An Open Letter To De From Your Veterans (The megathread)

[Jithvan]

I also Agree with everything you stated above *Salutes*

You have my support!

~ Jithvan (Closed Beta Player) (Founder of the Uber Falcons Clan)

[waaaaaaaals]

Ah man this reminds me of one MD mission where a group of grineer  we're just standing in front of the terminal. They didn't even try to attack it.

I will add the screenshot to this post when I find it.

 

Found the picture! They were just standing there doing nothing until Nova erased them.

 

Sticking to the same theme, I've got a bunch of these screenshots where the Grineer make peace with the Tenno and take up arms agains their real enemies; the walls.

 

[Bazools]

Ships have airlock, but maybe more will be added in a future update?

AI has been getting better every major update...especially infested.

Ships have airlocks? So... That blue portal gate thing is a airlock!? What does that have anyting to do with the discussion  and don't tell me its added content cause it isn't! I call it lazyness in level design or a major flaw in creativity!

 

AI is been getting even worse if that is even possible...AI was the first major flaw i noticed in this game when i began playing! 

 

I'm curious, 

either u really don't have the past knowledge about this game's past or u really delusional when it comes to Warframe. 

Imo u should be more demanding of the quality a game has, by saying that everything is fine and by not openning your eyes to the issues at hand u are not helping at all with the betterment of this game. 

Edited January 17, 2014 by Bazools

[Eremes]

Ah man this reminds me of one MD mission where a group of grineer  we're just standing in front of the terminal. They didn't even try to attack it.

I will add the screenshot to this post when I find it.

 

Found the picture! They were just standing there doing nothing until Nova erased them.

--SNIPS--

i have had already taken notice that the enemies spawned lose their headings once the objective changes.

 

when you are running a MD and one of the consoles is done, if you leave quickly and not clean the enemies the previously spawned enemies will still clog the console doing nothing, even long after any other console or pod finished defending.

 

its uncredibly more frustating when you notice the spawn rate decreased because the previous consoles had gathered spawns that arent respawning.

[Bazools]

Your opinion is that leaderboards are a joke. My opinion is that they are not. Knowledge is power, yes. And you seem to have the ability to make it a personal attack only a sentence before by stating 'If you think, you are x or x'.

 

Back to watching toriko for now!

Thank god... dude was really starting to... me off

[Eremes]

Sticking to the same theme, I've got a bunch of these screenshots where the Grineer make peace with the Tenno and take up arms agains their real enemies; the walls.

--SNOP--

it reminds me why noone likes nekros's signature skill, his minions are deaf, dumb and shoot at ghosts, working at best as cannon fodder, even despite being one of the very few skills in game that can both give cover, scale with the enemy level and provide some utility.

[GleamingEye]

it reminds me why noone likes nekros's signature skill, his minions are deaf, dumb and shoot at ghosts, working at best as cannon fodder, even despite being one of the very few skills in game that can both give cover, scale with the enemy level and provide some utility.

 

They also reduce enemy spawn rate, I hear.

 

 

 

i have had already taken notice that the enemies spawned lose their headings once the objective changes.

 

when you are running a MD and one of the consoles is done, if you leave quickly and not clean the enemies the previously spawned enemies will still clog the console doing nothing, even long after any other console or pod finished defending.

 

its uncredibly more frustating when you notice the spawn rate decreased because the previous consoles had gathered spawns that arent respawning.

 

Loki disarm does similar things, since it completely erases AI and replaces it with a really bad melee only AI that cant even use active abilitys (only passives like shield drones).

 

But thats besides the point, the point being that it also resets their detection of the players, making them just stand there if they can not directly see you after you finish casting making you have to go "collect them" or just kill them right there, like you ware some kind of sheep herder and not actually playing a survival mission where the enemies are ment to be the difficulty not the (completely RNG based and seemingly buggish depending on player numbers) air supply.

[-XeqtR]

The problem is, if it is provenly so that neither Defense nor Survival are a matter of skill/tactics, but repeating the same thing until your hardware gives out ... how can you think that leaderboards have merit, unless you do not know these things? No one gets congratulated for being able to put on pants every day, or for being able to write their name if they passed elementary school. Saying that either of those are hard ... because you are the best at it ... isn't really an argument. You may have that opinion. It is borne from either willing or unconquered ignorance. I am not saying your are lacking the intelligence, Shibbo.

I am just saying that you either don't know how (which makes you less knowledgeable) or you do and try to inflate your skill (which is overexagerating your abilities). I'd never claim it was hard to get to wave 80 with Frost on Infested Def. It was boring and took a lot of time. And I am aware that people get there and beyond with a lot of effort. I just know that this effort is not required. The knowledge about the game transcends the skill ceiling by far.

Makes sense?

I just know that no leaderboard in this game holds up to anyone who wants to top it. It's pointless. It's a competition in sitting at your PC.

Awesome, wave 80 on infested, that's hard. I find you are speaking about a subject of which you have no experience in, which is baffling to say the least. You claim to know so much about endless defense and survival missions, yet your only accomplishments are one hour survivals, and presumably a wave 80 defense. Just because you leave at the one hour mark of a survival and have a lot of oxygen left, does not mean you would be able to sustain that same level for hours on end. Regardless of you being a former forum moderator, that does not make you the all-knowing veteran of Warframe.

 

Much more goes into the skill of going to a high endless defense or survival than just sitting for a long time (Warframe composition makeup, strategies, team synergy and coordination, focus for extended periods of time, consistent killing rate in survival, etc)

Edited January 17, 2014 by -XeqtR
keep it civil

[f3llyn]

I'm only giving another side of the coin where it needs to shine. The AI is getting better, never said it was perfect.

 

Yeah...I'm pretty sure the AI hasn't changed for most enemies in the entire last year.

[LikeABawsh]

A veteran player of 300+ hours of playing totally agrees with everything in this post.

+1 for you, good sir.

 

 

 

-LikeABawsh, General of NiceClan

[KONAir]

If you cannot seem to understand that much more goes into the skill of going to a high endless defense or survival than just sitting for a long time (Warframe composition makeup, strategies, team synergy and coordination, focus for extended periods of time, consistent killing rate in survival, etc) then you obviously do not know anything and inherently are the ignorant one.

 

Wave 80 or any other pointlessly big Wave number is not hard.

There are two conditions render going on for that long meaningless;

First- You have a cookie cutter team, Wave 87897 is as hard as Wave 1. It becomes a test of endurance not skill.

Second- You don't have a cookie cutter team, Wave 87897 mobs one shot the defence target even if do you crazay acrobatics and dodge every bullet/blow.

Edited January 17, 2014 by KONAir

[Ced23Ric]

If you cannot seem to understand that much more goes into the skill of going to a high endless defense or survival than just sitting for a long time (Warframe composition makeup, strategies, team synergy and coordination, focus for extended periods of time, consistent killing rate in survival, etc) then you obviously do not know anything and inherently are the ignorant one.

 

Wait, so there's someone saying: "But it's hard and we were good, hence we got it done!" and that proofs him to be experienced, and when someone else says "Actually, it's really easy, you can just stay in one place and press some buttons, it just takes forever." ... he is ignorant and spews nonsense?

Okay. :)

 

Trust me, I am not one to make claims I don't know about. I do speak from knowledge or I keep my mouth shut, because I like to know what I am talking about. Educating myself, dissecting engines, etc. is a hobby. You don't need deep tactics to go forever in Survival. I am sorry if you think of Trinity/Nekros/Nova/Any other DD as a pinnacle of secret "Warframe Composition Makeup", which is incidientially the same as "team synergy and coordination" and "strategies".  There is no magic involved. You might want to reference back to what I wrote earlier: "... or you do [know] and try to inflate your skill (which is overexagerating your abilities)" You seem to be of the latter half. You are selling brainless repetition of Blessing, Desecrate, MPrime and AMD as a lot of fancy words that all mean the same.

I am sorry, but I understand quite well. And not just how endless runs work - but also how people like you try to sell their efforts in sitting in front of the same mission for hours as high levels of skill. Which is a joke. Which is why leaderboards a joke. Thanks for helping me to reiterate and illustrate my point, though.

 

Wave 80 or any other pointlessly big Wave number is not hard.

There are two conditions render going on for that long meaningless;

First- You have a cookie cutter team, Wave 87897 is as hard as Wave 1. It becomes a test of endurance not skill.

Second- You don't have a cookie cutter team, Wave 87897 mobs one shot the defence target even if do you crazay acrobatics and dodge every bullet/blow.

 

And that's the way the cookie crumbles.

Edited January 17, 2014 by Ced23Ric

[bejuizb]

Everyone, please don't resort to flaming one another. Lets all focus on the topic at hand: issues with the game. Lets try not to reduce this thread to a place where people attack one another. Stick to the facts, counter with facts.

[iBread]

Everyone, please don't resort to flaming one another. Lets all focus on the topic at hand: issues with the game. Lets try not to reduce this thread to a place where people attack one another. Stick to the facts, counter with facts.

But the problem is, there are always people who want to argue, and we cant avoid that...

there are always people who disagree with something then starts an argument, and there are always people who counter that "rejection of opinion", forums have always been like this since forever...

Edited January 17, 2014 by iBread

[LordofTibera]

I dont know what you guys classify as a "veteran" but ive been playing since U5 and i agree with many of this letter's points. You have my support.

*signed*

~LordofTibera, General of Clan Harakiri

[Sidathe]

Everyone, please don't resort to flaming one another. Lets all focus on the topic at hand: issues with the game. Lets try not to reduce this thread to a place where people attack one another. Stick to the facts, counter with facts.

It could be the argument has run out of facts to list, for now anyway. Eventually someone will find something to dissect and brutally deconstruct with a full list of reasons why it is the epitome of oblivion.

[-XeqtR]

Wait, so there's someone saying: "But it's hard and we were good, hence we got it done!" and that proofs him to be experienced, and when someone else says "Actually, it's really easy, you can just stay in one place and press some buttons, it just takes forever." ... he is ignorant and spews nonsense?

Okay. :)

 

Trust me, I am not one to make claims I don't know about. I do speak from knowledge or I keep my mouth shut, because I like to know what I am talking about. Educating myself, dissecting engines, etc. is a hobby. You don't need deep tactics to go forever in Survival. I am sorry if you think of Trinity/Nekros/Nova/Any other DD as a pinnacle of secret "Warframe Composition Makeup", which is incidientially the same as "team synergy and coordination" and "strategies".  There is no magic involved. You might want to reference back to what I wrote earlier: "... or you do [know] and try to inflate your skill (which is overexagerating your abilities)" You seem to be of the latter half. You are selling brainless repetition of Blessing, Desecrate, MPrime and AMD as a lot of fancy words that all mean the same.

I am sorry, but I understand quite well. And not just how endless runs work - but also how people like you try to sell their efforts in sitting in front of the same mission for hours as high levels of skill. Which is a joke. Which is why leaderboards a joke. Thanks for helping me to reiterate and illustrate my point, though.

 

 

And that's the way the cookie crumbles.

What a bold claim to say that you somehow know what composition my group uses (you're dead wrong and it's why we've never revealed such information). I think somehow you're still dead set on your little infested victory. Infested are the easiest enemy in the game. I will hands down agree with a Vauban that you can go to any wave and it will be repetitive like you say. Any other faction? No. Enemy levels get harder in survival, which brings the challenge of killing them with consistency. If you do not kill them at the same rate as the early levels, you end up getting less and less oxygen. I have done a survival for 7 hours and I can tell you from my experience that there were numerous times where we had thought we were going to lose and hung on just barely. How can you speculate difficulty when sitting down there at 1 hour?

 

As for your other statement about how those different things are the same, English must be your second language? Warframe composition would refer to which 4 frames you're bringing obviously. Synergy and Coordination are about how you as a team are able to communicate and work together to accomplish a goal. Strategy is how you and your team plan to execute a tactic to complete the mission (often has to do with placement).

 

Let's take for example the mindless task of a frost in a defense. You're saying that maintaining focus of keeping two frost globes up at intermittent times (rail-gun MOA's don't pierce it and intermittent so you never are without one) is a mindless task that would take no skill to do for 4+ hours? To maintain such focus and timing for that long is something I would applaud. *Applauds self*. Your opinion of mindless tasks is of something you have not even done. How about you keep your theories out of something I have factual knowledge (experience) of and I'll keep my theories about your intelligence out of it. You don't need to drop in "dissecting car engines" as a way to prove yourself; please, it's pathetic how hard you're trying.

[Letter13]

Keep it civil everyone.

Edit: Also keep it on-topic. Don't derail.

Edited January 17, 2014 by Letter13

[se05239]

DE's overall lack of progress kinda reminded me that the "drop-down-from-vent" intro is still the exact same one they had back when there was only Excalibur without abilities.. shown during that livestream where they looked back on how Warframe has evolved.

[KONAir]

You're saying that maintaining focus of keeping two frost globes up at intermittent times (rail-gun MOA's don't pierce it and intermittent so you never are without one) is a mindless task that would take no skill to do for 4+ hours?

 

This is the very definition of mindless task that can and should be automated via one of many macroing tools.

[Ced23Ric]

What a bold claim to say that you somehow know what composition my group uses.

 

I never said that's your line-up. But that's okay. Let's say you are a genius that has access to strategies eclipsing mere mortals. You are still off-topic, and still do not contribute to anything to the discussion. It doesn't really matter, in the end.

Edited January 17, 2014 by Letter13
removing off topic

[-XeqtR]

I never said that's your line-up. But that's okay. Let's say you are a genius that has access to strategies eclipsing mere mortals. You are still off-topic, and still do not contribute to anything to the discussion. It doesn't really matter, in the end.

Haha I'll admit the "access to strategies eclipsing mere mortals" part had me laughing pretty hard. Also, it's pretty hypocritical to make that claim when my off-topic posts are in response to your off-topic posts.

[MDRLOz]

It saddens me to see peoples only debating skill is "your wrong and do not understand because x,y and z". Try to understand the other viewpoints. Like a couple of pages ago we had someone say that they were happy with how the game is at present and what is just around the corner. This was then quoted a few times and people attacked the opinion maker. Instead why not ask what was their favourite things in game at present, then explain to them how it could be improved or show them someone's improved concept for that game area. Then see what they think. 

 

What I really think we are in DIRE need of right now is a Grineers Developers workshop post to outline stuff going on and what is next. I really feel that is a massively under utilised feature of these forums and goes far to long without posts. A weekly post in there even if only minor stuff had changed would alleviate a lot of this anger. Last post was December 12th.

 

Same goes for a community forum hot topic thread. Some months get 3 or 4 but we only got one in December and one so far in January. 

 

Really feels DE is distancing itself and hiding away.

Edited January 17, 2014 by MDRLOz

[Bazools]

I for one can't seem to understand why people would go for doing a mission (survival or defense) for more than 1 hour to be honest! Is that what Warframe is an endurance test? (well thats what DE made the game become) I for once find it an appalling thought!

I do not play to brag and to show the world that either i can do a 7 hour run or whatever. To be humble is to keep your accomplishments to oneself, that is what it means to be great imo (if one is meant to be recognized for those same accomplishements then ones peers will do so, no need for advertisement), there is no need to arise monuments for the world to see (that's what being great means to me).

 

I don't care about leaderboards all together, they do not bring me either satisfaction or a sense of power but for some having their name on top and a badge for most kills it is the high of their gaming experience (give me some swag, a fluffy Rhino or Excal some t-shirts and i'll think about it). 

 

I do care about a solid and well structured and fun gaming experience (not endurance tests, i'm no hamster on a trainning wheel!) and a development team that keeps their word and listens to their community, not only when threads like this, which i support, come up but that listen and give feedback on a regular fashion (developers workshop as it should exist). This game is lacking in all that has been stated on the original open letters.

 

So please guys please refrain from posting your achievements and lets get back on topic. 

Edited January 17, 2014 by Bazools

[-XeqtR]

I for one can't seem to understand why people would go for doing a mission (survival or defense) for more than 1 hour to be honest! Is that what Warframe is an endurance test? (well thats what DE made the game become) I for once find it an appalling thought!

I do not play to brag and to show the world that either i can do a 7 hour run or whatever. To be humble is to keep your accomplishments to oneself, that is what it means to be great imo (if one is meant to be recognized for those same accomplishements then ones peers will do so, no need for advertisement), there is no need to arise monuments for the world to see (that's what being great means to me).

 

I don't care about leaderboards all together, they do not bring me either satisfaction or a sense of power but for some having their name on top and a badge for most kills it is the high of their gaming experience (give me some swag, a fluffy Rhino or Excal some t-shirts and i'll think about it). 

 

I do care about a solid and well structured and fun gaming experience (not endurance tests, i'm no hamster on a trainning wheel!) and a development team that keeps their word and listens to their community, not only when threads like this, which i support, come up but that listen and give feedback on a regular fashion (developers workshop as it should exist). This game is lacking in all that has been stated on the original open letters.

 

So please guys please refrain from posting your achievements and lets get back on topic. 

Sorry that you misunderstood me. I was definitely not using my mention of a 7 hour survival as a way to brag but to prove my point in experience. As for the rest of what you said the difference is that for a casual gamer those are all that's needed to stay satisfied. I am a competitive hardcore gamer, and without a sort of ego bashing or what have you, games are boring. If only there was a real pvp system, I would have much more competitive fun. 

I respect your views and opinions and I thank you for making a constructive post that does not personally attack someone.