[Dante Unbound] Our plans for next week (35.5.6)

[CFandCo]

Almost there, these changes are closer to what this entire debacle has been about. Line of Sight in general for Tragedy should still get removed. The entire point of Tragedy is to 'Cash In' on Dark Verse's DoT. Line of Sight on a 'Cash In' is clunky. And no, range is also not his issue either.

There's multiple frames that have wide area damage that is not affected by Line of Sight. There are even some Weapons that don't have Line of Sight checks. If things not having Line of Sight is a problem then where is the consistency across the board? It doesn't seem fair to me that a frame with just a little under a week of releasing is being subjected to a ruling that some frames that have been around for much longer, do not adhere to.

Also I don't know if the Data you were looking into to see his Nuking is based on Normal Star Chart or from Steel Path. Because everyone late game, knows that if you are basing his Effectiveness on JUST normal chart Hydron, then that Data is obviously going to make something look good. At this point in time with where the game is at, I don't think focusing on just standard Star Chart is a good indicator of a Frame's position on the Power Scale. And some people would say that even base level Steel Path isn't the best Indicator either.

[Hercam-Prime]

people complaining because OH NO I CAN'T KILL ENEMIES THROUGH WALLS 200FT AWAY OH THE HORROR.They don't want to move in a game where movement is one of its biggest advantages over other games. Although I'm still upset how they handled the Nezha augment nerf

[Redrigoth]

2 hours ago, Melles64 said:

Does this mean Rage/Hunter's Adrenaline will no longer work while channeling an ability? If so, I'm just going to have to stop playing Oberon altogether. I love his aesthetic and I've been playing him a lot (still my most played frame) until recently, but if this change doesn't allow him to generate any energy with those mods his energy economy is just too bad to continue using. He's been in rough shape for a while but this would be the last nail in the coffin.

I think it means taking any damage while shield is 0 will trigger its effect. That way overguard can't cockblock inaros and nidus and kullervo.

And I guess any other frame would also gain energy if they gain overguard then get hit in the moment between when they lose all shields and before shield regenerates

[Sir-Lorkhan]

Il y a 2 heures, [DE]Momaw a dit :

It's been an exciting week for Warframe. Following the very positive launch of Dante Unbound, we threw open the doors to the Deep Archimedea and Elite Deep Archimedea. People have been laughing all the way to the bank with their new-found riches of Archon Shards.

But there's also been some missteps which we must take responsibility and apologize for, with regard to Dante himself and the rapid changes that caught people unawares. We've already made a big correction by fixing the new Line of Sight calculations which were, to put it bluntly, not as good as they should have been on release.

We never stop reviewing feedback, and in the spirit of making constant improvements to our game, here's a preview of our next steps in response to what players have said:

• Adding back and formalizing the Status Damage Vulnerability to Dante's "Pageflight". In other words not just making enemies take more Status procs, but also increasing the damage of their Status. We removed this in Hotfix 35.5.3 because it was unexpected, and we regarded it as a bug. But many of you have expressed a desire to have this back, so we are working to restore it.
• Improving the co-op play between Warframes that give their teammates Overguard and Warframes that rely on taking damage:
  • Vex Armor can charge its damage buff by getting ranged kills and its armor buff by getting melee or ability kills. This is in addition to the existing functionality. This allows Vex Armor to work while having Overguard and also in general provides a nice interaction where you can get the buff faster from playing well and not just from tanking hits.
  • Rage/Hunter Adrenaline will now grant Energy when you don't have Shields, so Inaros and Nidus (or any frame when their Shields are temporarily down), can regenerate Energy even through Overguard.

You can expect to see a Hotfix next week that adds these items. Other forms of self damage like Combat Discipline will also be reviewed in the future. We have definitely heard you on this point, we're just not sure that it will be done as quickly as the other interactions already mentioned.

 

 

THIS! THIS ! NOW you revert Dante to how he was before since your taking care pf the overguard probleme!!!

[ShaloomHD]

5 minutes ago, Obsero said:

actaully every frames and weapons should be in this state..if they revert every nerfs on them 

no not true so not sure on what game you play but theres a saying for a reason MR fodder 

[Spectrum_Revan]

Dear digital extremes this is a post from someone who has been living under a rock for the last 11 years because i just discoverd recently the game. Currently on day 55 login and i hope for many more to come. What can i say i love the game the mechanics ,art, sound and even the story.It is very rare form a game to hook me this good. Because i was late to the party i chose to use  the discounts given from time to time just so i can get a bit ahead because i really do not have that much time to grind for some items not saying that is a bad thing.So here is the thing, with so many warframes to chose it was hard form me to chose someone that fits my gameplay and fun factor until i found Gauss prime man that was a lot a fun and still is ,never could connect with another warframe until i discovered Dante , it just clicked with me and was having a blast with him until the nerfs. I understand that he was a walking ICBM and God the fun i had i can not describe it .When i have so much fun with a frame it means you have done something really good and it is not just my opinion its almost all of us. I get the overguard buff ruins the mechanics of other warframes and a proper nerf is necessary but the line of sight to tragedy does not work so good even after the update and it kills his wow factor a lot and the fun you have with it. My two cents on this, rework/rebalance/remove/ overguard so it can be in synergy with other frames and remove line of sight. Sorry for the rant, long post and spelling mistakes english is not my first language.

[ShaloomHD]

8 minutes ago, Hercam-Prime said:

people complaining because OH NO I CAN'T KILL ENEMIES THROUGH WALLS 200FT AWAY OH THE HORROR.They don't want to move in a game where movement is one of its biggest advantages over other games. Although I'm still upset how they handled the Nezha augment nerf

lol your a fool he could never kill through walls you play him? his 3 LOS... is 4 needs 3 to nuke so he could nuke with 4 thats been hit by 3 get in the bin trash talk also you didnt have to move with him lol now i deffo no you didnt play him again you needed to b in range with his 3 

Edited April 5 by ShaloomHD

[Kuwagata]

2 hours ago, [DE]Momaw said:

We've already made a big correction by fixing the new Line of Sight calculations which were, to put it bluntly, not as good as they should have been on release.

Ok, after around 30 mins testing, it Line of Sight seems to be a bit more accurate, but doesn't make it any more viable than what it was before these "fixes". This ability shouldn't be based on LoS at all. Just make it like a detonator for those in range. Yes, range. That is what Tragedy should be based on to avoid all these nonsense issues to begin with. 
Now about the Overguard issues, simply reduce the cap and generation of it for squad mates. Dante should be good on his own before being a support frame, in my opinion. 

[AliceTheAxolotl]

Reverting Pageflight and actually taking steps to fix the one, singular issue Dante had on release, which wasn't even specific to him. A step in the right direction, but you still haven't reverted the LoS on Dante's 4. You say you're listening to feedback, yet double-down to avoid admitting this nerf was a mistake.

[Arkainik]

36 minutes ago, UpstatePunk said:

How is that killing Oberon? The change made it so that Rage/HA work through overguard that's it. Did you take Rage and somehow give Oberon overguard so that you could stop generating energy? If so, why waste the mod slot if you were just disabling it anyways?

*"while shields are down" so there's more* He doesn't use overguard himself , while Yea it'll work with overguard but I need to take health damage in order for quick thinking to work effectively. Since were it sits now that's direct translation from hp to energy. Since I am doing a parasitic armor with all shield azure shard high hp regen build purposely exposing my hp. Basically Kirito. If it turns into simple regen while shields are down I will not be able to sustain my energy while taking dmg. Granted if the values are high enough I can counter the intake of dmg and maintain energy for regeneration and quick thinking. Tho this would be better as a new mod instead of changing what is currently there. Which would add more build types. I know my oberon isn't your standard type but I go after alt style builds. If curious about the synergy and loop I can show you ingame just add me. *tho give a heads up why* :P ... Essentially I have an oberon that can sit at 0-1 hp comfortably when getting pounded. Still can die easily from eximus if caught off guard, Plus due to the changes of eximus over time but that is gladly accepted. Then again I've used hunter's adrenaline for years since release since I happen to like taking damage to then eventually counter back in most of my builds.

[Kuwagata]

2 minutes ago, Hercam-Prime said:

people complaining because OH NO I CAN'T KILL ENEMIES THROUGH WALLS 200FT AWAY OH THE HORROR.They don't want to move in a game where movement is one of its biggest advantages over other games. Although I'm still upset how they handled the Nezha augment nerf

Oh so it's only upsetting when it's with a frame you like/play? Cool. 

[HerordikCZE]

Does the rage and hunter mods energy Regen include Kullervo?

[DanteAmerigo]

Hi, i almost never use the forums.. But this time it feels necessary. I have played your game since launch on pc and migrated to Xbox when it was available, so I have been here for all the up's and down's. This event by far takes the cake for complete disregard of your majority player base. I bought Dante to support you guys (DE) and i put 5 forma (1 Umbra) and 5 shards to make him a power house. All in the first day, then within a week or two of release you destroy him after im sure thousands of players spent real money and resources on him. The only adjustments that needed to be made was the ability to give others overguard. You took that feedback and destroyed a brand new warframe that you have been hyping up for months. Most people like overguard and the little bit more survivability it gives you in endgame missions. Wasn't he made with that in mind to rule cavia missions and deep arcamedia? The frame is now useless even with casting speed increase, to prevent instant death you just end up in a spam cast loop of 2,2,3 because now even with 400 ps you still get moot for overguard. And now you cant even nuke the enemies trying to kill you so you end up in the mindset of "oh okay, here's another useless frame I spent energy on that will just sit in my arsenal." Do indulge us with the logic of the LOS implementation that has never and will never work. Have you guys even play tested LOS bullet jumping through a confined area or on any smaller infested tileset. Los is a joke. Saryna nukes entire maps along with many other frames through walls or any environment for that matter. Why is Dante any different? Just revert the los change and work on his overguard. If people see his OG as an issue than make it so only hegets over guard or fix the underlying issue that individual Warframepowers don't work through OG. Remove Los on Dante or give me back my $15 USD and my 4 forma and 1 umbral forma. 

[Ellniko75]

Well, I guess there's no budging. You guys are always so so so afraid of nerfing damage, you always have to slap things like line of sight or unconveniences that make the warframe more boring and tedious to be played. Good update for 2 days I guess.

[ShaloomHD]

4 minutes ago, HerordikCZE said:

Does the rage and hunter mods energy Regen include Kullervo?

think so has he dont have shields

[Noctly]

Just revert all the changes made to Dante, he didn't need any of the nerfs. Every thread about this just ends up being 10-20+ pages of people telling you they want LOS removed. 

Even his overguard wasn't a problem, it melts in any content past star chart levels. The only issue he had was with Chroma and Rage/Hunter Adrenaline, which you just fixed. So revert him to his release state, which was fun, strong (but not overly so), and felt fun to play. 

[Siic07]

DE was known for listening to its community and thinking about its players.

There are more than 500 comments asking them to remove Los of Dante.

And they won't say anything about it?

 

 

[AHendy]

Even with the new line of sight upgrades it still just feels bad.  There’s an enemy a floor below me 10m away on a heavily obstructed hive map, I can’t hit him.  It’s just frustrating and unfun mechanics.  Please play the frame and see for yourself.

[Muevelosbbh]

Just gonna ignore Nezha though? Okay 

[AwwHeckASnek]

Changes are marginally better but still wildly inconsistent, LoS is not and never has been a fun mechanic to work around due to how tilesets are constructed and elevation, cover, and clutter are handled.

Remove LoS check from Dante, it does nothing but make him feel inconsistent, especially against enemies behind the camera. He was not in a place of power that was anywhere out of line compared to other more dominant damaging frames.

[Siic07]

Just now, AwwHeckASnek said:

Changes are marginally better but still wildly inconsistent, LoS is not and never has been a fun mechanic to work around due to how tilesets are constructed and elevation, cover, and clutter are handled.

Remove LoS check from Dante, it does nothing but make him feel inconsistent, especially against enemies behind the camera. He was not in a place of power that was anywhere out of line compared to other more dominant damaging frames.

Exactly it's horrible to play with him like that

[Rawbeard]

2 hours ago, [DE]Momaw said:

Following the very positive launch of Dante Unbound

so why did you guys decide to break the things that created the very positive reaction?

[AEXir0]

Imo Tragedy having line of sight is still a major downgrade. If disruptive/afk like spam is supposed to be countered, I think removing Tragedy's self damage is better, make it only deal damage theough actual status effects would be a good enough change, this makes Tragey more comfortable to use and more on line with his kit about priming enemies eith bleed and so on before deliverying a big nuke of 3-3-4 

Edited April 5 by AEXir0

[Bodusk]

Any plans on changing the nezha augment? Like maybe lowering the status damage instead of cutting the range in half? Or even capping how many statuses are spread? Because it is pretty rough. You can build for a ton of range and still be under 30 m. Doesn't really make a lot of sense when frames like saryn can DPS at large ranges.

[DraganotheDragonKing]

This update actually made me want to uninstall the game these nerfs were far too heavy handed and the wrong things. Dante should have reduced Overguard on allies and if you want to reduce his personal generation these were too much in my opinion and should be bumped back up a bit. Remove line of sight entirely it has always been a problem for the team and unwanted by the community it ruins many things and angers a lot of players and is not inherently a problem in higher levels of play which these kinds of decisions should be based on. The Arca Titron nerfs were unnecessary oh no the weapon was hitting billions of damage that required a build up I see no problem with that if it did with no set up I could understand and then get those numbers with after nerf with set up would be fine but the hammer relies on building the slam capacitor passive for a big payoff then you have to build it back up the whole point of endgame builds is pushing weapons to try and reach that sweet damage cap. The QOL changes to it though were very welcomed losing stacks on normal combos was annoying. The Nezha nerf also seems a bit heavy handed and should be reeled back a bit. This is long enough so lastly the enemy Overguard CC changes are extremely disappointing you do remember there are frames in this game that rely or revolve around CC right? Enemy Overguard is too strong and over tuned if anything it needs nerfed not more buffs I feel sorry for anyone who mains Nyx if they even exist anymore.