The Eviscerators Megathread

[Armanant]

Not sure if it has been suggested yet, but how about making bleed procs only have a chance of happening if heath is actually damaged by the triggering hit? This would make it weaker against heavily shielded enemies (which seems fine tbh) and also far weaker against tenno, as pretty much all tenno have good shields anyway (except Valkyr I guess, but she's got invincibility and vamp anyway).

 

To be honest I think this could probably apply to all status effects that directly affect hp or armor, so .. viral and corrosive too? Maybe you could argue that the virus/acid isn't stopped by the shield. However slash in particular seems like it really shouldn't proc unless it did health damage (oh noes you slashed me with a sword! I didn't actually get cut or anything as my forcefield blocked it, but now I'm bleeding! uhh.. don't ask from where, it's messy!).

[Deidaku]

Continued feedback/reports of just how big an issue this is is much appreciated. Relayed possible solutions and implications for players (new and old) on the current way Eviscerators work!

Erm another thing Rebecca ; I don't know of the art team is working on something similar but pleeease her me out

 

Currently tenno bleed though their suits, which doesn't make any sense 

So why not have the suits damaged /torn in some places when receiving  direct  health damage ? The armor would repair itself erate if you heal with a skill or item (after all it is a modified virus suit)

 

i.e shields are down , iron skin down,  tenno gets hit armors is gets damaged according to the percentage of health left 

[Hybridon]

Continued feedback/reports of just how big an issue this is is much appreciated. Relayed possible solutions and implications for players (new and old) on the current way Eviscerators work!

 

Not to sound like a prick, but this issue has been around and a concern since the Cicero Crisis... thats over 2 months and not a single change, it actually gets only worse as we have invasions with them spawning a lot, and Earth a low leveled planet that means nothing, cause they down you with 1 or 2 procs, depending on the frame.

 

This issue has to be fixed as soon as possible, at least it should already had been toned down for the meantime, until a permanent and satisfying fix comes.

[Kiyryite]

Procs are mostly a problem if you have low health

You people awalys build yourselves for the enemy you fight so swap redirection for vitality when up against grineer because as I've seen their weapons tend to have high impact (good against shields) or slash ( which bypasses shields and slowly bleeds health away on proc).

Personally I haven't really had much trouble dealing with eviserators since I used high shields rather than health(use vitality now instead of redirection since damage 2.0 came out) and I've notice on missions of medium to high tier grineer missions that at least one of my team mates are often killed or down by an eviscerator or heavy gunner and that seems to be the person with slow health (and if your wondering you cans see a player's health and shields by simply pressing 'Z' on the keyboard).

I don't want to see a challenging enemy be nerfed because some people didn't have the common sense or just couldn't handle it.

So no to be rude but... STOP WHINNING!!!!!! ---___---

The eviscerators teachs us a valuable lesson: Remember kiddos your warframe is your GREATEST asset if you can give your gun regular maintainance why not your warframe?

Edited February 13, 2014 by Kiyryite

[Redlove108]

I haven't had trouble with them but then I'm a Rhino most of the time.

 

 

No but seriously, I run around with a shotgun and tend to eat saws to the face half the time when I go to take one of these guys down. The bleed doesn't seem so bad, but then I also have 680 vitality. It is true that there are many, many frames I see which are rather squishy. Low HP or hell default HP values with no buffs whatsoever and they jump into mission where mobs are lvl 30 or higher.

 

Maybe these Eviscerators are teaching us to not be so one dimensional in our builds.

[Kiyryite]

EXACTlY!!!

Think about it people most proc either bypass or just render shields useless while only removing debuffing or slightly damaging health, meaning in a situation against another player or an advanced enemy (stalker, hyena, evsics, ancients, lephantis and etc..) high health is much better than high shields, because while health is effected by Procs the higher the more health the more elemantals damage you can take but all procs but magnetic ( which will instantly reduce your shields to approximately 75% anyway) will bypass your shields the rendering them useless against defending your self against procs.

Edited February 13, 2014 by Kiyryite

[Hadronox]

This is currently an issue for me. I do like a challenge, but Evis damage that bypasses shields is truly broken. I feel extremely vulnerable when encountering them, and unless I am playing my Rhino or some other very tanky frame, I often die repeatedly to them.

 

I once ran into a room with multiple Evis and, in an instant, my whole group was on the ground. It was both funny and sad, and I remember we tried to revive several times only to die instantly. And this type of thing happens a lot. Also, trying to use med kits is useless since their heal procs are way slower than the bleed proc.

Edited February 13, 2014 by Hadronox

[Kiyryite]

WHAT DIDI SAY!!!!!!!!!

Use vitality their proc doesn't last long enough to remove all you health with even a 75% to max vitality.

Did you even properly read my post?!?!?!?

and trust me if your armor is more than 15-30 the raw slash damage is a much bigger problem than the proc actually is, even with multiple eviscerators I'm the area, and if you were an light warframe (nyx, loki, nova, and etc) obviously you will die fast those that is why those type of warframes are so fast and remember to take cover when using and Non-tank warframe.

Am I surrounded by noobs? ---___--- ( please tell me I'm not)

Edited February 13, 2014 by Kiyryite

[WSkD]

I do not know~ I get killed quite easily by eviscerators, using any 100 base-health frame with Vitality and Vigor mods.

I think they are a bit to strong or at least their bleed proc. (100 base-health because I mainly use Frost and Valkyr)

[tmtke]

I don't want to see a challenging enemy be nerfed because some people didn't have the common sense or just couldn't handle it.

So no to be rude but... STOP WHINNING!!!!!! ---___---

The eviscerators teachs us a valuable lesson: Remember kiddos your warframe is your GREATEST asset if you can give your gun regular maintainance why not your warframe?

Please read the whole thread before posting. For a while we were talking about how hard earth is to new players who are without high level mods and equipment. With my fully loaded frames I can easily say the same, lot's of us have tried out earth maps without strong frames, and the result is devastating.

[Kiyryite]

But when you reach level 30 with maxed vitality and vigor your health will be 840 (or around that) and with the base armor of Valkyr and frost their blades should be doing relatively mediocre damage until endgame where they will do around medium to high damage

But if a Valkyr has maxed vitality and steel fibre they should be doing relatively NOTHING unless the damage tables have changed again.

And I've used my new zephyr on earth with my other new gear not maxed or even half levelled and I went in with a maxed vitality and I didn't have anyroblems with those eviscerators

Edited February 13, 2014 by Kiyryite

[WSkD]

Problem is slash ignores armour (at least this is my experience and it is stated on the wikia) -> my Valkyr has somewhat around 1900 armour and ~800 health and I get killed like... THIS. 

 

I have to admit that this only happens (that I get killed) when there are many evis and/ or they make a surprise party behind a doorway or so.

[DoniSWhite]

Hi, Only read the first page so i apologize if what i've said has been noted.

I agree they are terrible, However i like them as much as i like the new leaders. Then again I also loved nemesis mods in PoE (Kinda hope the keep them like they did rogues). WHY? Honestly how much time do you spend paying attention to what's going on, instead of just running around clicking. These guys hurt, ALLOT, but their projectiles are slow, and their aim is based only on your assumed position when it was fired.

I've toe to toe these guys, what i've found to be the most effective means of dealing with 3+... is dancing :P. Seriously though move like your in the crosshair's of a sniper, and they'll miss every shot. 

Mob's like these though need to exsist, just as badly as Corrupting Blood needed to in PoE. Without them, the game is easily returned to just a mindless run and gun with little disregard to enemies.

Edited February 14, 2014 by Letter13
Let's try to avoid inappropriate language, yes?

[Kiyryite]

Exactly, many and with enough numbers any enemy can overrun and kill you ( except if you have a powerful crowd control ).

And no slash does not ignore armor.

[XenosInfinity]

But when you reach level 30 with maxed vitality and vigor your health will be 840 (or around that) and with the base armor of Valkyr and frost their blades should be doing relatively mediocre damage until endgame where they will do around medium to high damage

But if a Valkyr has maxed vitality and steel fibre they should be doing relatively NOTHING unless the damage tables have changed again.

And I've used my new zephyr on earth with my other new gear not maxed or even half levelled and I went in with a maxed vitality and I didn't have anyroblems with those eviscerators

Realistically, it's impractical to use both Vitality and Vigor on most frames if you want to get the most out of their abilities. Armor makes no difference to bleed damage and never has (my Frost Prime with rejuvenation dies just as quickly as anyone else because the aura doesn't run whilst taking health damage). The blades themselves might not do a particularly large amount of damage but the bleed doesn't scale with the hit damage.

I find Eviscerators are more of a problem at higher levels, but I haven't run through Earth for ages because I can use higher-level missions where I don't have to fight Grineer at all.

[Kiyryite]

See just think, use common sense and maybe some strategy and eviscerators are a piece of cake

To be honest I never use vitality and vigor at the same time because the eviscerators aren't that bad even on higher levels and if the hit you just run to cover or just move fast and not aim down while fighting ( because they'll frequently if your not walking, still or running in a relatively straight line) them and you ll see they ain't so tough.

Edited February 13, 2014 by Kiyryite

[Shiniko]

My idea is that Eviscerators are buffed.

And then turned into Leaders alongside Machine Gunners.

[Kiyryite]

So your theory is that a player new to the game (We're discussing earth, here) should just "deal with it" and become "strategists" with their Mk1 Bratons and limited access to mods?

Interesting.

Really glad I started the game before 12.0 because if I had been a noob now, and Cambria is what it is, now -- I would've likely quit, honestly.

Cambria is the one place that allowed new players to farm mods while actually leveling frames/weapons etc.

You've now added an enemy and immediately say, "strategically plan your assault or die".

There's a difference between challenging and so hard it's stupid -- I hate to break it to you but, most NEW players I talk to, believe the latter...I agree w/them.

By the time you can target the Eviscerator in earth at 5 minutes, you have EVERYTHING ELSE, coming down on you...And you don't have a Soma, you don't have max mods, you have a Mk1 Braton and maybe 4 mods -- Hardly enough to actually survive...The best strategy in that situation: Skip Earth or get piggied through it, entirely.

The strategies thing is actually good because when they reach high tier even with good gear if they think they can just run head first in they have another thing coming

and at least this promotes more team work something warframe needs badly

Edited February 13, 2014 by Kiyryite

[Prios]

I'm... really mystified. I went out solo into the field--Earth, to be precise--to see for myself what the deal was with these supposedly broken eviscerators. For protection I brought a vigor mod, excalibur prime (don't have the original excalibur anymore, sorry about that), no vitality, no redirection, no iron skin, no steel fiber, no rush, and for a weapon, my newly-made unranked and unmodded Braton Prime.

 

My experience was just about exactly the opposite of every other post in this thread. I'd see an eviscerator two or three times a level. I circle strafed around him from about 20 meters away or so, close enough to land shots on his upper torso without much trouble. One of them hit me once--I got cocky and stupid, and was only 5 meters away from him when I rushed out into the open, so the first shot clipped across my back--but the result was the same: unmodded Braton Prime goes bangy bangy bangy, eviscerator drops dead after a second or two. Heavies they are not. You'd think they'd make these guys tougher, with such powerful and strategically useful weapons that force Tenno to stay on the move.

 

Groups of eviscerators can't track a circle-strafing Tenno any better than a single one can, so... just a matter of time.

 

The other enemies, though, were surprisingly annoying and frustrating. Lots of hitscan weapons blazing away at me and stripping away my existence points pretty fast unless I squatted obstinately behind cover. Getting caught in the open or trying to do fancy stuff was VERY dangerous. I died a couple times because one lancer too many got a bead on me for one second too long. Many times I outright cheated by crushing lancers with my damage-mod-boosted Jat Kittag instead of relying on the Braton Prime, because it was just too slow and too risky to shoot a squad down one mook at a time.

 

There is no option to dodge hitscan. You either get behind cover, or you have superior power, or you just die. And the hitscan weapons cause bleed procs!!! Why aren't people complaining about hitscan, if they're going to complain about eviscerators? O_o

 

I feel like I'm in the Twilight Zone here. I really, really do. Is everyone seriously so brainwashed by the ubiquitous cover shooters that nobody knows how to circle-strafe anymore? Do we need to display a little hint on death saying "Run left or right in front of eviscerators to avoid their deadly projectiles, and return fire while moving!" Does anyone even know what the heck I'm talking about when I say "circle-strafe"? Is circle-strafing the cassette tape of shooters now? Am I that old? What the heck people. Back in my day we didn't even use cover, we didn't even use mice even, we just ran around and fought against gigantic dual-rocket-launcher-wielding cyberdemons using the keyboard and we liked it. You young people are all soft. Get me my prune juice.

Edited February 13, 2014 by Prios

[Wahooo]

I've toe to toe these guys, what i've found to be the most effective means of dealing with 3+... is dancing :P. Seriously though move like your in the crosshair's of a sniper, and they'll miss every shot. 

Though I agree with you on the way to deal with eviscorators 100%.  All I could think when I read this comment:

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdaQHTWT_ZI

[DoniSWhite]

I agree forcing new players to deal with high risk mobs early on, is good, if not great, at creating good habbits. I'll admit for myself it wasn't until nightmare mode that i actually stopped playing the game running blindly into enemy fire and shooting everything, I use to fear rolling no health, now I just take myself, use cover, and always prioritize target. The truth is, early on, you can very easily get away with run and gun. If eviscerators teach players to prioritize targets, and take cover, then this will make them more useful players when they hit nightmare, and high level defense/survival later on.

[Ninja234War]

Eviscrerators are way too crazy, I have played with new players, they keep dying because of all the insane eviscrerators.

[Prios]

In case it wasn't clear from my tl;dr post above, I am firmly in the LEAVE EVISCERATORS ALONE camp. They are an enemy that is very dangerous and scary when you haven't figured them out, but merely a tactical consideration at worst once you have. They're a sort of puzzle to solve. They're interesting. Combat in Warframe needs to be more interesting, less mindlessly grindy, not the other way around.

 

How many new players would soon end up quitting Warframe out of boredom if they weren't able to face the initially-frustrating eviscerators? Maybe adding another route out of Venus would be a good idea, sure. But a lot of people are excited and intruiged by (seemingly) tough challenges.

[Neutralred]

How many new players would soon end up quitting Warframe out of boredom if they weren't able to face the initially-frustrating eviscerators? Maybe adding another route out of Venus would be a good idea, sure. But a lot of people are excited and intruiged by (seemingly) tough challenges.

Except that if you read back in the thread, we've got the opposite problem... it's exceedingly difficult to convince new players to continue once they hit the brick wall that is Earth. Eviscerators may be fine at higher level, but their one-shot procs on low level frames are inexcusable as early as this.

 

Being one-shot by an uncounterable attack bypassing your shields is a boss-level ability. What makes it balanced on relatively common mobs found in groups and with packs?

[Onisa]

@Prios

It's good that you had that much room to maneuver without being against a wall, since Miter blades bounce.

And it's when you have 6-10 blades bouncing around a small room that things get hairy.