Why Founders Pack Exclusivity Is Hard To Defend

[Aggh]

*Sip*

[(PSN)Pengu_Imperialus]

You can't play with PS4 players because there's (not to my knowledge) ANY cross-platform game where console players can play with PC players. You are wrong.

 

Please, mods, just close any and every thread bringing up this topic and start issuing warnings to people who do so.

FF14 has cross play and as far as I know DE is working on migration and cross play for war frame and currently having discussion s with sony.

[Seox]

You can't play with PS4 players because there's (not to my knowledge) ANY cross-platform game where console players can play with PC players. You are wrong.

 

Please, mods, just close any and every thread bringing up this topic and start issuing warnings to people who do so.

 

More importantly, if PS4 players are allowed to purchase founder's packs, what happens if cross platform is ever considered?

 

DE has less hoops to jump through than other companies with publishers. It's not too much of a stretch (besides sony's delays) to see cross-platform coming out for warframe, with how ambitious and capable they are.

 

That said, if PS4 players are allowed to buy these items and then cross platform comes out, DE will have broken their promise. IMO, Cross platform possibility + DE's honesty > players getting a frame and two weapons.

[(PSN)Pengu_Imperialus]

*Sip*

Ok, explain this thing to me. Now normally a forum person.

[Aggh]

Ok, explain this thing to me. Now normally a forum person.

*Sip*

[Zerrien]

Read the rest of the post next time

 

Getting off topic, not gonna continue on this. If you had actually read the page, you'd see examples that follow the exact format of what I said anyways.

 

You're underhandedly commenting that people who would like Excalibur Prime belong to 'Team Greed.' It's either abusive, (for randomly insulting a subset of people,) or it's an ad hominem attack, (they don't want anything but items for themselves, so their argument is easily discounted.) You're attacking the speaker, instead of the arguments themselves.

 

Earlier you claimed I was making a "straw man," argument over the issue of Pay2Win. Unfortunately, it isn't, as, Pay2Win and Exclusivity have always played an important roles in many Free2Play games.  There are many different elements that come into play, and Pay2Win/Exclusivity is part of it, I'm constantly revising and replying to various specific elements that people bring up.

 

If you want to accuse me of something, go ahead and use 'slippery slope,' (a bit late to use it though!) As Excalibur Prime had a benefit, (which was locked behind a Pay Wall,) and now Rhino Prime has a larger benefit (as, Rhino Prime's advantage over Rhino directly fixes a problem with the Rhino Frame itself, speed. Instead of Excalibur Prime's shield recharge rate, which doesn't target Excalibur's problems as much.) But, luckily, I guess, for me, is that, given sufficient evidence that such slopes are being descended, I can argue that someday, DE may just release a Loki Prime access that is locked away behind miniscule RNG %s, but for sale for $$$ while Loki Prime has more Armor and Health, to help with it's survivability.

 

Now note, I am willing to rescind my argument that Excalibur Prime may be 'buffed' on par with 'Rhino Prime,' because he already have a buff itself. But, due to the fact he has a gameplay advantage over Excalibur, is it -fair- that he was only obtainable with $$$?

[Kalenath]

All I can say is this...

 

 

Wow... such genius. It rivals this thread.

Edited March 19, 2014 by Kalenath

[Drivelikebrazil]

How exactly is me doing what I was supposed to get what I got and you didn't for whatever reason jerk behavior? I'm confused. Do you just not like the word NO? Is that it?

 

Lol, ok, I'm done with you. You can't comprehend it, enjoy being a #$&(%. You win the internet, please don't celebrate too loud, you'll wake your mom up in the other room.

[NevanChambers]

Don't forget the scarf.

What scarf? The syandanas didn't exsit at this point.

[SolidSp33d]

*Sip*

 

[(PSN)DanteVincent]

More importantly, if PS4 players are allowed to purchase founder's packs, what happens if cross platform is ever considered?

 

DE has less hoops to jump through than other companies with publishers. It's not too much of a stretch (besides sony's delays) to see cross-platform coming out for warframe, with how ambitious and capable they are.

 

That said, if PS4 players are allowed to buy these items and then cross platform comes out, DE will have broken their promise. IMO, Cross platform possibility + DE's honesty > players getting a frame and two weapons.

On the other hand, Sony wouldnt allow people with exclusive content play on their platform, there really isnt escape from this.

 

Also you can say that it doesnt interfere, but results are proven to be better arguments rather than speculation and our result so far is a non cross platform game with no possiblity to migrate, a result that supports better my speculation than yours, shall you go the no it doesnt interfere route.

[Aggh]

[Yezzik]

What scarf? The syandanas didn't exsit at this point.

 

Ah, my bad. I could have sworn that pack came with a scarf or some other cosmetic item.

[(PSN)octus]

Ah, my bad. I could have sworn that pack came with a scarf or some other cosmetic item.

i think it came with cosmetics for real life. bandana and t-shirt, unless that was a higher tier.

 

also, i feel like a lot of people are still waiting for theirs, or that there were some topics about it recently. i might be wrong though.

[Thirsty_Pickle]

Can you pre-order a game for the special content after it's been comercially released?

 

No, and Founders is no different.

[(PSN)octus]

Can you pre-order a game for the special content after it's been comercially released?

 

No, and Founders is no different.

pre-order items usually end up in the psn store and those items cost money at that point. before that they are free and just a way to entice customers to buy from a physical store and help support the people who work there.

 

DE is the same except, they made you pay a lot of money for items that would have been free in a sixty dollar game....(they arent the same, i found out recently they are scoundrels, and space pirates)

 

edit: i wasnt done

Edited March 20, 2014 by (PS4)octus

[Ionus]

On the other hand, Sony wouldnt allow people with exclusive content play on their platform, there really isnt escape from this.

 

Also you can say that it doesnt interfere, but results are proven to be better arguments rather than speculation and our result so far is a non cross platform game with no possiblity to migrate, a result that supports better my speculation than yours, shall you go the no it doesnt interfere route.

 

Source?

[Thirsty_Pickle]

End this thread

 

Founders is over

 

We ain't getting it back.

 

Deal with it.

[PoorCensored]

Actually, the founders would be able to get the derelict versions, the same as everyone else.  Set the founders items to not add mastery.  Run a script so that any founder who's leveled up a prime version gets the derelict equivalent marked as mastered to the same level - as if we had leveled it up and sold it.  Mastery is equalized, the founders keep what they were promised, non-founders have a shot at a special version of the items in question. 

 

And personally, I really doubt "People will want more of these cause they're cool" qualifies as a negative in any fashion.

 

The issue with a Derelict version of Excalibur is that if the model is any good, everyone is going to want a Derelict model of there favorite warframe. Then DE is in a situation, again, where it's potentially going to make people unhappy no matter what it does (not make more Derelict models, make more derelict models). Then again, anything it does or doesn't do about this subject is likely to make people unhappy.

 

DE should just release an exclusive pack for PS4 already so everyone can settle down. I personally don't care for the items in the founders pack, the only thing I want is excalibur prime so I can complete my collection of warframes.

 

DE should not make more exclusive items. I can't see anyway that will actually make anything better, and not make everything worse.

 

This illustrates the other side of this.  Do you people want to turn DE into liars?

 

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. People can promise things they shouldn't. Sometimes fixing it means recanting what you said. Is it messy? Yes. Is it the best option sometimes? Yes. Should DE? I don't know.

 

That's a cruel argument. The Founder's Badge and Solar Thank-You are 2 items.

 

For all the we know, Excalibur Prime, Lato Prime, and Skana Prime aren't covered under that.

 

Its a cruel argument, but its one you can make. Just like you could possibly say that DE can just delete the items under the Beta agreement - and then just not make them available to anyone. (I'm not advocating DE to take either of those options.)

 

You do know that threads get closed right, and yes they can say no because they are legally obliged to.

 

Unless you are a lawyer or judge, I don't think we should be going into hypotheticals about legal issues.

 

So, what you are inferring is that when they say it is all in the same in regards to development, that instantly means our playerbase is as one?

 

The only warframe contract is the EULA and the terms. Other than that, you guys are really starting to stretch things.

 

Unless you are a lawyer or judge, I don't think we should be going into hypotheticals about legal issues.

 

This is officially, the LONGEST thread I've ever seen in this forum that is not a Megathread..... can we make it to 60 pages?

 

Why not?

 

... Team Greed?

 

Both sides need to calm down with the ad hominem attacks.

 

While there may have been ad hominem attacks hurled by both sides, the majority seem to be coming from one side.

 

Can you pre-order a game for the special content after it's been comercially released?

 

No, and Founders is no different.

 

1) Since the advent of DLC, almost always, yes you can. Most publishers put up the pre-order content either day one, or shortly there after for a slightly higher than your average DLC fee. A few even eventually give you a way to unlock it in game for free. Or at least most publishers of games I care about anyway.

 

2) Why are you pointing to a bad practice to help make your point? Pre-order exclusives that never became available again were a terrible practice that lessened my ability to enjoy certain games, and made me bypass others all together.

Edited March 20, 2014 by PoorCensored

[Phatose]

Yeah, people wanting Derelict models of their particular frames isn't a problem unless there's some reason that would be impossible to give them.  And I don't see any way to make that claim.

[Zerrien]

The issue with a Derelict version of Excalibur is that if the model is any good, everyone is going to want a Derelict model of there favorite warframe. Then DE is in a situation, again, where it's potentially going to make people unhappy no matter what it does (not make more Derelict models, make more derelict models). Then again, anything it does or doesn't do about this subject is likely to make people unhappy.

 

 

DE should not make more exclusive items. I can't see anyway that will actually make anything better, and not make everything worse.

 

I don't think we're proposing alternate, new exclusives. At least, I'm not. Make a Derelict (or Beta, whatever you prefer,) version of Excalibur, make it drop in the void, sell it for Prime Access, etc. Just make something of equal power available. This applies with ALL past exclusives, so players may keep their Lato Vandals and Lato Primes, give us a Corrupted Lato and a Lato β, different variations that are similar gameplay wise. It doesn't devalue anyone's existing items.

 

I also like to propose that ALL the Primes be released simply as skins, with no power bonus associated with them. Let them behave as alternate model-swaps for the guns, keep them rare, make them a status item, not a gameplay item.

 

1) Since the advent of DLC, almost always, yes you can. Most publishers put up the pre-order content either day one, or shortly there after for a slightly higher than your average DLC fee. A few even eventually give you a way to unlock it in game for free. Or at least most publishers of games I care about anyway.

 

2) Why are you pointing to a bad practice to help make your point? Pre-order exclusives that never became available again were a terrible practice that lessened my ability to enjoy certain games, and made me bypass others all together.

 

Reiterating this, most DLC these days is a temporary exclusive package that people can buy later, or is given out later. Exclusives exist in a variety of forms, but I don't see any exclusive gameplay items this side of the hemisphere. It might be a classic motif in the Asian market, but NA/EU markets try to make things fair, so people don't get upset. Locking Excalibur Prime, Lato Prime, and Skana Prime (as well as the Closed Beta Lato Vandal, and Open-Beta Braton Vandal, plus any other exclusives I might've thought about.)

[Aggh]

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. People can promise things they shouldn't. Sometimes fixing it means recanting what you said. Is it messy? Yes. Is it the best option sometimes? Yes. Should DE? I don't know.

Whether they should or not is subjective.  The fact of the matter is that they did, not once, but multiple times.  And DE has built a trust with the community that isn't worth breaking over people getting butt hurt that they can't get a shiny.

Edited March 20, 2014 by Aggh

[Yezzik]

I also like to propose that ALL the Primes be released simply as skins, with no power bonus associated with them. Let them behave as alternate model-swaps for the guns, keep them rare, make them a status item, not a gameplay item.

 

I'd like to see this happen for all Primes, Vandals, Wraiths and even the Ak/Dual versions of weapons.

It'd clean up the weapon list a bit, if nothing else.

 

If this happens, then there's only three items that would need to be made available once again for absolute parity of maximum Mastery between all players--the Ether Daggers, Snipetron and Machete (The latter two because their alternate forms are also unavailable). That would completely fix all the gameplay issues relating to removed items.

[(PSN)DanteVincent]

Source?

You guys seriously have some comprehension problems.

 

First, i used the conditional, among others uses, such verbal form is used to express uncertainty.

Second, i said i was speculating, not alone though, many seem to agree with this speculation, and it makes perfect sense as well if you are familiar with these companies approach on exclusives, even worse, one that will allow players that didnt spend their money through the playstation network, to use it on this very network, people that can spend less on plat and not through psn and then use it on psn, list goes on, not gonna happen.

 

Which is why it really bothers me when people i will never play with tell me i shouldnt get something, one that i will pay 250$, money that goes towards both versions, yours and ours, but anyways, this matter i discussed in my previous tens of posts in this thread. :P

[Lunaticked]

I have an Excal Prime I haven't touched since it hit rank 30, and the lato prime and skana prime are useless. For all I care, you lot could have them if I could give them away.