Retune *all* The Frames! (11/19: Wildfire)

[tnccs215]

11 hours ago, taiiat said:

both Health and Shields.
it doesn't account for Armor, but as it stands, Killing like, two or three Lv30 Enemies would give you more Health than a Frost spamming Snowglobes.

that's the tricky part. what percent of Enemy EHP is actually balanced....

mh... Agreed. I suppose thats the problem of capped values. It would demand testing. However, I think its feasible. maybe a flat 1k health? It does decay overtime.... Overshields re already capped by default so I wont enter that realm.

God_is_a_Cat_Girl proposed for the excess to become armor, instead of flat values. I suppose armor can scale slighly better.

Edited March 2, 2016 by tnccs215

[tnccs215]

4 hours ago, ChronoEclipse said:

I like this idea; if it would be too overpowered, maybe just make Mend auto-trigger the heal burst under the same circumstances?

Yes, that is a very good alternative. It really would do the work, should DE consider the other overpowered.

 

By the by, another important addition, and this is a must, is for Mend symbol to appear next to the name of in range squadmates (on squad list). This simply allows better positioning. Mend is one of the few healing abilities with range limit, and its extremely hard to calculate distances when 1)you are under fire, and 2)your teammates wont stop screwing around.

[Nightange1]

I quickly leveled Hydriod and for the most part hated it (aside from laughing a lot when using undertow) but I really started to notice potential for him quickly. This is my idea for a rework for him I am not good with numbers so I will exclude those and hopefully you all can excuse the poor grammar. 

 

Hydriods Passive : stagnant waters.

After using any of his non ultimate abilities Hydriod leaves a puddle of water that persists for 8 seconds enemies who try and pass over the water have a chance of being staggered( slipping ) all of hydriods abilities have enhanced effects when used with stagnant waters.

 

Water Torrent (1) 

Hydriod fires off a water torrent(one handed action) in a straight line that knocks back the first enemy hit and others in a small aoe at the point of impact. Water torrent leaves stagnant water from the point of cast and impact of the enemy or when it reaches maximum range. If water torrent goes over stagnant water that isn't alligned with the original cast the torrent will split going over the stagnant water and striking out from those angles as well. If water torrent does go over stagnant water that is parallel with the torrent the knockback is stronger.

Water torrent           water torrent over parallel stagnant water        

------------]    0             =============]          0                                

Water torrent over perpendicular stagnant water

                _

                 I

-------------+-----]

                 I

                _

 

Tidal surge (2)

Acts the same way as tidal surge is currently aside from leaving stagnant water. However when tidal surge makes you and enemies caught over stagnant water, it will deposit the enemies in the stagnant water and act as a short duration undertow.

 

Undertow (3)

Undertow functions the same as before yet is given the functionality of bullet jumping out of the undertow. If you attempt to bullet jump out of undertow aside from simply spitting out enemies caught in undertow it will also knock those enemies and enemies near the undertow back this action would cost additional energy. The stagnant water interaction would disperse the water over a greater range.

 

Tentacle swarm (4)

 

(allowed to cast during undertow) When activated tentacles erupt from your body and seek out nearby enemies, if they do they become stationary and act as the skill functions currently. The tentacles when seeking out enemies will drag enemies out of undertow and tidal surges minor undertow. The stagnant water interaction would be the ability would be able to reach much farther on the map and allow more tentacles active while using stagnant waters as a station to attack from.

 

Hopefully it wasn't as confusing to read as I would worried about, regardless I wanted to make hydriod less about being pirate and more in align with the idea of water which is all about flow and adaptability. 

[Archwizard]

On 2/29/2016 at 1:39 AM, RealPandemonium said:

Overload's biggest problem is that its pulses are not spread far enough apart, so many of its stuns are overridden by an existing stun animation.  I propose that the pulses be spread out enough that they don't overlap

 

On 2/28/2016 at 5:42 AM, ChronoEclipse said:

Normalize the effectiveness levels between Overload with appliances and Overload without. I suppose this isn’t necessary, but it'd be awfully nice.

Hold-cast for Electric Shield sticks it to you. The time for the animation to place the shield is roughly the same as Ivara’s Quiver draw, so that seems like a good baseline for how long a “hold” needs to be. To avoid excessive self-buffing, I think it’s reasonable that Volt drop the currently-held shield if he hold-casts another one.

Between these two posts I think we could be getting somewhere.

The present thought I've been toying with the past couple days is for Overload to be affected by Power Duration, increasing the spacing between ticks without affecting the number of ticks. Combine this with the ability for Volt to emit the pulses from his current location throughout the cast (to synergize with Speed), while also only burning out affected electronics for the duration of the current cast and perhaps causing them to ragdoll targets. The intention here is that it becomes more of a hard CC-oriented power, and then more per-target damage (scaling, hopefully) would be attributed to Shock... somehow. A manner that still needs to be determined.

The point I've been trying to make with calling Overload and Shock redundant of one another, is that without having each one perform a separate role, one just becomes an upgrade/downgrade of the other, which doesn't make for a compelling kit. Lack of scaling aside, presently Overload gets the best of both worlds and Shock just becomes pointless beyond "I can cast a stun while reloading". 

Overload itself is a fairly boring ability - a relic of the time when every ultimate was a radial nuke - and just improving Overload without giving Shock its own distinctive role or benefit (the kind that isn't completely overshadowed by his ultimate) would simply give way to Press 4 spam. This is why I've been pushing for Volt to instead get a way to supercharge his other abilities, but if we can find a solution that doesn't just make Overload "better"...

[--Q--uaint]

1 hour ago, Archwizard said:

Overload to be affected by Power Duration, increasing the spacing between ticks without affecting the number of ticks.

That sounds horrid. If you stacked too much duration, the enemies would be able to shoot you between pulses. Likewise, that would improve my current Volt nuking build by a lot - almost no duration means I can recast almost instantly = more DPS.
I still think that a duration change for Overload should go the same way as for Miasma.

2 hours ago, Archwizard said:

The intention here is that it becomes more of a hard CC-oriented power, and then more per-target damage (scaling, hopefully) would be attributed to Shock... somehow. A manner that still needs to be determined.

I like this thought, since (as you say) 4th abilities that just kill radially are boring.
Thoughts on making Shock a damage power: (You could just give Shock more damage, nerf Overload's, and use my "charges" idea... but I don't think you want to.) Buff the base damage for Shock to somewhere on the level of 1.5-2 pulses of Overload, I think. Give it the recast for stronger and cheaper mechanic (like Landslide/Ripline), and give it a damage bonus against targets that have an electric proc on them.

2 hours ago, Archwizard said:

The point I've been trying to make with calling Overload and Shock redundant of one another, is that without having each one perform a separate role, one just becomes an upgrade/downgrade of the other, which doesn't make for a compelling kit. Lack of scaling aside, presently Overload gets the best of both worlds and Shock just becomes pointless beyond "I can cast a stun while reloading". 

Overload itself is a fairly boring ability - a relic of the time when every ultimate was a radial nuke - and just improving Overload without giving Shock its own distinctive role or benefit (the kind that isn't completely overshadowed by his ultimate) would simply give way to Press 4 spam. This is why I've been pushing for Volt to instead get a way to supercharge his other abilities, but if we can find a solution that doesn't just make Overload "better"...

An alternate path to take would be leave Overload as the damage ability, and alter Shock to:

Cast faster: we want to spam this for CC, so it shouldn't get all tied up on itself if you do so.
Give it a recast mechanic: each successive cast costs 1/2 the last one did, and chains to 2x the targets with 2x the chaining distance.

 

Buffing Shock to be a damage-dealing skill and making Overload a channeled CC would work well in my book - if you're changing Overload to follow the caster and be of variable duration, I think you may as well make it channeled.

[Archwizard]

24 minutes ago, ChronoEclipse said:

If you stacked too much duration, the enemies would be able to shoot you between pulses. Likewise, that would improve my current Volt nuking build by a lot - almost no duration means I can recast almost instantly = more DPS.
I still think that a duration change for Overload should go the same way as for Miasma.

Perhaps.

24 minutes ago, ChronoEclipse said:

I like this thought, since (as you say) 4th abilities that just kill radially are boring.

Yeah... but the reason I didn't point it out straightaway is because having an ultimate that's just a CC is even worse. Marginally acceptable in some cases like Vortex where the CC brings something new to the table, but in this case Overload would just be a status applicator with a chance to ragdoll - feels more like Oberon the more I think about it, trying to polish a turd with a quantity of effects.

24 minutes ago, ChronoEclipse said:

An alternate path to take would be leave Overload as the damage ability, and alter Shock to:

Cast faster: we want to spam this for CC, so it shouldn't get all tied up on itself if you do so.
Give it a recast mechanic: each successive cast costs 1/2 the last one did, and chains to 2x the targets with 2x the chaining distance.

Problem with leaving Overload as a damage ability is, again, scalability.
The only reason why the recast mechanic works for Landslide (since it was initially released without and simply considered a gimmick) is because it also amplifies melee damage, using an obscene amount of base damage.

And sorry, weren't you complaining that Overload is a more effective CC than Shock because of the affected area and duration of effect?

24 minutes ago, ChronoEclipse said:

if you're changing Overload to follow the caster and be of variable duration, I think you may as well make it channeled.

Thing is, that sort of duplicates World on Fire.

 

Although... I do have THAT marked to be removed in the OP anyway...
I have an older idea of just making Overload into a Thunderstorm effect that follows Volt, with lightning strikes to ragdoll nearby enemies, which I scrapped because it seemed too similar... but it we combined it with what I have for Supercharge, increasing Volt's Power Strength each time he strikes an electrical appliance while active...

Oh right, but I can't do that because of the "trailers".

Edited March 2, 2016 by Archwizard

[tnccs215]

12 minutes ago, Archwizard said:

 

 

Oh right, but I can't do that because of the "trailers".

#BringBackSuperJump

[Archwizard]

Just now, tnccs215 said:

#BringBackSuperJump

Was it in the trailers?

At any rate, upward Slash Dashing captures the aesthetic and Bullet Jump captures the function.

[Gurpgork]

1 hour ago, ChronoEclipse said:

Buffing Shock to be a damage-dealing skill and making Overload a channeled CC would work well in my book - if you're changing Overload to follow the caster and be of variable duration, I think you may as well make it channeled.

If I may, I'd like to chime in here.

Shock can't be a damage-dealing skill as long as it deals pure electricity damage, because that damage type has poor coverage against the various health type. It has a 50% damage multiplier against Machinery and Robotics, and a 50% penalty against Alloy Armor. Only 2 enemies in the game have Machinery hitpoints, and that is Rollers and Regulators. Regulators are easy to take out without any damage bonuses, and Rollers are a similar story. And while the bonus against Robotics is rather useful, the penalty against Alloy Armor would seriously hurt Shock as a damage skill. 

Electricity damage has good utility on account of its proc, and this is largely the reason why Volt is a utility frame and not a damage frame, contrary to his description. I am of the opinion that Volt should be a utility frame instead of a damage frame, but if Shock were to be made into a damage skill, it would be imperative to allow it to use different damage types, while preferably still proccing Electricity.

[--Q--uaint]

5 hours ago, Archwizard said:

Yeah... but the reason I didn't point it out straightaway is because having an ultimate that's just a CC is even worse. Marginally acceptable in some cases like Vortex where the CC brings something new to the table, but in this case Overload would just be a status applicator with a chance to ragdoll - feels more like Oberon the more I think about it, trying to polish a turd with a quantity of effects.

Good point. Thought: Temporarily disable ranged attacks and eximus auras. It's weaker than Disarm in that it's not permanent and that it'd have a travel time, but stronger in that prods > elbows and eximus auras aren't hindered by Disarm.

5 hours ago, Archwizard said:

Problem with leaving Overload as a damage ability is, again, scalability.

The only reason why the recast mechanic works for Landslide (since it was initially released without and simply considered a gimmick) is because it also amplifies melee damage, using an obscene amount of base damage.

Scalability? Again, my "charges" mechanic ;V
The recast mechanic only scales twice for Landslide. There's nothing saying Shock couldn't scale higher, and it almost always hits multiple targets.

5 hours ago, Archwizard said:

And sorry, weren't you complaining that Overload is a more effective CC than Shock because of the affected area and duration of effect?

Yes, but Shock can be spammed and doesn't restrict movement or action.
Giving Shock the multicast mechanic would give it a huge bump in the area of efficiency of CC. Being able to stunlock a small crowd for an extended period for extremely little energy would be quite useful, especially since it wouldn't interrupt your other actions.
Overload would still apply to large areas at once, but it has travel time, a long cast, and no spammability mechanic. (If the multicasting mechanic boosted chaining range and number of chains, you could very well get most of the mileage of Overload's CC from Shock - particularly if CC shock prioritized un-cc'd enemies. Another large point in Shock's favor is that you can cast way faster than the procs can wear off, so you could easily CC more than one group.)

5 hours ago, Archwizard said:

Thing is, that sort of duplicates World on Fire.

Although... I do have THAT marked to be removed in the OP anyway...
I have an older idea of just making Overload into a Thunderstorm effect that follows Volt, with lightning strikes to ragdoll nearby enemies, which I scrapped because it seemed too similar... but it we combined it with what I have for Supercharge, increasing Volt's Power Strength each time he strikes an electrical appliance while active...

Oh right, but I can't do that because of the "trailers".

TBH, there's nothing in the trailer that wouldn't allow for you to use Overload as a giant Shocking Speed field - it'd just have to have an initial cast thing.

 

I'm okay with the idea of an ability that does stuff as its main effect, but also supercharges abilities. Just not *only* supercharging.

[Hammahness808]

13 hours ago, Nightange1 said:

I quickly leveled Hydriod and for the most part hated it (aside from laughing a lot when using undertow) but I really started to notice potential for him quickly. This is my idea for a rework for him I am not good with numbers so I will exclude those and hopefully you all can excuse the poor grammar. 

 

Hydriods Passive : stagnant waters.

After using any of his non ultimate abilities Hydriod leaves a puddle of water that persists for 8 seconds enemies who try and pass over the water have a chance of being staggered( slipping ) all of hydriods abilities have enhanced effects when used with stagnant waters.

 

Water Torrent (1) 

Hydriod fires off a water torrent(one handed action) in a straight line that knocks back the first enemy hit and others in a small aoe at the point of impact. Water torrent leaves stagnant water from the point of cast and impact of the enemy or when it reaches maximum range. If water torrent goes over stagnant water that isn't alligned with the original cast the torrent will split going over the stagnant water and striking out from those angles as well. If water torrent does go over stagnant water that is parallel with the torrent the knockback is stronger.

Water torrent           water torrent over parallel stagnant water        

------------]    0             =============]          0                                

Water torrent over perpendicular stagnant water

                _

                 I

-------------+-----]

                 I

                _

 

Tidal surge (2)

Acts the same way as tidal surge is currently aside from leaving stagnant water. However when tidal surge makes you and enemies caught over stagnant water, it will deposit the enemies in the stagnant water and act as a short duration undertow.

 

Undertow (3)

Undertow functions the same as before yet is given the functionality of bullet jumping out of the undertow. If you attempt to bullet jump out of undertow aside from simply spitting out enemies caught in undertow it will also knock those enemies and enemies near the undertow back this action would cost additional energy. The stagnant water interaction would disperse the water over a greater range.

 

Tentacle swarm (4)

 

(allowed to cast during undertow) When activated tentacles erupt from your body and seek out nearby enemies, if they do they become stationary and act as the skill functions currently. The tentacles when seeking out enemies will drag enemies out of undertow and tidal surges minor undertow. The stagnant water interaction would be the ability would be able to reach much farther on the map and allow more tentacles active while using stagnant waters as a station to attack from.

 

Hopefully it wasn't as confusing to read as I would worried about, regardless I wanted to make hydriod less about being pirate and more in align with the idea of water which is all about flow and adaptability. 

Really not bad ideas at all. The 'Stagnant water' effect sounds like a very subtle change, yet could be a larger gameplay enhancer.

[Aquasurge]

i some how have a feeling whatever happens to mag may very well be somewhat similar to  what happens to volt in the sense of the realtionship between their 1's and 4's

Edited March 5, 2016 by Aquasurge

[Archwizard]

I modified the suggestion for Shadows of the Dead with respect to the tech in place for Ivara's Quiver and Equinox's Provoke: By turning it into a soft-toggle.
Additionally, as some people clamoring for Desecrate actually use it for the legitimate reason of regenerating energy and the above change serves to make him more of a hog, I decided to invoke his 'necromancer spirit' in a passive to automatically regenerate energy based on nearby deaths.
Between the two of them, you can almost get a feel for that "soul charge" mechanic that has been suggested for Nekros several times, only much less complicated.

I felt it was relevant after the release of Inaros to be sure that there was a clear difference between the intention for Nekros and what was released in Inaros. It took careful consideration before realizing that no, Inaros doesn't actually put a roadblock on the suggestions to remove Desecrate whatsoever, he simply represents a similar means to a different end in the same manner that Oberon and Trinity can both heal or Ivara and Equinox can both put targets to sleep, or howsabout all of the surface correlation between Loki and Ash?

In the meantime, just put Inaros into the foundry to bake for 3 days. As per my usual policy, won't be putting up anything related to him into the OP for at least a week after his release or my getting him to rank 30 (the hard way, none of that Draco bull) at least once, whichever happens second.

Edited March 6, 2016 by Archwizard

[Elydir]

On 3/21/2014 at 6:53 PM, Archwizard said:

Targets are also marked for a short period to be added as priority targets to the pool for Nekros' next cast of Shadows of the Dead, regardless of how they die, unless automatically resurrected by Shadows of the Dead. If cast directly on a Shadow minion, the minion detonates, dealing damage in a radius.

- Shadows of the Dead is also a toggled effect. In addition to its current effects, while toggled active and below the cap of active Shadows, enemies killed by Nekros or his minions will automatically be resurrected by Nekros, rather than added to the pool for his next cast; additional energy is only consumed whenever an enemy is revived in this manner, similarly to Provoke.

Does he really need both a way to prioritize targets to summon and autosummon if he can blow up his minions? Its kinda confusing.

[Rankii]

On 3/6/2016 at 3:41 AM, Archwizard said:

I modified the suggestion for Shadows of the Dead with respect to the tech in place for Ivara's Quiver and Equinox's Provoke: By turning it into a soft-toggle.
Additionally, as some people clamoring for Desecrate actually use it for the legitimate reason of regenerating energy and the above change serves to make him more of a hog, I decided to invoke his 'necromancer spirit' in a passive to automatically regenerate energy based on nearby deaths.
Between the two of them, you can almost get a feel for that "soul charge" mechanic that has been suggested for Nekros several times, only much less complicated.

I felt it was relevant after the release of Inaros to be sure that there was a clear difference between the intention for Nekros and what was released in Inaros. It took careful consideration before realizing that no, Inaros doesn't actually put a roadblock on the suggestions to remove Desecrate whatsoever, he simply represents a similar means to a different end in the same manner that Oberon and Trinity can both heal or Ivara and Equinox can both put targets to sleep, or howsabout all of the surface correlation between Loki and Ash?

In the meantime, just put Inaros into the foundry to bake for 3 days. As per my usual policy, won't be putting up anything related to him into the OP for at least a week after his release or my getting him to rank 30 (the hard way, none of that Draco bull) at least once, whichever happens second.

What's wrong with draco?

[taiiat]

57 minutes ago, Rankii said:

What's wrong with draco?

step 1 - stand on everyone's favorite box
step 2 - engage appropriate Macro for the Ability(ies) you'll need to keep active
step 3 - walk away and do something else

that's what's wrong.

[Rankii]

32 minutes ago, taiiat said:

step 1 - stand on everyone's favorite box
step 2 - engage appropriate Macro for the Ability(ies) you'll need to keep active
step 3 - walk away and do something else

that's what's wrong.

So nothing with the level itself? That sounds like a playerbase problem. On that note I guess there's everything wrong with any non-sortie defense under T4?

[RealPandemonium]

11 hours ago, Rankii said:

So nothing with the level itself? That sounds like a playerbase problem. On that note I guess there's everything wrong with any non-sortie defense under T4?

The problem is two-pronged.  Interceptions spawn new enemies in pre-deisgnated areass constantly as the current enemies are killed, instead of spawning them in waves like Defense does.  Draco also has a large number of spawn rooms located very far from the "Draco box" that everyone stands on.  If you stand on the box and use long-ranged powers to constantly kill (and thus cycle) enemies right after they spawn (reaching them just outside of the rooms where they spawn,) then you can inflate the spawn rate of the mission greatly and generate a lot of kills (and the asssociated affinity/drops) very quickly.  That's why people can exploit Interceptions missions like Viver and Draco.  It may even be possible to exploit Interception maps besides Draco, but Draco lent itself to the tactic readily due to being much larger and thus having much longer potential distances to the spawn areas.  

 

TL;DR

Interception spawn mechanics can be exploited.  Certain maps (especiially large ones) lend themselves more to exploitation, especially when using RJ which requires a line of sight to reach enemies. 

Edited March 9, 2016 by RealPandemonium

[taiiat]

35 minutes ago, Rankii said:

So nothing with the level itself?

as aforementioned - the Players, and mostly the Gamemode (which is a PvP Gamemode, not a PvE Gamemode anyways), are the problem, with a bit also the way some of our Equipment works.

the Tile? it's fine. it's pretty looking and is well setup for Enemies to Spawn out of sight and attack Objectives/Players, Et Cetera.

[Archwizard]

3 hours ago, Rankii said:

What's wrong with draco?

The short version is, players go there specifically to level up items quickly. In order to provide adequate feedback on equipment, I prefer to take mine through a non-cave route so I have the versatility to learn their intricacies and strengths as I gain access to them, rather than simply piggyback off of others' work and only learn their face value and failings.

A 'Frames & Abilities feedback forum isn't the proper place to be discussing it, however.

[tnccs215]

2 hours ago, Rankii said:

So nothing with the level itself? That sounds like a playerbase problem. On that note I guess there's everything wrong with any non-sortie defense under T4?

yes, and no. As Machiavelli said, "give someone an exploitative game mechanic, and ye shall exploit it." That is, if your game has some way, ANYWAY to allow resource exploitation, you ca be sure many will use it and abuse it. Many will say "well, dont use Draco.", but In the end, the difficulty and challenging level of a game is measured by how hard it is regardless of any equipment, power, or gimmick you possess beyond pure knowledge and skill. Forcing players that desire to have a challenge to gimp themselves is not having a challenging game. And this gets much worse when those that exploit the mechanics, bored from the cheese, but unwilling to give up on their overpowered assets, demand harder and harder content-- content unbareable for those who dont exploit. The result? Powercreep, and Cheese play becoming essential. We can see that on corpus. Instead of tweaking warframe abilities that allow exploitation and cheese, enemies that cheese were introduced, furthering ensuring the status quo of cheese has a necessity, and making the game impossible to play for those that dont abide to it.

In short, the problem is not the map per se, but the fact that humans are inherently exploitative, and that many, MANY warframe abilities, as they are, allow exploitation beyond measure. Ence, this thread.

[--Q--uaint]

23 hours ago, tnccs215 said:

We can see that on corpus. Instead of tweaking warframe abilities that allow exploitation and cheese, enemies that cheese were introduced, furthering ensuring the status quo of cheese has a necessity, and making the game impossible to play for those that dont abide to it.

This, in particular, upsets me a lot. Fleeting Expertise was the beginning of the end for Warframe, I feel. The sad thing is that there's no other game quite like it.

Flat AoE damage abilities were pretty fine... until spamming became a thing.

[taiiat]

20 minutes ago, ChronoEclipse said:

Flat AoE damage abilities were pretty fine... until spamming became a thing.

with how the game is nowadays, people can do that without Fleeting Expertise though.

[--Q--uaint]

1 hour ago, taiiat said:

with how the game is nowadays, people can do that without Fleeting Expertise though.

Hmmm. That brings up Energy Restores, Zenurik, and Energy Vampire.

I am against consumables in general (though that doesn't stop me from hoarding and using them occasionally - not wanting them to be part of the game is not the same as not liking their benefits)

Focus in general is really strange compared to the rest of the game. I think it'd be helpful to balance if the stronger Focus passives required something beyond just popping your #5... but I have no idea what that should be.

Energy Vampire is another thorny issue. Trinity in general is just kinda OP in concept. I dunno if it's even possible to make her not ridiculously OP while still being usable.

Did I miss anything?

[taiiat]

47 minutes ago, ChronoEclipse said:

I am against consumables in general (though that doesn't stop me from hoarding and using them occasionally - not wanting them to be part of the game is not the same as not liking their benefits)

Focus in general is really strange compared to the rest of the game. I think it'd be helpful to balance if the stronger Focus passives required something beyond just popping your #5... but I have no idea what that should be.

Energy Vampire / Trinity

i'm not entirely against Consumables, having supplies for... Emergencies, is reasonable. ofc that's not what we have.

i don't really know what to do with Focus either. the active mode thing and all of the active sides of it are completely irrelevant, while a few passive effects are quite useful but without meter.
both sides definitely need to get closer together, for sure.
i'm honestly partially apalled at how it turned out, Warframe is incredibly fast paced - how could CC'ing or dealing Damage to Enemies for a few seconds once in a while ever hope to be relevant? since Enemies usually die as soon as a Tenno looks towards them, it has to be...... spammable in order for it to be relevant to the game.
i think some of the underlying pacing and balance problems in the game exacerbate Focus.

had an interesting discussion once upon a time. no formal write up yet, but i'll get around to it sometime.