic survivability, but even with the nerf she's stellar at endless missions as long as she has something helping her stay alive. Yareli is also nowhere near as bad as people keep complaining, since her first impression wasn't very good.

DE's recent warframes have been fine, especially with the downsizing of their Warframe team in favor of Soulframe.

Yareli’s still bad and the new changes aren’t going to fix her.

DE straight up released Caliban and forgot he existed just as quickly.

Gyre is a DPS frame and they gimped her DPS to the point where she’s not even viable as a DPS frame.

The things they removed from Styanax were fun and gave him subtle advantages that actually helped him be a better frame. They then proceed to ignore the rest of his kit which could’ve benefitted from some minor tweaks.

And let’s not forget that every frame but Yareli you can get vastly superior frames than far earlier as they’re all locked behind The New War. So outside of Mastery there’s no motivation to ever farm them.

The reduction of the dev teams size is not an excuse for a drop in content quality.

You also forget the other part. They stopped doing Warframe feedback threads. Effectively telling us they don’t want to hear about ideas for improving the frames. Likely because they don’t care about the quality of the frames they’re releasing anymore.

[L3512]

2 hours ago, (XBOX)GearsMatrix301 said:

It’s no secret that DE’s been dropping the ball when it comes to new frames recently. From subpar kits, to never touching up the frames after release, to not even putting up a feedback thread for them. It’s an unfortunate trend that I’m not really seeing an end to.

So do y’all think Voruna will be good or bad?

If I had to put money down it would be on mediocre albeit could be fun to play, latest frame development seems to have become fairly formulaic.

Pablo wanted to nerf Saryn and recently nerfed his reworked Wukong because it was too popular so looks like useful but boring abilities like Tharros Strike from here on out instead of cool semi-broken abilities like Toxic Lash.

[(PSN)FunyFlyBoy]

1 hour ago, L3512 said:

Pablo wanted to nerf Saryn and recently nerfed his reworked Wukong because it was too popular so looks like useful but boring abilities like Tharros Strike from here on out instead of cool semi-broken abilities like Toxic Lash.

Forgetting Xata's Whisper exists and its interactions with various Warframes have been adjusted lately because walking around with a Magnetize like effect on demand can be quite powerful.

It's abilities like Rotorswell on Gyre that are getting hit into the ground. Abilities like Toxic Lash primarily appear when the Frame deals some kind of element primarily throughout all their abilities and theme which is why we don't see it appear often. We already have a Frame that applies specific elements to weapons from their abilities for a large chunk of the statuses across the board. Only ones we are missing is Impact, Puncture, Viral, and Blast. The rest we have. You could argue many of them we have from augments which is true yes but it isn't often that DE created a carbon copy of an ability (that includes aguments) and just slaps it on another frame. 

 

[L3512]

28 minutes ago, (PSN)FunyFlyBoy said:

Forgetting Xata's Whisper exists and its interactions with various Warframes have been adjusted lately because walking around with a Magnetize like effect on demand can be quite powerful.

Xata's whisper was cool on Mesa, DE destroyed that but I hadn't forgot it exists. Xaku is now two years old so not a new frame either.

 

28 minutes ago, (PSN)FunyFlyBoy said:

It's abilities like Rotorswell on Gyre that are getting hit into the ground. Abilities like Toxic Lash primarily appear when the Frame deals some kind of element primarily throughout all their abilities and theme which is why we don't see it appear often. We already have a Frame that applies specific elements to weapons from their abilities for a large chunk of the statuses across the board. Only ones we are missing is Impact, Puncture, Viral, and Blast. The rest we have. You could argue many of them we have from augments which is true yes but it isn't often that DE created a carbon copy of an ability (that includes aguments) and just slaps it on another frame. 

Toxic Lash is not a mere elemental imbuing ability/augment like Nourish, Thermal transfer, Smite infusion, Venom dose, Fireball Frenzy or Shock trooper. 

[Silfrulfr]

5 hours ago, (XBOX)GearsMatrix301 said:

It’s no secret that DE’s been dropping the ball when it comes to new frames recently. From subpar kits, to never touching up the frames after release, to not even putting up a feedback thread for them. It’s an unfortunate trend that I’m not really seeing an end to.

So do y’all think Voruna will be good or bad?

After they dropped her design so hard it's difficult for me to have any hope for her kit, depending on how the heads play into her abilities there will probably only be one actual useful one; maybe two if we're lucky.

[(PSN)Claudija]

6 hours ago, (XBOX)GearsMatrix301 said:

It’s no secret that DE’s been dropping the ball when it comes to new frames recently. From subpar kits, to never touching up the frames after release, to not even putting up a feedback thread for them. It’s an unfortunate trend that I’m not really seeing an end to.

So do y’all think Voruna will be good or bad?

I intend to really put her through her paces myself as I still like her. As for good or bad? That'd be subjective, I really like Yareli say but our community majority- loathe her. Many here think Wukong is god, I find him boring and we have others who can do anything he can but better- all subjective

[(PSN)Claudija]

10 hours ago, (XBOX)DragonMan 2700 said:

(Sigh) I know, I completely understand DE's reasoning to do it this way. I'm just bummed out of what they could have done mechanically with the tails if incorporated into her kit.

I really wanted that Naruto nine tails cloak/ Bleach Bankai !  Let Go! moment, right. 

Sometimes we get different nice things instead of the ones we wanted, tho I thought it was going to be bigger/wider like in the concept art kinda flair out to the side more ya, know, maybe DE is saving that for the prime? 

I posited that very evolution idea waaay back for Xaku with my Kitsune-themed frame Vulpinara that's on a compilation thread here somewhere.

As she leveled she would grow up to 4 tails starting from 1. Vulpinara Prime would have those as default before gaining up to 9 as she leveled up. I also went kinda Venomancer from OG Perfect World as her buffs in humanoid form, carried to her Ult kitsune form which changed your melee and ranged attacks to Pounce and Sharpened Claws plus a pack of your Kavats; I did kinda post that but you never know, DE may still go with the concept in abilities; bar the Ult as they say no transformations... we'll find out this week on Prime Time likely or a Devstream just before Nov 30th- fingers crossed :p

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

1 hour ago, (PSN)Claudija said:

I intend to really put her through her paces myself as I still like her. As for good or bad? That'd be subjective, I really like Yareli say but our community majority- loathe her. Many here think Wukong is god, I find him boring and we have others who can do anything he can but better- all subjective

Wukongs been B tier for me since they ruined his 4. Tho I judge frames on ability design and performance. So yeah Yareli still gets an F from me.

[(PSN)Claudija]

8 hours ago, (XBOX)GearsMatrix301 said:

Wukongs been B tier for me since they ruined his 4. Tho I judge frames on ability design and performance. So yeah Yareli still gets an F from me.

I just find her fun myself but each their own. What are you feeling Voruna'll be like yourself and what do you think she'll be? I think she'll be a DPS as they have gone away from expectations so far so a melee tank is expected, DPS she becomes or Utility is my guess

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

35 minutes ago, (PSN)Claudija said:

I just find her fun myself but each their own. What are you feeling Voruna'll be like yourself and what do you think she'll be? I think she'll be a DPS as they have gone away from expectations so far so a melee tank is expected, DPS she becomes or Utility is my guess

I think she’ll be some kind of support frame. I’d honestly be very concerned if she was made a DPS frame because they straight up nerfed Gyre simply for being good at being a DPS frame.

[sunderthefirmament]

17 hours ago, (XBOX)GearsMatrix301 said:

Releasing half baked new frames doesn’t tie down power creep. It just makes those frames a waste of development as nobody wants to play them and they just stick to the older frames.

Well said.  If the new direction for Warframe design is focused on conservatively creating generalist frames that don't really do anything special (Gyre and Styanax are two recent examples), then why would I invest in new frames while my tried-and-true older frames have more clearly defined roles/niches/purposes?  I think DE is trying to move away from frames with as widespread and dramatic influence as Limbo, Saryn, and Nova, for example.

 

15 hours ago, (XBOX)GearsMatrix301 said:

Yareli’s still bad and the new changes aren’t going to fix her.

I think they'll help quite a bit, but yeah, there's no fixing a K Drive frame.  I trotted her out last night to get the NW K Drive Kills challenge, and she feels every bit as awful to use as ever.

 

32 minutes ago, (XBOX)GearsMatrix301 said:

I think she’ll be some kind of support frame. I’d honestly be very concerned if she was made a DPS frame because they straight up nerfed Gyre simply for being good at being a DPS frame.

I would prefer a support/utility frame as opposed to DPS.  I just don't think DE knows how to make a relevant DPS frame for the game as it stands.  Gyre's DPS is basically nil for the content required to actually unlock her.  Styanax's DPS identity is basically only linked to his 4, which just doesn't scale meaningful for content at the level that DE is incentivizing: Steel Path (no longer a "just for the challenge" game mode) and Archon Hunts.

 

If she's DPS and somehow has statstick functionality, she'll be dead on arrival for me.  But there's no reason to be excessively negative until we know more about her kit.

[(PSN)Claudija]

9 hours ago, sunderthefirmament said:

Well said.  If the new direction for Warframe design is focused on conservatively creating generalist frames that don't really do anything special (Gyre and Styanax are two recent examples), then why would I invest in new frames while my tried-and-true older frames have more clearly defined roles/niches/purposes?  I think DE is trying to move away from frames with as widespread and dramatic influence as Limbo, Saryn, and Nova, for example.

 

I think they'll help quite a bit, but yeah, there's no fixing a K Drive frame.  I trotted her out last night to get the NW K Drive Kills challenge, and she feels every bit as awful to use as ever.

 

I would prefer a support/utility frame as opposed to DPS.  I just don't think DE knows how to make a relevant DPS frame for the game as it stands.  Gyre's DPS is basically nil for the content required to actually unlock her.  Styanax's DPS identity is basically only linked to his 4, which just doesn't scale meaningful for content at the level that DE is incentivizing: Steel Path (no longer a "just for the challenge" game mode) and Archon Hunts.

 

If she's DPS and somehow has statstick functionality, she'll be dead on arrival for me.  But there's no reason to be excessively negative until we know more about her kit.

I'm with you and Gears both, just the two week just under wait is the hard part :p

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

21 minutes ago, (PSN)Claudija said:

I'm with you and Gears both, just the two week just under wait is the hard part :p

Oh yeah that’s the other thing. The fact that we aren’t getting an actual look at the frames abilities until shortly before their release or the day of their release is a major red flag.

[(XBOX)DragonMan 2700]

42 minutes ago, (XBOX)GearsMatrix301 said:

Oh yeah that’s the other thing. The fact that we aren’t getting an actual look at the frames abilities until shortly before their release or the day of their release is a major red flag.

Most likely on the last dev stream of the year before DE go off on Holiday. 🥳 🎉 

[(PSN)FunyFlyBoy]

You know what gets me, the people going, "She looks like a dragon, her ears look more like horns than ears, meeehh!" Dude, look at the concept art, they always looked more like horns than ears, and that's when they were on a side profile drawing. You're actually seeing her from the front, were you see less of the shape of those "ears" compared to the side. Her whole back of her head looks like a Queen Xenomorph crest, horns and all, in her past concept art. What about that is "Wolf" like to begin with?

[MadxWorld]

Naaah, she fully got change. Nothing in "that" looks like a wolf to me, she looks more like a dragon than a wolf. The only thing that looks like a wolf are her legs wolf heads, the shoulders look more dragon than wolf.
 

 

[Alchemist_Moth]

Voruna looks more like a wolf than Ember does a phoenix, or Zephyr a bird.

Plus wolves don't exist in Warframe. They're Old-Earth creatures that are long extinct and the closest we have are kubrodons plus things that are named after wolves such as the Wolf of Saturn Six and Amar.

Warframe is its own universe. Nothing is going to look as much like their inspirations as you all seem to want. There isn't any distinctly wolf-like features one can give something to make it 100% obvious it's a wolf unlike how a warframe like Hydroid can have "baggy" armor and a tricorn alt helmet to immediately give the appearance of a pirate.

Yes, they changed the design, but going from concept to model is almost never a smooth process. Creating skins is one thing, but an entirely new warframe is another entirely. While the concept art we got is what they showed us, in the end it was still a months-old design that likely ran into problems being made into the end product. These things don't change without reason.

That being said it is fine to not like the design we wound up with. It's a drastic shift, but it is one we saw the seeds of in the last Devstream we had that they had changed a number of the design elements, such as the heads and making her slimmer. The overall design and theming is still there however, and saying it's not is a bit nitpicky from my point of view.

[(PSN)Claudija]

3 hours ago, Alchemist_Moth said:

Voruna looks more like a wolf than Ember does a phoenix, or Zephyr a bird.

Plus wolves don't exist in Warframe. They're Old-Earth creatures that are long extinct and the closest we have are kubrodons plus things that are named after wolves such as the Wolf of Saturn Six and Amar.

Warframe is its own universe. Nothing is going to look as much like their inspirations as you all seem to want. There isn't any distinctly wolf-like features one can give something to make it 100% obvious it's a wolf unlike how a warframe like Hydroid can have "baggy" armor and a tricorn alt helmet to immediately give the appearance of a pirate.

Yes, they changed the design, but going from concept to model is almost never a smooth process. Creating skins is one thing, but an entirely new warframe is another entirely. While the concept art we got is what they showed us, in the end it was still a months-old design that likely ran into problems being made into the end product. These things don't change without reason.

That being said it is fine to not like the design we wound up with. It's a drastic shift, but it is one we saw the seeds of in the last Devstream we had that they had changed a number of the design elements, such as the heads and making her slimmer. The overall design and theming is still there however, and saying it's not is a bit nitpicky from my point of view.

Fully agree though it seems each of the female frames have some animal aspect in there especially Yareli, Valkyr (we call her Valkitty), Khora still having spider theme, Ivara base being frog and Ivara Prime as jellyfish, Mirage has a fox-like Tennogen... So Voruna does as you say; fit in with her big sisters in that sense aesthetically.

Those on about her twins... Protea Deluxe. Compare that to base Protea and she looks more defined in the chest. Nyx's Pasithea does it too and a couple others plus we only see Voruna base model, there's an alternate helmet in her bundle and likely NW plus Voidshell we haven't seen just yet so everyone losing their minds over her base model need to sit back and chill

[(PSN)FunyFlyBoy]

6 hours ago, MadxWorld said:

Naaah, she fully got change. Nothing in "that" looks like a wolf to me, she looks more like a dragon than a #*!%ing wolf. The only thing that looks like a wolf are her legs wolf heads, the shoulders look more dragon than wolf.

Her head never looked like a Wolf. All you people saying it does in the concept art are more blind than a Starnose Mole. Voruna's looks like a Xeno Queen on her head sculpt in the initial concept art, not some Wolf-Infested thing.