Shotguns Incredibly Lackluster Now

[Bulletmachine]

Bump for buffs.

[(PSN)friedricetheman]

The Boar Prime is still viable for high level content if modded correctly.

I have been using it exclusively with my Rhino Prime.

Accelerated Blast is still needed on the Boar Prime for the fire rate increase. It makes the Boar a bullet hose.

You will need all damage mods at maxed for it too. Point Blank, Vicious Spread, Blaze.

Elemental Damage mods to make corrosive damage - Shell Shock and Toxic Barrage.

Rounding it off with R2 Shotgun Ammo Mutation and Maxed Hell's Chamber.

You can fit all that in with 2 forma's (both V polarity) and one potato.

And once you're done, it's a viable shotgun alternative for high level content.

[Edgedemon]

 all that means is that ALL. every. single. Physical Damge Mod is useless. there isn't a single one that's worth using now. ever. zero situations.

why are they even in the game now? why would you ever want to specialize in Physical Damage types when ANY Elemental Mod is infinitely more effective?

 

because they would multiply for any elemental mod you put in?

 

if you have 2 elemental mods each at +60% damage, and you increase 30% your physical damage, you will get 30% physical + 15% more for each elemental mod.

 

with 4 elementals picking the right physical damage mod means almost 100% more total damage, who would not want that?

[taiiat]

because they would multiply for any elemental mod you put in?

 

if you have 2 elemental mods each at +60% damage, and you increase 30% your physical damage, you will get 30% physical + 15% more for each elemental mod.

 

with 4 elementals picking the right physical damage mod means almost 100% more total damage, who would not want that?

if i have two things to choose from, 30% to one Physical Type based off of that Physical type, or 90% additional Damage of a fourth type on top of what i have already, which would i choose?

 

well, even if the Elemental type had a -50% modifier on the Enemy you're shooting, it would still add more Damage than the 30% Physical Mod does.

 

that's why they're useless.

 

Edit: f*cking autoformatting, sigh.

Edited April 8, 2014 by taiiat

[DoomFruit]

Shotties do need some attention (Im leaning towards crit chance and multiplier) but moaning about Accel Blast getting FIXED isnt doing your cause any justice. Depending on borderline sploits is never good.

It wasn't fixed, it was rendered defective. AB was the only useful physical damage mod in the game. Go on, try and add slash damage to your Bolto. Tell me how it goes, then add fire damage and see how that goes. Setting aside the massive disparity (30% slash vs. 90% fire), tell me which is more effective. Not a single one of my clanmates uses physical damage mods because they are utterly useless in comparison to elemental mods, rate of fire and ammo drum.

 

EDIT: or try adding slash damage to your Galatine. Molten Impact still gives you more damage output.

 

because they would multiply for any elemental mod you put in?

 

if you have 2 elemental mods each at +60% damage, and you increase 30% your physical damage, you will get 30% physical + 15% more for each elemental mod.

 

with 4 elementals picking the right physical damage mod means almost 100% more total damage, who would not want that?

Current physical mods don't add to the elemental damage. There's no reason why a correctly working physical damage mod would have to.

Edited April 8, 2014 by DoomFruit

[Mokkania]

Current physical mods don't add to the elemental damage. There's no reason why a correctly working physical damage mod would have to.

Hi, I know it's off topic but I've been curious about that since some other posts on builds are implying exactly what you said.

From what I read from a certain half reliable source, the elemental damage take the base damage so an image exemple :

 

your weapon is 100 puncture with serration, with piercing hit you get 130 puncture and with 2 imaginary elemental mod AB 100%  you get 130 puncture 130 element A 130 element B? But actually not?

[RealPandemonium]

The "fix" to accel blast along with the change to status and critical chance per pellet have indeed removed the leg that shotguns could stand on vs other weapon types.  Phage is currently the only shotgun that's super powerful and it's not even a shotgun.  On the other hand balancing weapons around overpowered options like the soma, boltor prime, and launchers is probably a bad idea.  I would welcome a nerf to the most powerful weapons along with tweaks to the damage system and enemy strength so that the game is easier for new players and harder for fully outfitted players overall.  

[00zau]

Hi, I know it's off topic but I've been curious about that since some other posts on builds are implying exactly what you said.

From what I read from a certain half reliable source, the elemental damage take the base damage so an image exemple :

 

your weapon is 100 puncture with serration, with piercing hit you get 130 puncture and with 2 imaginary elemental mod AB 100%  you get 130 puncture 130 element A 130 element B? But actually not?

 

IPS mods (like piercing hit) increase the damage type the effect by a percentage of that damage. This extra damage does not count as base damage for elemental mods.

 

Example (using simple numbers):

Base weapon deals 10i/10p/10s, and it's base damage is 30 (so 30 is the number that your elemental mods scale off of; adding 50% elemental damage will give you 15 damage)

Add in 100% serration, weapon now deals 20i/20p/20s, base damage is 60 (so a 50% elemental mod will give 30 damage)

If you add in a mod that increases your puncture by 50%, you now deal 20i/30p/20s, but your base damage remains 60; a 50% elemental mod will still only add 30 damage.

 

This is why the IPS mods are useless; in the above example, adding 50% puncture damage is only a 16% improvement to the base damage, while a 50% elemental mod is a 50% improvement. Not only that, but outside of a simple hypothetical, the IPS mods don't even give the same percentage boosts as an elemental mod; the primary weapon IPS mods add just 30%, while elementals add 90%. Even with an optimal weapon the IPS mods are useless. Take the Latron Prime, for instance. The vast majority of it's base damage is puncture, which means it gets more benifit from Piercing hit than most guns (not sure if it has the highest proportion of one damage type, but it doesn't really matter). Sounds like a perfect candidate, right? No. Adding piercing hit to its 8i/68p/8s (84 total) stats gives it 88.4 puncture damage, giving it a new total damage of 8/88.4/8 (104.4), which is a 24.3% increase in damage. Any elemental mod will add 90% damage, end of story. That's more than three times as good. Even if a weapon was 100% puncture damage or 100% slash or 100% impact, the elemental mod would still be three times better. Even if the weapon was 100% of one damage type, a bane mod would be better because it does count as base damage and thus scales your elemental damage.

 

tl;dr in the current system IPS mods are the worst damage mods in any circumstance. Do not use them. At all. The add less damage than anything else, under any circumstance.

[RealPandemonium]

IPS mods (like piercing hit) increase the damage type the effect by a percentage of that damage. This extra damage does not count as base damage for elemental mods.

 

Example (using simple numbers):

Base weapon deals 10i/10p/10s, and it's base damage is 30 (so 30 is the number that your elemental mods scale off of; adding 50% elemental damage will give you 15 damage)

Add in 100% serration, weapon now deals 20i/20p/20s, base damage is 60 (so a 50% elemental mod will give 30 damage)

If you add in a mod that increases your puncture by 50%, you now deal 20i/30p/20s, but your base damage remains 60; a 50% elemental mod will still only add 30 damage.

 

This is why the IPS mods are useless; in the above example, adding 50% puncture damage is only a 16% improvement to the base damage, while a 50% elemental mod is a 50% improvement. Not only that, but outside of a simple hypothetical, the IPS mods don't even give the same percentage boosts as an elemental mod; the primary weapon IPS mods add just 30%, while elementals add 90%. Even with an optimal weapon the IPS mods are useless. Take the Latron Prime, for instance. The vast majority of it's base damage is puncture, which means it gets more benifit from Piercing hit than most guns (not sure if it has the highest proportion of one damage type, but it doesn't really matter). Sounds like a perfect candidate, right? No. Adding piercing hit to its 8i/68p/8s (84 total) stats gives it 88.4 puncture damage, giving it a new total damage of 8/88.4/8 (104.4), which is a 24.3% increase in damage. Any elemental mod will add 90% damage, end of story. That's more than three times as good. Even if a weapon was 100% puncture damage or 100% slash or 100% impact, the elemental mod would still be three times better. Even if the weapon was 100% of one damage type, a bane mod would be better because it does count as base damage and thus scales your elemental damage.

 

tl;dr in the current system IPS mods are the worst damage mods in any circumstance. Do not use them. At all. The add less damage than anything else, under any circumstance.

Accel blast was bugged and worked by total base damage instead of base puncture, making it very strong.  Now that it's fixed shotguns as a whole besides Hek have been nerfed considerably. 

[Mokkania]

 

Okay, thanks for the info

[00zau]

Accel blast was bugged and worked by total base damage instead of base puncture, making it very strong.  Now that it's fixed shotguns as a whole besides Hek have been nerfed considerably. 

It wasn't 'very strong.' It was powerful, yeah, but it was a rare NM mod. It added firerate and 60% 'elemental' damage, in comparison to the average elemental mod which adds 90% elemental damage; AB was probably better for DPS but an ele mod gave better damage per shot (and thus ammo economy).