Brainsworth Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Alright I have always had Loki and I will admit I do love him but I never could wrap my head around why people say he needs his speed cause that is what makes him great. It does not make any sense to me because I can just cloak myself and walk through entire levels with out detection from enemys and wipe them out that way and if I get into trouble I can use my decoy or my disarm for lawls. His speed is nice to have I will admit that but whens it comes down to who Loki is you really do not need his speed to use him. Heck you could bring his speed down 1.15 and he still be the trickster of the map. Before people jump all over me about the speed go play a frame with the same speed of 1.15 and they are still quite fast. Lastly this is my opinion and ask people respect that instead of raging at me for my opinion and everyone is entitled to there opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brimir Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 It is more than just gameplay; it fits his theme/concept. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MegaSnail Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brainsworth Posted February 16, 2014 Author Share Posted February 16, 2014 It is more than just gameplay; it fits his theme/concept. I can understand that but I have had a good amount of debates with people about it and they always say that if he lost his speed he be useless and it dumbfounds me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casardis Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 He won't lose his trickster abilities, of course. It's just a matter of how his speed actually compliments his playstyle. By being fast like he is, when invisible he can either escape or get close to enemies much faster than most frames. Not sure if he NEEDS the speed, but it sure is a good addition to his arsenal IMO. Whether he needs it or not, it's one of the main fun factor that people find on Loki, so that's a good point to have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sewens Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 (edited) You don't ''need'' speed for loki. You also don't "need" any mods. Speed makes you better at avoiding damage and is compensation for low shields, health, and armor. You can take it or leave it but it's not a necessary advantage like all mods. Edited February 16, 2014 by sewens Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoboDoge Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 (edited) Problem with Loki is that you have to move around if you want to survive. Melee on toxics over level 90 is half suicide, and if you are kissed by anything that can drain energy you are pretty doomed. I dont use Vitality on my Loki and i dont rely on Invisibility that much because i tend to use Loki for RD. Having 213 health on level 30 isnt much, and every attack that bypasses your shields is almost certain death. Edited February 16, 2014 by RoboDoge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archistopheles Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Make every frame 1.0 and let's all be boring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Pearl- Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 People say that he needs his speed due to those times when he isn't in invis. Survivability via never being hit due to running around the map like a chicken it's head cut off is very popular. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ttariel Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 GTG FST Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brainsworth Posted February 16, 2014 Author Share Posted February 16, 2014 (edited) People say that he needs his speed due to those times when he isn't in invis. Survivability via never being hit due to running around the map like a chicken it's head cut off is very popular. This is true however you can mod him to the point he never runs out of energy or his cloak it last a long time this goes for his decoy etc. All you need is continuity and constitution and your in business for his cloak and decoy. Lets add on flow,Streamline and Energy Syphon. Then lets work on his low shields and health ok so lets add Vigor and redirection and with this build his last two abilitys are still useful. Edited February 16, 2014 by Tailsy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThePresident777 Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Because the other Warframes are too slow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anatolius Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Make every frame 1.0 and let's all be boring. Loki with maxed rush has already spoiled me. Anything 1.0 and less is ungodly slow to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leorion Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Try not using Invisibility. He goes down so fast and him being slow and taking more hits won't help him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoboDoge Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Loki with maxed rush has already spoiled me. Anything 1.0 and less is ungodly slow to me Agree. Once you use some other frames that Loki ( 1.0> speed ), they all feel like they are towing Nuclear Submarine while running. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Temfist Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 (edited) Loki, as a team player, is all about creating slight distractions to help alleviate fire off the rest of the team, whilst you melee them with your stealth bonus damage. Loki's only move to get into CQC is his "Switch Teleport" when used on a crowd of enemies, but since none of the enemies are targeting you, a lot of them are moving around constantly and can be annoying to chase and beat down. If your not fast, you will need to resort to using weapons that have a large aoe knockdown on their jump attacks, and use CC to stop them, which is good for the team anyway, but for max DPS with Loki, you'll probably be doing heavy charge attacks, or light charge attacks. Loki can excel with weapons like Dakra Prime where you can just run around swinging wildly, but you'll run out of stamina and not catch up with infested if you do that, so it's situational I guess. melee characters like Ash and Loki need some movement speed to be effective in melee, otherwise, just stick to your guns. (IMO, if you primarily use guns, Loki is only gonna benefit you when your rushing through an objective that doesn't require you to kill or protect, and he might be nice in Survival until later waves, but you'll be risking too much if your trying to kill everything for extra life support. In most regards, Loki is extremely specialized, and is not as effective in certain mission types. Having a fast Loki makes him excel at his specialty more, rushing certain objectives.) Edited February 16, 2014 by Temphis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silraed Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 If you are not running a perma-invisibility build, because let's face it not everybody has the mods or likes that style, then his speed is his survivability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brainsworth Posted February 16, 2014 Author Share Posted February 16, 2014 (edited) Try not using Invisibility. He goes down so fast and him being slow and taking more hits won't help him. His cloak is his edge in the first place along with his other ability and he suffers for it by loosing his shield and health but keep in his mind he has a armor of 60 not 15 like most squishy frames. I have tired not useing his cloak at all with my build and I can still survive fine cause he still has his decoy and his lawl look you dropped your weapons and when it comes to running I do not need that extra speed i think he is fast as it is and I agree he is a team player Edited February 16, 2014 by Tailsy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mystokai Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Yet looking at Mass Destruction warframe called Nova with 1.20 Speed (2nd fastest right behind Loki), and that she have Wormhole which allows her to skip a lot of distance... hmmm Seems legit to me... Compared to her kit potential Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archistopheles Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 (edited) GTG FST Got to go Fist? Yet looking at Mass Destruction warframe called Nova with 1.20 Speed (2nd fastest right behind Loki), and that she have Wormhole which allows her to skip a lot of distance... hmmm Seems legit to me... Compared to her kit potential Ok. Nova has damage, damage, movement, and damage. Loki has Defense, Defense, Utility, and Utility. Seems fine to me. Edited February 16, 2014 by Archistopheles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fi5h Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Real loki's don't run across the map stealthed, they walk. dat username Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 I main Loki, even when he is not exactly the tankiest frame around. Why? Because I can quickly jump behind/between/from cover when the going gets tough. His speed fits his playstyle, it's made for agile players with quick reflexes. Damn, Exta can get me killed even in a tanky frame, but I never die there with Loki, even when my strategy to defeat Lech Kril involves getting into melee range with him all the time. Sometimes being a bullet sponge just doesn't cut it in this game, and that's when speedy frames like Loki truly shine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stormandreas Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 I can understand that but I have had a good amount of debates with people about it and they always say that if he lost his speed he be useless and it dumbfounds me. I agree with you. We should not have one frame that runs off away from every other. He would be fine having his speed at 1.15 He won't lose his trickster abilities, of course. It's just a matter of how his speed actually compliments his playstyle. By being fast like he is, when invisible he can either escape or get close to enemies much faster than most frames. Not sure if he NEEDS the speed, but it sure is a good addition to his arsenal IMO. Whether he needs it or not, it's one of the main fun factor that people find on Loki, so that's a good point to have. The frame that needs speed is Ash. His smokescreen has such a short time that HE is the one that needs the speed to run away. Loki doesn't Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nightrunner_ks Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 (edited) I can understand that but I have had a good amount of debates with people about it and they always say that if he lost his speed he be useless and it dumbfounds me. This is a ninja game. Slow ninjas get killed. Slow ninjas make for terrible characters. Slow ninjas ruin ninja games. This isn't ME3, if you want to hide behind cover and shoot things, go play ME3 MP. That still has better gameplay and melee combat than Warframe, which is hilarious. If you want to slow down any frame in this game, just shut the hell up. Edited February 16, 2014 by nightrunner_ks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archistopheles Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Slow ninjas get killed. Slow ninjas make for terrible characters. Slow ninjas ruin ninja games. Rhino with a hobble key is a celebrated in game feature and is somewhat required to get certain mods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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